Re: [opensuse-marketing] openSUSE Newspaper Advert
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit :
But if they don't publish the advert, and it doesn't appear on the streets on London then I have reason enough to make a claim against them I guess.
isn't that more expensive than publishing your own document and giving it to public in IT stores? In France any IT store or nearly accept to keep such related to IT document on table, and the users are IT users
If you are giving adverts away in an IT store. The ad will only be affective in the IT community which probably is interested and hence informed about openSUSE anyway. Publishing ads in newspapers might also reach another audience, which should be interesting for us too. The goal of marketing should be to widen the area of application. -- Best wishes, Okuro Okiawa aka Thomas Hofstaetter ### openSUSE Member ### ### openSUSE Ambassador ### ### Member of the openSUSE Marketing Team ### ### Writer of the openSUSE News (Event-Editor) ### ### http://en.opensuse.org/User:Okuro ### ### http://linuxokuro.wordpress.com/ ### ### Private Website: http://hidden-space.at.tf ### -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit :
But if they don't publish the advert, and it doesn't appear on the streets on London then I have reason enough to make a claim against them I guess.
isn't that more expensive than publishing your own document and giving it to public in IT stores? In France any IT store or nearly accept to keep such related to IT document on table, and the users are IT users
If you are giving adverts away in an IT store. The ad will only be affective in the IT community which probably is interested and hence informed about openSUSE anyway.
Publishing ads in newspapers might also reach another audience, which should be interesting for us too. The goal of marketing should be to widen the area of application. True. Then again, it also matters to be effective :D
But it's true that esp for the openSUSE box, which comes with phone support, it is important to reach the 'general public'.
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...] But it's true that esp for the openSUSE box, which comes with phone support, it is important to reach the 'general public'.
Yea, reaching the "general" public seems most important to me especially for Linux as a whole. If you consider the development of Windows, you will see that they have reached this turn-over because it is preinstalled on most PCs. Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS... -- Best wishes, Okuro Okiawa aka Thomas Hofstaetter ### openSUSE Member ### ### openSUSE Ambassador ### ### Member of the openSUSE Marketing Team ### ### Writer of the openSUSE News (Event-Editor) ### ### http://en.opensuse.org/User:Okuro ### ### Private Website: http://hidden-space.at.tf ### -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured. jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On 24.05.2011 15:10, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
Well, and exactly that's the reason, why openSUSE and Linux in general is mostly common in nerds or IT freaks (besides the Linux Servers). The question for openSUSE now is, which direction should be chosen: (1) reach more users or (2) let away all the "user-friendly" stuff and keep the distro clean of mostly useless stuff. I cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally, (2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.) -- Best wishes, Okuro Okiawa aka Thomas Hofstaetter ### openSUSE Member ### ### openSUSE Ambassador ### ### Member of the openSUSE Marketing Team ### ### Writer of the openSUSE News (Event-Editor) ### ### http://en.opensuse.org/User:Okuro ### ### Private Website: http://hidden-space.at.tf ### -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Le 24/05/2011 15:38, Okuro Okiawa a écrit : cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally,
(2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.)
but unless the strategy discussion change a bit, it's not the present openSUSE situation. And I don't think ubuntu is best on this respect, it should be a very hard work to reach such a goal (for example finding way to have all legal drivers on board, and a team to make any gadget work right out of the box - extremely unlikely) so out of this thread scope! jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 14:54:30 jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 15:38, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally,
(2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.)
but unless the strategy discussion change a bit, it's not the present openSUSE situation.
