[opensuse] sort of cloning of hard drive
Hello, My main computer have now two drives: one SSD for system (openSUSE 13.2) and the original Hard drive 1Tb, for Windows 7 system and data. This computer is now 4 years old and I would like to have a replacement hard drive at hand in case the old one break. I already have the drive (same size). I have backup for all the data. I don't really mind to backup the linux systems I still have on this old disk (too old), so the main problem is backing up windows to get a bootable result. Of course I don't want to use any windows utility, not boot windows if not obliged to :-). I just keep windows because I need it sometime. the partition table is like this: /dev/sda1 2048 206847 204800 100M 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT /dev/sda2 206848 629360441 629153594 300G 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT /dev/sda3 * 629360640 1926973439 1297612800 618,8G f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda4 1926973440 1953521663 26548224 12,7G 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT (only linux partition after that) The cloning tools (clonezilla, redo backup) needs booting a live cd, so making the computer unusable for the backup time, and redo is from 2012 (http://redobackup.org/), so I'm unsure if it works with windows 7. I guess I will have to use dd, but I know it for being dauntingly slow and wonder if there is not a best way. I found that sfdisk -d /dev/sdX | sfdisk /dev/sdY could copy the partition table to the new disk. Then I could use rsync? But will this copy the file system?? if not (I guess not), will mkfs.ntfs and mkfs.vfat make usable systems for partitions 1, 2 and 4? will the resulting disk be bootable on windows? I have also questions about booting windows and license updating, but it's probably not the good place. do you have any experience on this? If I need to use dd, what are the best options for speed? thanks jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-26 15:09, jdd wrote:
I guess I will have to use dd, but I know it for being dauntingly slow and wonder if there is not a best way.
dd? dd is as fast at it can be. You have to write, and write is the same speed in any program. Maybe... ok, dd has to copy even the empty sectors. Clonezilla skips them if it knows the filesystem format. I have done this. Source and target being the same size, I would do a brute force 'dd' of the entire disk. This way Windows does not notice that the disk has changed (it looks at an identifier in the partition table). Otherwise, you have to clone the partition table exactly, then 'dd' each partition individually. If grub image was installed on the "extended" partition, you even have to dd it. This is preferable if you want to skip a partition, because it is damaged or something.
I found that
sfdisk -d /dev/sdX | sfdisk /dev/sdY
could copy the partition table to the new disk.
Then I could use rsync?
For Windows, no, it will not boot.
But will this copy the file system?? if not (I guess not), will mkfs.ntfs and mkfs.vfat make usable systems for partitions 1, 2 and 4?
No, create ntfs partitions using Windows. If you need to copy files, consider that rsync will not see the windows native attributes.
will the resulting disk be bootable on windows?
No. With rsync, no.
I have also questions about booting windows and license updating, but it's probably not the good place.
It is an identifier in the partition table.
do you have any experience on this? If I need to use dd, what are the best options for speed?
I have done it. Just dd source to dest, and go out for lunch, a walk, sleep, whatever. It is impossible to copy faster, it goes at maximum cable speed. If the machine is in use, there are options to tell dd not to use the cache, which makes the rest of the system more responsive. Try "oflag=direct". Perhaps "nocache". -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
Le 26/05/2015 15:28, Carlos E. R. a écrit :
I have done it. Just dd source to dest, and go out for lunch, a walk, sleep, whatever. It is impossible to copy faster, it goes at maximum cable speed. If the machine is in use, there are options to tell dd not to use the cache, which makes the rest of the system more responsive. Try "oflag=direct". Perhaps "nocache".
I mean some block size option, some time ago (don't know for now), the default was 512 bytes and copying 1Tb would need several weeks :-). I will keep rsync for next update (if ever I need one) thanks :-) jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-26 15:42, jdd wrote:
Le 26/05/2015 15:28, Carlos E. R. a écrit :
I mean some block size option, some time ago (don't know for now), the default was 512 bytes and copying 1Tb would need several weeks :-).
