SPAM: A good read re Microsoft and Novell
From: http://blogs.sun.com/webmink/entry/the_morning_after The word on the street is that Novell had some deep patent dirt on Microsoft and went proudly to demand their bounty. Negotiations proceeded over several months, and the result (hurriedly rescheduled to respond to Oracle) was today's shindig in San Francisco. So how was it that at the end of the day they ended up affirming software patents (something Microsoft wants and Free software people hate), set a precedent that open source distributors owe Microsoft money, slandered GNU/Linux as derivative and encumbered, and much more? Novell is now safe in the shade of a patent exchange and gets to talk about interoperability, a few private developers have a protection they hadn't been worrying about much and everyone else is left wondering if this means they are next for the visit from the Redmond enforcement department ... They went in seeking a huge payout, and emerged with the payout, yes - but also with a commitment to pay it back in royalties on open source software they sell. ------end-snip That last bit is what I don't get. Why does microsoft get royalties on open source software. Go to Novells page and read the agreement. And, yes, Rob Unsworth did post that link first. Hats off to Ron. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
On Sat, 4 Nov 2006 00:37:01 -0900 John Andersen wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
That last bit is what I don't get. Why does microsoft get royalties on open source software. Bingo! It's too soon to tell. But something is going to change in the future. As some have mentioned already, perhaps Samba will get pulled and something else will replace it that "enhances" windows & linux interoperatability. Just a wild hunch.
-- cheers, dg
Darko Gavrilovic wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
That last bit is what I don't get. Why does microsoft get royalties on open source software.
Bingo! It's too soon to tell. But something is going to change in the future. As some have mentioned already, perhaps Samba will get pulled and something else will replace it that "enhances" windows & linux interoperatability. Just a wild hunch.
I see it as a classic Divide-and-Conquer move directed at RedHat. First M'soft convinces the world that Novell / SuSE is the way to go for interoperability. Then when RedHat is pretty much out of the picture as a commercial force, they pull one of their classic changes of direction and leave Novell hanging in the breeze, having eliminated the other major force in the market. Then they can turn on Novell. Trust Microsoft? About as far as I can throw Bill Gates' bank statement.
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 10:26, Gordon Keehn wrote:
I see it as a classic Divide-and-Conquer move directed at RedHat. First M'soft convinces the world that Novell / SuSE is the way to go for interoperability. Then when RedHat is pretty much out of the picture as a commercial force, they pull one of their classic changes of direction and leave Novell hanging in the breeze, having eliminated the other major force in the market. Then they can turn on Novell. Trust Microsoft? About as far as I can throw Bill Gates' bank statement.
I think you've broken the code. I had thought that MS's plan was to put Novell/SuSE out of business but I hadn't thought about how they could get RH too. After 7 years of SuSE and being very happy with it, I just downloaded Kunbuntu. Probably will make the switch soon.
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 07:35, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 10:26, Gordon Keehn wrote:
I see it as a classic Divide-and-Conquer move directed at RedHat. First M'soft convinces the world that Novell / SuSE is the way to go for interoperability. Then when RedHat is pretty much out of the picture as a commercial force, they pull one of their classic changes of direction and leave Novell hanging in the breeze, having eliminated the other major force in the market. Then they can turn on Novell. Trust Microsoft? About as far as I can throw Bill Gates' bank statement.
I think you've broken the code. I had thought that MS's plan was to put Novell/SuSE out of business but I hadn't thought about how they could get RH too.
That is exactly the plan. Unfortunately, the suits at Novell can't see it. This has been the modus operandi for MS for years. Create FUD and turn people away from the leader to another competing product. Then drop the competitor leaving everyone running to Uncle Bill.
After 7 years of SuSE and being very happy with it, I just downloaded Kunbuntu. Probably will make the switch soon.
Let us know how it goes. I'd be curious if it is half as easy to maintain as SUSEsoft. -- kai ponte www.perfectreign.com
I've looked at Kubuntu a bit and one thing is for sure, there's better
support for KDE! I've never had a SuSE KDE update that didn't get
into dependency hell and/or screw up my install. There's never been
one that worked in my experience. It looks like Kubuntu gets KDE
versions up for update quite quickly. It's looking like a more
attractive option all the time. Since I think mono is a collossal
waste of effort and GNOME likewise, I think Novell will be looking
less and less attractive as time goes.
Suse/SUSE has been a good ride though and I'm going to miss YaST2. It
is, however, as I understand, open source now so perhaps the Germans
who started SUSE will get back together and start something new that
will take the place of the dependable distro we all loved.
Unlikely as it is, Novell, Red Hat, Sun and Oracle certainly leave
room for hp or IBM or somebody to create a KDE based distro and as the
suits like to say, "Let the market decide."
Chuck
On 11/7/06, Kai Ponte
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 07:35, Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 10:26, Gordon Keehn wrote:
I see it as a classic Divide-and-Conquer move directed at RedHat. First M'soft convinces the world that Novell / SuSE is the way to go for interoperability. Then when RedHat is pretty much out of the picture as a commercial force, they pull one of their classic changes of direction and leave Novell hanging in the breeze, having eliminated the other major force in the market. Then they can turn on Novell. Trust Microsoft? About as far as I can throw Bill Gates' bank statement.
I think you've broken the code. I had thought that MS's plan was to put Novell/SuSE out of business but I hadn't thought about how they could get RH too.
That is exactly the plan. Unfortunately, the suits at Novell can't see it.
