[opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

Bob Williams

23 Jun 2008 23 Jun '08

12:44

I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp? Bob -- Bob Registered Linux User #463880 GPG-FP: A6C1 457C 6DBA B13E 5524 F703 D12A FB79 926B 994E openSUSE 11.0, Kernel 2.6.25.5-1.1-default, KDE 3.5.9 Intel Celeron 2.53GB, 2GB DDR RAM, nVidia GeForce 7600GS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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Florian Schäfer

23 Jun 23 Jun

12:55

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams wrote:

...

I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Both directories are intended for different purposes by the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. Why do you want to merge them? Although, you can use a symlink or mess with sysconfig settings....

...

Bob

-- Best regards, Florian Schäfer -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob Williams

21:35

On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Both directories are intended for different purposes by the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. Why do you want to merge them? Although, you can use a symlink or mess with sysconfig settings....

OK. What size would you recommend each directory should be? -- Bob Registered Linux User #463880 GPG-FP: A6C1 457C 6DBA B13E 5524 F703 D12A FB79 926B 994E openSUSE 11.0, Kernel 2.6.25.5-1.1-default, KDE 3.5.9 Intel Celeron 2.53GB, 2GB DDR RAM, nVidia GeForce 7600GS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Druid

21:46

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 6:35 PM, Bob Williams wrote:

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On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Because of your problem and some other problems, people often link /var/tmp in /tmp or the other way around. cheers Marcio --- Druid -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob Williams

24 Jun 24 Jun

07:45

On Monday 23 June 2008 22:46:04 Druid wrote:

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On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 6:35 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

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On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Because of your problem and some other problems, people often link /var/tmp in /tmp or the other way around.

jdd sur free

07:53

Bob Williams wrote:

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ln -s /var/tmp /tmp

but I'm not sure where it should go. Inside /tmp or replacing it in / ?

replacing /tmp, I beg jdd

...

-- Jean-Daniel Dodin Président du CULTe www.culte.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

08:33

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Williams" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 3:45 AM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp On Monday 23 June 2008 22:46:04 Druid wrote:

...

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 6:35 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Because of your problem and some other problems, people often link /var/tmp in /tmp or the other way around.

That's what I want to do. When I installed this system, I partitioned the drive into / for 'the system' 2GB /var for variable files 15GB /usr 10GB /home already exists on another drive. I want to give plenty of space for temporary files, so I thought it would be better to put the in /var/tmp. I know how to do ln -s /var/tmp /tmp but I'm not sure where it should go. Inside /tmp or replacing it in / ? Thanks for everyone's help. ----------- If /tmp is currently a directory in /, not a mount point (say to a ramdisk). Then you should: mv /tmp /tmpx ln -s /var/tmp /tmp Then, boot to single user mode and: umount /var (if it was even mounted in single-user mode) mkdir -p /var/tmp chmod 1777 /var/tmp reboot Then reboot back to normal mode. That way, when booting into single user or when /var is busted or for whatever reason /var isn't mounted some time, /tmp is still a functional /tmp. When /var is mounted, /tmp is a symlink to a dir in the /var filesystem. When /var is not mounted, /tmp is a symlink to a dir in the / filesystem. Either way, the system is sane. You don't want to have /tmp be just a broken symlink some time because /var isn't mounted. Too many things just assume /tmp is always there, always a directory, always writeable by all users. If /var can't be unmounted even in single-user mode, then boot a live cd and mount the "/" partition manually to a temp directory, like: mkdir /hd mount /dev/sda1 /hd (whatever partition is usually "/") mkdir -p /hd/var/tmp chmod 1777 /hd/var/tmp umount /hd reboot It may be that /var is already somewhat populated in / even when not mounted for just this reason. If /var/tmp already exists when /var isn't mounted, then of course don't worry about creating it. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob Williams

09:18

On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

...

