[zypp-devel] OSI: openSUSE Installer Presentation

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Raul Romero

18 Dec 2008 18 Dec '08

12:05

Hello everyone, My name is Raúl Romero, and I'm a openSUSE Member. I have an idea that I want to share with you: Off-Line one click install (MSI for Linux) Same concept as MSI packages for Windows but exploiting the One Click Install concept of openSUSE (and therefore inheriting the simplicity, code and security). Basically a compressed file which includes a repository inside, plus one click install information, and a script to trigger the oneclickinstall handler with the data as payload in the script. Therefore is a collection of rpms that can be installed. Detailed description is here http://en.opensuse.org/OSI There is a feature open at https://features.opensuse.org/?rm=feature_show&id=305582 Thanks for your time, and best regards. -- Raúl Romero [^BgTA^] - http://www.bgta.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

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Dominique Leuenberger

18 Dec 18 Dec

13:12

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On 12/18/2008 at 1:05 PM, "Raul Romero" wrote: Hello everyone,

My name is Raúl Romero, and I'm a openSUSE Member. I have an idea that I want to share with you:

Off-Line one click install (MSI for Linux)

Same concept as MSI packages for Windows but exploiting the One Click Install concept of openSUSE (and therefore inheriting the simplicity, code and security).

Hi, This sounds pretty interesting, but by reading this I end up with a question: - what if some of the missing dependencies that are not in 'my' repository are missing on the target system? 1-click-install is usually just getting them and most ymp files simply add the online repos of openSUSE as repositories (they are probably activated on almost every system). So in case I have an 'offline-1-click-setup), I have no way of guaranteeing that any random library (could be any random library for example). To guarantee that all this would be working on every single target machine, I'd have to make the offline-1-click contain all of it's dependencies... and very soon I would call it a distribution. Did I miss the crucial part where this was explained? Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Raul Romero

13:33

Hi Dominique, OSI's bundle will contain all those dependencies that are not within the standard openSUSE repository. The basis of the idea of OSI, is that the user will have at least the standard repository of openSUSE, either because they have their online version or the version in DVD / CD installation. Additionally, OSI uses the technology "One Click Install", so it may recommend as an option the online version that contains the most current package of what is going to install. P.D: Sorry for my bad english :) -- Raúl Romero [^BgTA^] - http://www.bgta.net On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 2:12 PM, Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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Hi,

This sounds pretty interesting, but by reading this I end up with a question: - what if some of the missing dependencies that are not in 'my' repository are missing on the target system? 1-click-install is usually just getting them and most ymp files simply add the online repos of openSUSE as repositories (they are probably activated on almost every system).

So in case I have an 'offline-1-click-setup), I have no way of guaranteeing that any random library (could be any random library for example). To guarantee that all this would be working on every single target machine, I'd have to make the offline-1-click contain all of it's dependencies... and very soon I would call it a distribution.

Did I miss the crucial part where this was explained?

Dominique

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Dominique Leuenberger

13:33

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On 12/18/2008 at 2:33 PM, "Raul Romero" wrote: Hi Dominique,

OSI's bundle will contain all those dependencies that are not within the standard openSUSE repository.

The basis of the idea of OSI, is that the user will have at least the standard repository of openSUSE, either because they have their online version or the version in DVD / CD installation.

Additionally, OSI uses the technology "One Click Install", so it may recommend as an option the online version that contains the most current package of what is going to install.

Ok, then it does actually pretty much what I expected: It expects me to have an internet connection in order to access the default repositories ;) Depending on the fact that the user has 'at least the DVD' is not enough, as the online repo is much larger than what is shipped on the DVD. Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Dominique Leuenberger

13:38

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On 12/18/2008 at 2:33 PM, "Raul Romero" wrote: Hi Dominique,

OSI's bundle will contain all those dependencies that are not within the standard openSUSE repository.

A short advise for readability of your script from the wiki. You could change cat installer.ymp | sed "s/\${REPO_URL}/file:\/\/\/tmp\/$TARGET_NAME\/root\/repo\//" > installer.ymp to sed -i "s/\${REPO_URL}/file:\/\/\/tmp\/$TARGET_NAME\/root\/repo\//" installer.ymp Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Raul Romero

13:56

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A short advise for readability of your script from the wiki.

