Re: [S.u.S.E. Linux] Win 32 & Linux
zentara wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>If you look hard enough, you can get free apps for linux to do most <BR>things. Also much of the software you describe, is available to non- <BR>commercial users for free. <BR> <BR>Well Linux is getting there. Look at KDE. It's not quite perfected, but <BR>getting there fast.</BLOCKQUOTE> Yea, I want to play with that. I think its on the CD. I'll try to figure out how to set it up.
And as far as command line use goes, linux is way <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>easier to do things.</BLOCKQUOTE> Yep! <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Windows NT is really a waste unless you use the NTFS filesystem. <BR> </BLOCKQUOTE> Are there any advantages to NTFS over Linux file systems? I must plead ignorance here. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>I played with NT4 for awhile, and it isn't any easier than <BR>linux. In fact it is harder, because everything is hidden <BR>from you in dlls.</BLOCKQUOTE> Well for basic installation the first time around I will say that NT has the advantage. You really don't need to do a lot of thinking. On the other hand you *can't* do a lot of thinking with the NT installations. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
The biggest drawback to win95-NT is the price. <BR>To set up winNT with Linux functionality and security, <BR>costs about $1000 !!! The NT Server license, plus Visual Basic, <BR>plus Visual C++, is way out of the reach of average people. <BR>Whereas SuSe is $50, Perl is free, and it has it's own compiler.</BLOCKQUOTE> I have gcc loaded on my NT partition. It is the latest version. I believe there are actually many GNU ports to NT. I know that xemacs is being ported. NT cost me $200 +, a year ago. I got one disk and no software. Suse cost me $65, and came with more software than I have disk space. :-) <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> Plus the source code is open to look at. I have a big distrust <BR>of corporate motives. I wouldn't want to trust the entire planets <BR>computer network to a profit seeking organization, who hides their <BR>code.</BLOCKQUOTE> I don't mind big companies. I don't like the games that MS is playing. I think it is true that MS has become something of a monopoly. This is not good for the consumer. Monopolies are price setters not price takers. It seems clear to me that MS is trying to dump products on the market in an attempt to prevent companies like Netscape from making successful inroads into the computer software industry. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> Linux should be what is taught in schools, it is affordable <BR>to all students.</BLOCKQUOTE> Hmm, interesting. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> Well you should look at the comp.emulators.wine ( I think that's right) <BR>newsgroup. They discuss the nuts and bolts of it. <BR>You are right. These guys see light at the end of the tunnel, <BR>so they are working hard. BUT.... there are so many little <BR>incompatibilities that pop up, principally due to Microsoft's <BR>habit of just patching up old code to make it work. That makes it <BR>very hard for "intelligent, methodical, programmers" to make <BR>a consistent emulation scheme. <BR>They just patch things up as they come.</BLOCKQUOTE> I'll take a look. You should take a look at John D. Blair's book on Samba. He really brings this out in the realm of Lanman. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> So we are talking about 2 different types of users. The web-surfers, and chat-room lovers, and people who want <BR>to print an occaisional T-shirt up on their ink-jet printer; <BR>comprise one group. They are always complaining about about system <BR>crashes, and lockups, and are willing to spend alot of money <BR>to "buy their way into computer functionality". Microsoft <BR>can make a bundle off of this group. This group would <BR>love to get win32's going on linux. It would make it <BR>easier to get the new "linux status-symbol" going for them. <BR>This isn't a huge market really. <BR> </BLOCKQUOTE> Well, we are attempting what could become a huge intranet project for DoD, and we are doing much of it on NT. IT'S NOT MY FAULT! There are some pretty good MS based products out there. I am the only UNIX head in the group and my Unix experience is not great at this point. I really don't know what is out there as far as tools for UNIX / Linux and web tools go. I much prefer running Netscape servers on UNIX. There are often more permissions gotchas in UNIX, but onec you figure those out, well, you are running on UNIX. What more can I say? I have daily Dr. Watsons on my NT systems. One of my UNIX systems had been up for months until I did something do knock it out of commission. That was easier to fix on UNIX than it would have been on NT. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> </BLOCKQUOTE> Perhaps I should get my Dad's old 386 running Linux for my little sister. <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> Get me drunk, and talking about this stuff.... I'll talk your <BR>ears off. :-) <BR> </BLOCKQUOTE> I'll take you up on that sometime. <PRE>-- "Alles Vergaengliche Ist nur ein Gleichniss" -Goethe, as quoted in Ludwig Boltzmann's Vorlessungen ueber Gastheorie.</PRE>
Steven T. Hatton wrote:
zentara wrote:
Are there any advantages to NTFS over Linux file systems? I must plead ignorance here.