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Williams" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 3:45 AM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

Brian, many thanks for your detailed reply. Bob -- Bob Registered Linux User #463880 GPG-FP: A6C1 457C 6DBA B13E 5524 F703 D12A FB79 926B 994E openSUSE 11.0, Kernel 2.6.25.5-1.1-default, KDE 3.5.9 Intel Celeron 2.53GB, 2GB DDR RAM, nVidia GeForce 7600GS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

26 Jun 26 Jun

20:37

On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

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On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

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----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

This is just speculation, but I think I recall that grub uses some /tmp, and perhaps also fsck. (Or is it using the ramdisk /tmp????) If you bury your /tmp as a symlink into /var, then it may not be available when needed. My other reasoning is that so many progs use /tmp, that I would hate for a foul ball to wipe out my /var partition. Tom in NM -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

21:35

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:37 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

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On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

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On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

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----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

as an FYI, this (master) pc has been up 37 days, has currently myself (locally) and two other users (ssh -X) logged in (two on FVWM and one on KDE), and is running mysql, apache, firefox, zoneminder camera security, a gimp session, and I am in Qcad. My /var/tmp is 17 meg, and /tmp is 149 meg, and /var is totally 505 meg. Tom in NM -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

22:59

----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Patton" To: Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:37 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

...
On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

...
----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

as an FYI, this (master) pc has been up 37 days, has currently myself (locally) and two other users (ssh -X) logged in (two on FVWM and one on KDE), and is running mysql, apache, firefox, zoneminder camera security, a gimp session, and I am in Qcad.

My /var/tmp is 17 meg, and /tmp is 149 meg, and /var is totally 505 meg.

Tom in NM

Either tmp can spike into the gigs when people are careless or clueless about how they use graphics converters and/or the print spooler. For a mult-user system it is even more radically unpredictable. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

27 Jun 27 Jun

00:06

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 18:59 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Patton" To: Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

...

Either tmp can spike into the gigs when people are careless or clueless about how they use graphics converters and/or the print spooler. For a mult-user system it is even more radically unpredictable.

-- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR Agreed. I've seen my /tmp well over a gig when editing with Cinelerra (video). Rendering video and keeping an "undo" level eats space.

I guess it can be a hot button with some, but I still stick with the old school of separate partitions for nearly every root partition. I guess to me...it just feels "safer". Add to that, I am off the power grid, and although it is really rare, there are times that a switch from generator to inverter power will produce a hard crash. In the past 6 yrs, I have only (rather reiserfs) failed to recover ONCE ...and that was a lost /tmp and /usr/lib, both at the same time. I really think that was a head crash, as I was never able to re-use those two partitions. The drive itself, however, is still going strong, a year later. Tom in NM -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

00:25

Tom Patton wrote:

...

Agreed. I've seen my /tmp well over a gig when editing with Cinelerra (video). Rendering video and keeping an "undo" level eats space.

I guess it can be a hot button with some, but I still stick with the old school of separate partitions for nearly every root partition. I guess to me...it just feels "safer". Add to that, I am off the power grid, and although it is really rare, there are times that a switch from generator to inverter power will produce a hard crash. In the past 6 yrs, I have only (rather reiserfs) failed to recover ONCE ...and that was a lost /tmp and /usr/lib, both at the same time. I really think that was a head crash, as I was never able to re-use those two partitions. The drive itself, however, is still going strong, a year later.

Ever consider getting a UPS? -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

05:10

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...

...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

;-) Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter... So at the moment, a changeover relay works 99% of the time! Tom -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hans Krueger

10:03

Tom Patton wrote:

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On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

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...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

;-)

Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

So at the moment, a changeover relay works 99% of the time!

Tom

a friend of mine had the same problem www.rbelectronics.com I think he tried different one till he found ones that worked -- Hans Krueger hanskrueger007@roadrunner.com registered Linux user 289023 411024 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

10:42

----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Patton" To: Sent: Friday, June 27, 2008 1:10 AM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...
...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

yowch! -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

12:30

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Thursday 2008-06-26 at 23:10 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...
...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

;-)

Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

So at the moment, a changeover relay works 99% of the time!

If you have frequent need for ups, or running the computer from batteries, a better solution is to drive the PC power supply directly from batteries instead of mains supplied by an inverter. There is one stage less, and you conserve battery power. I saw those PSUs years ago, but I haven't seen them recently :-? On the other hand, if you have -48 instead of +48 there are telephone exchange quality inverters that can be chained with no problem. I used them, but I suppose they are quite expensive (heavy duty and very reliable, 24*7). - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIZN1ztTMYHG2NR9URAnTvAKCVVKs/fH+G0GqbaZD9Jp1b/U154QCfaQwX aN94cALzt4+CeHFbfBXTxAs= =c7cK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

13:01

From: "Carlos E. R."

