On 10/30/2009 12:26 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On Friday 30 October 2009 05:34:21 Michael Matz wrote:
Hi,
On Thu, 29 Oct 2009, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On Thursday 29 October 2009 18:42:27 Bart Whiteley wrote:
I just installed 11.2 rc2 from gnome liveCD, then immediately ran 'zypper dup'. It installed over 1GB of new software, including 184MB worth of OpenOffice.org help files in six languages I don't speak.
Why doesn't 'zypper dup' stick to distribution upgrades? Instead it seems to install the union of the favorite packages of every SUSE developer, or some such.
Because the livecd distribution is not as complete as it can be. OpenOffice package recommends things and zypper upgrades your distribution to complete it.
That is something that can and should be mentioned somewhere, release notes, websites, whatever is "hip" currently. For some people it might be good news ("I'll get fantastic new languages I never dreamed of") that make a difference of choice, for some others it guides the expectations they have towards first online updates from a CD/liveCD/DVD.
"Note that due to space limitations we can't put everything onto a physical medium like a DVD. We try to strive for a good balance but sometimes we have to leave out even recommended packages. So don't be surprised if the first online update you do tries to install some additional packages."
Actually in older releases I softlocked the packages that would be installed to avoid this suprise. But this information is not displayed anywhere, so it's pretty complicated to "break". But I will still do that, see e.g. bug#550875 - these "recommendations" just have too many suprises.
Multiple languages of help files is clearly a bug. Beyond that though, I believe this whole way of thinking is flawed. Back in the day where the install was performed mainly by DVD or multiple CDs, and there were no online repositories, it made sense to install everything that most users might someday need up front. Otherwise, installing things later was painful ("now where did I put that DVD?"). Now, with ubiquitous broadband, great online repos, and a great tool (zypper), we don't need to do this anymore. Rather than immediately bring a liveCD install in sync with a DVD install, just let the user install things as she discovers that they are missing. I watched 'zypper dup' run for about an hour, and nearly everything it pulled down are things I don't want. I would rather use that disk space for something else. If I am missing something, it is easy to fetch. In fact, I've been running 11.2 since m7, and the first time I ran 'zypper dup' was with rc2. I never noticed anything missing prior to running 'zypper dup'. If some people do want to immediately bring a liveCD install in sync with a DVD install, make it a different zypper command. Don't combine it with upgrade. 'zypper dup' should only be concerned with upgrade. Make a different command: 'zypper install_a_bunch_of_recommended_junk' -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: zypp-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: zypp-devel+help@opensuse.org