July 2015 - openSUSE Project - openSUSE Mailing Lists

[opensuse-project] membership_officials team
by jdd 17 Jul '15

17 Jul '15

Hello, I began three days ago to makes clear who is willing to keep working with the membership_officials team https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Membership_officials#Members giving we are on summer and the verification began only few days ago, not having an answer is not a real problem. But I write here, because if you are member of the team and didn't receive any mail from me on the last days, may be your e-mail is not correctly setup on my side, please correct (PM is ok) as you may see in the link, I have right now only 4 people active (and answering), one more not willing to participate here anymore and 10 which I await answer. some of them are wery well known openSUSE members that may not have time for this team for very good reasons. anyway, I will come again in one week and we may have to find new team members (I don't know how the team member are chosen, I guess by the board). thanks jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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Re: [opensuse-project] Leap 42.1: Positioning / USP
by Jay 17 Jul '15

17 Jul '15

Am Freitag, 17. Juli 2015, 15:00:47 schrieb Bruno Friedmann: > On Friday 17 July 2015 12.35:15 Jay wrote: > > Am Freitag, 17. Juli 2015, 11:13:26 schrieb Martin Schlander: > > > Torsdag den 16. juli 2015 18:17:24 skrev Jay: > > > > So I took a look at Leap again. When using the latest LTS-kernel > > > > > > > with the SUSE-packages, it has the following features/benefits: > > > Some of these are questionable. > > > > > > > - hard to beat stability > > > > - continuity through long-term-support > > > > > > Already a lot of SLE core packages are being replaced (kernel, qt, gtk, > > > gnome, alsa, pulseaudio). Imagine how it will be in 42.2 and 42.3. > > > > > > I guess in the end the added "stability" and "continuity" will be > > > limited to systemd, the LAMP stack, GNU utils and maybe YaST. > > > Everything else will have the same stability as before or worse, > > > because the packages are tested more on Tumbleweed, than they will be > > > on Leap. > > > > "worse" would be bad indeed. > > But can really be an option, we have less than 6 months to build the > building By long experience, those are most of the time the not best > release we made. > > > Also there's a big question mark about how the service packs will be > > > announced and installed. The way things are looking to me the, the user > > > will need to keep track of service pack releases himself. And then > > > either > > > download an ISO and upgrade with that, or manually switch repos to 42.2 > > > and > > > zypper dup every 12 months (maybe the YaST Wagon module will be > > > usable?). > > > Upgrading the desktop environment and all applications to new and > > > changed > > > versions. I'm not sure desktop users will perceive that as continuity, > > > even > > > if systemd and some other base packages don't change. Compare that e.g. > > > to > > > running 13.2 for 26 months, with nothing really changing. > > > > > > For server users the service packs will probably be less disruptive, so > > > they might experience some continuity, even if they need to > > > "distupgrade" every 12 months. But it's a complicated thing to > > > communicate to them I think.> > > Your'e painting a rather grim picture here. Hope this doesn't come true. > > I supposed those things would already be clear at this stage. > > I guess Martin is sharing is long time experience, and mine started around > 7.x will agree. Only in a few cycles we will see if we change the way we > release things. Actually yes there's just a bit too much question marks ;-) Yep! What's in need here is checkmarks! > > > > For me there are too many open questions to even begin considering a > > > strategy for how to market Leap. > > > > But it's about time if Leap is to be launched at the beginning of > > November. > > That's why I wrote this thing. > > > > Rainer Fiebig > > On my point of view, so To be taken with a grain of salt, I would stay very > humble on the promise of Leap at the beginning. > I believe it could hurt a lot if something is advertised and "sell as" and > we don't offer (at least at the very beginning) the level of quality we all > want. Too late for being humble! Take a look at the name: "Leap 42.1"! ;) With that name we won't ge a second chance to make a first impression! It's got to be a spot-landing at the first trial. ;) Rainer Fiebig -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-fr] RMLL (retour)
by jdd 16 Jul '15

