Re: [opensuse] leap422 okular printing issue
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Per Jessen Gesendet: Do. 15.12.2016 08:20 An: opensuse@opensuse.org Betreff: Re: [opensuse] leap422 okular printing issue
Carlos E. R. wrote:
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On 2016-12-14 14:28, Per Jessen wrote:
Carlos E. R. wrote:
I'll check.
There are no page-size related settings in YaST for this printer. It's all about whether it is the default and which driver to use (currently 'raw').
It should be in the CUPS control web page.
But the local CUPS isn't in use.
Then remote cups page.
Yes, but as it works with every other system, there's no need to fiddle with it. In fact, that is a good reason _not_ to fiddle with it. Besides, I think every print-job has its own page-size setting?
I think that you would use the local CUPS with the driver for the printer, which hands up to a remote CUPS, set up as "raw". One of the two uses the printer driver, not the two.
The client system talks directly to the printserver via this:
lpstat -v device for BESR-printer: ipp://192.168.2.128:631/printers/BESR-printer device for Kyocera: ipp://192.168.2.128:631/printers/Kyocera device for Kyocera2: ipp://192.168.2.128:631/printers/Kyocera2
There are no PPDs installed locally.
I dont know where I saw the 'raw' driver setting, somewhere in YaST I think.
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-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht Ende----- Oh, great. I think I know the problem. AFAIK, you need(!) for every printer to talk in raw to, the ppd installed locally for that printer. Then, you need to specifiy within raw that you are talking to a kyocera. I did paste you an image where to do this in yast: http://paste.opensuse.org/75014130 Note that for what I know you need also to have the ppd locally installed for that(!) specific printer. So yast will know that it needs raw, it will know to which brand to send it and it should format it rightly using the specific ppd setting. This is what I had to do with a non professional setup working with raw. But since your problem seem right like mine, have a try.
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stakanov@freenet.de wrote:
Oh, great. I think I know the problem. AFAIK, you need(!) for every printer to talk in raw to, the ppd installed locally for that printer.
The other systems seem to work fine without it :-)
Then, you need to specifiy within raw that you are talking to a kyocera. I did paste you an image where to do this in yast: http://paste.opensuse.org/75014130
I don't recognise that window at all - when I install a desktop, I usually only have to go and enable network printers in YaST, that's all. The printers are listed and I can set the default.
Note that for what I know you need also to have the ppd locally installed for that(!) specific printer.
On Leap421, openSUSE 13.1 and older it works fine without. My understanding (albeit limited) is that the printer driver is installed on the print server, and that the clients all just deliver raw output to the server. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (1.5°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - free dynamic DNS, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/15/2016 03:48 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
My understanding (albeit limited) is that the printer driver is installed on the print server, and that the clients all just deliver raw output to the server.
No, that's exactly wrong. RAW means that the output has already been sent through processing according to the ppd, and the output is ready for direct delivery to the printer. Not-Raw means that the print server should do that processing before printing it. Raw means pre-processed and ready for the printer. The print server is told to send it exactly as received from the workstation. It does NO Processing of RAW jobs. Windows users typically install all the print drivers, PPDs and the entire stack needed to support the printer, and the output from their workstations IS USUALLY RAW. This happens at printer install time. Linux users have a choice of doing the processing locally and sending RAW print, or handing it to cups to send it through the print processing stack on the print server. The latter is Less local work load, but this option is seldom available for windows. So typically you create two queues in your Linux Print Server, one for raw and one for non-raw, you name them such that the word RAW is in the name somewhere. -- After all is said and done, more is said than done. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
John Andersen wrote:
On 12/15/2016 03:48 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
My understanding (albeit limited) is that the printer driver is installed on the print server, and that the clients all just deliver raw output to the server.
No, that's exactly wrong.
RAW means that the output has already been sent through processing according to the ppd, and the output is ready for direct delivery to the printer.
Not-Raw means that the print server should do that processing before printing it.
Raw means pre-processed and ready for the printer. The print server is told to send it exactly as received from the workstation. It does NO Processing of RAW jobs.
I'm trying to understand that, but I'm having trouble with "raw = pre-processed". Common sense suggests "raw" = "unprocessed"? I may have misinterpreted the configuration - in YaST->Printers->Configuration(Kyocera), I see "no driver" and "raw queue" : http://files.jessen.ch/office68-screenshot-yast-printer-config.jpeg Up until a recent CUPS release, we only needed to set the default printer when installing a new desktop, the network printers were picked up automatically. Recently (I'm not sure as of when), we have to run "yast printer" to enable network printing, but otherwise it is the same.
Windows users typically install all the print drivers, PPDs and the entire stack needed to support the printer, and the output from their workstations IS USUALLY RAW. This happens at printer install time.
We only have a couple of Windows users, it looks like they have the driver installed locally, but the printers are accessed via samba. In samba we have "use client driver = yes". So this output is raw? Anyway, the setup has been working fine for years for Linux and Windows both, it's only Leap422 clients that have a problem.
