On 06/14/2012 01:39 PM, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On 14.06.2012 13:35, Angelos Tzotsos wrote:
On 06/14/2012 01:52 PM, todd rme wrote:
3. As working more strictly will require more time, I would like to either ditch release schedules all together or release only once a year and then rebase Tumbleweed - as already discussed in the RC1 thread. What if we do it the other way around? We have Tumbleweed as the "official" openSUSE version (which is only rebased when SLES is released), and we periodically pull out a version of Tumbleweed and release it as a versioned openSUSE? This version would be frozen with a specific set of package versions, and the release cycle would only involve fixing problems in those versions? That way we avoid the
On Thu, Jun 14, 2012 at 10:46 AM, Stephan Kulow
wrote: problem of new updates breaking existing fixes during the polishing phase. -Todd Very good idea :)
Please be a bit more verbatim in this thread - I tried to ask very kindly, but let me put it again a bit harsher:
Mhm, maybe this is only my personal POV, but I sense this as being actually _the_ issue stopping contributors from contributing... So my (slightly off-topical due to not offering any technical) idea is this: Instead of throwing yet more scripts, OBS features and policy at this apparent issue, how about we all try to establish a more welcoming and open-minded spirit of doing community work. I mean, I certainly have my share in breaking Factory, but more than once I had to question myself if that is all worth it given all the flaming on the lists. For me, this question is still easily answered but (I know) there are a lot of guys that lost interest due to being sick of being told how stupid/incompetent/ignorant they are. Similarly, the question is why open requests, a red Factory monitor page and reminder mails are still being ignored. IMO because they're all technical solutions to a social issue, too. In my experience, things start to change radically if you talk to people in person (or via personal e-mails). I do think this is because one actually starts to identify with the issue and the people you talk with. Also, it becomes clear who's responsible for fixing it. This surely isn't the case with anonymous mails or requests to a whole bunch of (inactive) OBS project maintainers. They're far to easy to ignore (for me too). The truth is, most community members don't get money to work on Factory, but I see two major reasons to do it anyway: - Scratching your own itch - Getting kudos While the first one is truly a personal thing, the second one can really matter. Positive feedback about something you achieved is way more motivating than "you forgot to also fix these 30 other packages", or "oh cool, now you broke $X" or even "we gonna drop your stuff if you don't fix it by $Y days" ;-) Getting back to the responsibility thing, I think we should drop all maintainers from all OBS project instead of the two (or three) most active ones. We have projects with over 30 maintainers, where nobody does anything because the others could do so too (a famous excuse btw.). Long story short, my point is about: - being nice and friendly - communicating personally - making people feel responsible
please no fan boys in this thread. If you know how factory is developed, if you suffered the problems of running or developing against factory, share your insight.
But if you just try to add noise to the thread - DO NOT!
Greetings, Stephan
-- Viele Grüße, Sascha Peilicke