December 2020 - openSUSE Project - openSUSE Mailing Lists

Board meeting Minutes 2020-12-08 0800 CET
by Axel Braun 12 Dec '20

12 Dec '20

== Board meeting Minutes 2020-12-08 0800 CET == Attendees: Marina, Stasiek, Gerald, Vinz, Simon, Axel Minutes: Axel Meeting closed 0930 CET Next meeting 2020-12-22 0800 CET === General === 6 meeting minutes outstanding - overdue reminder given to individuals === Pending trademark approval for notebook preload === * Shop in Belgium asked for permission to use openSUSE logo for preloads * According to https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Trademark_guidelines redistribution is allowed * Shop wants to apply additional unfree software (Skype, Zoom,...) * Some questions aound this procedure - Simon to drive open questions with shop === Various complaints about user behaviour on openSUSE mailing list(s) === * https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Guiding_principles describes rules of engagement * There were various ML posts in the last weeks that broke guiding principles, adding up to existing complaints * Third party media like Twitter or Facebook is out of openSUSE control, but still reflect (positively or negatively) on openSUSE and therefore matters * Mail reminder being sent by Simon that lists should stay on topic (https:// en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Mailing_lists_subscription) in order to avoid moderation of users in list: https://lists.opensuse.org/archives/list/project@lists.opensuse.org/thread/ XSYTEQMXPE477IWCRSHY46D3TARU7SGM/ * Additional moderators are welcome. To kickstart the process, if you feel you are a good moderator, please contact mailing list admins admin(a)o.o * Stasiek to discuss this internally with the admins to align that they are OK with the procedure * Gerald sent mail to project@ about steps taken: https://lists.opensuse.org/archives/list/project@lists.opensuse.org/message/ SMZBVV7AF5A5CZCNKGJYJXU5WIM7FMQW/ * accepted by vote 6-0 === Tracking trademark usage approvals === delayed due to time constraints -- Dr. Axel Braun <docb(a)opensuse.org> Member of the openSUSE Board

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An update from the board
by Gerald Pfeifer 11 Dec '20

11 Dec '20

Dear fellow geekos, last week has seen various interactions on this list and elsewhere that went against the words and the spirit of our guiding principles (cf. https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Guiding_principles ). What I saw was disappointing, discouraging and damaging to our project and community. At the same time I was very encouraged to see some of you step in and moderate themselves and others. Thank you! As a board we received several complaints, and working through those and our own observations in our meeting yesterday we have - issued a warning to some members; - put some members under mailing list moderation for three months; - agreed to share a general reminder to stay a bit more on topic per the respective list chartas (cf. https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Mailing_lists_subscription ) and that moderation of individuals will be considered if necessary. We have not taken these steps lightheartedly and will continue to work on any open issues. I am looking forward to many more respectful, constructive and open conversations around the forthcoming elections and otherwise. And please never hesitate to reach out! Thank you, Gerald -- Dr. Gerald Pfeifer <gp(a)suse.com>, CTO @SUSE + chair @openSUSE

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Re: Election process (Was: An update from the board)
by Conrad Smith 11 Dec '20

11 Dec '20

On Fri, 2020-12-11 at 06:33 +0100, Mark Stopka wrote: > > > Serving on the openSUSE Board is a privilege in a way, but first > > and foremost a service, and generally not very thankful at that. > > If there are perks of the job (or for former members) I have yet > > to see them. ;-) > > > > > Yes it does, it does matter when, where and how you say things, > > > we > > > call it context and there is an entire department at your company > > > called the PR department that thinks about what to say,when to > > > say > > > it, where to say it, and how to say it. > > > > Let's keep our employers out of the conversation here, please. We > > all contribute to openSUSE as individuals, exclusively or to a good > > extent in our spare time. > > I could as well use *any sufficiently large company that does a lot > of > communications with the ouside*, but you can see 13 words against 1 > more relatable example, you can replace that with any organization of > a reasonable size really... The point was communication is a tricky > business, and it does influence views of projects / people / > organizations in the eyes of both the internal and external > stakeholders. > > I admit, that *certain company* established internal comms department > between *certain company* Business Services - Global Infrastructure > Services and rest of the company after I have during *program name* > transition & transformation have communicated some changes in the > structure of company data storage infrastructure to the rest of the > company that were considered too bold without the proper softeners, > for some. > > Example: > I would communicate to Local IT and the L-team of a specific local > subsidiary that as part of the transformation we would be migrating > their IT assets to a different location, as part of a streamlining > effort (we were going from 90+ DCs to about 50), but I have omitted > those in my eyes at the time unimportant details like "there will > likely be no changes to the structure of human resources associated > with this on-going and important effort that strengthens our company > leading position in our industry". > > I hope that does provide some clarity on what I meant by that. First Richard, then Henne, now Gerald - just how many current and ex-board member will you ignore when they teach you how the Project actually works? If Richard was paranoid why do you keep trying to make openSUSE a business? This make no sense. We are a free software community by volunteer. Please stop trying to make openSUSE to something it isn't