...

The Thursday 2008-06-26 at 23:10 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

If you have frequent need for ups, or running the computer from batteries, a better solution is to drive the PC power supply directly from batteries instead of mains supplied by an inverter. There is one stage less, and you conserve battery power.

I beleive that is exactly what he just said he is in the process of doing. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

18:12

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2008-06-27 at 09:01 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

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From: "Carlos E. R."

...
The Thursday 2008-06-26 at 23:10 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

If you have frequent need for ups, or running the computer from batteries, a better solution is to drive the PC power supply directly from batteries instead of mains supplied by an inverter. There is one stage less, and you conserve battery power.

I beleive that is exactly what he just said he is in the process of doing.

No, not exactly. He said he would suply the UPS from the 48 volt stack. That means: UPS PSU ______________________ _______ / \ / \ 48V DC --> 120 or 230 AC --> --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3? What I propose is: PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3? There is no DC-->AC stage, and no AC-->DC stage. Another alternative is an internal PSU/UPS unit: PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V \ -12V 230V AC --> +5V -5V 3? - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIZS2HtTMYHG2NR9URAptMAJ4i4Xz2l+1SX09GWVVjwFV1baVzBwCeMVuR VZ0jOzZdZsNRZ4bBRvDx5Ds= =Gwqb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hans Witvliet

22:49

On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 20:12 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1

The Friday 2008-06-27 at 09:01 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

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From: "Carlos E. R."

...
The Thursday 2008-06-26 at 23:10 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:25 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...
Ever consider getting a UPS?

Actually, one more solar panel and I will have a separate 48v battery stack to serve as the storage cells for a UPS on this computer. It will then take over automatically when the genny is stopped. I have tried three UPS brands, but none "liked" the inverter output. More accurately, the inverter did not like driving the high surge current of the UPS, in essence an inverter driving another inverter...

If you have frequent need for ups, or running the computer from batteries, a better solution is to drive the PC power supply directly from batteries instead of mains supplied by an inverter. There is one stage less, and you conserve battery power.

I beleive that is exactly what he just said he is in the process of doing.

No, not exactly. He said he would suply the UPS from the 48 volt stack. That means:

UPS PSU ______________________ _______ / \ / \ 48V DC --> 120 or 230 AC --> --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3?

What I propose is:

PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3?

There is no DC-->AC stage, and no AC-->DC stage.

Another alternative is an internal PSU/UPS unit:

PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V \ -12V 230V AC --> +5V -5V 3?

- --

Seems the 12V is only fed from the 48v DC... Secondly PV-systems ave a very large ranging dc-output voltage I know that there are psu that have an iput of -48DC and output of +/- 12V and +5v (for instance HP) but the are rare, and only intended for their equipment. Most cots use 120-250 AC As a ham, i was advicsed against using PV directly, but use an intermediate 230AC (because of the highly variable DC-voltage and a very power ineffcient dc/dc converter. (just my 0.02 euro's) PE1CXJ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

28 Jun 28 Jun

02:09

New subject: OT: QSL was: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

----- Original Message ----- From: "Hans Witvliet"

...

PE1CXJ

KA2PLF! And dad is N2CHX Ok so I got that when I was 9 and I'm 38 now and it's long since lapsed. (and you still had to actually know some electronics and radio theory and actually had to *gasp* code, and no phone allowed, all just for a Novice class, and I had to take my test under a rutheless genius Advanced, in the snow, uphill both ways... .damned kids have it so easy these days buying a Technician's like damned cb license or a fishing license, "Amatuer Extra" that obsoletes the Advanced yet only requires 5wpm! 5??? ... 5! *disgust* .... 5 *sigh*) ;) __._ ... ._.. -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

11:41

New subject: OT: QSL was: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

Brian K. White wrote:

...