Ah, of course. Use a block of anything from 1 to 100 MB. "bs=100M oflag=nocache" or something of the sort. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
Carlos & jdd, et al -- ...and then Carlos E. R. said... % % On 2015-05-26 15:42, jdd wrote: % > Le 26/05/2015 15:28, Carlos E. R. a écrit : % > % > I mean some block size option, some time ago (don't know for now), the % > default was 512 bytes and copying 1Tb would need several weeks :-). % % Ah, of course. Use a block of anything from 1 to 100 MB. "bs=100M % oflag=nocache" or something of the sort. Agreed. I routinely make complete copies of my 250G 7200rpm SATA drives via a dumb USB2 controller, and with dd if=/dev/sdX bs=64M of=local.big.sdX.file it takes me maybe three hours to write it to a RAIDed scratch vol. I haven't tried significantly different block sizes, and this is on a RAM-skinny machine (more than enough for Linux, of course) so I couldn't go to something like 512M anyway. Then I swap in the restore test drive and reverse the process and write it out in about five hours, after which I go and boot from it to make sure that it actually works :-) Actually, before I do any of this I mount the filesystem and then write 0s to the blank space for F in ceiling ( $FREESPACE / 32G ) do gzip -dc prepared.dev-zero.32G-bigfile.gz >/vol/tmp/BIGFILE.$F done rm /vol/tmp/BIGFILE.? so that my gzip later has lots of repeat chars instead of leftover binary garbage. That makes a lovely difference in the gzip even when I have less than 10% free space (I rarely get to start a second 32G chunk, sad as that is). Speaking of backups, I keep meaning to start a thread on that and not getting a chance to... Perhaps later this week :-) % % -- % Cheers / Saludos, % % Carlos E. R. HAND :-D -- David T-G See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/email/ See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/tofu.txt -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 09:41 PM, David T-G wrote:
Speaking of backups, I keep meaning to start ~
- after format of new disk , one might use tar , and : Konsole output tar clf - . | ( umask 0; cd /mnt; tar xvf - ) ............ regards -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 03:23 PM, ellanios82 wrote:
On 05/26/2015 09:41 PM, David T-G wrote:
Speaking of backups, I keep meaning to start ~
- after format of new disk , one might use tar , and :
Konsole output tar clf - . | ( umask 0; cd /mnt; tar xvf - )
I used to do that too, back in the old SCO UNIX days ... .... then I discovered rsync. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-27 19:20, Anton Aylward wrote:
On 05/26/2015 03:23 PM, ellanios82 wrote:
On 05/26/2015 09:41 PM, David T-G wrote:
Speaking of backups, I keep meaning to start ~
- after format of new disk , one might use tar , and :
Konsole output tar clf - . | ( umask 0; cd /mnt; tar xvf - )
I used to do that too, back in the old SCO UNIX days ...
.... then I discovered rsync.
which is more reliable. It checks. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
On 05/27/2015 01:33 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
It checks.
It plays chess too! Oh WOW! I never noticed that. Talk about "more capable!" -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/27/2015 01:48 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2015-05-27 19:38, Anton Aylward wrote:
On 05/27/2015 01:33 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
It checks.
It plays chess too!
Nay. But emacs does :-P
The problem with Emacs is that it tries to emulate an artificial intelligence. I could settle for a DWIM editor but a "do what I ought to" is quite another matter. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On May 26, 2015 2:41:43 PM EDT, David T-G
Carlos & jdd, et al --
...and then Carlos E. R. said... % % On 2015-05-26 15:42, jdd wrote: % > Le 26/05/2015 15:28, Carlos E. R. a écrit : % > % > I mean some block size option, some time ago (don't know for now), the % > default was 512 bytes and copying 1Tb would need several weeks :-). % % Ah, of course. Use a block of anything from 1 to 100 MB. "bs=100M % oflag=nocache" or something of the sort.
