[opensuse-project] openSUSE Board Meeting Minutes, Nov19
openSUSE Board Meeting Minutes Nov 19th, 8pm - 10:30pm CET Participants: Federico Mena Quintero (federico1) Hendrik Vogelsang (henne) Michael Löffler (michl) Bryen Yunashko (suseROCKs) Pascal Bleser (yaloki) Joe Brockmeier (zonker), for the 1 hour Advisory Board Zonker suggested to have an advisory board to enhance direct communication with sponsors. This board shouldn't be limited to sponsors ony but open to people having interest in openSUSE. This is kind of additional value for sponsor and was brought up by company which show interest to sponsor openSUSE. Discussion about pros and cons. Just for political reason, does it works, what is the benefit? Adds two-way for interaction and exchange for sponsors and people with a key role. It may add bureaucracy to the project also. At what cost does an advisory board comes? The existence of such a Board filled with nice names may add prestige, visibility and credibility to the project. openSUSE deserves some broader backing that we have today. Would this make a legal entity for openSUSE necessary? The board couldn't come to a clear yes or no. This need some more discussion and the role of an advisory needs to be described in detail. We agreed having the discussion on the board list till Friday and then move it to -project to get feedback. AI: michl to send sponsor agreement to the rest of Board members Member Approval 36 approved 14 rejected 14 need additional review to reach 3 times + or - suseRocks came up with the idea to send the reject one a friendly mail and offer kind of mentorship to show them how to become a future openSUSE member suseROCKS is willing to handle the reject mails, henne does the approval mails, we post for volunteers for a mentor program on -project Discussion of the hard ones: Does upstream contributino qualifies to become a member? For openSUSE related stuff like infrastructure (eg. OBS) yes, for software (KDE, Mono) no. But we shoudn't be "Heiliger als der Papst" (more catholic than the pope). All need to finish voting by Monday Nov 24 Action Items Membership scripting WIP by Henne, probably done by Friday this week AI: henne, post meeting logs to board wiki Thank you letter to the election committee AI: michl to write one personally to the members of the committee + public post + ping zonker on gifts Board Introductory letter AI: suseROCKs Board Blog We'd like to have our own blog. Lizards does not offer RSS feed tied to an author. Own board tag - but fear of abuse and press don't like it. We may need to set up our own wordpress on board.o.o - takes too long Why not using news.o.o? Using news.o.o found broad acceptance. We start using that an see if it works out. openSUSE conference Michl shared the information that zonker is planning an openSUSE conference in summer 2009 targeted to developers and packagers. SUSE has now for years an internal SUSELabs conference in the Czech Republic where around 100 developers gather to meet each other, exchange information, do some hacking and to have fun. The idea is to extent this event to the community. Probably it takes place in the Prague or Nuremberg area as we so make it easy for many SUSE developers to attend the conference which the conference will benefit from. Next meeting Dec 3, chaired by yaloki -- Michael Löffler, Product Management SUSE LINUX Products GmbH - Nürnberg - AG Nürnberg - HRB 16746 - GF: Markus Rex -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 18:49 +0100, Michael Loeffler wrote:
Discussion of the hard ones: Does upstream contributino qualifies to become a member? For openSUSE related stuff like infrastructure (eg. OBS) yes, for software (KDE, Mono) no. But we shoudn't be "Heiliger als der Papst" (more catholic than the pope).
To clarify - this means the current opinion is that upstream project developers who are only users of openSUSE wouldn't qualify? -JP -- JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> Novell, Inc. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 19:41 +0000, JP Rosevear wrote:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 18:49 +0100, Michael Loeffler wrote:
Discussion of the hard ones: Does upstream contributino qualifies to become a member? For openSUSE related stuff like infrastructure (eg. OBS) yes, for software (KDE, Mono) no. But we shoudn't be "Heiliger als der Papst" (more catholic than the pope).
To clarify - this means the current opinion is that upstream project developers who are only users of openSUSE wouldn't qualify?
-JP -- JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> Novell, Inc.
