Re: [opensuse-wiki] Article reviewing - current status
Rupert Horstkötter wrote:
With the Mentoring Session one week over, I see 6 Articles "checked", 21 Articles "under review" and 5 Articles "not transferred". While this is certainly appreciated, I assume that we won't manage to go through http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_List in a reasonable timeframe if we don't accelerate this effort significantly.
i can't speak for any others...but, the 'holidays' were joyful (yipee) and didn't offer the reams of 'free time' i had planned to donate to the open source/openSUSE cause...and, when i tried to dive in, i found a few problems/challenges which severely dampened my willingness to plunge ahead at Mach 2: 1. a HUGE list <http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_List> of work--daunting, over powering and seemingly endless...chilling...a mountain of work...i got 'tired' just trying to find something i *wanted* to spend time with... and then i found an article i was willing to _begin_ with and turned to the checklist <http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_Guidelines> of things to do for each article--and *immediately* find instructions i don't know how to follow, like: 2. in Step 1 > Format check > "Change capitalization of title page by moving the article to the new name." ok, that is simple enough instructions (for a Wiki Guru...which i'm not,) so i have zero idea how to "move" the article to the new name...and, that means i can't pick anything with a title that needs changing. (which is ok, 'cause now _my_ list is shorter and more manageable because any article with more than a one word title is off limits for me---waaaaaaaaaaa, what if all the ones i wanna work on have two or more words in the title?) 3. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > "knowledge bar" and immediately i need to know a. how i am supposed to know (or learn) if the article has been tested against which (if any) of the current releases?? b. i've never actually run any 11.x more than a few minutes, so maybe i'm not qualified to help at all--is this a task for bleeding edgers only? c. am i to wander around in the wiki until i've filled in the list of 'recommended articles'? d. if i wander around and find an article to be mentioned, how do i decide if it is a "recomended article" or a "related article" e. i wonder if the article i'm reviewing is going to have to be reviewed EVERY eight months, *forever*?? and, who is gonna do that? (obviously it will have to be an 'early adopter' huh?) 4. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > Communication > Team members, and i wonder a. if each article needs a list of "team members"? b. and what team? is each page supposed to have a 'team' of originators/contributors/editors? (that wasn't mentioned in the mentoring session i attended..) c. so, where do i find the list of 'team members'? or, do we expect it to grow, naturally? if i'm on that list will i still be there when i have "moved on" in, say 50 years? d. if there is to be a team then what about this: "This article is under review! The contents are currently being evaluated and edited by [[User:{{{1}}}]]. Others should not make any changes." <http://en.opensuse.org/Template:InReview> which is not a very 'team building' pronouncement, framed in red. e. will each page have a 'team leader' or will each page have their own mini-anarchy? 5. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > Mailing list, and i wonder a. if each article requires a mailing list be associated with it? do some articles need two mailing lists? three? b. what about forums--if we list related mailing lists shouldn't we also name the related forums? c. how do i decide which mailing list/forum should be on any particular article? see? imHo, i can do a half okay job of turning non-native speaker/writer's or 'hacker' prose into nearly clearly usable, not overly hacker/technical english...but, to do ALL that is expected for any one article i have a LONG way to go to be helpful with: -moving wiki pages -wiki mark up language (sure i can learn it, eventually) [i 'know' basic html, is there a converter? like can i feed in a finished html page with say <b>this</b><br>and <i>that</i><br> and out pops wiki with '''this''' and ''that'' which i can copy paste into a wiki editing box?] -develop the 'knowledge' of version specifics and recommended/related articles -associating mail lists -following the fully ripe/mature instructions/guidelines/checklists needed to implement the ideas/ideals decided before i stumbled in.. vr, DenverD -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
On 01/06/2010 02:45 AM, DenverD wrote:
Rupert Horstkötter wrote:
With the Mentoring Session one week over, I see 6 Articles "checked", 21 Articles "under review" and 5 Articles "not transferred". While this is certainly appreciated, I assume that we won't manage to go through http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_List in a reasonable timeframe if we don't accelerate this effort significantly.