Agreed. I routinely make complete copies of my 250G 7200rpm SATA drives via a dumb USB2 controller, and with
dd if=/dev/sdX bs=64M of=local.big.sdX.file
it takes me maybe three hours to write it to a RAIDed scratch vol. I haven't tried significantly different block sizes, and this is on a RAM-skinny machine (more than enough for Linux, of course) so I couldn't go to something like 512M anyway. Then I swap in the restore test drive and reverse the process and write it out in about five hours, after which I go and boot from it to make sure that it actually works :-)
Actually, before I do any of this I mount the filesystem and then write 0s to the blank space
for F in ceiling ( $FREESPACE / 32G ) do gzip -dc prepared.dev-zero.32G-bigfile.gz >/vol/tmp/BIGFILE.$F done rm /vol/tmp/BIGFILE.?
Nifty trick but I suspect this is a better way to actually create the big zero filled files: dd if=/dev/zero of=/vol/tmp/BIGFILE.$F bs=10MB count=3200 Why are you preparing a dev-zero file in advance? Greg Greg -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Greg, et al --
...and then greg.freemyer@gmail.com said...
%
% On May 26, 2015 2:41:43 PM EDT, David T-G
On 2015-05-27 00:46, David T-G wrote:
% Why are you preparing a dev-zero file in advance?
Because the time saving is enormous :-)
Can't be. cer@Telcontar:~> time dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/null bs=10M count=3200 3200+0 records in 3200+0 records out 33554432000 bytes (34 GB) copied, 10,6955 s, 3,1 GB/s real 0m10.698s user 0m0.007s sys 0m10.689s cer@Telcontar:~/Downloads/Firefox_downloads> It is processed at 3.1 GB/s, way faster than the disk hardware. Reading from a compressed archive should be slower, it has to be decoded. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
On 05/26/2015 06:46 PM, David T-G wrote:
% % Why are you preparing a dev-zero file in advance?
Because the time saving is enormous :-)
David, I don't think you understand how /dev/zero works. it not like /dev/random (which can block) or /dev/urandom. RTFM /dev/zero is like /dev/null. *ALL* it does is read zeros. The zero don't come from anywhere, least of all the disk so they will, by definition, be faster than any possible disk operation. in fact they are as fast as a basic system call, as fast as the kernel can fill the input buffer. So a big buffer on the 'dd' command will be much faster than a number of smaller one because it is the system call/return overhead that dominates. Try it and see. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Then I have simply used dd with the less options: dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ with the Z disk in an esata dock. and: * 8 hours for the 1Tb copy, with high io (iotop 80M/s read, 40M/s wrtie) * exact copy at this moment O noticed none of the drives could boot windows without the help of the main ssd drive. The result was "GRUB..." not a big deal, it's obviously a too old openSUSE install on the first disk. but from the ssd 13.2 install, both of them boot windows, not even necessary to remove one of the two (I can if necessary remove a disk from bios). so looks like a success... of course I didn't try windows more than some seconds :-) jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2015-05-28 17:34, jdd wrote:
Then I have simply used dd with the less options:
dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ
with the Z disk in an esata dock.
and:
* 8 hours for the 1Tb copy, with high io (iotop 80M/s read, 40M/s wrtie) * exact copy
Slow. You have to specify a bigger buffer, you specified none. SATA should do about a 100MB/s write. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlVnOCUACgkQja8UbcUWM1xsVwD+J/0wl8ph6fOD6rv/Le7ApM5G cXufWvZyjwFISmlzlRgA/3RpC2PsH+XI3xbAKkMb/0rjPrcAlgHRQOmTgLKmOhyi =xVdK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Le 28/05/2015 17:45, Carlos E. R. a écrit :
Slow. You have to specify a bigger buffer, you specified none. SATA should do about a 100MB/s write.
yes, I simply wanted to do the simpler command jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/28/2015 11:45 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
On 2015-05-28 17:34, jdd wrote:
Then I have simply used dd with the less options:
dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ
with the Z disk in an esata dock.
and:
* 8 hours for the 1Tb copy, with high io (iotop 80M/s read, 40M/s wrtie) * exact copy
Slow. You have to specify a bigger buffer, you specified none. SATA should do about a 100MB/s write.