16 Jul '15

the RMLL is one of the mai french speaking yearly show that happen each year in a different town. This year in Beauvis, France. https://2015.rmll.info/ openSUSE had a booth, thanks to Nicolas and Alionet. I could attend two days on the 8 days of the show. * first saturday, in front of the Cathedral and under the sun (apart a brief but strong storm on early morning), all went well, with a public not very large but motivated and friendly. Installation on Friday: http://dodin.info/piwigo/index.php?/category/5855 Saturday: http://dodin.info/piwigo/index.php?/category/5848 The salamander is a symbol of Beauvais, gecko like, isn't it? http://dodin.info/piwigo/picture.php?/110158-dsc04906_11134/category/5848 Small video: http://dodin.info/piwigo/index.php?/category/5843 * On Monday, at the Campus, distros where parked on a small hall and we had no network, so not that good for demos and installs. We didn't see many people. Where here openSUSE, ubuntu, mageia and fedora. http://dodin.info/piwigo/index.php?/category/5868 Summary: It's worth going on Saturday (public days), may be on Sunday if RMLL are in a large city (Beauvais is quite small). For the rest of the week it would be more useful to have two or so workshops Thanks Nicolas for his implication - he was nearly alone for the rest of the week. others may give infos on the other days? jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] The Name & Version for the new openSUSE Regular Distribution
by Richard Brown 09 Jul '15

09 Jul '15

Hi all, Drum roll please. First we would like to thank everyone who participated in the naming discussion [1][2] for the input and for entrusting the board to bring the process to a conclusion. After due deliberations and consulting with the release and maintenance teams we have decided the name and version of the next release should be openSUSE Leap 42.x We felt that Leap, with reference to motion, i.e. how the distribution moves forward, provides a nice contrast to Tumbleweed. It also represents that we are taking a leap to get there. It does not cast is into a mold that would set the precedence of openSUSE <plant_name> which we think would have encouraged a regular debate as new <plant_names> were considered for each product or release to go with the theme. Finally it leaves the door open for plenty of options should there be other efforts to create an openSUSE release based on Factory snapshots at some point in the future. As far as the version number is concerned we concluded that 42 is a great starting point due to the historical reference in the project. It's quirky and we felt it suits us well. We deliberated other options such as starting at 1.x or some other arbitrary number such as 22 but we preferred 42. Additionally 42 has already gotten some notoriety and thus we might as well stick with it. In the end we all know the number is more or less arbitrary and the important point is that it increases going forward ;) .x is used to indicate the service pack of SLE from which the sources originate. We expect the first release to be 42.1 because we intend to have the release aligned and sharing code with SLE 12 SP1. The major version will increase alongside the major version of the shared SLE sources, therefore a SLE 13 SP2 servicepack based release would be named openSUSE Leap 43.2 Thanks again to everyone for helping out. Special thanks to Rainer Fiebig, a new contributor who after seeing a news article about 'openSUSE 42' joined our mailinglist and proposed this new name for our new baby. Your openSUSE Board [1] http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-factory/2015-06/msg00314.html [2] http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-project/2015-06/msg00340.html -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] How to name the baby
by Robert Schweikert 03 Jul '15