The question came up more for those of us who are new on the board and grasping an understanding of how membership applications were approved in the past. It was not a declaration of a hard and fast rule that applies to any Novell employee. What we were asking was whether or not a blanket rule should be applied where if you're a Novell employee, do you automatically get approval if you apply? Although we're still sifting through the backlog of applications, we have found that generally the Novell applicants have met the test for approval, as any other applicant. The requirements for anyone, Novell employee or not, is that there has to be some meaningful contribution to the project. Some examples include: - Filing bug reports - Participating on the mailing lists - Contributing to the wiki - Providing online support (e.g., IRC support channels) - Advocacy/evangelism/projects that promote the use of openSUSE - Coding/Packaging/etc. The above list of examples is definitely not exhaustive and we look at each applicant individually. (Hence why it takes so much time to process memberships.) We believe that providing such a litmus test adds real value to the prestige of becoming a member of the openSUSE Project. One applicant who was rejected by the last board came to me and asked what he needed to do to become approved in the future. I explained that he needed to provide real contribution to the project. His response was that he appreciated that and that when his application does get approved eventually, he'll have real honor for accomplishing this. We have no intention of setting the bar too high that it becomes extremely difficult to become a member. However, simply being a user, whether an employee of Novell or not, does not meet the litmus test. -- Bryen Yunashko openSUSE Board Member -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 27 Nov 2008, Bryen wrote:
The requirements for anyone, Novell employee or not, is that there has to be some meaningful contribution to the project. Some examples include:
I feel this is extremely important a point: being a Novell employee should have absolutely no influence on being granted openSUSE membership as far as I can tell. Does anybody disagree?? Gerald -- Dr. Gerald Pfeifer E gp@novell.com SUSE Linux Products GmbH Director Inbound Product Mgmt T +49(911)74053-0 HRB 16746 (AG Nuremberg) openSUSE/SUSE Linux Enterprise F +49(911)74053-483 GF: Markus Rex -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 23:08 -0600, Bryen wrote:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 19:41 +0000, JP Rosevear wrote:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 18:49 +0100, Michael Loeffler wrote:
Discussion of the hard ones: Does upstream contributino qualifies to become a member? For openSUSE related stuff like infrastructure (eg. OBS) yes, for software (KDE, Mono) no. But we shoudn't be "Heiliger als der Papst" (more catholic than the pope).
To clarify - this means the current opinion is that upstream project developers who are only users of openSUSE wouldn't qualify?
-JP -- JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> Novell, Inc.
The question came up more for those of us who are new on the board and grasping an understanding of how membership applications were approved in the past. It was not a declaration of a hard and fast rule that applies to any Novell employee.
What we were asking was whether or not a blanket rule should be applied where if you're a Novell employee, do you automatically get approval if you apply? Although we're still sifting through the backlog of applications, we have found that generally the Novell applicants have met the test for approval, as any other applicant. The requirements for anyone, Novell employee or not, is that there has to be some meaningful contribution to the project. Some examples include:
- Filing bug reports - Participating on the mailing lists - Contributing to the wiki - Providing online support (e.g., IRC support channels) - Advocacy/evangelism/projects that promote the use of openSUSE - Coding/Packaging/etc.
The above list of examples is definitely not exhaustive and we look at each applicant individually. (Hence why it takes so much time to process memberships.) We believe that providing such a litmus test adds real value to the prestige of becoming a member of the openSUSE Project.
What I'm saying is the a significant upstream contributor is really an openSUSE contributor no matter who they are, we need their code, so if someone like that applies (and does not really contribute to openSUSE directly in the above areas), I think they should still be considered for membership. Building a better upstream relationship is a good thing. -JP -- JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> Novell, Inc. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> writes:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 23:08 -0600, Bryen wrote:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 19:41 +0000, JP Rosevear wrote:
On Thu, 2008-11-27 at 18:49 +0100, Michael Loeffler wrote:
Discussion of the hard ones: Does upstream contributino qualifies to become a member? For openSUSE related stuff like infrastructure (eg. OBS) yes, for software (KDE, Mono) no. But we shoudn't be "Heiliger als der Papst" (more catholic than the pope).
To clarify - this means the current opinion is that upstream project developers who are only users of openSUSE wouldn't qualify?
-JP -- JP Rosevear <jpr@novell.com> Novell, Inc.
The question came up more for those of us who are new on the board and grasping an understanding of how membership applications were approved in the past. It was not a declaration of a hard and fast rule that applies to any Novell employee.
What we were asking was whether or not a blanket rule should be applied where if you're a Novell employee, do you automatically get approval if you apply? Although we're still sifting through the backlog of applications, we have found that generally the Novell applicants have met the test for approval, as any other applicant. The requirements for anyone, Novell employee or not, is that there has to be some meaningful contribution to the project. Some examples include:
- Filing bug reports - Participating on the mailing lists - Contributing to the wiki - Providing online support (e.g., IRC support channels) - Advocacy/evangelism/projects that promote the use of openSUSE - Coding/Packaging/etc.
The above list of examples is definitely not exhaustive and we look at each applicant individually. (Hence why it takes so much time to process memberships.) We believe that providing such a litmus test adds real value to the prestige of becoming a member of the openSUSE Project.
What I'm saying is the a significant upstream contributor is really an openSUSE contributor no matter who they are, we need their code, so if someone like that applies (and does not really contribute to openSUSE directly in the above areas), I think they should still be considered for membership. Building a better upstream relationship is a good thing.
IMHO if that upstream contributor is fixing bugs that are filed against the openSUSE distribution or taking care of building the upstream package in the build service, I voted for him as member. But if you don't see any openSUSE specific action at all by him - no bug reports against openSUSE, no mails on the mailing lists etc - , I'm in favor of rejection. Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, Director Platform / openSUSE, aj@suse.de SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
Andreas Jaeger wrote:
But if you don't see any openSUSE specific action at all by him - no bug reports against openSUSE, no mails on the mailing lists etc - , I'm in favor of rejection.