- -- Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
What would be the command to specify a buffer when using dd? "dd -help" does not show such a usage. Thanx--doug -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-28 19:07, Doug wrote:
What would be the command to specify a buffer when using dd?
"dd -help" does not show such a usage.
"bs". dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ bs=10MB It is about the first item in the man page :-) And on such a big copy job, I would try "oflag=nocache". Perhaps "direct". Otherwise, it eats the cache and the machine becomes unresponsive. Of course, if it is the only thing you are doing, it doesn't matter. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 1:51 PM, Carlos E. R.
On 2015-05-28 19:07, Doug wrote:
What would be the command to specify a buffer when using dd?
"dd -help" does not show such a usage.
"bs".
dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ bs=10MB
It is about the first item in the man page :-)
And on such a big copy job, I would try "oflag=nocache". Perhaps "direct". Otherwise, it eats the cache and the machine becomes unresponsive. Of course, if it is the only thing you are doing, it doesn't matter.
If you ever truly want a buffer, not just a block size, mbuffer (http://www.maier-komor.de/mbuffer.html) is a great tool. It is in the distribution. Greg -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/28/2015 01:51 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2015-05-28 19:07, Doug wrote:
What would be the command to specify a buffer when using dd?
"dd -help" does not show such a usage.
"bs".
dd if=/dev/sdX of=/dev/sdZ bs=10MB
It is about the first item in the man page :-)
And on such a big copy job, I would try "oflag=nocache". Perhaps "direct". Otherwise, it eats the cache and the machine becomes unresponsive. Of course, if it is the only thing you are doing, it doesn't matter.
Thanx. My distro doesn't have a man page for dd. Just the -help. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 08:09 AM, jdd wrote:
Hello,
My main computer have now two drives: one SSD for system (openSUSE 13.2) and the original Hard drive 1Tb, for Windows 7 system and data.
This computer is now 4 years old and I would like to have a replacement hard drive at hand in case the old one break. I already have the drive (same size).
I have backup for all the data. I don't really mind to backup the linux systems I still have on this old disk (too old), so the main problem is backing up windows to get a bootable result. Of course I don't want to use any windows utility, not boot windows if not obliged to :-). I just keep windows because I need it sometime.
the partition table is like this:
/dev/sda1 2048 206847 204800 100M 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT /dev/sda2 206848 629360441 629153594 300G 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT /dev/sda3 * 629360640 1926973439 1297612800 618,8G f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda4 1926973440 1953521663 26548224 12,7G 7 HPFS/NTFS/exFAT (only linux partition after that)
The cloning tools (clonezilla, redo backup) needs booting a live cd, so making the computer unusable for the backup time, and redo is from 2012 (http://redobackup.org/), so I'm unsure if it works with windows 7.
I guess I will have to use dd, but I know it for being dauntingly slow and wonder if there is not a best way.
I found that
sfdisk -d /dev/sdX | sfdisk /dev/sdY
could copy the partition table to the new disk.
Then I could use rsync?
But will this copy the file system?? if not (I guess not), will mkfs.ntfs and mkfs.vfat make usable systems for partitions 1, 2 and 4?
will the resulting disk be bootable on windows? I have also questions about booting windows and license updating, but it's probably not the good place.
do you have any experience on this? If I need to use dd, what are the best options for speed?
