-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

On Mon, 2008-11-10 at 12:12 +0100, Andreas Jaeger wrote:

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Note: novfs is now part of our kernel tree: pm -qlp kernel-default-2.6.27.5-1.1.i586.rpm |grep novfs /lib/modules/2.6.27.5-1-default/kernel/fs/novfs /lib/modules/2.6.27.5-1-default/kernel/fs/novfs/novfs.ko

So, no need anymore for the kmp.

It IS part of the kernel, but (at least on my system... I did not update yet to the 2.6.27.5 kernel) the version is older than what is shipped in the 2.0 beta client (2.0.0-440 vs 2.0.0-504 from the client)

Ouch, so now it means that there is no way to upgrade the KMP as it will conflict with the kernel package :( IMHO it would be better to have it as a KMP that is always built against the latest kernel in oss-updates, especially if the release cycles differ.

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We could if they have the quality we need and get released at the right time - and the last is one problem, we do not want to touch the official repos after we released the goldmaster,

Why not just have them in a repository of their own ? It would be non-oss, with EULA/disclaimer/copyright/whatever, but in its own repository.

That might be a critical point, especially considering that for 10.3 there is still no 'releasable quality' available.

Is there something else that can be done in further improving this state? (I have nothing against playing the bridge between two Novell departments :) )

It does sound quite hopeless, tried in the past already. Seems that the Novell Client for Linux is developed by the part of Novell that doesn't care at all about openSUSE. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJGJimr3NMWliFcXcRAruhAJ4nuVFakGrJZXmsHhq8Y+HFplrWkwCePj+c 8khax6Aufn+0CcarJLIHAs8= =W4mc -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Susanne Oberhauser wrote:

Pascal Bleser writes:

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Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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Note: novfs is now part of our kernel tree: pm -qlp kernel-default-2.6.27.5-1.1.i586.rpm |grep novfs /lib/modules/2.6.27.5-1-default/kernel/fs/novfs /lib/modules/2.6.27.5-1-default/kernel/fs/novfs/novfs.ko

So, no need anymore for the kmp. It IS part of the kernel, but (at least on my system... I did not update yet to the 2.6.27.5 kernel) the version is older than what is shipped in

On Mon, 2008-11-10 at 12:12 +0100, Andreas Jaeger wrote: the 2.0 beta client (2.0.0-440 vs 2.0.0-504 from the client) Ouch, so now it means that there is no way to upgrade the KMP as it will conflict with the kernel package :(

ko modules from KMPs go to a different location (/lib/modules/$kernel/updates) so they don't conflict.

Eh, right, sorry :)

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IMHO it would be better to have it as a KMP that is always built against the latest kernel in oss-updates, especially if the release cycles differ.

I tend to agree to that anyway, because of the different release cycle

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We could if they have the quality we need and get released at the right time - and the last is one problem, we do not want to touch the official repos after we released the goldmaster, Why not just have them in a repository of their own ? It would be non-oss, with EULA/disclaimer/copyright/whatever, but in its own repository.

non-oss repos on build.opensuse.org is an interesting idea.

You could alternatively ask for a build.novell.com for non-oss software, to have a clear and obvious separation of the two.

Indeed, it must be separated, and personally, I really don't bother whether it's in the OBS or anywhere else. But not having a proper repository with up-to-date packages for the most recent openSUSE versions is somewhat ridiculous, when you think about it.

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It does sound quite hopeless, tried in the past already. Seems that the Novell Client for Linux is developed by the part of Novell that doesn't care at all about openSUSE.

'not at all' is too strong -- it's about priorities and about risk:

Really. I suppose you had a look at this bug already: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=262319 I opened that bug 2007-04-07 (even though it was already an issue before that), it was closed for whatever reason (because there's a public beta for 10.3 and 11.0 that isn't even in a repository ?) so IMHO it still isn't quit there yet. I agree, "not at all" might be too strong, "barely" or "not much" is probably more adequate. How can it not be a priority to have Novell's own Novell Client on Novell's own community distribution ? I understand that having it built, tested and made available on SLED and Windows is the top priority, but really, I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds that not having a working Novell Client on openSUSE is.. let's say somewhat ironical at best :)

openSUSE has no support or QOS commitments whatsoever, and no API commitments, nothing. It's a world in its own and there is a lot of goodwill but nobody would buy a great car if you *maybe* get it fixed, which is if someone happens to be interested in fixing it.

While I understand the point you're trying to make as far as comparing openSUSE to SLE*, that does sound quite extreme. "No support commitments whatsoever" ? Except 2 years of support regarding security patches and major bugfixes. No API commitments, probably, although there are policies in place wrt a best effort API+ABI stability, e.g. providing security and bug fixes as backports instead of bumping to upstream versions. If the openSUSE distribution was about "maybe get it fixed", then none of us would be here right now.

So if Novell officially commits to support a product on top of openSUSE, and some bug that shows in the product actually needs a fix in the base OS, then the users are bad off.

That doesn't sound like a probable use case though, I'd rather expect that the Novell Client would require fixes because of bugs in it, or that it would require changing a few bits in its novfs KMP if the distribution requires a newer kernel for security reasons and the FS API in the kernel differs (not all that likely though).

That's why. It's actually a "we do care": we care about the implications.

"we do care" == making the Novell Client for openSUSE a very low priority job ? I'm not sure :)

I agree, though, a 'beta' release with goodwill commitments could be a Good Thing.

Just give it to us, we'll test and report bugs, that'll benefit everyone. But also take care of fixing the bugs that are reported and put a somewhat higher priority on this. That would mean "we do care" to me, tbh. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJGV/Or3NMWliFcXcRAtOmAKCLwTe0PdIuLwpkIBc4my8T5X04hwCdG8Eg QsRa32aD786daItirkSY9KE= =5TpB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org