[SLE] 6.4 quality
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned? Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality. I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat. -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Frankly, I share your opinion. I've been using SuSE since the 5.3 distribution and this is the worse one that I have bought by far. What you have seen in the way of fixes are just that...the fixes. I can't get susefax or sendfax to work since the upgrade. I've had a ticket open on these since 4/22. When questioned about the status of the ticket I was told that the researchers haven't gotten back yet and that I might want to replace the libc library with the one from 6.3. I don't know about you but that a pretty big change for me!!! Now I know why SuSE gives 60 days of support. It takes that amount of time to answer a question. I've also seen others here complaining of the length of time to get answers. I can only suppose that all the dev folks are really, really busy trying to find fixes to outstanding problems. I know it's not SuSE's fault but I also can't get pgp to compile with 6.4. It compiles on 6.3 just fine. I've been seriously thinking of just going back to 6.3. I sure as hell am NOT going to upgrade any other host for a long time. The one I did upgrade was only a test and I'm happy I used that one first!!! Gerry On Fri, 5 May 2000, Derek Fountain wrote:
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned?
Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality.
I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Gerry "The lyf so short, the craft so long to learne" Chaucer -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned?
Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality.
I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat.
-- I would concur with SuSE 6.4 being the poorest so far. Of course once all the
On 05-May-00 Derek Fountain wrote:
patches are applied the resultant is up to spec. But it shipped too early.
After this one, I'm seriously thinking of switching to something Debian based
(Stormix?) the next time I do any major updates to my system.
-----------------------------------
Arlen Carlson
Arlen Carlson wrote:
I would concur with SuSE 6.4 being the poorest so far. Of course once all the patches are applied the resultant is up to spec. But it shipped too early. After this one, I'm seriously thinking of switching to something Debian based (Stormix?) the next time I do any major updates to my system.
Hmmm, I'm confused. I always thougt the sig was supposed to be four lines of text, not the message itself... So please cut your sig to four lines please. But my $0,02: I've done a fresh install with 6.4 and an upgrade: no problems at all. -- SuSE Linux 6.4 -o) | "Jesus saves...but Gretzky gets the rebound!" Kernel 2.2.14 /\ | -- Daniel Hinojosa on a i686 _\_v | mailto:frhart@home.nl | -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Is this a troll? I have had far less trouble over the years with SuSE than any other distro, especially RedHat. And RedHat only has 650M of krap to install. Netscape has always been broken on all distros, so that is a moot point. I havn't upgraded anything and this is coming from NS. Which I leave up most of the time. This seems like the best NS yet... I would say that you should look at the other distros a little closer. my2cts. Derek Fountain wrote:
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned?
Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality.
I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- Michael H. Collins http://www.linuxlink.com The Ultimate WM http://www.xfce.org Fun with the Austin Linux group http://www.austinlug.org Need a Real Texas Radio Fix? http://www.texasrebelradio.com -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
"Michael H. Collins" wrote:
Is this a troll? I have had far less trouble over the years with SuSE than any other distro, especially RedHat. And RedHat only has 650M of krap to install. Netscape has always been broken on all distros, so that is a moot point. I havn't upgraded anything and this is coming from NS. Which I leave up most of the time. This seems like the best NS yet...
I would say that you should look at the other distros a little closer.
No, it's not a troll. You're the only preson so far who has disagreed with me. Compared to RHL etc, SuSE-6.4 might be great. I've no intention of looking at other distros. But compared to SuSE-6.3, which is where I've just come from, 6.4 has loads of problems. I'm struggling to get it working with my laptop, and downloaded tens of megabytes of patches in the process. Lots of people are complaining about all sorts of stuff. This distro is going nowhere near my main workstation and servers, and it's only on my laptop because I need the later kernel, alsa and pcmcia stuff. SuSE is still the best distro in terms of what you get for the money, but this one has clearly been rushed out without enough testing. That's the sort of thing Microsoft do, and it's sad to see my favourite Linux vendor doing the same thing.
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned?
Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality.
I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- Michael H. Collins http://www.linuxlink.com The Ultimate WM http://www.xfce.org Fun with the Austin Linux group http://www.austinlug.org Need a Real Texas Radio Fix? http://www.texasrebelradio.com
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Derek Fountain wrote:
No, it's not a troll. You're the only preson so far who has disagreed with me. Compared to RHL etc, SuSE-6.4 might be great. I've no intention of looking at other distros. But compared to SuSE-6.3, which is where I've just come from, 6.4 has loads of problems. I'm struggling to get it working with my laptop, and downloaded tens of megabytes of patches in the process. Lots of people are complaining about all sorts of stuff. This distro is going nowhere near my main workstation and servers, and it's only on my laptop because I need the later kernel, alsa and pcmcia stuff.
SuSE is still the best distro in terms of what you get for the money, but this one has clearly been rushed out without enough testing. That's the sort of thing Microsoft do, and it's sad to see my favourite Linux vendor doing the same thing.