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Thoughts on capturing the CentOS marketshare...
by Mark Stopka 10 Dec '20

10 Dec '20

Hi all, as you probably know by now, traditional CentOS is being depreciated by RedHat, and is going to be replaced by CentOS Stream which will basically be the development branch for RHEL N+1... Many (CentOS / RHEL) users are upset about this as this will / may have impact on their products and / or services, I see it as an opportunity to capture some of the CentOS market-share and for SUSE perhaps even some RHEL market share... I am wondering if someone here is committed to trying to come up with the strategy on how to go about that, I think it will be essential to produce easy to understand migration guides from Centos -> openSUSE Leap and stress that CentOS is moving in the exactly opposite direction as we are moving with openSUSE Leap and SUSE Linux Enterprise... If this gains traction here and interest of perhaps 5 - 10 people with right skillset: - technical writer - graphics designer (who does not like pretty graphics) - geeks (so we can translate and test CentOS guides for openSUSE) It will make sense to discuss our thoughts on some sort of a conf. call, by the end of this week, or early next week, and move forward from there... Thoughts? I myself have more knowledge about CentOS / RHEL that I would like, I have started some promotions on Reddit and other social media and it seems it is gaining traction... In addition @ddemaio@opensuse.org is there any chance to have some small budget allocated for some PPC campaign or something like that from the SUSE side? I am not sure how exactly these things work, but I am more than happy to take that off-line with you and discuss options if there are any. -- Best regards / S pozdravem, BSc. Mark Stopka, BBA Managing Partner (at) PERLUR Group mobile: +420 704 373 561 website: www.perlur.cloud

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Backing away from candidacy for openSUSE Board
by Mark Stopka 09 Dec '20

09 Dec '20

Dear all, after being approached by "The openSUSE Board" regarding my conduct which completely ignores the conduct of Richard Brown and the relevant context, I have decided to back away from my candidacy for openSUSE Board. I wish all candidates good luck in upcoming elections, but I myself won't be a candidate in elections where people in positions of influence attempt to influence the masses to vote or not to vote for a specific candidate, I see enough of that in national politics. I can in no way consider these elections to be free, democratic and fair after failure of The Board to address the behavior of Richard Brown. I would ask for revokal of my membership altogether, but that would mean loosking @opensuse.org account, which I use on too many services. Thank you, and all the best to all of you. -- Best regards / S pozdravem, BSc. Mark Stopka, BBA Managing Partner (at) PERLUR Group mobile: +420 704 373 561 website: www.perlur.cloud

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Board meeting minutes 24-11-2020
by Simon Lees 09 Dec '20

09 Dec '20

Present: Axel, Gerald, Simon, Stasiek, Vinz Excused: Marina - openSUSE Jitsi server still has issues. == overdue meeting minutes == * Simon will send draft for this and last meeting in the next 4 hrs. == Status of Election == * Happy with the progress of the current election process. == Governance (what do we need to formalize?) == * Merge Membership official rules into board rules, and call it constitution (this was agreed and never done by previous boards) A.I. Simon. * Prepare a document on openSUSE governance and proposed changes for newer SUSE upper management. * Better ask teams for updates for conference talk next year == Foundation-Roadmap == * Continue to address some of the governance issues listed above * Formally reapproach SUSE management in the new year once some of these Governance issues have been taken care of and once SUSE management has settled slightly following the merger with Rancher. == Merchandise == * Still looking into organizational logistics.