i can't speak for any others...but, the 'holidays' were joyful (yipee) and didn't offer the reams of 'free time' i had planned to donate to the open source/openSUSE cause...and, when i tried to dive in, i found a few problems/challenges which severely dampened my willingness to plunge ahead at Mach 2:
1. a HUGE list <http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_List> of work--daunting, over powering and seemingly endless...chilling...a mountain of work...i got 'tired' just trying to find something i *wanted* to spend time with...
and then i found an article i was willing to _begin_ with and turned to the checklist <http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_Guidelines> of things to do for each article--and *immediately* find instructions i don't know how to follow, like:
ditto for me! Instructions WAY too confusing and off-putting! yikes! Although I understand that cleanup is needed, maybe everything should be transitioned to new setup (somehow--I can't even get my head around the namespace business and how it applies to existing pages if you want to know the truth! :/) and then go back to template compliance. Or, put up a "generic template" and tell us how to paste germaine content into it?
2. in Step 1 > Format check > "Change capitalization of title page by moving the article to the new name." ok, that is simple enough instructions (for a Wiki Guru...which i'm not,) so i have zero idea how to "move" the article to the new name...and, that means i can't pick anything with a title that needs changing. (which is ok, 'cause now _my_ list is shorter and more manageable because any article with more than a one word title is off limits for me---waaaaaaaaaaa, what if all the ones i wanna work on have two or more words in the title?)
3. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > "knowledge bar" and immediately i need to know a. how i am supposed to know (or learn) if the article has been tested against which (if any) of the current releases?? b. i've never actually run any 11.x more than a few minutes, so maybe i'm not qualified to help at all--is this a task for bleeding edgers only? c. am i to wander around in the wiki until i've filled in the list of 'recommended articles'? d. if i wander around and find an article to be mentioned, how do i decide if it is a "recomended article" or a "related article" e. i wonder if the article i'm reviewing is going to have to be reviewed EVERY eight months, *forever*?? and, who is gonna do that? (obviously it will have to be an 'early adopter' huh?)
4. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > Communication > Team members, and i wonder a. if each article needs a list of "team members"? b. and what team? is each page supposed to have a 'team' of originators/contributors/editors? (that wasn't mentioned in the mentoring session i attended..) c. so, where do i find the list of 'team members'? or, do we expect it to grow, naturally? if i'm on that list will i still be there when i have "moved on" in, say 50 years? d. if there is to be a team then what about this: "This article is under review! The contents are currently being evaluated and edited by [[User:{{{1}}}]]. Others should not make any changes." <http://en.opensuse.org/Template:InReview> which is not a very 'team building' pronouncement, framed in red. e. will each page have a 'team leader' or will each page have their own mini-anarchy?
5. same Step 1 > Format check > "Follows the openSUSE:Article Template" > Mailing list, and i wonder a. if each article requires a mailing list be associated with it? do some articles need two mailing lists? three? b. what about forums--if we list related mailing lists shouldn't we also name the related forums? c. how do i decide which mailing list/forum should be on any particular article?
see? imHo, i can do a half okay job of turning non-native speaker/writer's or 'hacker' prose into nearly clearly usable, not overly hacker/technical english...but, to do ALL that is expected for any one article i have a LONG way to go to be helpful with:
-moving wiki pages
-wiki mark up language (sure i can learn it, eventually) [i 'know' basic html, is there a converter? like can i feed in a finished html page with say <b>this</b><br>and <i>that</i><br> and out pops wiki with '''this''' and ''that'' which i can copy paste into a wiki editing box?]
-develop the 'knowledge' of version specifics and recommended/related articles
-associating mail lists
-following the fully ripe/mature instructions/guidelines/checklists needed to implement the ideas/ideals decided before i stumbled in..
vr, DenverD
-- ============================================================ Kay Schenk "No one ever regarded the First of January with indifference. It is that from which all date their time, and count upon what is left. It is the nativity of our common Adam." -- Charles Lamb -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
2010/1/6 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>:
ditto for me! Instructions WAY too confusing and off-putting! yikes! Although I understand that cleanup is needed, maybe everything should be transitioned to new setup (somehow--I can't even get my head around the namespace business and how it applies to existing pages if you want to know the truth! :/) and then go back to template compliance. Or, put up a "generic template" and tell us how to paste germaine content into it?
