jdd wrote:

The page linked: http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Foundation have as title : "Charter and Purpose of a Foundation".

This should be changed for "Charter and Purpose of the openSUSE Foundation"

Maybe "Charter and Purpose of openSUSE eV" ?

In my mind, at first think, a "Foundation" deals only with legal stuff and money, not with the day to day life of a project.

That is what I have envisioned too. To help identify other objectives/purposes, maybe complete these sentences: we want an association, because we want to .... we want an association, because we need to .... we want an association, because we have to ... I'm deliberately saying "association" because an eV is not a foundation.

I don't know for sure (and I don't know at all for german associations), but I beg to be a member of an association one have to pay some fee ("cotisation" in french) and to be identified physically (not only in electronical form). Associations with non local (country resident) members may have to be special - most states wants to control strangers activity.

I doubt if that is a real issue - I'm a (fee-paying) member of at least three international associations, none of which have met me in person. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (1.4°C) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

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On 1/29/2011 at 12:16 AM, in message <4D43BEDF.9060807@dodin.org>, jdd wrote: This topic is probably the most important,

It is. As you point out below it sets the tone and scope of the Foundation.

but hopefully we will agree pretty easily on it :-), so may be we have to discuss it now.

First some details.

The topic pages says: "Objective of the Foundation". May be we should say "objectives" (plural)??

The page linked: http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Foundation have as title : "Charter and Purpose of a Foundation".

This should be changed for "Charter and Purpose of the openSUSE Foundation"

Good catch - I changed the wiki page.

then on the most important parts.

In my mind, at first think, a "Foundation" deals only with legal stuff and money, not with the day to day life of a project. So I see two options for the openSUSE foundation:

* restricting the goals to that (legal and money), make it leaded by a small group of old timers, well known and interested members and let the openSUSE community at large work with the project on informal basis (like many free software projects). Then the foundation will have a board different from the openSUSE board as seen now (the present board can have a control power of some sort);

* make the foundation the whole project. Looks like it's the prefered option for now. In my opinion it's a bit more complicated to deal with.

I don't know for sure (and I don't know at all for german associations), but I beg to be a member of an association one have to pay some fee ("cotisation" in french) and to be identified physically (not only in electronical form). Associations with non local (country resident) members may have to be special - most states wants to control strangers activity.

This is necessary and even very important because any group involving money may attract some bad interest :-(.

No membeship fees!

In this option, by-laws have to be very well fitted not to have the main direction board changed too easily.

That's why it is important to put checks and balances into the bylaws. Setting the scope of the organization within the charter is one. Voting parameters is another; setting high thresholds for significant changes for example -we'll dive into that as part of another topic.

Let me give an example: I beg than kde organisation do not attract many users at large, but mostly kde developpers. It's not the case for openSUSE that have to work with a large community. I remember when the ICANN wanted to have an "At large" vote, and sent reigistered mails to any people that wanted to vote (I was in them), the cost was probably hudge.

I have already seen relatively small groups of motivated people take the power in association against the former board. It's not impossible than 20 motivated people could discourage others and take the power in openSUSE (how many people in openSUSE are really intersted in legal problems? right now there is little interest to do so and Novell is in control, but on a foundation with lot of money...)

I personnally don't have any real taste for one or the other option :-(

let's discuss it.

jdd NB: If you agree, I may summarize the discussion. Given we are on a week end, may be be we can let go for 4 days, until approx tuesday?

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