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Board Meeting Minutes 10-11-2020
by Simon Lees 09 Dec '20

09 Dec '20

Present: Axel, Gerald, Simon, Stasiek, Vinz, Doug DeMaio (first part) Excused: Marina == Merch discussions == * Discussions around adding an additional merch provider as we were approached by them. == Statistics == * metrics.opensuse.org shows wrong figures due to no 15.2 * Doug will Email Heroes to see if someone can fix it. (Doug left the meeting) == Missing Minutes == * Will remind people == Meeting time == * Create a fallback slot? * Keep the slot - Have 21:00 CET tues as a backup. * Probably only a couple of meetings left this year == Board Elections == * Gerald will follow up with the committee

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Questions for Board candidates
by Vojtěch Zeisek 08 Dec '20

08 Dec '20

Hello, dear candidates, I'd have few questions. :-) First of all, it's pleasure to see platforms of such a good candidates. Regardless results, I'm sure the updated Board will be excellent. I'd like to ask all of You (platforms [1-6]) for which of Your activities (read ways You help to improve the Project) do You need (or is highly helpful) to be Board member? I mean for which of Your targets, aims, goals, thoughts, agendas or objectives You need to be in Board, why is it necessary or helpful? Or asking from the opposite side, what of Your aims You can't do as any other community member? Second, how do You understand the sentence "The purpose of the openSUSE Board is to lead the overall project." ([7], bit longer version at [8]) regarding the "main tasks" listed there and lack of any sort of executive power? Which kind of leadership (or governance), if any, do You have in mind in association with our Board? Current members of the Board who would like to be re-elected (AFAIK simotek and DocB) I'd like to ask what are their major successes in the ending tenure. Regarding Your 2018 platforms [9-10], are there any aims, goals or thoughts You were planning, but for whatever reason rethink or failed? How did Your point of view developed in past 2 years? (BTW: Simotek's 2020 platform links to category "Board election 2018" while category "Board election 2020" linked from other platforms doesn't exist. I know it's wiki, but I'm not sure if only election committee is allowed to manage these things or so.:) When reading plans of DocB [11], Knurpht [12], Mark [13] and bit also Neal [14] I have obsessive feeling that You all are touching, from Your personal perspective and experience, similar problem/group of problems regarding communication among (sub)groups of members etc., coordination, and even possible some leadership/governance. If my impression is correct, I wonder what are Your intersections, shared points, and what are discrepancies among You? It looks to me that You use different words to say very similar things. Is my impression correct? DocB, Mark, simotek and Neal mention creation of some sort of foundation, while Knurpht and m4u9 don't mention it. Knurpht and m4u9, do You think there should be no foundation at all? Or You just don't have strong opinion on that topic? DocB, Mark, simotek and Neal, do You have any particular idea how that foundation should look like? What are main advantages and risks of this transition? All of You, what do You think are main threats and challenges for our dear Project in near future? How to be prepared? I'm looking forward fruitful discussion, V. [1] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_DocB> [2] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_Knurpht> [3] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_m4u9> [4] <https://en.opensuse.org/ openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_Mark_Stopka> [5] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_simotek> [6] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_-_Neal_Gompa> [7] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board> [8] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Guiding_principles#Governance> [9] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2018_platform_Knurpht> [10] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2018_platform_simotek> [11] <https://en.opensuse.org/ openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_DocB#Targets_for_the_next_season> [12] <https://en.opensuse.org/ openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_Knurpht#Aims.2C_Goals.2C_Thoughts> [13] <https://en.opensuse.org/ openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_Mark_Stopka#Agenda_for_the_current_board_member_term> [14] <https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_-_Neal_Gompa#…> -- Vojtěch Zeisek https://trapa.cz/ Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux https://www.opensuse.org/

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End of 2020 openSUSE community poll
by Adrien Glauser 08 Dec '20

08 Dec '20

Hello, I've just stitched together ideas for an "end of the year survey" to probe satisfaction & use cases. The first draft is visible at https://etherpad.opensuse.org/p/oS-2020-poll Reasoning: - it's fun to fill end-of-of the years surveys: it gives a sense of closure and know doesn't like to express themselves?? - surveys are useful for the community: it builds self-knowledge - surveys are useful for the current and future Board, especially in election times, as it may translate into better governance since a Boards' decision can build on what people want, expect, and feel like. y/n ? when would be the best time window for sending? Cheers, Adrien

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[opensuse-project] About shaming people on the list
by Neal Gompa 07 Dec '20