Linux users have a choice of doing the processing locally and sending RAW print, or handing it to cups to send it through the print processing stack on the print server. The latter is Less local work load, but this option is seldom available for windows.
So typically you create two queues in your Linux Print Server, one for raw and one for non-raw, you name them such that the word RAW is in the name somewhere.
We don't have that, only one queue per printer. For the Kyoceras, the drivers are defined in CUPS on the printserver ("Driver: Kyocera FS-C5015N (KPDL) (color, 2-sided printing"). The driver in Windows is also "FS-C5015N (KPDL)". I guess the IPP protocol is able to determine whether output is raw or "cooked"? -- Per Jessen, Zürich (-0.5°C) http://www.hostsuisse.com/ - virtual servers, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2016-12-16 08:32, Per Jessen wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
On 12/15/2016 03:48 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
My understanding (albeit limited) is that the printer driver is installed on the print server, and that the clients all just deliver raw output to the server.
No, that's exactly wrong.
RAW means that the output has already been sent through processing according to the ppd, and the output is ready for direct delivery to the printer.
Not-Raw means that the print server should do that processing before printing it.
Raw means pre-processed and ready for the printer. The print server is told to send it exactly as received from the workstation. It does NO Processing of RAW jobs.
I'm trying to understand that, but I'm having trouble with "raw = pre-processed". Common sense suggests "raw" = "unprocessed"?
My understanding is that raw means it is not processed by the machine that is set to raw, but it may be processed by the other machine. The intention is that only one machine does the processing, and it can be either the client or the server, in the Linux world (In Windows it is the client which processes).
Windows users typically install all the print drivers, PPDs and the entire stack needed to support the printer, and the output from their workstations IS USUALLY RAW. This happens at printer install time.
We only have a couple of Windows users, it looks like they have the driver installed locally, but the printers are accessed via samba. In samba we have "use client driver = yes". So this output is raw?
Rather the input is raw. In the sense that the server must not manipulate, treat as raw. Wording is confusing here...
Anyway, the setup has been working fine for years for Linux and Windows both, it's only Leap422 clients that have a problem.
Yes.
Linux users have a choice of doing the processing locally and sending RAW print, or handing it to cups to send it through the print processing stack on the print server. The latter is Less local work load, but this option is seldom available for windows.
So typically you create two queues in your Linux Print Server, one for raw and one for non-raw, you name them such that the word RAW is in the name somewhere.
We don't have that, only one queue per printer. For the Kyoceras, the drivers are defined in CUPS on the printserver ("Driver: Kyocera FS-C5015N (KPDL) (color, 2-sided printing"). The driver in Windows is also "FS-C5015N (KPDL)". I guess the IPP protocol is able to determine whether output is raw or "cooked"?
You have "use client driver = yes" which does it, I understand. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlhTyIIACgkQja8UbcUWM1ySbQD+MkrC7aWVwYompvSj9xeaYS/K 6JhyAuMJhpRrf/tJdOgA+QFcHMQR7LxZJQp/ix238xJz35kGWVxKKe/YWUOywqGZ =KeAI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/16/2016 02:57 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
My understanding is that raw means it is not processed by the machine that is set to raw, but it may be processed by the other machine.
Exactly this. RAW is an INSTRUCTION to the print server NOT to perform any additional processing. -- After all is said and done, more is said than done.
On 12/16/2016 02:32 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
I'm trying to understand that, but I'm having trouble with "raw = pre-processed". Common sense suggests "raw" = "unprocessed"?
As I understand it, it's an issue of where the processing is done. If you use openoffice writer and that does the layout, then what it sends to the printer is preformatted and does not require any more cooking by the print driver. The 'cooking' for my printer involves converting it to PCL5 or Postscript. heck, this was a log clearer under the UNIX-V print subsystem where you could push formatters down into the print processing and select which one - or none - when you invoked the printer. It was all very explicit! -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/15/2016 11:32 PM, Per Jessen wrote:
I'm trying to understand that, but I'm having trouble with "raw = pre-processed". Common sense suggests "raw" = "unprocessed"?
Yea, its kind of the same situation as X-11, wrapping your head around which part is the server and which part is the client is a stumbling block at first blush. I'm speaking from the perspective of the print server here (cups), not your application or your workstation. In the case of a locally installed printer, I'm referring to how CUPS sees the print stream and what it does with it. See https://www.cups.org/doc/options.html (bottom of page). In linux, we don't usually install printer drivers for the users, we install them into cups, as cups is supposed to do ALL the processing. The applications do not spew printer ready data streams. However some few applications DO produce printer ready data streams as do most windows machines. Those don't need and shouldn't receive any additional processing by the CUPS server. Those go to the raw queue. As far as your screen shot, IDK. The wording is odd in the context of cups. -- After all is said and done, more is said than done -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (5)
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Anton Aylward -
Carlos E. R. -
John Andersen -
Per Jessen -
stakanov＠freenet.de