After re-reading http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_Guidelines#Step_1_:_Articles_review I honestly don't know how we should explain the process even more straightforward. We're certainly open for suggestions though. As of http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Article_Template .. It's a general template we value to ensure a consistent look&feel when browsing the wiki. What specific information is needed and valid for a specific article is certainly the estimation of the reviewer (also what information is not). Looking forward to your suggestions and thanks for participating, R -- Rupert Horstkötter, open-slx gmbh openSUSE Board Member openSUSE Community Assistant http://en.opensuse.org/User:Rhorstkoetter Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Jabber: ruperthorstkoetter@googlemail.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 2010-01-07 at 11:04 +0100, Rupert Horstkötter wrote:
2010/1/6 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>:
ditto for me! Instructions WAY too confusing and off-putting! yikes! Although I understand that cleanup is needed, maybe everything should be transitioned to new setup (somehow--I can't even get my head around the namespace business and how it applies to existing pages if you want to know the truth! :/) and then go back to template compliance. Or, put up a "generic template" and tell us how to paste germaine content into it?
First you pick an article that has not been reviewed and is not under review. Once you have done that, you begin the review process yourself, for that article that you have selected. Then you edit the article for 2 main things. 1) for brows-ability. In other words, make sure it fits the format, the templates that we have drawn up. 2) Accuracy. You need to check the article and make sure it's current and accurate. Once your done with that, you let us know. Some one will check it and either let you know what needs to be fixed, or put the stamp of approval on it. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
On 01/07/2010 02:04 AM, Rupert Horstkötter wrote:
2010/1/6 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>:
ditto for me! Instructions WAY too confusing and off-putting! yikes! Although I understand that cleanup is needed, maybe everything should be transitioned to new setup (somehow--I can't even get my head around the namespace business and how it applies to existing pages if you want to know the truth! :/) and then go back to template compliance. Or, put up a "generic template" and tell us how to paste germaine content into it?
After re-reading http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_Guidelines#Step_1_:_Articles_review I honestly don't know how we should explain the process even more straightforward.
Rupert-- The explanation of the process IS straightforward...it's the process itself and the intricacies with it that are confusing for folks who are not versed in the internals of the wiki. For example, the last instruction on "Choosing an article" says this... * Then go to the current article and put the Template:InReview at the top of its page, along with with {{InReview|YourWikiName}} hmmmm....???? a link on how to do this or what you mean by this would be VERY helpful. Under "Format Check" is a very long list of regulations. My initial reaction to this is one of great confusion. I don't really understand the need to as many references as you have here. For example: # Follows the openSUSE:Article Template # Uses standardized Templates only. See openSUSE:Wiki_Template_Guidelines for the main templates to be used. so how many templates should I follow, and how do I actually use/insert them? I think a nice little short instruction page on the use of templates would be great! I see you have a link to the wikipedia Help:Template page but, well, this isn't very easy to decipher really. My ONE big suggestion at the moment would be to considerably simplify the "Format check" section in some way if you can. Next would be to do up a very short page from this one -- http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Wiki_Template_Guidelines#Standardized_templa... ----> this little section When creating a new article or portal, make sure to use * Article template * Portal Template linking the word "use" into a short tutorial on how to "use" the openSuSE standardized templates ... We're certainly open for suggestions though. As of
http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Article_Template .. It's a general template we value to ensure a consistent look&feel when browsing the wiki. What specific information is needed and valid for a specific article is certainly the estimation of the reviewer (also what information is not).