----- Original Message ----- From: "Hans Witvliet"

...
PE1CXJ

KA2PLF! And dad is N2CHX

Ok so I got that when I was 9 and I'm 38 now and it's long since lapsed. (and you still had to actually know some electronics and radio theory and actually had to *gasp* code, and no phone allowed, all just for a Novice class, and I had to take my test under a rutheless genius Advanced, in the snow, uphill both ways... .damned kids have it so easy these days buying a Technician's like damned cb license or a fishing license, "Amatuer Extra" that obsoletes the Advanced yet only requires 5wpm! 5??? ... 5! *disgust* .... 5 *sigh*)

VE3ZU here. Got my license 36 years ago and also had real tests, with essay questions, not multiple guess. Had to do code for a year, before going for Advanced license. With the first license, no phone on HF, though we could use it on VHF & above. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

01:12

On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 20:12 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1

The Friday 2008-06-27 at 09:01 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

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What I propose is:

PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3? Sorry to range off-topic, but here's my reasoning. I considered direct dc-dc conversion, but, also being a HAM, there is probability of RFI and even lightning entering the computer from the solar system/battery bank outside. Having a good commercial UPS already, I am replacing its batteries with my (soon-to-be) 48v stack, and the UPS will then function normally in response to the few hours a day we are on generator. The higher capacity solar-charged batteries will carry the system for the remainder of the day.

The main system is (4) GNB Absolyte-IIP 440AH batteries in parallel for 12v. They supply two (phase-locked) inverters and 12v lighting circuits to the house. It would be slightly more efficient running the main at 48, but at the time the RV inverters were much less expensive than an industrial inverter. Being 12v also let me expand the solar panels as I went along, and allow for several "mobile" radios in the HAM shack. So I hope that answers the /tmp question! Tom in NM 73 all -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

11:04

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2008-06-27 at 19:12 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

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On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 20:12 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

...
What I propose is:

PSU ____ / \ 48V DC --> +12V -12V +5V -5V 3?

...

Sorry to range off-topic, but here's my reasoning. I considered direct dc-dc conversion, but, also being a HAM, there is probability of RFI and even lightning entering the computer from the solar system/battery bank outside. Having a good commercial UPS already, I am replacing its batteries with my (soon-to-be) 48v stack, and the UPS will then function normally in response to the few hours a day we are on generator. The higher capacity solar-charged batteries will carry the system for the remainder of the day.

RFI can be blocked with chokes. Some (many?) DC-DC converters have in fact an AC stage, with a transformer, so there is galvanic isolation. Lightning... ufff!. Dunno. Best thing is a good l. rod. You know that bad lighning protection is worse that no protection? It atracts rays, which then find no easy route to earth, and use the house and equipment instead. Fire and disasters. I remember seeing some years ago a PC power supply that replaced the standard PSU, and had internal batteries, working as an UPS when the AC failed. Ie, it was a PSU/UPS unit in one, with one converter stage less, more efficient, which is something to consider when you are not on mains. There may exist commercial 12DC PSUs for computers, but probably the inverter road is more known/cheaper. There is a range of -48 V converters used in telephone exchange. They should be very expensive. And it is -48 because earth is the + line (dunno why, historical reasons, I suppose). All equipment designed for telephone exchange must use -48, but sometimes they are forced to use standard AC mains equipment with inverters. I have seen, for instance, Cisco routers fed from -48 directly.

...

The main system is (4) GNB Absolyte-IIP 440AH batteries in parallel for 12v. They supply two (phase-locked) inverters and 12v lighting circuits to the house. It would be slightly more efficient running the main at 48, but at the time the RV inverters were much less expensive than an industrial inverter. Being 12v also let me expand the solar panels as I went along, and allow for several "mobile" radios in the HAM shack.

A complex installation :-)

...

So I hope that answers the /tmp question!

Right, I changed the subject O:-) - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIZhrVtTMYHG2NR9URAnfRAJ4yMyFL7UUl+EZGJrqVowkdZSjSMQCfbPOu QC3qM1eq8uioeCRLfrqsv8o= =UPvp -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

11:58

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

RFI can be blocked with chokes. Some (many?) DC-DC converters have in fact an AC stage, with a transformer, so there is galvanic isolation. Lightning... ufff!. Dunno. Best thing is a good l. rod.

They all have an an AC stage. It's the only way you can use a transformer to efficiently change voltage. However, they tend to operate at several KHz and not power line frequencies.

...

You know that bad lighning protection is worse that no protection? It atracts rays, which then find no easy route to earth, and use the house and equipment instead. Fire and disasters.