thanks jdd
My Windows machine recently popped up a message that the hard drive was dying. I immediately backed up critical information. Did all the usual maintenance things one should do with Windows. i also discovered that Windows will create a system image disk set for you. Reinstalling all the stuff you add to Windows after install can be a royal pain in the posterior but if the image works as advertised that shouldn't be necessary. I then shut off the machine until the new hard drive arrived. At the same time we ordered the new drive we ordered an "Aukey Super Speed USB3.0 Dual Bay 2.5 & 3.5 inch Sata Hard Drive Dock." I must tell you up front, the instructions for use completely suck. But, this little black box has openings for two 2.5 or 3.5 inch sata drives. Plug in the power supply. Push the on button. Drop the old drive in the "Source" slot and the new, same size or larger only, drive in the "Target" slot. Make sure the slide switch is in the "Clone" position. Press the button on the back that says "Start" and go watch a movie or two. No computer necessary. It says that it will clone any operating system. I haven't tried it on anything but Windows so............................. Being completely OS independent when working I suppose it simply starts up the drives and copies sector A to sector A and sector B to sector B and so on till the job is done. It just moves 1's and 0's. Supposedly, with the slide switch in the "PC" position it will act as an external hard drive dock by USB. Haven't tried that. The upshot is that my Windows computer is back up and running, completely as it was before with no issues, with a brand new hard drive. Way, way, WAY easier than re-installing everything from scratch. AND, I now have a recovery set that will, supposedly, put my system back exactly as it was just in case. -- A cat is a puzzle with no solution. Cats are tiny little women in fur coats. When you get all full of yourself try giving orders to a cat. _ _... ..._ _ _._ ._ ..... ._.. ... .._ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-26 15:47, Billie Walsh wrote:
i also discovered that Windows will create a system image disk set for you.
Do you have a reference for that, so that I can find the option? Maybe I did something of the sort, to CD, but it was terribly slow and I was not happy. So I don't know if it is the same thing as you did. (I have W 7).
Reinstalling all the stuff you add to Windows after install can be a royal pain in the posterior
Indeed. People that say that Windows is easy to install most likely have not done many bare bones installs. What they do is restore manufacturer images.
but if the image works as advertised that shouldn't be necessary. I then shut off the machine until the new hard drive arrived.
-- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
On 05/26/2015 08:57 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2015-05-26 15:47, Billie Walsh wrote:
i also discovered that Windows will create a system image disk set for you. Do you have a reference for that, so that I can find the option? Maybe I did something of the sort, to CD, but it was terribly slow and I was not happy. So I don't know if it is the same thing as you did. (I have W 7).
There's several ways to get there. Start > All Programs > Accessories > Maintenance > Backup and Restore On the left side there are two options; "Create System Image" and "Create System Repair Disk". My system image took 8 DVD's. YMMV The system repair disk is one DVD.
Reinstalling all the stuff you add to Windows after install can be a royal pain in the posterior Indeed.
People that say that Windows is easy to install most likely have not done many bare bones installs. What they do is restore manufacturer images.
Installing Windows is easy. Pop in the DVD, answer a few questions and go watch a movie. Prtty much the same process as installing your favorite flavor of Linux, if you don't fuss with the standard install configuration. It's all the stuff you have to add after the install to make Windows actually do something that is a pain. Half of it won't work from your other install because you have to pay for it again to get the code. ARGH! -- A cat is a puzzle with no solution. Cats are tiny little women in fur coats. When you get all full of yourself try giving orders to a cat. _ _... ..._ _ _._ ._ ..... ._.. ... .._ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-26 16:56, Billie Walsh wrote:
On 05/26/2015 08:57 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
There's several ways to get there.
Start > All Programs > Accessories > Maintenance > Backup and Restore
On the left side there are two options; "Create System Image" and "Create System Repair Disk".
My system image took 8 DVD's. YMMV The system repair disk is one DVD.
Ah, yes, I remember now. I did them both when I got my computer, and now I don't know where they are. When I store something safely then I never find it again... sigh :-( In fact, yesterday I needed the repair disk, to run "Bootrec.exe /FixMbr", which apparently is only there, and my laptop refused to create the repair disk with error "0x80070057". The advice on the microsoft support site failed to do anything.