03 Jul '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Oh no, not another lengthy thread.... I am afraid it is going to be, but hopefully we can stick to the topic and only focus on the name. A brief summary: Stephan as the release manager has decided that he will concentrate on building a distribution around the project known as openSUSE:42. In [1] he also tried to start the discussion about the naming of the new distro. However, this did get sidetracked rather quickly, thus, please focus on naming only. - - Not all questions for the new release have been answered, we do not need to revisit this. Some answers will only emerge as the baby starts to crawl and then walk.... - - Just because Stephan will take on the release manager responsibilities of a distro around the SLE sources does not preclude another person or team to build/release... a distro based on Factory snapshots. As the distribution is a representation of the project as a whole, i.e. all contributors, I think it is fair that people get an opportunity to weigh in with their concerns. This view may not be shared by everyone, so please bare with the rest of us as your mailbox once again fills up ;) However, to those participating in the discussion please focus on the name not on side issues. It has been advocated in other threads that a vote on the name should be considered as the final solution. There are reasonable arguments for and against such a direction. Thus, lets not focus on the voting part at this point either, lets just focus on the name and see where the discussion goes. If this should or should not be voted on can be a separate discussion once we collectively understand the concerns people have with respect to the name. In a "thread renaming" post we have had the following suggestion: * openSUSE Oak """" So how about Oak? It's a solid tree, it fits with the green theme and it will give us: * openSUSE Tumbleweed * openSUSE Oak """" "openSLES" has also been suggested a few times but lets just say that we will probably run afoul with a number of legal restrictions. Plus it is not really SLES, it is based on SLES sources and not a verbatim build of the SLES sources. My suggestion would be to focus on the name while considering that we should not create a name that would produce a potential conflict as described in [2], also consider the reply [3] So please lets focus on the name the child might have. State your case for the name you propose, include in the proposal a numbering scheme, if you think we should stick with numbers. Staring at 1 for a numbering scheme has rather obvious disadvantages, all other numbers are probably equally arbitrary, but you can certainly state the case why the number being proposed is favorable. I propose the above as the guidelines for the naming discussion. I will add my personal opinion about the name as a follow up post. Lets see if I can manage to stay within my own proposed guidelines ;) I apologize to those that are subscribed to both the -factory and the - -project list. However I know that there are a number of people that are not following -project but follow -factory, thus the cross post. As I mentioned, I believe that the distribution represents all of us and thus everyone should have their chance to weigh in on the name given to the baby that represents the community. Let the fun begin. Robert [1] http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-factory/2015-06/msg00203.html [2] http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-project/2015-06/msg00278.html [3] http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-project/2015-06/msg00280.html - -- Robert Schweikert MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU Public Cloud Architect LINUX rjschwei(a)suse.com IRC: robjo -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVgJlWAAoJEE4FgL32d2UkO9gH/i/TzZ9ayW2m2LAOryTk1mPT 4nViWBbxPH9NA1QVMlTc+bGpauuny7VWDz1GSZgF6aNXu8RQA+FJ914H3DOOiGJP C8y8Ik2aLikWOjVU/ZkF9F3YOY/Qt/gdia1LVJQnz5l5EsA98vjLpjNjV3grDlTy jmwogwCrR8WUoPx2YPompuqxePeZTjNFcQpa5i76TQhXj+afX5FKKVxSlWQlra8Q iS+h/3ke+28hUvAAeSQk3ufbfiuSN+93JX7R01N/Ni+03KX5CR0asTk+Go2KZ91F aQnaEXNeWWVyAB21GOcAe5m5duKWgkB59A0Wu3EjiS4Y+2+kRssZ38dF8Y/dLrI= =183F -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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Re: Post to opensuse-project@opensuse.org denied: Re: [opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] How to name the baby -- A Summary
by george kanakis 02 Jul '15

02 Jul '15

Board decision as well. On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 8:40 PM, <opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org> wrote: > Hi, this is the Mlmmj program managing the <opensuse-project(a)opensuse.org> > mailing list. > > The message from <gkanos(a)gmail.com> with subject "Re: [opensuse-project] > Re: [opensuse-factory] How to name the baby -- A Summary" was unable to be > delivered to the list because of an access rule set up by the list > administrator. > > (The denied message is below.) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: george kanakis <gkanos(a)gmail.com> > To: opensuse-project(a)opensuse.org > Cc: > Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2015 20:40:35 +0200 > Subject: Re: [opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] How to name the baby -- A Summary > Board decision from me as well > > On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 7:38 PM, Jim Henderson <hendersj(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Duplicating my response in the other ML (just in case): >> >> Board decision >> >> -- >> Jim Henderson >> Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits >> >> -- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org >> To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org >> > > -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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Re: [opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] How to name the baby -- A Summary
by Craig Gardner 02 Jul '15

02 Jul '15

On Thursday 02 July 2015 08:48:32 Robert Schweikert wrote: > I would like to bring this back to the question from the summary, > "vote" or "board decision" Board Decision -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] How to name the baby -- A Summary
by Carlos E. R. 02 Jul '15

02 Jul '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2015-07-02 13:50, Richard Brown wrote: > There's one problem I foresee with 'Oak' that Leap doesn't suffer > from > > With Oak, there will be a tendency to consider other 'Tree names' > for each release No, the tree name is for the kind of the distribution. Not tree, but plant or something vegetable: evergreen, tumbleweed, oak... The release would be a number. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlWVKVkACgkQja8UbcUWM1wJOQEAg84MxMZhLOyhIvm4+MVIIUYy fyzaY6nPqWhWUNOx2o4A/icm0PO8AqHMvE7KD9SQ45ZmQ1PpDPQvmDT4Ls+DQcAx =gDrM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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[opensuse-project] Marketing Definitions from oSC15
by Home 02 Jul '15