Looking forward to your suggestions and thanks for participating, R
-- ============================================================ Kay Schenk ph: 530-898-5339 Applications Development and Enterprise Design CSU, Chico "No one ever regarded the First of January with indifference. It is that from which all date their time, and count upon what is left. It is the nativity of our common Adam." -- Charles Lamb -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
Kay, here's what I did: I found an article which was under review. I clicked "edit" only to see how the source looked like. (Please don't change anything in this article.) That pretty much answered my questions and I could start editing my own article. If you still have questions, just keep "your" article open and go to the IRC Wiki channel. Keep in mind that people there can see what you see and can help you online. HTH Uwe -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
Kay, 2010/1/7 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>:
On 01/07/2010 02:04 AM, Rupert Horstkötter wrote:
2010/1/6 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>:
ditto for me! Instructions WAY too confusing and off-putting! yikes! Although I understand that cleanup is needed, maybe everything should be transitioned to new setup (somehow--I can't even get my head around the namespace business and how it applies to existing pages if you want to know the truth! :/) and then go back to template compliance. Or, put up a "generic template" and tell us how to paste germaine content into it?
After re-reading http://en.opensuse.org/Transition_Guidelines#Step_1_:_Articles_review I honestly don't know how we should explain the process even more straightforward.
Rupert--
The explanation of the process IS straightforward...it's the process itself and the intricacies with it that are confusing for folks who are not versed in the internals of the wiki.
For example, the last instruction on "Choosing an article" says this...
* Then go to the current article and put the Template:InReview at the top of its page, along with with {{InReview|YourWikiName}}
*Confused* You put {{InReview|YourWikiName}} on top of the article source-code, that's it.
hmmmm....???? a link on how to do this or what you mean by this would be VERY helpful.
Under "Format Check" is a very long list of regulations. My initial reaction to this is one of great confusion. I don't really understand the need to as many references as you have here. For example:
# Follows the openSUSE:Article Template # Uses standardized Templates only. See openSUSE:Wiki_Template_Guidelines for the main templates to be used.
so how many templates should I follow, and how do I actually use/insert them?
Every article should match the Article Template. The Template Guidelines explain the use of standardized wiki templates where appropriate (like e.g. a Version note or similar). The usage of these is explained (with Code sample) at http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Wiki_Template_Guidelines and http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Wiki_Tag_Guidelines
I think a nice little short instruction page on the use of templates would be great! I see you have a link to the wikipedia Help:Template page but, well, this isn't very easy to decipher really.
My ONE big suggestion at the moment would be to considerably simplify the "Format check" section in some way if you can.
Sorry, I see where you're coming from but I honestly don't see an opportunity to further simplify the process as it actually involves the steps outlined at Format Check.
Next would be to do up a very short page from this one -- http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Wiki_Template_Guidelines#Standardized_templa...
----> this little section When creating a new article or portal, make sure to use
* Article template * Portal Template
linking the word "use" into a short tutorial on how to "use" the openSuSE standardized templates ...
May you please, as Uwe suggested, use a already "reviewed" and/or "in review" page? This is the best example you may get here. Does this address your questions/concerns? I am (we're) certainly open for suggestion on HOW to simplify the Format Check though. Best, R
We're certainly open for suggestions though. As of
http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Article_Template .. It's a general template we value to ensure a consistent look&feel when browsing the wiki. What specific information is needed and valid for a specific article is certainly the estimation of the reviewer (also what information is not).
Looking forward to your suggestions and thanks for participating, R
-- ============================================================ Kay Schenk ph: 530-898-5339 Applications Development and Enterprise Design CSU, Chico
"No one ever regarded the First of January with indifference. It is that from which all date their time, and count upon what is left. It is the nativity of our common Adam." -- Charles Lamb -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
-- Rupert Horstkötter, open-slx gmbh openSUSE Board Member openSUSE Community Assistant http://en.opensuse.org/User:Rhorstkoetter Email: rhorstkoetter@opensuse.org Jabber: ruperthorstkoetter@googlemail.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-wiki+help@opensuse.org
participants (5)
-
DenverD -
Jonathan Rocker -
Kay Schenk -
Rupert Horstkötter -
Uwe Buckesfeld