People that say that Windows is easy to install most likely have not done many bare bones installs. What they do is restore manufacturer images.
Installing Windows is easy. Pop in the DVD, answer a few questions and go watch a movie. Prtty much the same process as installing your favorite flavor of Linux, if you don't fuss with the standard install configuration. It's all the stuff you have to add after the install to make Windows actually do something that is a pain. Half of it won't work from your other install because you have to pay for it again to get the code. ARGH!
You have to go to the video card manufacturer, get the driver. The board manufacturer, same. The sound card, same. Every bit of hardware, you need searching - unless you bought a packaged computer that came with a driver disk for all. Then, as often as not, the driver is older or newer than your Windows release and will not work, and you have to try several. Then run all the updates for Windows, which can take hours to download (I have 100Mb/s now, and a 100 MB update took more than one hour), and several reboots, specially if there is a service pack involved. Plus repeat procedures for printer, scanner, whatever. Plug and play? Rather insert disk, some clicks, reboot(s). Sometimes plug the hardware before, sometimes after. A mistake, and it breaks. Then google. Nay, it is a pain to install Windows from scratch. It is only easy on packaged computers. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
Le 27/05/2015 13:06, Carlos E. R. a écrit :
Nay, it is a pain to install Windows from scratch. It is only easy on packaged computers.
yes. Many people asked me to install w7 over w8, I don't I explain I can install openSUSE, but not w jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/27/2015 06:06 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Nay, it is a pain to install Windows from scratch. It is only easy on packaged computers.
Some years ago I used to build my own computers. But, with computer prices now days I can buy off the shelf cheaper. I have matching Acer AMD Quad cores sitting here that I only paid something like $250US each for. Of course I had to bump up the memory and add bigger hard drives. I also bumped up the low end OEM power supply just because. So, probably somewhere around $350US each. I stole, figuratively, my virtually new AMD Quad core with 8gigs of ram HP laptop for $200US [ HP suggested retail was $1,300US I paid exactly what he was asking for it. ]. It was about a year old and had never been registered with HP so I got the whole manufacturers warranty. One of the things I love most about Linux. The HP laptop had provision for a second hard drive. Found and ordered the cable. I moved the Windows hard drive that came with the laptop to the secondary drive cable and took the hard drive from my Gateway out and put it in as the primary drive. Booted up the laptop to the "new" primary drive got Grub reconfigured to boot Windows and all was well. Linux didn't even blink when it found itself in a different computer. Just kept right on truckin' like nothing had changed. Try that with a Windows drive. -- A cat is a puzzle with no solution. Cats are tiny little women in fur coats. When you get all full of yourself try giving orders to a cat. _ _... ..._ _ _._ ._ ..... ._.. ... .._ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2015-05-27 15:07, Billie Walsh wrote:
On 05/27/2015 06:06 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
One of the things I love most about Linux. The HP laptop had provision for a second hard drive. Found and ordered the cable. I moved the Windows hard drive that came with the laptop to the secondary drive cable and took the hard drive from my Gateway out and put it in as the primary drive. Booted up the laptop to the "new" primary drive got Grub reconfigured to boot Windows and all was well. Linux didn't even blink when it found itself in a different computer. Just kept right on truckin' like nothing had changed. Try that with a Windows drive.
Yes, I have done that, too. Works surprisingly well. Windows? No way. If it manages to boot at all (very similar machine) then it will tell you it is a pirated copy, and you will have to start chasing drivers. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)
On 05/27/2015 09:07 AM, Billie Walsh wrote:
Linux didn't even blink when it found itself in a different computer. Just kept right on truckin' like nothing had changed.
BTDT many times :-) had to fiddle with X11 a bit cos I'd over-configured/optimized.
Try that with a Windows drive.