07 Dec '20

Hey all, We seem to have a problem on the openSUSE mailing list of shaming people and assuming ill intent. This is exemplified by the following thread excerpt: On Fri, Nov 27, 2020 at 11:35 PM Felix Miata <mrmazda(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > > Vojtěch Zeisek composed on 2020-11-27 10:20 (UTC+0100): > > > Bottom-posting is the standard here. Let's keep it so. > > > A: Yes. > >> Q: Are you sure? > >> > A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. > >> > > Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? > > +++ The problem with this is threefold: 1. You are deliberately shaming someone publicly 2. You are piling on the shame by reinforcing it 3. You are assuming that people cannot learn any other way (or ill intent) None of this is actually *helpful*. And I would wager to say that the majority of folks just flat out don't really care if it's top posted or bottom posted. I personally don't. My email client collapses the quotes the same regardless. I realize that to some extent, I'm doing this too by posting this message. But I have been seeing this to various degrees for *years* and it's not only unhelpful, it literally scares people away from our community. And I cannot stomach it anymore. The openSUSE community is intended to be a welcoming place that allows a variety of people from all over the world to work together to make great things. And our Netiquette (which is now linked at the bottom of *every single email from the list*) declares this kind of behavior as undesirable. It does occur to me that a large majority of the people on all openSUSE lists do not know we have rules for the mailing lists. This is why Stasiek and I decided that they would be added to the footer of all emails that travel through the list server. I would like to reiterate that there are much kinder ways of helping people change their behaviors, and that you should always attempt to privately help the person who may be inadvertently doing the wrong thing. Shaming them publicly is a great way to scare people away and even potentially make existing folks leave. Please reconsider the next time you think about doing it. And consider how *you* would feel if someone did it to you. -- 真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth!

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2020 Board Elections: my platform
by Mark Stopka 07 Dec '20

07 Dec '20

Hi all, my election platform is now finished, I would appreciate any feedback from your side.... https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_Mark_Stopka -- Best regards / S pozdravem, BSc. Mark Stopka, BBA Managing Partner (at) PERLUR Group mobile: +420 704 373 561 website: www.perlur.cloud

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Netiquette on openSUSE MLs
by Thorsten Bro 05 Dec '20

05 Dec '20

Hi list, sorry to bring this up on the project level and I'm sorry for the 'mostly reading' users like me - to have one mail more in our inboxes, but the behaviour shown by several users over the last days and even before is just annoying me a lot and it might annoy others as well. We have a netiquette on all of our lists. You can find it here. https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Mailing_list_netiquette There is clearly stated, that a discussion is perfectly fine, but it shouldn't go completely off topic. Over the past month we had several cases of personal one-vs-one fights on this mailinglist or even one-vs-many. Which does not only show a very unprofessional view of our project to the outside world, but also is clearly off-topic. It's cool to discuss questions with candidates here and it's cool to discuss general aspects like this one here, which affects the whole project, on this list. What is not so nice is, if two members end up in a 1-on-1 discussion about nit picking in 10+ mails of each of them. How about a direct conversation and just remove the list from CC then. Remember that with every mail you drop here, you might use someones most valuable thing - time. If we all just work a little bit on our own attitude how we live this Netiquette and our own rules - it might become a better public forum here and in the end - way less mails to read for everyone. How cool would that one to be achieved? And without further lines, I'd just like to remember everybody that proper quoting, proper threading and proper formatting is part of the Netiquette. If you see yourself with a bad format or threading on the list, maybe even splitting up a thread unwanted, please check your mail client settings - that would be great. With all the best wishes. Stay healthy. -- Thorsten Bro <tbro(a)opensuse.org> - Member of openSUSE Heroes - https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Heroes - Member of openSUSE VideoTeam - https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Video

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Netiquette on openSUSE MLs
by Thorsten Bro 05 Dec '20

