Tim, They have already stated many times that making manuals here and even burning from a master CD (even one downloaded via FTP) is still more expensive than having the manuals and CD's made here. Why do you keep driving this case on this particular issue? They say its not cheaper so lets leave it at that. Onto the issue about having a $25-$30 CD set, how are you going to fit 7 CD's and a DVD onto a Jewel Case? The biggest I have seen only takes 4...If they could sort out the packaging issue, how much saving would this bring to SuSE? Not selling the manuals does not mean that expense has been spared with releasing the cheaper version for $39. The expense is still there and needs to be coevered. I do very much disagree that SuSE should even be thinking about IPO at this time. However, even a private organisation still needs to show growth for it to get the funding capital it needs to continue onwards and upwards. Last month was bad, way bad across the board for Technology companies, most are being forced to consilidate.... SuSE are the only ones to offer decent manuals....And to have a really stable system, at least they did not introduce a beta GCC compiler, now that was really stupid (and people pay way more for less; less and broken too). Matt On Fri, 9 Feb 2001, Timothy R. Butler wrote:
"Well put"???? Hardly....
I disagree.
If all you are getting was the kernel and the GNU tools to make a simple OS then perhaps your comments would be accurate. But, I do believe you are 'forgetting" to consider most of the features that make SuSE the finely engineered product that it is. Perhaps if you were to go play
To be honest, 7.0 didn't sound like a well engineered product. It sounded down right buggy on this list. BTW, I'm not implying that SuSE should cut the price on every version, simply that the current upgrade price isn't an adequate solution. Here is my idea of a good upgrade:
- 7 CD's + DVD - NO Manuals. - No Support - In a jewel case, no box. - $30-$35
Now, that is perfect. That would draw the Linux users who never need help, or those like me who just write into a Linux list (like SLE) rather than contact support. Additionally, I have no need to pay for a bunch of manuals, my 6.4 manuals are sitting in the box, and haven't been glanced at since the day I bought it (and only briefly then, out of curiousity to see what was new in the manual).
with RH for a while you might appreciate YaST, the excellent manuals,
I have used RH, I don't like it. Although, funny you should mention YaST here, at least RH's installer is open source.
and the fine collection of software present on the 6 CDs, most of which have been tailored to be automatically installed (or uninstalled) in/on
That's what I like about SuSE. I'm not sure that I like it $70 worth, but I do like it say $40-$50 worth. I don't have an endless cash supply - that is why I suggest the idea above. According to Michael Hasenstein, IIRC, much of the price hike was due to extra tech support. Well if that's true, and I never used the 30-days from 6.1 and 6.4, I'd really like to avoid paying for 90-days and 6 manuals I'll never use.
all appropriate config files, menus, man pages, etc...
Granted.
If putting together a high quality distro is so cheap and easy then by all means stop bothering folks on this list and go to http://linuxfromscratch.com and build your own. Think of all the money you will save.... and all the time you will lose.
I'm not suggesting that. I _am_ suggesting there are better ways to reduce costs. Now, I'm not sure if this is a rumor or not, but I heard on this list last night that SuSE ships all the US packages here from Germany. If that is true, right there they could save loads. Ship the master copy over to the States (or save even more and do the work in Mexico), and print 'em here. Pass those savings to the customers. Secondly, the suggestion above is perfect. I have a cable connection, so I can download the CD's off the 'net, but I would like to support SuSE. But I don't see the need to give that much money to them for stuff I don't need. But if they offered a bare bones package like the one above, I could (1) support SuSE, (2) save time, (3) get the DVD still. It would also cost SuSE less to produce (no manuals, box, or support), so it would be a win/win situation.
-Tim
----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Christian Web Services Since 1996 tbutler@uninetsolutions.com http://www.uninetsolutions.com ============== "Information Powered by Innovation" ==============
"If the atheists are right, I'll never know, but if I'm right, they definitely will know!"
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