That is the opinion of the current board as well. But this is really a hypothetical case we try to solve here. I think we should cross the bridge when we get there. All Member applications get checked individually and we talk to the people about their contributions and reasons to apply for an openSUSE Membership. So rest assured that we wont miss any corner cases because of some rules set to stone. Henne -- Henne Vogelsang, openSUSE. Everybody has a plan, until they get hit. - Mike Tyson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 27 November 2008 18:49:22 Michael Loeffler wrote:
Lizards does not offer RSS feed tied to an author.
Of course it does. Have a look at the site, look how Planet SUSE aggregates. Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Stephan Binner wrote:
Lizards does not offer RSS feed tied to an author.
Of course it does. Have a look at the site, look how Planet SUSE aggregates.
http://lizards.opensuse.org/author/${AUTHOR}/feed/ -- Best Regards / S pozdravom, Pavol RUSNAK SUSE LINUX, s.r.o Package Maintainer Lihovarska 1060/12 PGP 0xA6917144 19000 Praha 9, CR prusnak[at]suse.cz http://www.suse.cz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 27 November 2008 18:49:22 Michael Loeffler wrote:
Why not using news.o.o? Using news.o.o found broad acceptance. We start using that an see if it works out.
How shall this work? What do you think news offers that lizards doesn't? Bye, Steve -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 27 November 2008 17:49:22 Michael Loeffler wrote:
openSUSE conference Michl shared the information that zonker is planning an openSUSE conference in summer 2009 targeted to developers and packagers. SUSE has now for years an internal SUSELabs conference in the Czech Republic where around 100 developers gather to meet each other, exchange information, do some hacking and to have fun. The idea is to extent this event to the community.
If I am not mistaken, that would probably continue being a SUSE developers conference (SUSELabs) because there are not many community developers and packagers ("officially" so to speak). What about something more general to better cover other areas where community contributes actively? I'm thinking of something like Akademy and GUADEC. -- Regards, Carlos Goncalves -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Carlos Goncalves wrote:
On Thursday 27 November 2008 17:49:22 Michael Loeffler wrote:
openSUSE conference Michl shared the information that zonker is planning an openSUSE conference in summer 2009 targeted to developers and packagers. SUSE has now for years an internal SUSELabs conference in the Czech Republic where around 100 developers gather to meet each other, exchange information, do some hacking and to have fun. The idea is to extent this event to the community.
If I am not mistaken, that would probably continue being a SUSE developers conference (SUSELabs) because there are not many community developers and packagers ("officially" so to speak).
What about something more general to better cover other areas where community contributes actively? I'm thinking of something like Akademy and GUADEC.
Yeah, I'd also think it should be about contributors in general, not limited to developers and packagers. I think "developers and packagers" actually means "contributors", as opposed to "mere users" ;) Michl, Zonker: could you please confirm or correct that ? :) cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJMIKfr3NMWliFcXcRAgQdAJ481c6mUkeFdz2+s/zLiQIWYuw94QCghnnl 290T5Sbl9Ro6p7xbItMP8yE= =NQ2/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, Nov 28, 2008 at 6:45 PM, Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> wrote:
I think "developers and packagers" actually means "contributors", as opposed to "mere users" ;)
Well, I'd hesitate to say "mere users," -- using openSUSE is the first step on the path of contribution, right? :-) But, yes -- targeted at contributors in that the program is going to be for people who are contributing to openSUSE. Best, Zonker -- Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier openSUSE Community Manager jzb@zonker.net http://zonker.opensuse.org/ http://blogs.zdnet.com/community/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier wrote:
On Fri, Nov 28, 2008 at 6:45 PM, Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> wrote:
I think "developers and packagers" actually means "contributors", as opposed to "mere users" ;)
Well, I'd hesitate to say "mere users," -- using openSUSE is the first step on the path of contribution, right? :-)
What I meant is that it would be oriented towards hacking sessions, presentations and meetings for contributors (developers, packagers, translators, wiki editors, marketing, ...), stuff like that. As opposed to introductions to and showcasing of openSUSE (as it would be the case on "user conferences" where most visitors never heard of Linux and such). The idea is more of an "openSUSE FOSDEM" than an "openSUSE CeBIT". Or, at least, that was my understanding ;D
But, yes -- targeted at contributors in that the program is going to be for people who are contributing to openSUSE.
OK :) cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJMQsVr3NMWliFcXcRAt1RAJ9T+6odPueIy1vucWHZLzcOv98GxACfUyhG oPI6DTOmEvm40IwcO9UOM4Q= =qo5Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
participants (11)
-
Andreas Jaeger -
Bryen -
Carlos Goncalves -
Gerald Pfeifer -
Henne Vogelsang -
Joe 'Zonker' Brockmeier -
JP Rosevear -
Michael Loeffler -
Pascal Bleser -
Pavol Rusnak -
Stephan Binner