On 29. 11. 22, 10:54, Richard Brown wrote:
On Tue, 2022-11-29 at 10:46 +0100, Jiri Slaby wrote:
On 29. 11. 22, 10:17, Richard Biener wrote:
It always depends on the benchmark, but the more strong argument is marketing and manager perception.
Ah, I was so dumb and now I see -- it's only politics in it. And it affects community-based distro. Yes, I understand the SUSE's POV -- to sell, sell, sell. I also know, that managers always affected openSUSE in some manner. At least indirectly by e.g. providing HW, manpower etc. But this is sort of different. This appears to be a non-technical decision applied to _open_SUSE for reasons I still don't follow.
How about considering the following
Factory/Tumbleweed has an important role as the target for SUSE's "Factory First" policy
We (I literally mean we: me and others) maintainted Tumbleweed even without this "Factory First" policy. And surprise, it well made sense and was supported even then.
That function of Factory/Tumbleweed is a lynchpin that justifies the HW, manpower, etc that SUSE provide openSUSE for Factory/Tumbleweed
Nah. What justifies all that are the results. Not a policy, sorry.
A Factory/Tumbleweed that is still v0 when SUSE's commercial products are all v2 is significantly degraded/pointless in it's role as SUSE's "Factory First" target
Could you elaborate on that "degraded/pointless"? We cover ix86 in TW and TW is not degraded in any way due to that WRT to SUSE. It's rather mostly we waste resource to build it. Including -v0 (I am not inclined to -v0 BTW, having cx16 sounds like a reasonable cut, as I wrote elsewhere) by any means does not make TW will have less coverage and testing. Quite the contrary. So this is a very legit reason when potentially talking to SUSE managers.
Ergo, it makes perfect sense that Factory/Tumbleweed must at least be v2 if SUSE is jumping to v2 (no matter SUSE's reasons, be they technical, political, religious, or otherwise)
It's the right call, purely to ensure the relationship between Tumbleweed and SUSE's products remains relevant.
Yep, covering -v2 _plus_ a bit older machines fulfills the role even more. Again, those machines are still quite alive and will be for more years.
And as a workaround, it seems it will result in building Tumbleweed exactly twice. Bah. OK.
Well we don't NEED to build Tumbleweed twice. If we didn't have you or someone like you stepping up to take on the burden of looking after it, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't be doing the second build.
Yep, we can force the users to migrate to another (saner) distro. Less coverage, less testing, less cookies. That's what would managers love to hear. Note that I'm still concerned about the picking up of "v2" to be the right choice and spread it everywhere. From the technical POV, it is not (saying so while wearing one of few x86 maintainers hats inside SUSE). regards, -- js suse labs