And I don't think ubuntu is best on this respect, it should be a very hard work to reach such a goal (for example finding way to have all legal drivers on board, and a team to make any gadget work right out of the box - extremely unlikely)
so out of this thread scope!
jdd
I dont see why we cant strive to get it as close as we can but what we need to do is campaign to more manufacturers to support linux directly. Buffalo, Apple, TomTom to name but a few. KDE is easy to use as is gnome, lxde etc, LibreOffice Amarok K3B all easy to use alternatives to their windows counterparts I believe Linux is fit for Purpose and openSUSE is the fit distrobution for that purpose of course some people have difficulties with different hardware and this is where howto guides and technical support come in. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Le 28/05/2011 10:33, Stuart Tanner a écrit : I fear you miss completely the point. Most computer users (large public ones) are completely computer illiterate; Most do not know that the monitor (screen) is not the computer, don't know what is a programm or an application. I made windows to linux migration, in fact mostly word to openoffice and the only thing the users wanted to know was 'where is my "icon"'. Once they understood that openoffice icon was slightly different from the word one and know the new one, they where satisfied. (but here was a sysadmin to configure they computer) Most dont even know what version of windows they run.
Buffalo, Apple, TomTom to name but a few.
Do you think you will make Apple change?? the only location we can go is professional systems; Once people know Linux run on they professional computer, they can use it at home (an can ask the company admin in case od problem). On the public, we can only gain the computer addicts that are not also game addicts (and most of they friends) the problem is not ease of use, but habit and comercial power jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Saturday 28 May 2011 09:47:18 jdd wrote:
Le 28/05/2011 10:33, Stuart Tanner a écrit :
I fear you miss completely the point. Most computer users (large public ones) are completely computer illiterate; Most do not know that the monitor (screen) is not the computer, don't know what is a programm or an application.
I made windows to linux migration, in fact mostly word to openoffice and the only thing the users wanted to know was 'where is my "icon"'. Once they understood that openoffice icon was slightly different from the word one and know the new one, they where satisfied. (but here was a sysadmin to configure they computer)
Most dont even know what version of windows they run.
Buffalo, Apple, TomTom to name but a few.
Do you think you will make Apple change??
the only location we can go is professional systems; Once people know Linux run on they professional computer, they can use it at home (an can ask the company admin in case od problem).
On the public, we can only gain the computer addicts that are not also game addicts (and most of they friends)
the problem is not ease of use, but habit and comercial power
jdd
I doubt Apple will change but i encourage people to Android instead. As for Buffalo and TomTom, Buffalo are seriously considering it, because the do sell their products to industry as well as domestic users and industry are asking for it also. TomTom many have tried for many years to get them to support Linux, but for both of these companies we need to get a cross ditrobution group to sign partitions and submit it to the companies, maybe then they will include support. If they use Linux in their boxes, they should be made to include Linux Support to upgrade and maintain those boxes also. Buffalo can be acheived using FreeLink. As for SysAdmins, well as technical support and retailers I want to offer that level of support they get anyway. There are companies out their offering windows support via call centre, so why can't we do the same for Linux? -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Am 24.05.2011 15:38, schrieb Okuro Okiawa:
Well, and exactly that's the reason, why openSUSE and Linux in general is mostly common in nerds or IT freaks (besides the Linux Servers). The question for openSUSE now is, which direction should be chosen: (1) reach more users or (2) let away all the "user-friendly" stuff and keep the distro clean of mostly useless stuff.
I cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally, (2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.)
This is one of the reasons why I would prefer two openSUSE releases. One "Personal" release for the users, who aren´t so savvy at all, and one "Professional" release for the users, who say, that they don´t need such stuff for help and user friendly apps, but more devel-stuff or network-software. But I think, the disadvantage of this bi-released-openSUSE is the fact, that maintaining and care about the two releases is more more difficult then "just" maintaining *one* single DVD-version and the KDE/GNOME live CD. But I think this doesn´t belong to this thread actually, and if anyone´s interesting in continue such discussion, just open another thread or mail me privacy. -kdl PS: By the way, what´s on with the strategy discussion? Is there any result, or any things that needs to achive? Afaik it´s in freeze-mode till the foundation is founded, is that right? -- Kim-Dennis Leyendecker openSUSE Ambassador / openSUSE Wiki Team DE HAVE A LOT OF FUN! http://www.opensuse.org | http://www.suse.de Have you tried SUSE Studio? Need to create a Live CD, an app you want to package and distribute , or create your own linux distro. Give SUSE Studio a try. www.susestudio.com. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 25 May 2011 17:26:48 Kim Leyendecker wrote:
Am 24.05.2011 15:38, schrieb Okuro Okiawa:
Well, and exactly that's the reason, why openSUSE and Linux in general is mostly common in nerds or IT freaks (besides the Linux Servers). The question for openSUSE now is, which direction should be chosen: (1) reach more users or (2) let away all the "user-friendly" stuff and keep the distro clean of mostly useless stuff.
I cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally, (2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.)
This is one of the reasons why I would prefer two openSUSE releases. One "Personal" release for the users, who aren´t so savvy at all, and one "Professional" release for the users, who say, that they don´t need such stuff for help and user friendly apps, but more devel-stuff or network-software.
But I think, the disadvantage of this bi-released-openSUSE is the fact, that maintaining and care about the two releases is more more difficult then "just" maintaining *one* single DVD-version and the KDE/GNOME live CD.
But I think this doesn´t belong to this thread actually, and if anyone´s interesting in continue such discussion, just open another thread or mail me privacy.
-kdl
PS: By the way, what´s on with the strategy discussion? Is there any result, or any things that needs to achive? Afaik it´s in freeze-mode till the foundation is founded, is that right? Nah, there was a blog by Thomas Thym, who has been involved with that. He wanted to push it forward. I'm not sure exactly what his plan is there, so I CC'ed him and he can tell you if he wants :D
Good morning, On Thursday 26 May 2011 13:33:51 wrote Jos Poortvliet:
On Wednesday 25 May 2011 17:26:48 Kim Leyendecker wrote:
Am 24.05.2011 15:38, schrieb Okuro Okiawa:
Well, and exactly that's the reason, why openSUSE and Linux in general is mostly common in nerds or IT freaks (besides the Linux Servers). The question for openSUSE now is, which direction should be chosen: (1) reach more users or (2) let away all the "user-friendly" stuff and keep the distro clean of mostly useless stuff.
I cannot really decide between the two options... For me personally, (2) is the best option, but (1) would make openSUSE more competitive in the OS-market. (In this regard, Ubuntu is a step ahead.)
This is one of the reasons why I would prefer two openSUSE releases. One "Personal" release for the users, who aren´t so savvy at all, and one "Professional" release for the users, who say, that they don´t need such stuff for help and user friendly apps, but more devel-stuff or network-software.
But I think, the disadvantage of this bi-released-openSUSE is the fact, that maintaining and care about the two releases is more more difficult then "just" maintaining *one* single DVD-version and the KDE/GNOME live CD.
But I think this doesn´t belong to this thread actually, and if anyone´s interesting in continue such discussion, just open another thread or mail me privacy.
-kdl
PS: By the way, what´s on with the strategy discussion? Is there any result, or any things that needs to achive? Afaik it´s in freeze-mode till the foundation is founded, is that right? Nah, there was a blog by Thomas Thym, who has been involved with that. He wanted to push it forward. I'm not sure exactly what his plan is there, so I CC'ed him and he can tell you if he wants :D
I have put the draft of the strategy on the wiki. http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Strategy_draft There is a section about the user as well so it might help you with your question. The strategy is not official yet, but there were many people from the community involved and it is reviewed by the board. So I think the big direction will not change anymore. I hope we can vote on the strategy before the creation of the foundation. Cheers, Thomas -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Le 27/05/2011 06:30, Thomas Thym a écrit :
I have put the draft of the strategy on the wiki. http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Strategy_draft
may be we couls quote evergreen and tumbleweed? specially in the last paragraph? (openSUSE does not...) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 27 May 2011 06:58:53 jdd wrote:
Le 27/05/2011 06:30, Thomas Thym a écrit :
I have put the draft of the strategy on the wiki. http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Strategy_draft
may be we couls quote evergreen and tumbleweed? specially in the last paragraph? (openSUSE does not...)