I'm fairly ignorant of the details here also. I know that ext2 is very solid. I'm sure they are similar. Although when I was playing with NT4, they did have a defragger program for it, so that may say something negative about it. I remember when NT4 came out, there was alot of talk about how the US Government had "certified it" as "secure"; and that was highly tauted by MS. However, the fine print revealed that it's certified only when using NTFS; since it, like ext2fs records ownership and permissions. If you have a fat partition, forget it. Just for the sake of talking about it, I liked the HPFS filesystem that OS2 used as the nicest for a single user system. No permissions were kept, but you got almost no slack space on huge drives, since it used 512 byte ionode sizes, thats .5k , compared to ext2fs smallest of 1k.
I played with NT4 for awhile, and it isn't any easier than linux. In fact it is harder, because everything is hidden from you in dlls.
Well for basic installation the first time around I will say that NT has the advantage. You really don't need to do a lot of thinking. On the other hand you *can't* do a lot of thinking with the NT installations.
Well I remember having as much trouble with PnP cards under NT4, as with Linux. Also alot of people have problems getting RAS to work, just as linux users struggle with mgetty. Cmmercial software does install nicer on NT than Linux, but Linux users don't have to endlessly fight with that "*&#%$#@! registry" !! I hate that registry. It just keeps growing until your system is slowed down, then you need a fresh install. I saw a statistic that the average Windows95 registry lasts 18 months before it makes the system useless.
I don't mind big companies. I don't like the games that MS is playing. I think it is true that MS has become something of a monopoly. This is not good for the consumer. Monopolies are price setters not price takers. It seems clear to me that MS is trying to dump products on the market in an attempt to prevent companies like Netscape from making successful inroads into the computer software industry.
Well remember the railroads and the Morgans? The Information SuperHighway is the "railroad" of the next century. Those who fail to learn the lessons of history, are doomed to repeat it. Microsoft is weilding too much clout already. This recent ruling about anti-trust and Internet Explorer is a slap on the wrist from the government. MS is trying to position itself to rule. It dosn't seem too important now, but wait until digital TV becomes the standard. The computer and TV will be all rolled into one media. We know how powerful TV is now, in terms of "controlling the masses". Wait until computer generated media starts to become standard TV fare. Whoever controls it, will be able to force their vision of reality on the public thru subliminal tricks.
Well, we are attempting what could become a huge intranet project for DoD, and we are doing much of it on NT. IT'S NOT MY FAULT! There are some pretty good MS based products out there. I am the only UNIX head in the group and my Unix experience is not great at this point. I really don't know what is out there as far as tools for UNIX / Linux and web tools go.
Well, get a book from O'Reilly on PERL, called "The Lhama book"; since it has one on the cover. It will introduce you to PERL, and CGI with it. Go to www.perl.org and check out the links to free scripts and modules. It is the biggest kept secret in the computer world. I'm just beginning to see how powerful the Linux-Perl combination is. Plus, there is a port of PERL for NT, so you can go cross platform with it. Finally, there is going to be a real compiler for Perl soon, to make stand-alone executables from your scripts. To top it off, the Perl Gurus are talking about VISUAL Perl, and it's all free!!! Then there is TCL, and TK which is sort of like Visual Basic, but Perl seems to be where you can do real nitty-gritty kind of work.
Perhaps I should get my Dad's old 386 running Linux for my little sister.
Ya you should, it might give her a head start on a rewarding career. zentara -- To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e
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