02 Jul '15

Dear community, I wanted to come into the overarching discussion of defining out target audience for the project after reviewing the board’s presentation at oSC15. At this meeting the discussed a few key points with which they are making a proposal to the team to work on a more targeted audience to build the strength of the project. While many of us can agree or disagree that the Board’s intention is correct, incorrect, relevant or irrelevant. I believe there is great insight to be gained from their proposal to think about for the very near future. I feel that if we do not put cards on the table, we lose the ways in which we are strong together and weak by ourselves. For a very long time, even before the Board explained this improved aim, we have had issues or deep thoughts about where the project is going; what the project’s direction is. When will we be able to think of the project as a driving force in Open Source? These are a few things that matter and are worth reviewing. It seems that every so often we work on doing an introspection to find the strength within to continue with the project. With this introduction in mind, I invite you to read on. This email will be long, you have been warned! The Board explained in our most recent conference that the current project seems aimless, given that we tend to be the distribution of everyone doing everything, and at the same time, being the distribution that does nothing and belongs to no one. Our aim seems lost and we must find it to gain strength and followers. The openSUSE Board did an exercise where they placed different audiences against a set of core features that are part of the distribution and project. The clever arrangement showed the amount of connections that a target audience could make with our current technologies, particular to openSUSE. They noted that despite the lack of marketing done for this distribution for 13.2, we nonetheless had the highest download numbers ever for our distribution. So, there is something to say about the distribution that works itself as a popular choice underground; without much intervention, or that the methods we were able to use last minute, were really good and strong. They defined the openSUSE’s areas of strength. They are tools, packages, and distributions. It should be noted that these are very technically centered, where there could probably be room for other areas of strength in the project. However, we can leave that discussion for later. They considered ISVs but were quickly ruled it out because of their lack of connections to the areas of strength. They also matched system administrators, and developers. Again the list was short and oriented to the technical audience. Given these strengths the Board felt that our highest “match” would be a developer audience looking to find a solid distribution where their development environments would be stable and productive. Throughout the discussion, I took a few notes and questions that I invite the Board and all of us to try to answer. By “answer” I mean “answer.” Please shy away from confrontational discussions on values, morals, personal attachment and look at this discussion in the light of the evidence and what seems rational, sensical, and forward-thinking. Here are some questions that I think we should think about from a Marketing standpoint. Some of them are more fundamental than others but for each of their particular value, please take a minute to ponder and provide feedback. 1. The project looks for marketing strength in the light of the technologies that the distribution currently ships with each distribution. Kiwi, OBS, Tumbleweed, etc. Are the strengths of the project only based on technological advancement? If yes or no, which ones do you think are a strength to the project and which ones do you think are not valuable to the project? Should they all be technical, should they not? 2. The Board feels that a Developer audience, and maybe a System Administrator audience, is a strong focal point for our marketing. What are the strengths and weaknesses of approaching, via marketing, to these two main audiences? 3. Given the lesser marketing push for 13.2, which resulted in increased download numbers, should we think of a strong push for marketing through our traditional channels? Making the counter, creating banners for online sites such as Facebook, Google +, Twitter. Creating a page on our site to promote the release, creating a release announcement to distribute, etc. 4. What are the thoughts around the strength of a developer community versus other target audiences such as education, public service, finance, medicine, research, general public, non-technical users, gamers, etc? What are the merits of a developer community target as opposed to others? 5. If there is a marked marketing strategy resulting in practical application, what the core activities that we should do for the project in marketing terms to target a developer audience versus what we currently do? 6. The project is large and has a few diverse areas of focus. If we are targeting developers, should we keep or remove initiatives that do not align with the target audience in hopes that by concentrating efforts into one audience will produce a better outcome in the end? For example, why work on integrating so many desktop platforms when a developer might simply care to have support for specific languages, a command line, a text editor and a compiler? If a development environment is an aim, should we not remove efforts that go into areas unrelated to a development environment? There may be more questions that I could formulate as we move along the subject, but I ask you to limit your answers to the ones above and we can lead a separate discussion for derivative subjects on a different thread. Thank you team Andy (anditosan) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe(a)opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner(a)opensuse.org

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