05 Dec '20

Hi list, sorry to bring this up on the project level and I'm sorry for the 'mostly reading' users like me - to have one mail more in our inboxes, but the behaviour shown by several users over the last days and even before is just annoying me a lot and it might annoy others as well. We have a netiquette on all of our lists. You can find it here. https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Mailing_list_netiquette There is clearly stated, that a discussion is perfectly fine, but it shouldn't go completely off topic. Over the past month we had several cases of personal one-vs-one fights on this mailinglist or even one-vs-many. Which does not only show a very unprofessional view of our project to the outside world, but also is clearly off-topic. It's cool to discuss questions with candidates here and it's cool to discuss general aspects like this one here, which affects the whole project, on this list. What is not so nice is, if two members end up in a 1-on-1 discussion about nit picking in 10+ mails of each of them. How about a direct conversation and just remove the list from CC then. Remember that with every mail you drop here, you might use someones most valuable thing - time. If we all just work a little bit on our own attitude how we live this Netiquette and our own rules - it might become a better public forum here and in the end - way less mails to read for everyone. How cool would that one to be achieved? And without further lines, I'd just like to remember everybody that proper quoting, proper threading and proper formatting is part of the Netiquette. If you see yourself with a bad format or threading on the list, maybe even splitting up a thread unwanted, please check your mail client settings - that would be great. With all the best wishes. Stay healthy. -- Thorsten Bro <tbro(a)opensuse.org> - Member of openSUSE Heroes - https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Heroes - Member of openSUSE VideoTeam - https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Video

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Meet your Candidates: Building Trust and Friendliness through Engagement with Voters
by Adrien Glauser 04 Dec '20

04 Dec '20

Hello, I've said it all in the subject of this message. Thanks for your attention and have a nice day. Just kidding. How about we set up some Ask Me Anything Session / round-table / dialogue between Candidates and the openSUSE community? Perhaps pulling this out for the ongoing election is a tall order, but what about the next one? You hit four birds with one stone: 1) Motivate and help the candidate to share and express their ideas. 2) Get the community interested in Board things. 3) Get the individuals in the community feel part of the community by gathering them around one common objective. 4) Get the individuals in the community to better know the community and each other because it's always interested to meet people over politics. y/n ? Assuming yes the 2 next questions that naturally come up are: a) sync or async? By which I mean: Should participants exchange get & answer questions live or offline? Sync would be a Jitsi Meeting, async would be a forum or ML. b) on one or distinct "channels"? By which I mean: Should participants talk within a single context (i.e. one single ML) or via separate channels, one for each candidate (i.e. distinct wiki pages or discord rooms). Please don't reply by expressing aversion or love for communication tech stack A or B. If you like the idea and keep in mind a) and b), it won't be difficult to infer the communication tech stack you'd favour. Cheers, Adrien

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Heads up: Removal of openSUSE:Jump:15.2 project in OBS
by Lubos Kocman 03 Dec '20

03 Dec '20

Ahoy openSUSE! We'd like to remove openSUSE:Jump:15.2 project which will be no longer developed as all the developmed is now happening directly in Leap 15.3 Alpha. Removal of the project to free resources was previously dicussed as part of Release Engineering meeting and will be initiated today by Adrian. We're removing it mainly to free resources. In case you've missed the previous annoucement: https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-project/2020-11/msg00001.html Enrollment of Jump concept to 15.3 received blessing from openSUSE Board shortly after the No-go decision for Leap 15.2.1 https://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Jump/Leap15.2.1:GoNogo Thank you very much for your understanding -- Lubos Kocman, Release Manager openSUSE Leap SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg - Germany (HRB 36809, AG Nürnberg) Geschäftsführer: Felix Imendörffer

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openSUSE Conference 2020 Videos
by Jason Evans 03 Dec '20

03 Dec '20

Hi all, I was going to post this to the openSUSE Conference mailing list, but that appears to be defunct. I would like to know whether there will be any more videos from the conference uploaded to YouTube or if that is all that were recorded. Thanks. Best Regards, Jason

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Results of openSUSE ARM Usecases survey
by Lubos Kocman 03 Dec '20

