Reboot. Lets start again, this time organized

Henne Vogelsang

28 Jan 2011 28 Jan '11

12:03

Hey, we have started off not very organized and I would like to change that now. I think we need to make this a purposeful discussion that has rules, moderation and an end. Otherwise we'll never get anywhere. So here is how I want us to do it. 0. In all of this we are trying to find compromise and consensus. This is not about getting it your way. We need to build something together! 1. Before we discuss anything we pick someone who moderates the discussions. The moderator is supposed to summarize, track progress and call an end to the discussion. We need results! 2. We discuss single aspects of the foundation. Not the whole foundation and all it's aspects at once. The list of items to discuss is tracked on the wiki at http://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Foundation/Topics We need to focus! 3. We discuss these aspects by trying to make clear our intentions and by agreeing on the important points. Not by hammering out elaborated paragraphs of text. Bullet points first, formulations later. We need to keep track of the important matters! 4. The discussion is limited to arguments. That means if you agree you don't say anything. NO "I like this!" MAILS. If you disagree with something you make an argument against it. NO "I don't like this!" MAILS. We need to keep the length of the discussion to a minimum! 5. We only re-visit a previous discussed topic if the _result_ of a discussion of another topic is that we need to. When we agree on something it's the way it is. We need to be able to rely on things! Comments on those rules? Any additional rule you would want to see? Henne -- Henne Vogelsang, openSUSE. Everybody has a plan, until they get hit. - Mike Tyson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

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jdd

28 Jan 28 Jan

12:52

Le 28/01/2011 13:03, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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Comments on those rules? Any additional rule you would want to see?

only set a moderator if it's necessary. Hope it will not here. I get a start for the first point in an other post jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://pizzanetti.fr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

Henne Vogelsang

12:57

Hey, On 01/28/2011 01:52 PM, jdd wrote:

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Le 28/01/2011 13:03, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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Comments on those rules? Any additional rule you would want to see?

only set a moderator if it's necessary. Hope it will not here.

This is a typical "I don't like this" mail. Please make an argument why you don't want a moderator that does the things I proposed. Sorry but "I don't like this" just doesn't cut it :)

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I get a start for the first point in an other post

Sorry I don't understand. Can you rephrase this sentence please? Henne -- Henne Vogelsang, openSUSE. Everybody has a plan, until they get hit. - Mike Tyson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

jdd

13:21

Le 28/01/2011 13:57, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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This is a typical "I don't like this" mail. Please make an argument why you don't want a moderator that does the things I proposed. Sorry but "I don't like this" just doesn't cut it :)

may be I was too attracted by the word 'moderator', If you seek for somebody to summarize a discussion, may be the better is to let do this the one that launch the discussion? I can do for the one I did (location)

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I get a start for the first point in an other post

Sorry I don't understand. Can you rephrase this sentence please?

first point of the list on the wiki page. Should be obvious, now that you should have received the mail :-) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://pizzanetti.fr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

Henne Vogelsang

13:37

Hey, On 01/28/2011 02:21 PM, jdd wrote:

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Le 28/01/2011 13:57, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

...
This is a typical "I don't like this" mail. Please make an argument why you don't want a moderator that does the things I proposed. Sorry but "I don't like this" just doesn't cut it :)

may be I was too attracted by the word 'moderator', If you seek for somebody to summarize a discussion

Yes I wrote what the moderator is supposed to do didn't I? :)

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may be the better is to let do this the one that launch the discussion?

That would be a nice way to let everybody know who the moderator is and would prevent too many threads.

...

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I get a start for the first point in an other post

Sorry I don't understand. Can you rephrase this sentence please?

first point of the list on the wiki page. Should be obvious, now that you should have received the mail :-)

Yes it is. We (you and me) didn't even agree on these rules before you fired it off. This is leading nowhere... Henne -- Henne Vogelsang, openSUSE. Everybody has a plan, until they get hit. - Mike Tyson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

jdd

13:52

Le 28/01/2011 14:37, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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Hey,

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Yes it is. We (you and me) didn't even agree on these rules before you fired it off. This is leading nowhere...

you said you don't want "I agree" mail :-) I have nothing to add jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://pizzanetti.fr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

Henne Vogelsang

14:10

Hi, On 01/28/2011 02:52 PM, jdd wrote:

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Le 28/01/2011 14:37, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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Yes it is. We (you and me) didn't even agree on these rules before you fired it off. This is leading nowhere...

you said you don't want "I agree" mail :-)

We have also said that a moderator needs to call an end to the discussion. By now (per your idea) this is for the rules me. And the rules say that we only discuss a single aspect at a time. Henne -- Henne Vogelsang, openSUSE. Everybody has a plan, until they get hit. - Mike Tyson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

Vincent Untz

29 Jan 29 Jan

01:02

Hi, Le vendredi 28 janvier 2011, à 13:03 +0100, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

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1. Before we discuss anything we pick someone who moderates the discussions. The moderator is supposed to summarize, track progress and call an end to the discussion. We need results!

Since I can't just say "I agree" without breaking the rules ;-), let me suggest that the moderator also specifies a deadline for each topic being discussed. Saying "this discussion will end in 5 days, and I'll summarize the results after that" should, hopefully, lead to better results. Cheers, Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

Alan Clark

1 Feb 1 Feb

01:25

Henne, To try to bring some focus to the topics and to help everyone know which topics are currently being discussed and who the moderator is, I updated the wiki pages. On the main page, I created entries for a moderator, status and results for each topic. Both you and suseROCKS had AI from previous board meetings, so I put you on as moderators, then I spread the board members around the topics to give us some default moderators, we can discuss that. I also moved some of the details that were on the portal:Foundation page onto a couple other pages to help cleanly divide out the topics and to give us room for the content. -Alan

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On 1/28/2011 at 05:03 AM, in message <4D42B0A4.4060202@opensuse.org>, Henne Vogelsang wrote: Hey,

we have started off not very organized and I would like to change that now. I think we need to make this a purposeful discussion that has rules, moderation and an end. Otherwise we'll never get anywhere.

So here is how I want us to do it.

0. In all of this we are trying to find compromise and consensus. This is not about getting it your way. We need to build something together!

1. Before we discuss anything we pick someone who moderates the discussions. The moderator is supposed to summarize, track progress and call an end to the discussion. We need results!

2. We discuss single aspects of the foundation. Not the whole foundation and all it's aspects at once. The list of items to discuss is tracked on the wiki at http://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Foundation/Topics We need to focus!

3. We discuss these aspects by trying to make clear our intentions and by agreeing on the important points. Not by hammering out elaborated paragraphs of text. Bullet points first, formulations later. We need to keep track of the important matters!

4. The discussion is limited to arguments. That means if you agree you don't say anything. NO "I like this!" MAILS. If you disagree with something you make an argument against it. NO "I don't like this!" MAILS. We need to keep the length of the discussion to a minimum!

5. We only re-visit a previous discussed topic if the _result_ of a discussion of another topic is that we need to. When we agree on something it's the way it is. We need to be able to rely on things!

Comments on those rules? Any additional rule you would want to see?

Henne

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org

jdd

4 Feb 4 Feb

11:37

Le 28/01/2011 13:03, Henne Vogelsang a écrit :

...

Hey,

we have started off not very organized and I would like to change that

don't sems to be many people here :-( jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://pizzanetti.fr -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-foundation+help@opensuse.org