jdd
I quoted Evergreen in my advert but I didn't quote Tumbleweed partly because it slipped my mind, partly because of limited space, and partly because I would like customers to purchase longer term support and then get into tumbleweed. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 27 May 2011 07:58:53 jdd wrote:
Le 27/05/2011 06:30, Thomas Thym a écrit :
I have put the draft of the strategy on the wiki. http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Strategy_draft
may be we couls quote evergreen and tumbleweed? specially in the last paragraph? (openSUSE does not...)
I added those. Meanwhile, Thomas, this has taken long enough. I think you should move this from strategy_draft to simply strategy and start a vote. See my mail to the strategy ml over how to do that vote. Cheers, Jos
jdd
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd, I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects? If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc. It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base. We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-) Izabel
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On Tuesday 24 May 2011 16:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
The thing that is limiting us is not Linux itself. openSUSE is not per-se harder than Windows. But it doesn't have the vendor support, it doesn't have the neighboor-next-door who can help and it is unfamiliar. And you can't easily buy a PC with it. And it is seen as 'different' so if something goes wrong, you blame linux (while if something goes wrong with Windows most ppl blame themselves). It is more of a cultural issue, not a technical one. But that doesn't change the fact that JDD is indeed right. If linux is to have a chance, it's gonna be with professionals (the ones we target!) and on dumbed-down devices like tablets (which the openSLX/KDE/Plasma Active team is targeting). Just my 2 cents on this issue :D
Izabel
-- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
2011/5/24 Jos Poortvliet <jospoortvliet@gmail.com>:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 16:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
The thing that is limiting us is not Linux itself. openSUSE is not per-se harder than Windows. But it doesn't have the vendor support, it doesn't have the neighboor-next-door who can help and it is unfamiliar. And you can't easily buy a PC with it. And it is seen as 'different' so if something goes wrong, you blame linux (while if something goes wrong with Windows most ppl blame themselves).
So I must consider myself really luck to never had a vendor support or a neighboor-next-door to work with kids in digital inclusion projects. I do believe ... the best case. Again... if we don't change our minds or believes we'll still in the same path! In Brazil we can easily buy a PC with linux, sometimes a terrible distro inside, and you are right about the buyers soon change for windows and again the words come from them: "- We are not genius to use linux!" That is exactly what I think we should change and our words or advertise could for sure help a lot. In time I'm not a genius either and I use linux!!! (BTW the best one ;-)
It is more of a cultural issue, not a technical one. But that doesn't change the fact that JDD is indeed right. If linux is to have a chance, it's gonna be with professionals (the ones we target!) and on dumbed-down devices like tablets (which the openSLX/KDE/Plasma Active team is targeting).
Certainly cultural... as people say we brazilians have more hope than others ;-) BUT If we are targeting professionals I'm definitely in the wrong community! Really sorry. cause as volunteer I'm looking to spread and show the best technical option to everyone and leaving professionals to big companies to do. Something to think... Maybe better now... Izabel
Just my 2 cents on this issue :D
Izabel
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Le 25/05/2011 00:22, Izabel Valverde a écrit :
In Brazil we can easily buy a PC with linux, sometimes a terrible distro inside, and you are right about the buyers soon change for windows
like for the netbooks some said "hourrah, we can have XP in place of Linux", because the linux installed was odd. May be in Brazil the situation is different. I'm pretty sure the people that replace Linux by windows don't pay the $200 bill corresponding but use "free" one! the best thing we could do should be to target one computer make and issue an install dvd certified for this make. But this should be done by country (localisation mandatory) and I don't think we have the man power to do that. Don't forget many openSUSE applications *don't work at all* because we couldn't test all sufficiently. testing the install is the first thing to do, we iobviously don't have enough testers jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
and if the advertisement project is made effective, there is a way to know if it works: add a coupon for 3 pound rebate on it and see how many come... jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 25 May 2011 07:50:13 jdd wrote:
Le 25/05/2011 00:22, Izabel Valverde a écrit :
In Brazil we can easily buy a PC with linux, sometimes a terrible distro inside, and you are right about the buyers soon change for windows
like for the netbooks some said "hourrah, we can have XP in place of Linux", because the linux installed was odd.