03 Dec '20

Ahoy openSUSE! I'd like to give big thanks to all of you who have participated in the survey, the data is pure gold. I'd also like to give thanks to openSUSE Release team who helped to make this survey happen and those of you who went with me through all of the feedback. Cumulated notes from review during past two days can be found here https://etherpad.opensuse.org/p/ReleaseEngineering-20201202-arm . I have processed the exported survey results and turned it into the following wiki page: https://en.opensuse.org/Portal:15.3/Surveys/ARM_Usecases Data showed us that there is a big ARM userbase that essentially doubled over past 12 months. There seems to be still a lot of ARMv7 devices around, and people on these devices care about Leap. Based on this feedback openSUSE Release team is now looking into ways how to bootstrap openSUSE Leap 15.3 for ARMv7. We don't want to let our users down. We will also look into what we can do about the Rasp Pi 4 issues (sound etc.). We will also see what can be done the multilib libraries. There was a also suggestion to support some newer devices or to provide images with different partition setup (no swap or avoiding separate /boot). Next step is that we will process the notes in a closer loop and will make sure to open features, bugs, poo tickets, contact right people to make sure we can be seen as one of the fine tuned distributions for all of these devices. The optional email contacts we've received as part of the survey will be kept within the openSUSE release team. I hope you we will find a great use for the data. Thank you once again. -- Lubos Kocman, Release Manager openSUSE Leap SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg - Germany (HRB 36809, AG Nürnberg) Geschäftsführer: Felix Imendörffer

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[opensuse-project] 2020 openSUSE Board Election Candidates.
by Ariez Vachha - openSUSE 02 Dec '20

02 Dec '20

Dear openSUSE members, The list of candidates and their respective profiles for the 2020 openSUSE Board Election are: * Axel Braun - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/docb * Maurizio Galli - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/mauriziogalli * Neal Gompa - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/Pharaoh_Atem * Gertjan Lettink - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/Knurpht * Mark Stopka - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/m4r3k * Nathan Wolf - https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/futureboy Members are encouraged to refer to the candidates profiles at the links above. Candidates, we wish you all good luck! Please remember to updated your details and pictures on your profiles, wikis etc., for the benefit of the members. The election committee will use your profile pictures in the official election poster and materials. Please refer to https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election for details. -- Regards, The Election Committee: election-officials(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] 2020 Board Elections: my platform
by Maurizio Galli 01 Dec '20

01 Dec '20

Hello fellow Geekos, First of all thank you to the Election committee for the work done. > * Maurizio Galli - > https://connect.opensuse.org/pg/profile/mauriziogalli In addition to my Connect profile, I set up my candidate platform here: https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Board_election_2020_platform_m4u9 Cheers, Maurizio -- Maurizio Galli (m4u9) Xfce Team https://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Xfce

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[opensuse-project] openSUSE Release Engineering Meeting 01.12.2020 - ARM usecases initial review
by Lubos Kocman 01 Dec '20