You could change cat installer.ymp | sed "s/\${REPO_URL}/file:\/\/\/tmp\/$TARGET_NAME\/root\/repo\//" > installer.ymp

to

sed -i "s/\${REPO_URL}/file:\/\/\/tmp\/$TARGET_NAME\/root\/repo\//" installer.ymp

Dominique

You're quite right. I updated the script. Thanks very much! -- Raúl Romero [^BgTA^] - http://www.bgta.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Stanislav Visnovsky

13:15

Hi! On Thursday 18 December 2008 13:05:10 Raul Romero wrote:

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Hello everyone,

My name is Raúl Romero, and I'm a openSUSE Member. I have an idea that I want to share with you:

Off-Line one click install (MSI for Linux)

Same concept as MSI packages for Windows but exploiting the One Click Install concept of openSUSE (and therefore inheriting the simplicity, code and security).

Basically a compressed file which includes a repository inside, plus one click install information, and a script to trigger the oneclickinstall handler with the data as payload in the script. Therefore is a collection of rpms that can be installed.

Detailed description is here http://en.opensuse.org/OSI

Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information. Stano -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Jan Kupec

13:59

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

...

Hi!

On Thursday 18 December 2008 13:05:10 Raul Romero wrote:

...
Hello everyone,

My name is Raúl Romero, and I'm a openSUSE Member. I have an idea that I want to share with you:

Off-Line one click install (MSI for Linux)

Same concept as MSI packages for Windows but exploiting the One Click Install concept of openSUSE (and therefore inheriting the simplicity, code and security).

Basically a compressed file which includes a repository inside, plus one click install information, and a script to trigger the oneclickinstall handler with the data as payload in the script. Therefore is a collection of rpms that can be installed.

Detailed description is here http://en.opensuse.org/OSI

Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Is it possible to install an add-on product by downloading & opening a file? - -- cheers, jano Ján Kupec YaST team - ---------------------------------------------------------(PGP)--- Key ID: 637EE901 Fingerprint: 93B9 C79B 2D20 51C3 800B E09B 8048 46A6 637E E901 - ---------------------------------------------------------(IRC)--- Server: irc.freenode.net Nick: jniq Channels: #zypp #yast #suse #susecz - ---------------------------------------------------------(EOF)--- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAklKV10ACgkQgEhGpmN+6QFw2wCeM9rDB79TUIih0uHAYRziUX9B DxkAn3C6HXc88cktE3tCCQW9NIpj6vUL =8/ey -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Lukas Ocilka

14:04

Jan Kupec wrote:

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Detailed description is here http://en.opensuse.org/OSI Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Is it possible to install an add-on product by downloading & opening a file?

In general? Yes it is. If that file contains information about which URL should be used as a new repository. Add-On product handling then takes the additional information (required packages/patterns/installation workflow) from installation.xml and/or content file. L.

Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett

15:58

Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

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Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes. But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way. I have never seen any webpage offering an addon that you can download and then click from your desktop and get a YaST wizard to install it. And that is why I find interesting from the concept, I think there is value to exploit here. You may be right that technically, using the addon concept + the missing glue is a better technical solution than Raul's prototype. But the idea remains the same. The thread should focuse on how to get there. Any technical solution is valid. - May be we only lack a small glue here to allow a one click install from a downloaded file - May be we only lack easy mime type info (to recognize an addon file in the desktop) - May be we lack marketing on how to create an addon for people wanting just to distribute a set of interdependent packages - May be it is possible and I just haven't seen it. Duncan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Benji Weber

16:10

2008/12/18 Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett :

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Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

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Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I'm also not sure that add on products would currently allow us to create distribution independent bundles, which is something that would be nice. -- Benjamin Weber -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Dominique Leuenberger

16:30

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On 12/18/2008 at 5:10 PM, "Benji Weber" wrote: 2008/12/18 Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett : Stanislav Visnovsky wrote: Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I'm also not sure that add on products would currently allow us to create distribution independent bundles, which is something that would be nice.

That would basically require building against an LSB base project. I think that's the only way this CAN be achieved. But then the /sbin/yast2 part of the suggested OSI is not suitable. Latest at this stage you end up not being able to use any package manager (well, wrong. There is PackageKit). Or you get to the 'traditional' setups known from commercial game publishers. After all those work as well. Downside: almost everything is statically linked or they bring it themself in the lib dir of the application. and there goes the nice concept of shared libraries and being able to fix security iessues at a single spot... urghs. Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett

16:40

Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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That would basically require building against an LSB base project. I think that's the only way this CAN be achieved.