Tried it once. *N*E*V*E*R* Again! Pull my nose hairs one by one! Make me watch re-runs of Gerry Anderson's "Thunderbirds" and "Space 1999", but don't ask me to port Windows. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Le 26/05/2015 15:47, Billie Walsh a écrit :
At the same time we ordered the new drive we ordered an "Aukey Super Speed USB3.0 Dual Bay 2.5 & 3.5 inch Sata Hard Drive Dock."
Being completely OS independent when working I suppose it simply starts up the drives and copies sector A to sector A and sector B to sector B and so on till the job is done. It just moves 1's and 0's.
I use routinely docks, but till now they all needed some windows software to make copies
The upshot is that my Windows computer is back up and running, completely as it was before with no issues, with a brand new hard drive.
great! I will try this ASAP!
Way, way, WAY easier than re-installing everything from scratch. AND, I now have a recovery set that will, supposedly, put my system back exactly as it was just in case.
probably not. It will revert to the state you buy it. Handy to sell the computer :-( 10 years ago (may be more, I guess it was windows NT), one could build dvd's one the own system. May be not with applications, but with SP's included. Don't know if it's still possible. My widows expertise is getting low :-( thanks jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 09:00 AM, jdd wrote:
Le 26/05/2015 15:47, Billie Walsh a écrit :
At the same time we ordered the new drive we ordered an "Aukey Super Speed USB3.0 Dual Bay 2.5 & 3.5 inch Sata Hard Drive Dock."
I gues this one:
That's the one. I think Tracie did buy it on Amazon.
Being completely OS independent when working I suppose it simply starts up the drives and copies sector A to sector A and sector B to sector B and so on till the job is done. It just moves 1's and 0's.
I use routinely docks, but till now they all needed some windows software to make copies
The upshot is that my Windows computer is back up and running, completely as it was before with no issues, with a brand new hard drive.
great! I will try this ASAP!
Way, way, WAY easier than re-installing everything from scratch. AND, I now have a recovery set that will, supposedly, put my system back exactly as it was just in case.
probably not. It will revert to the state you buy it. Handy to sell the computer :-(
10 years ago (may be more, I guess it was windows NT), one could build dvd's one the own system. May be not with applications, but with SP's included. Don't know if it's still possible. My widows expertise is getting low :-(
thanks jdd
I hope it did the whole system not just the OS. I hope I never have to find out. *<]:oD -- A cat is a puzzle with no solution. Cats are tiny little women in fur coats. When you get all full of yourself try giving orders to a cat. _ _... ..._ _ _._ ._ ..... ._.. ... .._ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Billie, et al -- ...and then Billie Walsh said... % % On 05/26/2015 09:00 AM, jdd wrote: % > ... % >10 years ago (may be more, I guess it was windows NT), one could % >build dvd's one the own system. May be not with applications, but % >with SP's included. Don't know if it's still possible. My widows % >expertise is getting low :-( % % I hope it did the whole system not just the OS. I hope I never have % to find out. *<]:oD For shame! The first thing I do when I buy a machine is figure out how to create its restore media (because none of them come with discs any more) and then wipe it. I'd much rather test it before moving in than find out down the road that there's a problem! I actually caught an issue by doing that, in fact; the laptop I bought was sold with and even had Win XP Pro installed but the restored version was XP Home or similar. That went back to the store in a hurry :-) I always write my backups out to a test disk and boot from it, too, to make sure that I got a good backup. If it isn't tested, it didn't happen ;-) HAND :-D -- David T-G See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/email/ See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/tofu.txt -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 11:49 AM, David T-G wrote:
For shame! The first thing I do when I buy a machine is figure out how to create its restore media (because none of them come with discs any more) and then wipe it. I'd much rather test it before moving in than find out down the road that there's a problem!