01 Dec '20

Ahoy openSUSE let me thank you all for participating in the survey. The amount of responses was enormous (way more than entire Leap 15.2 release retro)! Let me share thoughts from initial review by peoplew ho came up with the survey. We definitely want to do this on release2release basis so we can see trends. There will be two public rounds of survey review tomorrow on jitsi, everybody is welcome to grab coffee/tee and join. More information can be seen in the invitation from Doug https://news.opensuse.org/2020/12/01/opensuse-release-team-to-share-results… All meeting minutes can be found here: https://etherpad.opensuse.org/p/ReleaseEngineering-meeting Participants: dimstar, dirk, lkocman, a_faerber, maxlin, guillaume_g The survey template for the future: https://etherpad.opensuse.org/p/survey-armv7-suggestions Q: Which ARMv6/ARMv7/ARMv8 (aarch64) hardware are you using? The option 'AArch64 based general purpose (e.g. Mustang, ThunderX/X2, Any UEFI AArch64 platform, aarch64-laptops, other) (SQ05)' contains a lot of choices. We need to break it down to the future. UEFI/aarch64 covers a huge - U-Boot implemented UEFI, too. Perhaps other with text field would help. Q: What distributions do you use on your ARMv6/v7/aarch64 Hardware? Ideas: custom image can be misleading as it could be modified Leap 15.1/15.2/TW image or also unlisted item (JeOS). The original idea was a self-built image containing non-standard patches/package- set/configuration. Andreas: mention Kubic next time? (cf. 211 for G01Q06) consider MicroOS, too? Q: How long are you using openSUSE on ARMv6/v7/v8 already? Growth from 36 - 124 over past 4 years Q: In case you selected Leap, what is the reason for that? Andreas: Some comments look like people don't know that we have aarch64 TW images? cf. 151 for G01Q06 Dirk: we need to invest little bit more into getting Leap (on Arm) right. Q: Would you be okay with migrating your existing Leap installation to openSUSE Tumbleweed? we somehow missed ARMv8/AArch64 but that was due to the description which was ARMv6/7 specific. Andreas: perhaps split questions into two. If you run Leap would you consider Leap question yes/no and vice versa (or split by architecture). Q: Please share us with any information you might want to add in addition. We need to do more marketing/blog posts around aarch64 Raspberry Pi (RPi4 in particular) Lubos: perhaps make a blog post with summary of our userbase and summarize current Arm situation in openSUSE project (what's available and what not). * Sound for Raspberry Pi 4 requested, let's make sure that plan is mentioned in the blog post. Not yet tracked by SUSE for backporting to SP3? Dirk: suggests to do a user case specific blog post for raspi-pi4 (e.g. first contact with opensource world, or computer for kids). Perhaps use the trend of RPi 400. Andreas: someone should test the RPi400 if we do the blog post. Andreas: can we do something so that openSUSE is perceived as more fine-tuned for Raspberry Pi? So it's comparable to e.g. raspbian Guillaume: I think this could be video decoding. Andreas: config tool on Raspbian for editing config.txt - consider a YaST Raspberry Pi module similar to raspi-config? Multilib on aarch64: apps like citrix seem to require 32bit libs. Can we ship multilib on Arm? Guillaume: Rasp Pi4 is capable of running both 32/64bit libs, but some Armv8 hardware are 64-bit only and would need ILP32. (zypper does not allow to install armv7 rpm packages on aarch64) - Andreas: note that ILP32 libs would not help Citrix apps, right? G: ILP32 would not help for 32-bit libs and ILP32 is unlikely to reach upstream. Andreas: -32bit packages seen for ilp32 project, do we need to enable this via some setting? (careful: do not confuse AArch32/armv7 and ILP32 here, we'd need aarch32 in a way that doesn't rule out ilp32 in the future). G: Please do not enable ILP32, there is no support upstream! Dirk: 32bit builds are in fact done on ARMv8 (Andreas: and hopefully not picking up Armv8 features) Andreas: While Raspberry Pi 1 is no longer sold, Raspberry Pi 0W still is, as "new" Armv6 device (G: It should remain in production until at least January 2026). Would be interesting to monitor how to Armv6 numbers evolve over time (getting less vs. going up?) Andreas: report of issues with Raspberry Pi firmware in transactional update mode (157) Andreas: report of problems with RPi.GPIO on RPi3/RPi4 (241) ddemaio: Might consider adding a demographic question to the survey to know when best to brief results to community. Something like "What region are you in. [] Asia [] EMEA [] Americas

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[opensuse-project] openSUSE Foundation status + creating the transition team
by Syds Bearda 01 Dec '20

01 Dec '20

Hi all, I've been reading up on the Foundation proposal and i wonder what is the current status? I see a few outstanding issues since August 2020: 1) Discussions with SUSE regarding trademarking; 2) Decision on the legal format of the Foundation; 3) Board is waiting on people to come forward to help in the transition and analysis of legal + financial challenges. 1) Trademarking - Are these talks ongoing at the moment? (also who are having these talks?); - Has a lawyer looked at it already?; - Also what about paying an annual license to SUSE for the use of the openSUSE trademark while naming the Foundation "Geeko Foundation"? As why does the foundation need to be named after the distro's it's supporting? Why not keep it more general? I mean we have loads of different flavours of openSUSE with Leap, Tumblewed, Kubic, MicroOS, etc. Maybe in the future even other distro's will come our way that doe not bear the name openSUSE <xxx>.. 2) Legal Format - I see 3 options; Foundation or e.V. if going with German Law, or a different countries type of foundation (maybe a different EU country..); - Has a Lawyer already drawn up the required documents? 3) Transition team - have some people stepped forward?; - is there already a working group who is having regular meetings with minutes and action-points? Also i would like to step forward to help in the transition team on the financial side. I'm a financial controller with a MSc in Accountancy and I've worked in international environments and with not-for-profit organisations in the past (including helping in setting up a German gGmbH). On a last note I'd like to point out that I'm in favor of having a separate foundation for the project, where the financial and legal side of the project resides. Mainly for donations, sponsorships and the ability to make decisions in the best interest of the community without feeling that we need to listen to one particular group extra. Which does not mean that the two groups can't be mutually beneficent for each other. BR, Syds

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