Why? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Michael Andres

17:00

On Thursday 18 December 2008 17:30:28 Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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On 12/18/2008 at 5:10 PM, "Benji Weber" wrote:

2008/12/18 Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett :

...
Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

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Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I'm also not sure that add on products would currently allow us to create distribution independent bundles, which is something that would be nice.

That would basically require building against an LSB base project. I think that's the only way this CAN be achieved. But then the /sbin/yast2 part of the suggested OSI is not suitable. Latest at this stage you end up not being able to use any package manager (well, wrong. There is PackageKit).

You could also try to detect an appropriate package manager, or simply call osi_install /tmp/$TARGET_NAME/root/installer.ymp and leave it to the admin/distributor to provide an appropriate implementation of it. Or without osi_install fall back to 'rpm -Uvh' hoping the dependencies are resolved. -- cu, Michael Andres +------------------------------------------------------------------+ Key fingerprint = 2DFA 5D73 18B1 E7EF A862 27AC 3FB8 9E3A 27C6 B0E4 +------------------------------------------------------------------+ Michael Andres YaST Development ma@novell.com SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nuernberg) Maxfeldstrasse 5, D-90409 Nuernberg, Germany, ++49 (0)911 - 740 53-0 +------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Benji Weber

18:14

2008/12/18 Dominique Leuenberger :

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On 12/18/2008 at 5:10 PM, "Benji Weber" wrote: 2008/12/18 Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett : Stanislav Visnovsky wrote: Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I'm also not sure that add on products would currently allow us to create distribution independent bundles, which is something that would be nice.

That would basically require building against an LSB base project. I think that's the only way this CAN be achieved. But then the /sbin/yast2 part of the suggested OSI is not suitable. Latest at this stage you end up not being able to use any package manager (well, wrong. There is PackageKit).

I was more thinking of how OCI allows different instructions for different distributions in the same file. Each distribution follows its own instructions. -- Benjamin Weber -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Raul Romero

16:10

The idea of OSI is not new. It's similar to PBI files of PC-BSD. Look this page for some examples: http://www.pbidir.com/ In the future, opensuse.org could have a url with contents like pbidir.com... -- Raúl Romero [^BgTA^] - http://www.bgta.net On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 4:58 PM, Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett wrote:

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Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

...
Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I have never seen any webpage offering an addon that you can download and then click from your desktop and get a YaST wizard to install it. And that is why I find interesting from the concept, I think there is value to exploit here.

You may be right that technically, using the addon concept + the missing glue is a better technical solution than Raul's prototype. But the idea remains the same. The thread should focuse on how to get there. Any technical solution is valid.

- May be we only lack a small glue here to allow a one click install from a downloaded file - May be we only lack easy mime type info (to recognize an addon file in the desktop) - May be we lack marketing on how to create an addon for people wanting just to distribute a set of interdependent packages - May be it is possible and I just haven't seen it.

Duncan

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

Stanislav Visnovsky

19 Dec 19 Dec

09:14

On Thursday 18 December 2008 16:58:49 Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett wrote:

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Stanislav Visnovsky wrote:

...
Frankly, I fail to see difference to the add-on product concept, which is basically a repository with addiotional information.

Technically yes.

But technically everything is the same. - Wav files are just compressed mp3s - Alien movie is just Jaws on a Spaceship

Innovation is usually the small final step/small difference that makes people use it in a different way.

I have never seen any webpage offering an addon that you can download and then click from your desktop and get a YaST wizard to install it. And that is why I find interesting from the concept, I think there is value to exploit here.

You may be right that technically, using the addon concept + the missing glue is a better technical solution than Raul's prototype. But the idea remains the same. The thread should focuse on how to get there. Any technical solution is valid.

Agreed. Stano

...

- May be we only lack a small glue here to allow a one click install from a downloaded file - May be we only lack easy mime type info (to recognize an addon file in the desktop) - May be we lack marketing on how to create an addon for people wanting just to distribute a set of interdependent packages - May be it is possible and I just haven't seen it.

Duncan

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org

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participants (8)

Benji Weber
Dominique Leuenberger
Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett
Jan Kupec
Lukas Ocilka
Michael Andres
Raul Romero
Stanislav Visnovsky