May be in Brazil the situation is different. I'm pretty sure the people that replace Linux by windows don't pay the $200 bill corresponding but use "free" one!
the best thing we could do should be to target one computer make and issue an install dvd certified for this make. But this should be done by country (localisation mandatory) and I don't think we have the man power to do that. Don't forget many openSUSE applications *don't work at all* because we couldn't test all sufficiently.
testing the install is the first thing to do, we iobviously don't have enough testers
jdd
I would like to launch my own brand of computers test the hardware and also sell the compatible accesories to go with it. 90%+ Wifi works I would say 99-100% of network and sound works (if you ignore pulseaudio). I can purchase a range of prebuilt unbranded computers without operating systems from £99+ trade I am going to order one of each next week and see how well they work. I will feed back the results. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 23:22:31 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 Jos Poortvliet <jospoortvliet@gmail.com>:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 16:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
The thing that is limiting us is not Linux itself. openSUSE is not per-se harder than Windows. But it doesn't have the vendor support, it doesn't have the neighboor-next-door who can help and it is unfamiliar. And you can't easily buy a PC with it. And it is seen as 'different' so if something goes wrong, you blame linux (while if something goes wrong with Windows most ppl blame themselves).
So I must consider myself really luck to never had a vendor support or a neighboor-next-door to work with kids in digital inclusion projects. I do believe ... the best case.
Again... if we don't change our minds or believes we'll still in the same path!
In Brazil we can easily buy a PC with linux, sometimes a terrible distro inside, and you are right about the buyers soon change for windows and again the words come from them: "- We are not genius to use linux!" That is exactly what I think we should change and our words or advertise could for sure help a lot. In time I'm not a genius either and I use linux!!! (BTW the best one ;-)
It is more of a cultural issue, not a technical one. But that doesn't change the fact that JDD is indeed right. If linux is to have a chance, it's gonna be with professionals (the ones we target!) and on dumbed-down devices like tablets (which the openSLX/KDE/Plasma Active team is targeting).
Certainly cultural... as people say we brazilians have more hope than others ;-)
BUT If we are targeting professionals I'm definitely in the wrong community! Really sorry. cause as volunteer I'm looking to spread and show the best technical option to everyone and leaving professionals to big companies to do. Something to think... Maybe better now...
Izabel
+1 Izabel again totally agree and I am working to launch a range of PC's which are openSUSE Pre Installed and looking to increase the range of Linux powered devices included. I would like to know the biggest hardware gripes we have and then we can advise people to keep away from them, and also what we know works really well and again we can do this also. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 22:57:12 Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 16:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
The thing that is limiting us is not Linux itself. openSUSE is not per-se harder than Windows. But it doesn't have the vendor support, it doesn't have the neighboor-next-door who can help and it is unfamiliar. And you can't easily buy a PC with it. And it is seen as 'different' so if something goes wrong, you blame linux (while if something goes wrong with Windows most ppl blame themselves).
It is more of a cultural issue, not a technical one. But that doesn't change the fact that JDD is indeed right. If linux is to have a chance, it's gonna be with professionals (the ones we target!) and on dumbed-down devices like tablets (which the openSLX/KDE/Plasma Active team is targeting).