If your time is worth nothing, then this is one possibility. But you won't be able to find your backups when you need them, and restoring them will be via some obscure and arcane methodology which will be more trouble then it is worth. I buy machines with the smallest hard drive offered. Tiny. Before I boot the machine, if it is going to be linux, I remove the hard drive, and put it on the shelf. I seldom bother even activating windows. Then I replace the drive with the largest I can afford/need. I seldom spend more than 100 bucks on this extra step. And it preserves my warranty. The original disk sits unused on the shelf until the warranty expires then I re-purpose it. Obviously, If i commit a a machine to linux AFTER warranty, I dispense with the windows partition immediately. (I never dual boot, VMs are a better way.) If you have to preserve windows, buy a model that supports drives in carriers that can be changed simply, with no tools. And buy two carriers and an extra drive. -- After all is said and done, more is said than done. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
John -- ...and then John Andersen said... % % On 05/26/2015 11:49 AM, David T-G wrote: % > For shame! The first thing I do when I buy a machine is figure out how % > to create its restore media (because none of them come with discs any % > more) and then wipe it. I'd much rather test it before moving in than % > find out down the road that there's a problem! % % If your time is worth nothing, then this is one possibility. But you won't % be able to find your backups when you need them, and restoring them will % be via some obscure and arcane methodology which will be more trouble % then it is worth. [snip] That's very interesting. Do you know something that I don't? Are my restore image discs not in their dedicated case? Do I expect to be robbed, or is my house scheduled to be destroyed, some time soon? Is the made-for-idiots restore procedure which I will already have accomplished once going to be suddenly much more arcane? I'm very interested in your prognostication and perception skills and how you can know these things about me that even I don't. If you'd be so kind as to tell me next week's winning lottery number, I'll be sure to pick up a ticket, too. HANN :-D -- David T-G See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/email/ See http://justpickone.org/davidtg/tofu.txt -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 05/26/2015 02:49 PM, David T-G wrote:
If it isn't tested, it didn't happen ;-)
Good philosophy! I wish more people subscribed to it. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
jdd composed on 2015-05-26 15:09 (UTC+0200):
My main computer have now two drives: one SSD for system (openSUSE 13.2) and the original Hard drive 1Tb, for Windows 7 system and data.
This computer is now 4 years old and I would like to have a replacement hard drive at hand in case the old one break. I already have the drive (same size).
I have backup for all the data. I don't really mind to backup the linux systems I still have on this old disk (too old), so the main problem is backing up windows to get a bootable result. Of course I don't want to use any windows utility, not boot windows if not obliged to :-). I just keep windows because I need it sometime.
The cloning tools (clonezilla, redo backup) needs booting a live cd, so making the computer unusable for the backup time, and redo is from 2012 (http://redobackup.org/), so I'm unsure if it works with windows 7.
I guess I will have to use dd, but I know it for being dauntingly slow and wonder if there is not a best way.
To clone a whole disk there probably is no faster way than dd, which doesn't have to wade through any filesystems to do its job, but simply copy sectors sequentially. I don't often use dd myself, preferring to use the non-free tool I use for partitioning instead[1]. To clone one HD to another HD that contains no part of a booted Linux operating system, no "live media" boot is required, though logistically for some people it might be preferred. Just attach the extra HD, umount any filesystems on the source HD, and dd from old to new. The only absolute requirement is to not boot Windows whilst both old and new are connected, but you won't want to reboot Linux with both attached either unless you take into account any adjustments that might be necessary to fstab on account of duplicated UUIDs or volume labels. If fstab has references to filesystems for such a case, and reboot is required with both attached at boot time, I typically will have new UUIDs generated, and volume labels tweaked, for whatever source partitions are in fstab, possibly by commenting them such out of fstab until the work is done. To test that the new works when the copy is done, substitute the new for the old and try to boot it. The worst that could happen with the original removed is the new somehow fails to boot. The undisturbed original is the backup in that case. [1] http://www.dfsee.com/dfsee/ -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (12)
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Anton Aylward -
Billie Walsh -
Carlos E. R. -
David T-G -
Doug -
ellanios82 -
Felix Miata -
Greg Freemyer -
greg.freemyer＠gmail.com
-
James Knott -
jdd -
John Andersen