I remember seeing some years ago a PC power supply that replaced the standard PSU, and had internal batteries, working as an UPS when the AC failed. Ie, it was a PSU/UPS unit in one, with one converter stage less, more efficient, which is something to consider when you are not on mains.

There may exist commercial 12DC PSUs for computers, but probably the inverter road is more known/cheaper.

There is a range of -48 V converters used in telephone exchange. They should be very expensive. And it is -48 because earth is the + line (dunno why, historical reasons, I suppose). All equipment designed for telephone exchange must use -48, but sometimes they are forced to use standard AC mains equipment with inverters. I have seen, for instance, Cisco routers fed from -48 directly.

A lot of telecom gear can be used with either + or - grounded or both sides floating. I could be wrong, but I seem to recall positive ground was used to reduce corrosion of the wires. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

29 Jun 29 Jun

22:26

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2008-06-28 at 07:58 -0400, James Knott wrote:

...

Carlos E. R. wrote:

...
RFI can be blocked with chokes. Some (many?) DC-DC converters have in fact an AC stage, with a transformer, so there is galvanic isolation. Lightning... ufff!. Dunno. Best thing is a good l. rod.

They all have an an AC stage. It's the only way you can use a transformer to efficiently change voltage. However, they tend to operate at several KHz and not power line frequencies.

Yes, but it is not the only method. Switching capacitors, for instance. Or capacitors and chokes.

...

...
There is a range of -48 V converters used in telephone exchange. They should be very expensive. And it is -48 because earth is the + line (dunno why, historical reasons, I suppose). All equipment designed for telephone exchange must use -48, but sometimes they are forced to use standard AC mains equipment with inverters. I have seen, for instance, Cisco routers fed from -48 directly.

A lot of telecom gear can be used with either + or - grounded or both sides floating. I could be wrong, but I seem to recall positive ground was used to reduce corrosion of the wires.

All the equipment I handled was only +48, but I always thought that could be changed if they wanted. Corrosion? Could be, it would make sense. I seem to recall reading about cars with positive ground in the states :-? - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIaAw2tTMYHG2NR9URAoeEAJ9nzFfEXFeLrHfqVp95uMkd8UqeGgCeNmzH WJe/ftbqCgM64lO5KbAfqVE= =Z0fn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

23:09

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

* Carlos E. R. [06-29-08 18:29]:

...

All the equipment I handled was only +48, but I always thought that could be changed if they wanted. Corrosion? Could be, it would make sense. I seem to recall reading about cars with positive ground in the states :-?

Ford had positive ground in the early '50s and before. Maybe until they changed from 6 to 12 volts in 1954, iirc. I was younger then and had better recall :^) -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

23:42

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Sunday 2008-06-29 at 19:09 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Carlos E. R. <> [06-29-08 18:29]:

...
All the equipment I handled was only +48, but I always thought that could be changed if they wanted. Corrosion? Could be, it would make sense. I seem to recall reading about cars with positive ground in the states :-?

Ford had positive ground in the early '50s and before. Maybe until they changed from 6 to 12 volts in 1954, iirc. I was younger then and had better recall :^)

I have a book on car mechanics that the first edition was written in the twenties or there abouts, and has been modernized later (the author is dead, but the mechanic department of a university has taken over). I have three different editions, and its curious to see how many things remain the same and many other change. It is there where I read about cars with positive ground, but I've never seen any one. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIaB3ytTMYHG2NR9URAnE0AJ9E03+XOL5LdXfWZMmOrp+mhL0PnQCeJcAk CajVWpsg9Fhd3ZCbk1umqSc= =W6T7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jerry Houston

30 Jun 30 Jun

00:57

New subject: [opensuse] DC power suply [Was: /tmp or /var/tmp]

Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Carlos E. R. [06-29-08 18:29]:

...
All the equipment I handled was only +48, but I always thought that could be changed if they wanted. Corrosion? Could be, it would make sense. I seem to recall reading about cars with positive ground in the states :-?