Just my 2 cents on this issue :D
Sorry Jos but I think this is wrong, my parents and my brother all use Linux they don't need to know how it works only that it does work. When they want to burn a DVD they load K3b, when they want to connect to wifi network they click network manager. IT Professionals most likely use bash so therefore what's the point of KDE/Gnome? Why bother using wifi? IT Professionals probably use Ethernet? Unless we get Linux out to the masses we will never get hardware support. How much hardware support to Microsoft Dos v 1 have? OK we hare now nearly on 12, and look how far we have come. Yes there is a long way to go, but unless we market our product with its STRENGTHS and not its WEAKNESSES what is the point of a marketing team at all? Who are we marketing to? other Linux users? small market to keep infighting - we need to look outside to the big wide world and focus on them. Let the professionals use Enterprise and lets focus our open efforts on the open world...
Izabel
-- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
-- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 15:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
Izabel
-- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Hi Izabel I agree with you entirely I am promoting the Education Li F E project, the Medical Project as well as Evergreen and standard projects. I truley and honestly believe that openSUSE is fit for purpose i recommend it to everybody and those that use it love it. Its ready to go and I am ready to take it to the masses, I have covered the costs through my own family support, lets just see what happens when the newspaper hits the stands on the 6th of June. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Le 28/05/2011 10:38, Stuart Tanner a écrit :
Its ready to go and I am ready to take it to the masses, I have covered the costs through my own family support, lets just see what happens when the newspaper hits the stands on the 6th of June.
Yes. I hope you the best thank you trying jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
2011/5/28 Stuart Tanner <stuart@bolin.org.uk>
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 15:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
Izabel
-- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Hi Izabel
I agree with you entirely I am promoting the Education Li F E project, the Medical Project as well as Evergreen and standard projects.
I truley and honestly believe that openSUSE is fit for purpose i recommend it to everybody and those that use it love it.
Its ready to go and I am ready to take it to the masses, I have covered the costs through my own family support, lets just see what happens when the newspaper hits the stands on the 6th of June.
-- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner
Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK
24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA
Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028
www.bolin.org.uk
Dear Stuart, I just can say that I wish you luck and I hope this gift that you are giving for the noble unknown as to the most incredulous members of openSUSE Community can soon give a great return both personally and financially. I spent some time in London and I can tell you I was a fan of newspapers distributed in the streets. Who knows there are many other curious like me willing to try something new. Believe in your bet! I do!
From here I will keep doing what I always did.
And please let us know what happened today... :-) Best wishes, Izabel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 01 Jun 2011 15:44:54 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/28 Stuart Tanner <stuart@bolin.org.uk>
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 15:23:20 Izabel Valverde wrote:
2011/5/24 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>
Le 24/05/2011 13:12, Okuro Okiawa a écrit :
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
be warned that openSUSE is *not* designed for dummies (no Linux is). It's nice to be installed to your friend that can ask you for help. I real newbie will not use openSUSE if not preinstalled and configured.
jdd
Hi jdd,
I strongly disagree with your words or better saying quote! If is not for dummies how can we explain the success case in elementary schools or in digital inclusion projects?
If we still defending that linux is not for everyone we always will live like now with bunch of people with closed mind or worst thinking that are superior just because run linux or whatever in their own pc.
It's time to change our minds and if you need a close case I can show you a school full of newbies that make TV, Radio, Publicity and much more using linux as their base.
We all should think about it... or at least write in a different way ;-)
Izabel
-- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
Hi Izabel
I agree with you entirely I am promoting the Education Li F E project, the Medical Project as well as Evergreen and standard projects.
I truley and honestly believe that openSUSE is fit for purpose i recommend it to everybody and those that use it love it.
Its ready to go and I am ready to take it to the masses, I have covered the costs through my own family support, lets just see what happens when the newspaper hits the stands on the 6th of June.
-- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner
Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK
24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA
Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028
www.bolin.org.uk
Dear Stuart,
I just can say that I wish you luck and I hope this gift that you are giving for the noble unknown as to the most incredulous members of openSUSE Community can soon give a great return both personally and financially.
I spent some time in London and I can tell you I was a fan of newspapers distributed in the streets. Who knows there are many other curious like me willing to try something new.