Derek, I was trying to figure out if 6.4 was more problemmatic than other versions of SuSE I've used. It's impossible for me to objectively assess this. I am trying to do far more with it than I used to. I have it running as my primary workstation/development box at work. I have three of my home systems running 6.4, and have done a lot more with them than I used to. I've hit a few bugs. I believe 6.4 may have more bugs on the surface. That is, the Netscape problem, or the path issue in the startkde, for example, are more obvious to the average user than, say, a tcsh bug in the Informix configuration script. One thing about 6.4 that is probably true is that the SuSE folks are really looking toward the next 'level' of SuSE. By that I mean XFree86 v4 with SaX2. They are also working on Yast2 which is surely a distraction from getting all the components in the current level perfect. I will admit sound was a problem for me. Then again, ALSA is brand spanking new, and I spent a lot of time with it before I went back to OSS. I can't complain about download time anymore. I now have DSL, which, BTW worked right away in 6.4. I've only had 6.4 for a month or so, and most of the problems I've had are corrected in patches. At least I don't have to screw with some stupid service pack CD that comes out once a year and must be completely reinstalled every time I make a change to the system. I know it can be frustrating to spend countless hours trying to configure things especially when you find out it's not your fault they don't work. Take a look at the SuSE distribution. There are 6 CDs full of software. SuSE is a ~300 person company. To me it is incredible they can produce this with the excellent quality they do. I have always worked with SuSE under the assumption that there will be problems. It is my job to find them, report them, and if I know how, tell them how to fix them. Yeah, I've done a bit of grumbling about 6.4, but I think it's important to remembr the folks at SuSE are human, they make mistakes, and they have feelings. If you are too hard on them, you may reduce their motivation to continue the outstanding performance they consistently deliver. I guess what I'm trying to say is, if you have problems, by all means, let people know. If you get frustrated, a bit of venting is inevitible, but running around using the "M" word doesn't do anybody a bit of good. Steve -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
My point was that the beta testing phase where you find bugs and report them should have been done before they put the CDs on the shelves. Redhat do a beta release or two before bringing out new distributions; I think, after experiencing the SuSE-6.4 CDs, SuSE should be doing the same. Being human and making the odd mistake is perfectly acceptable, but rushing out a substandard distro and making me resent paying for it is not sensible. My aim wasn't to reduce motivation, it was to give them a bit of a kick up the butt in order that they acknowledge that this isn't good enough. If people don't complain, SuSE won't know why their sales figures are dropping. As it is, I'll be a lot more cautious before jumping into 7.0. Hopefully they can limit the damage to that.
worked with SuSE under the assumption that there will be problems. It is my job to find them, report them, and if I know how, tell them how to fix them. Yeah, I've done a bit of grumbling about 6.4, but I think it's important to remembr the folks at SuSE are human, they make mistakes, and they have feelings. If you are too hard on them, you may reduce their motivation to continue the outstanding performance they consistently deliver.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
This isn't a troll either, but I've been using SuSE since 6.1, which was the first distro I was able to install and understand after various failed attempts as a complete newbie to install various varieties of RH and Caldera . SuSE was my salvation and 6.2 and 6.3 were even better. I am only mildly irritated by the mess-ups with kpackage and netscape although I think both are not really forgiveable. I don't know if this has happened to anyone else but on my setup Yast2 does not work with 6.4. It gets so far and then says "some error occured" and fails. Ok so I use Yast1 which I prefer anyway.. But if similar had happened when I first installed 6.1 I may well have given up on Linux finally. I've been trying to get my office to set up a demo Linux box for the IT crowd to see what it could reaaly do, but if I do that now I'd have to use Mandrake 7.0 rather than SuSE 6.4 to be confident of a really smooth GUI based install. Mike On Mon, 08 May 2000, Derek Fountain wrote: > "Michael H. Collins" wrote: > >
Is this a troll? I have had far less trouble over the years with SuSE than any other distro, especially RedHat. And RedHat only has 650M of krap to install. Netscape has always been broken on all distros, so that is a moot point. I havn't upgraded anything and this is coming from NS. Which I leave up most of the time. This seems like the best NS yet...
I would say that you should look at the other distros a little closer.
No, it's not a troll. You're the only preson so far who has disagreed with me. Compared to RHL etc, SuSE-6.4 might be great. I've no intention of looking at other distros. But compared to SuSE-6.3, which is where I've just come from, 6.4 has loads of problems. I'm struggling to get it working with my laptop, and downloaded tens of megabytes of patches in the process. Lots of people are complaining about all sorts of stuff. This distro is going nowhere near my main workstation and servers, and it's only on my laptop because I need the later kernel, alsa and pcmcia stuff.
SuSE is still the best distro in terms of what you get for the money, but this one has clearly been rushed out without enough testing. That's the sort of thing Microsoft do, and it's sad to see my favourite Linux vendor doing the same thing.
Is it my imagination, or is the 6.4 SuSE distro a pretty poor one as far as quality and beta testing is concerned?
Having just got 6.4, I went to the updates site to collect the patches which were relevant to me. I got 2 kernels, kpackage, kdebase, netscape, the X fixes, the Yast update, the gdb update and a few others. I left plenty behind. This involved a 40-something megabyte download - just as well I have a company connection. Most - not all, but most - of these fixes are for problems which were SuSE's fault. Shipping with a dodgy Netscape was a really stupid thing to do and just shows poor quality.
I can just see a new user buying 6.4, watching Netscape et al fall over, seeing that the fixes will take a day on the phone to download, then going off and buying Red Hat.
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- Michael H. Collins http://www.linuxlink.com The Ultimate WM http://www.xfce.org Fun with the Austin Linux group http://www.austinlug.org Need a Real Texas Radio Fix? http://www.texasrebelradio.com
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
participants (7)
-
adcarlso＠visinet.ca -
fountai＠hursley.ibm.com -
frhart＠home.nl -
gdoris＠home.com -
hattons＠bellatlantic.net -
mhtexcollins＠austin.rr.com -
michael.norman1＠which.net