Ford had positive ground in the early '50s and before. Maybe until they changed from 6 to 12 volts in 1954, iirc. I was younger then and had better recall :^)

My '62 Triumph TR3-A had "positive earth," with two 6v. batteries in series behind the seats. But the TR4 that replaced it had a single 12v. and negative ground. I believe that positive ground was uncommon for cars in the US by the '60's, because mechanics were usually quite surprised by it. Something about "Lucas, Prince of Darkness" comes to mind when I think back to those days. Rather than try to steer this thread back on topic, I'm just going to quietly back out now. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Brian K. White

27 Jun 27 Jun

00:29

----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Patton" To: Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 8:06 PM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 18:59 -0400, Brian K. White wrote:

...
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Patton" To: Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [opensuse] /tmp or /var/tmp

...
Either tmp can spike into the gigs when people are careless or clueless about how they use graphics converters and/or the print spooler. For a mult-user system it is even more radically unpredictable.

-- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR Agreed. I've seen my /tmp well over a gig when editing with Cinelerra (video). Rendering video and keeping an "undo" level eats space.

I guess it can be a hot button with some, but I still stick with the old school of separate partitions for nearly every root partition. I guess to me...it just feels "safer".

Can't be argued with. Everyones arguments on both sides (split up fs's, one or few fs's) are right. Comes down to personal preference and maybe occasionally to some kind of statistical guesstimanalysis of the users needs, tolerance for downtime, usage pattern, philosopy on risk aversion vs productivity, etc... -- Brian K. White brian@aljex.com http://www.myspace.com/KEYofR +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++. filePro BBx Linux SCO FreeBSD #callahans Satriani Filk! -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

00:23

Brian K. White wrote:

...

Either tmp can spike into the gigs when people are careless or clueless about how they use graphics converters and/or the print spooler. For a mult-user system it is even more radically unpredictable.

In that case, ln -s /dev/null /tmp. ;-) -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hans Witvliet

26 Jun 26 Jun

21:41

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:37 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...

On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

...
On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

...
----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

This is just speculation, but I think I recall that grub uses some /tmp, and perhaps also fsck. (Or is it using the ramdisk /tmp????) If you bury your /tmp as a symlink into /var, then it may not be available when needed.

My other reasoning is that so many progs use /tmp, that I would hate for a foul ball to wipe out my /var partition.

Tom in NM

Just curious.... Why would you give those partitions that much space ? I recently came across a number of system that held over 500MB in /tmp or /var/tmp, but most of them were more than a week old, indicating that the cron-janitor cleaning those areas was "on leave" ;-) hw -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider

21:52

Hans Witvliet pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:37 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

...
On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

...
----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

This is just speculation, but I think I recall that grub uses some /tmp, and perhaps also fsck. (Or is it using the ramdisk /tmp????) If you bury your /tmp as a symlink into /var, then it may not be available when needed.

My other reasoning is that so many progs use /tmp, that I would hate for a foul ball to wipe out my /var partition.

Tom in NM

Just curious.... Why would you give those partitions that much space ?

I recently came across a number of system that held over 500MB in /tmp or /var/tmp, but most of them were more than a week old, indicating that the cron-janitor cleaning those areas was "on leave" ;-)

hw

Either "on leave" or hasn't been hired yet. :-) -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

23:58

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Thursday 2008-06-26 at 23:41 +0200, Hans Witvliet wrote:

...

Just curious.... Why would you give those partitions that much space ?

I recently came across a number of system that held over 500MB in /tmp or /var/tmp, but most of them were more than a week old, indicating that the cron-janitor cleaning those areas was "on leave" ;-)

Try opening really large o high quality photos with Gimp and you will see temporay usage soaring up there like an eagle. Or open a large tar with mc. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIZC0StTMYHG2NR9URAoveAJ9C+sdUNHWl04oCs4P+R+kxcLPkrACfRP79 /rT5gzIlyGeA2GGDdvEVqz0= =GjAG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

27 Jun 27 Jun

00:19

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 23:41 +0200, Hans Witvliet wrote:

...

On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:37 -0600, Tom Patton wrote:

...
On Tue, 2008-06-24 at 10:18 +0100, Bob Williams wrote:

...
On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:33:36 Brian K. White wrote:

...
----- Original Message ----- I do believe my approach would be to resize your /var to 10GB, and create a new 5 GB partition mounted at /tmp.

This is just speculation, but I think I recall that grub uses some /tmp, and perhaps also fsck. (Or is it using the ramdisk /tmp????) If you bury your /tmp as a symlink into /var, then it may not be available when needed.

