2010/7/16 jdd <jdd@dodin.org>:
Le 16/07/2010 01:40, Rajko M. a écrit :
On Thursday 15 July 2010 05:49:54 jdd wrote:
I didn't understood you want to discourage new contributors and old ones...
You are right, you didn't understood what he was saying, so just drop it.
Sincerely, the wiki structure is explained well (...)
where? I didn't find what you say next (and I follow the wiki list from the beginning).
You already checked http://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Wiki there it's perfectly explained to you, with some nice links to articles where we explain more on a certain item, like namespaces. It may have helped if you had reed the news: http://news.opensuse.org/2010/07/08/the-devil-is-in-the-details/ Following this list from the beginning? Well, then it's clearly not our fault, you don't understand. I started to work on the new wiki 3 weeks ago and it took 1 day to undestand. Maybe sometimes a question about a certain article, but that's it. This also counts for everybody else. Question? Just ask! We are more than heapy to help.
May be the way to submit pages have to be more simply documented. May be also the lack of efficient search tools is dramatic.
For example I have a Blu ray writer and I wrote some ideas to write Blu ray here (in french):
http://forums.opensuse.org/other-languages/francais-french/contributions/doc...
Search for Blu Ray on the wiki returns nothing (and google site:en.opensuse.org blu ray don't help)
Well, then there's nothing wrong with our search engine then he? Welcome to a wiki! If you find a article not there, and you know things about it. Don't start complaining, write it! With all the text writing in complaint e-mails, you already should have already have 3 articles finished!
The openSUSE home pages gives little if no clue on what one have to do. Project? looks like only self-advertisement Distribution? same things Wiki? most people I know don't even know what is a wiki... they see a "web site") support? I don't need support, I'm here to give some :-).
See above
However, I see there a much better search box (I wonder why it's not on the home page?) and a very intimidating list of "portals", that is an other jump level before anything usefull.
Then I jump to the "Documentation" Portal.. there I find finally "Review or _Write_ Documentation", but that needs an other jump
And there I see absolutely nothing about writing my own small page on the wiki. After half an hour unusefull work, I give up. On the Forum all I had to do is go to "document" and open a new thread...
Why? what's so hard about it? Type search, if the article doesn't exist, you click the red link in the search results, done!
We had a very long thread on an other list (marketting or project, I don't remember) about "how to make users participate".
The better way to make users participate is to allow them to do small tasks. Writing on the wiki is the more rewarding task, but also quite intimidating and should be encouraged as much as possible.
Why not a "wikisandbox" namespace where one could write a raw document, of course a part that should be specially followed to help classifying and writing (or do you plan to follow mailing lists and forums searching for doc to include in the wiki?)
We have this system, with the reviewing process, which you complained about in an earlier mail.
I don't question the need for organized documentation, but to have something organized, you have to have something to organize, and all the present doc is subject to obsolescence!
Off course the wiki is still quite empty and a lot of pages are still to be transferred. I would say: help out by finding them on the old-en.o.o read them, review them, fix them, then transfer them. If you find it difficult to transfer, mark it as {{Reviewed}} and we'll do the work for you! People and especially editors (including you) knew about this wiki transition long ago. Long enough to help out in the painful and slow progress of transferring articles. You don't have to help, it's all volunteer based, but reading this mailing list all the time, knowing what is happening (and letting it happen), but not giving any feedback, improvements, help out or what soever and now start complaining like a mad man? This is not the way. Off course you are free to share your feedback with us, we are more than happy to hear. But come with facts we can do something about. eg: please include in search the following. If more people support it, it will be done. Simple.
sorry if tghis is not exactly the good thread, But I couldn't think of a better title :-(
You are right, not the good tread, we are trying to work here with practical things. If you'd wish to continue this discussion open a new thread for this: Complaints Greetings, Tim
jdd
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