Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (1355 mails)

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Re: [opensuse] Philosophical question?
On 15/06/18 17:32, Anton Aylward wrote:
I wouldn't know.
I don't use Yast for package management, I use zypper and I can add, remove,
lock, unlock multiple packages at the CLI.

That's fine. I can and do most simple maintenance tasks at the CLI.
However, if I don't know what a package is called, or I want to
manipulate a few separate packages at once, or install a bunch of
packages without finding a neat exclusive wildcard, or for whatever
reason, I prefer a GUI.

I'm happy enough with CLIs but I like GUIs too.

Let's say, for instance, that I am experimenting with different
desktops. I pick this task as it's a real one I've done recently on
openSUSE, Fedora and Ubuntu.

I might add the distro's metapackage (or whatever it's called) for Xfce,
e.g.

apt install xfce-desktop

or

sudo zypper -n in patterns-openSUSE-xfce

(See? Already more complex. With apt I don't need to worry about a
package versus a "pattern" -- everything's a package, even if it's just
a package of packages.)

But that gives me a basic install.

If I want to add accessory bits that aren't included, I might run the
GUI and search for "xfce", browse the list, tick a dozen, then click
"install".

What if later I want to remove 5 of the dozen? In Synaptic I would just
right-click them, pick "remove" and hit "apply".

In YAST I can't do that. I'd have to do it one by one, and for each,
click through a series of dialogs if removing xfce-a breaks xfce-b and
removing xfce-b breaks xfce-a.

For 5 packages, this is a major pain and a 15min job. For 20, it's a
nightmare. When I tried to remove KDE this way, I ended up with a
non-bootable system and had to reinstall.

I look at the CLI package tools on the Debian, recall the ones I used on
Mandrake back when and MUCH prefer zypper!

/De gustibus non est disputandam/. Or /Chacun à son goût/. There can be
no argument about taste.

These days, I am more used to apt, and IMHO it is the single best
packaging system I have used on any OS. But that's just my opinion.

I remember when SUSE Linux Pro got apt4rpm and I was delighted. Sadly,
again IMHO, it didn't go anywhere, and instead SUSE invented its own
recursive depedency-solver. I happen not to know how to drive it very
well yet, and to feel that the packaging bit of YAST isn't the equal of
Synaptic.

But then, overall, having YAST at all more than compensates for that. I
have not really used urmpi in anger, and whereas YUM and DNF are fine, I
tried Yumex, the recommended graphical wrapper for YUM, and found it
terrible.

I'm sure I must have used Yast for some things, but I'm not sure what.
Perhaps I'm confusing 'use' with 'experimenting to see what was there'.

As you choose. I am definitely not here to say anyone is wrong.

"Synaptic' as a package manager?
Googling I see that it seems more capable than yast.
But is there a openSuse version?
I don't see one.
http://www.nongnu.org/synaptic/links.html

Synaptic is a graphical wrapper for Apt. Apt handles .deb packages via
``dpkg''. Even if there were a SUSE port, it would be little use, as
SUSE does not use Apt or dpkg or .deb packages. It uses zypper, ``rpm''
and .rpm instead.


--
Liam Proven - Technical Writer, SUSE Linux s.r.o.
Corso II, Křižíkova 148/34, 186-00 Praha 8 - Karlín, Czechia
Email: lproven@xxxxxxxx - Office telephone: +420 284 241 084



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