My other reasoning is that so many progs use /tmp, that I would hate for a foul ball to wipe out my /var partition.

Tom in NM

Just curious.... Why would you give those partitions that much space ? I wouldn't, myself. But he had 15G for /var, so it was rather rhetorical. Among others, I use 4G /usr, 4G /usr/lib, 4G /var, and 2G /tmp. I seldom see any of them more than 30% full.

Tom -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

24 Jun 24 Jun

14:13

Bob Williams wrote:

...

On Monday 23 June 2008 22:46:04 Druid wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 6:35 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp? Because of your problem and some other problems, people often link /var/tmp in /tmp or the other way around.

That's what I want to do. When I installed this system, I partitioned the drive into / for 'the system' 2GB /var for variable files 15GB /usr 10GB

/home already exists on another drive.

I want to give plenty of space for temporary files, so I thought it would be better to put the in /var/tmp.

I know how to do

ln -s /var/tmp /tmp

but I'm not sure where it should go. Inside /tmp or replacing it in / ?

Thanks for everyone's help.

Clear out everything in /tmp and remove the directory. Then create the symlink. It's probably easier to do this from a rescue CD, so there won't be any open files in /tmp to cause problems. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider

23 Jun 23 Jun

21:46

Bob Williams pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp? Both directories are intended for different purposes by the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. Why do you want to merge them? Although, you can use a symlink or mess with sysconfig settings....

OK. What size would you recommend each directory should be?

Not intended to start a flame war. Why bother? 20 years ago when disk drives were small ( not to mention expensive ) it was necessary to have separate partitions because drives just were not big enough for everything. Today that limitation does not exist. All that is really necessary today is two partitions, one for swap and one for /. Some people prefer to put /home on a separate partition. By using one large partition you eliminate all of the guess work. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hans Witvliet

22:54

On Mon, 2008-06-23 at 17:46 -0400, Ken Schneider wrote:

...

Bob Williams pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...
On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp? Both directories are intended for different purposes by the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. Why do you want to merge them? Although, you can use a symlink or mess with sysconfig settings....

OK. What size would you recommend each directory should be?

Not intended to start a flame war.

Why bother? 20 years ago when disk drives were small ( not to mention expensive ) it was necessary to have separate partitions because drives just were not big enough for everything. Today that limitation does not exist. All that is really necessary today is two partitions, one for swap and one for /. Some people prefer to put /home on a separate partition. By using one large partition you eliminate all of the guess work.

What has size to do with it? Main reasons for having separate mount points and disks were and still are: 1) security (protecting system against runaway programs or sloppy users/admins) 2) speed (small but ultra fast disk for fast startup or intermediate results and otoh slow but huge disk for logs&data&homes) If neither of those mean anything to you (test systems): fine, just use "/". -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

23:01

Ken Schneider wrote:

...

Bob Williams pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...
On Monday 23 June 2008 13:55:47 Florian Schäfer wrote:

...
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:44 PM, Bob Williams

wrote:

...
I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp? Both directories are intended for different purposes by the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. Why do you want to merge them? Although, you can use a symlink or mess with sysconfig settings....

OK. What size would you recommend each directory should be?

Not intended to start a flame war.

Why bother? 20 years ago when disk drives were small ( not to mention expensive ) it was necessary to have separate partitions because drives just were not big enough for everything. Today that limitation does not exist. All that is really necessary today is two partitions, one for swap and one for /. Some people prefer to put /home on a separate partition. By using one large partition you eliminate all of the guess work.

There's another reason for a separate partition for /var or /tmp. Sometimes something runs away and keeps adding to them. If in the same partition as everything else, it can really kill the system. If limited to there own partition, the system might not die, though you will have some strange results. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

14:55

Bob Williams wrote:

...

I have both /tmp and /var/tmp here. /var/tmp is much bigger than /tmp. How can make sure all temporary files end up in /var/tmp?

Bob

Create a symlink from /tmp to /var/tmp. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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participants (13)

Bob Williams
Brian K. White
Carlos E. R.
Druid
Florian Schäfer
Hans Krueger
Hans Witvliet
James Knott
jdd sur free
Jerry Houston
Ken Schneider
Patrick Shanahan
Tom Patton