Believe in your bet! I do!
From here I will keep doing what I always did.
And please let us know what happened today... :-)
Best wishes,
Izabel
I got into openSUSE because I purchased a retail version from PC World back in 2005, therefore I was dissapointed when they stopped selling it, offering people the support as well as a brand to believe in, really can make the difference I think. Currently, i have introduced 35 people to the retail version, how many of them really wanted it and how many decided it from an advert I really can't say, but I am going to start following up with past customers next week and I will forward their stories to the mailing list to support our cause that openSUSE is ready for mainstream use. I know it is, my father uses it, my brother uses it, everybody whom i introduce it to swears by it (unless they use damn iPhones!). Why can't somebody just develop GTKPod!!! -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:12:54 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...]
But it's true that esp for the openSUSE box, which comes with phone support, it is important to reach the 'general public'.
Yea, reaching the "general" public seems most important to me especially for Linux as a whole. If you consider the development of Windows, you will see that they have reached this turn-over because it is preinstalled on most PCs.
Hence, openSUSE has to be presented as an easy and comfortable solution for your work to take away the "fear" of some people of "damaging" anything when they touch their OS...
Exactly my point and the point being made by the Advertisement against this very point. "to overcome your fear we offer several levels of support, telephone and email support from myself, forum (my own or the general one), telephone and e-mail support from open-slx), and the community in general which of course i try to participate in as much as possible. This is targeting Non-IT people not IT people. If they know about Linux chances are they are using Ubuntu.. I am targeting people who are dissatisfied with windows but no of nothing else or are concerned to give it a try. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...]
By the way: Are there any predesigned ads for openSUSE for download? -- Best wishes, Okuro Okiawa aka Thomas Hofstaetter ### openSUSE Member ### ### openSUSE Ambassador ### ### Member of the openSUSE Marketing Team ### ### Writer of the openSUSE News (Event-Editor) ### ### http://en.opensuse.org/User:Okuro ### ### Private Website: http://hidden-space.at.tf ### -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 13:15:51 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...]
By the way: Are there any predesigned ads for openSUSE for download? afaik, no. But creating something would be a good idea...
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 13:19:43 Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 13:15:51 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...]
By the way: Are there any predesigned ads for openSUSE for download?
afaik, no. But creating something would be a good idea... If anybody would like to see the final newspaper when its published next week I will send links over for the documents.
This magazine is available in and around London, it will also be available in every branch of HMV in London and Diesel Nationwide. There are other more local newsagents and general stores where it is also available. I have now received a formal invoice and my family have loaned me the money to cover the advert plus I used my Bursary to cover it. -- Kind Regards Stuart Tanner Bolton Linux Delivering openSUSE Retail to the UK 24 Vincent Street Bolton BL1 4SA Tel: +44-1204-410474 Mob: +44-7868-028028 www.bolin.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-marketing+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 27 May 2011 22:44:13 Stuart Tanner wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 13:19:43 Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 13:15:51 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 12:46, Jos Poortvliet wrote:
On Tuesday 24 May 2011 12:32:25 Okuro Okiawa wrote:
On 24.05.2011 09:04, jdd wrote:
Le 24/05/2011 01:18, Stuart Tanner a écrit : [...]
By the way: Are there any predesigned ads for openSUSE for download?
afaik, no. But creating something would be a good idea...
If anybody would like to see the final newspaper when its published next week I will send links over for the documents.
This magazine is available in and around London, it will also be available in every branch of HMV in London and Diesel Nationwide.
There are other more local newsagents and general stores where it is also available. I have now received a formal invoice and my family have loaned me the money to cover the advert plus I used my Bursary to cover it.
Cool, I'd love to see the end result. I hope you'll recoup the money, dude...
participants (7)
-
Izabel Valverde -
jdd -
Jos Poortvliet -
Kim Leyendecker -
Okuro Okiawa -
Stuart Tanner -
Thomas Thym