This has been the modus operandi for MS for years. Create FUD and turn people away from the leader to another competing product. Then drop the competitor leaving everyone running to Uncle Bill.
After 7 years of SuSE and being very happy with it, I just downloaded Kunbuntu. Probably will make the switch soon.
Let us know how it goes. I'd be curious if it is half as easy to maintain as SUSEsoft. -- kai ponte www.perfectreign.com
-- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com
On 11/7/06, Chuck Davis
I've looked at Kubuntu a bit and one thing is for sure, there's better support for KDE! I've never had a SuSE KDE update that didn't get into dependency hell and/or screw up my install. There's never been one that worked in my experience. It looks like Kubuntu gets KDE versions up for update quite quickly. It's looking like a more attractive option all the time. Since I think mono is a collossal waste of effort and GNOME likewise, I think Novell will be looking less and less attractive as time goes.
Suse/SUSE has been a good ride though and I'm going to miss YaST2. It is, however, as I understand, open source now so perhaps the Germans who started SUSE will get back together and start something new that will take the place of the dependable distro we all loved.
Unlikely as it is, Novell, Red Hat, Sun and Oracle certainly leave room for hp or IBM or somebody to create a KDE based distro and as the suits like to say, "Let the market decide."
Chuck
I tried Ubuntu (I prefer Gnome) and like it a lot. Has not broken on me yet. Also gave the kid Edubuntu. Lots of fun in the household. Whatever come out of this MS & Novell episode, this will be a huge blow to Linux in the enterprise in the end.
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 18:51, Chuck Davis wrote:
I've looked at Kubuntu a bit and one thing is for sure, there's better support for KDE! I've never had a SuSE KDE update that didn't
I looked at it also. And promptly took it off. My reason? Any distro that comes out and doesn't install the correct kernel gets dumped. It's that simple. I've heard it a million times. Just use apt and get the smp kernel. I want it up and running correctly the first time. Why should I have to download something that should be included. it's not that hard. As for the KDE updates, I've not had problems with them. But then again, I don't need the latest and greatest. Just something that works.
attractive option all the time. Since I think mono is a collossal waste of effort and GNOME likewise, I think Novell will be looking less and less attractive as time goes.
Got to agree on that one. Mono, and the stuff associated with it are a waste of time. Suse/SUSE has been a good ride though and I'm going to miss YaST2.
It is, however, as I understand, open source now so perhaps the Germans who started SUSE will get back together and start something new that will take the place of the dependable distro we all loved.
We can dream.. And I hope it comes true. Mike -- Powered by SuSE 10.0 Kernel 2.6.13 X86_64 KDE 3.4 Kmail 1.8 7:25pm up 22 days 2:06, 4 users, load average: 1.08, 1.12, 1.15
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 08:51, Chuck Davis wrote:
I've looked at Kubuntu a bit and one thing is for sure, there's better support for KDE! I've never had a SuSE KDE update that didn't get into dependency hell and/or screw up my install.
What are you talking about? There was a KDE update yesterday with 83 modules to update, and it worked in SuSE 10.1 perfectly! I'm running KDE 3.5.5 release 39.1. No problemo! -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
* John Andersen
What are you talking about? There was a KDE update yesterday with 83 modules to update, and it worked in SuSE 10.1 perfectly!
I'm running KDE 3.5.5 release 39.1.
No problemo!
me 2. Smart did it all. -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 08:04, Kai Ponte wrote:
Let us know how it goes. I'd be curious if it is half as easy to maintain as SUSEsoft.
Parsing "half as easy" hurts my brain. Its every bit as easy. Icon in tray says updates available. Click, enter password, window shows updates (using almost exactly the same window and icon) updates downloaded, applied, and exit. The big difference is it takes less than a third the time the suse process does. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
Gordon Keehn wrote:
Darko Gavrilovic wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
That last bit is what I don't get. Why does microsoft get royalties on open source software.
Bingo! It's too soon to tell. But something is going to change in the future. As some have mentioned already, perhaps Samba will get pulled and something else will replace it that "enhances" windows & linux interoperatability. Just a wild hunch.
I see it as a classic Divide-and-Conquer move directed at RedHat. First M'soft convinces the world that Novell / SuSE is the way to go for interoperability. Then when RedHat is pretty much out of the picture as a commercial force, they pull one of their classic changes of direction and leave Novell hanging in the breeze, having eliminated the other major force in the market. Then they can turn on Novell. Trust Microsoft? About as far as I can throw Bill Gates' bank statement.
According to articles on Groklaw, it appears MS is paying Novell more than 8x what Novell pays MS. In addition, most of what MS pays is up front and what Novell pays, is spread over 5 years. Novell contends there are no MS patents violated and the agreement was written with GPL in mind and there is no licensing of MS patents, simply an agreement not to sue, should such an issue arise.
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 16:47, James Knott wrote:
simply an agreement not to sue, should such an issue arise.
Protection Money. Plain and simple. Pay me 300 dollars every month and I'll see to it your store doesn't burn down. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
John Andersen wrote:
On Tuesday 07 November 2006 16:47, James Knott wrote:
simply an agreement not to sue, should such an issue arise.
Protection Money. Plain and simple. Pay me 300 dollars every month and I'll see to it your store doesn't burn down.
MS is paying Novell more than 8x what Novell pays MS.
participants (11)
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Bruce Marshall -
Chuck Davis -
Darko Gavrilovic -
Gordon Keehn -
James Knott -
JJ Gitties -
John Andersen -
Kai Ponte -
Mike -
Patrick Shanahan -
Steve Jeppesen