[opensuse] mailing from CLI
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???). Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message. One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird. One simplifying factor is that I need only to send an email-- don't have to read any. The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL. I created a ~/.mailrc which contains this: account street \ from="gebser@speakeasy.net (ken) \ password-user@host=pass-word-w-dashes \ imap-auth=login alias dest: recip@host.tld The command I use-- well, one of them I've tried: echo '.' | nail -A street -q mailfile.in -s "test using nail" \ -r gebser@speakeasy.net dest The only error messages this and its variations yeild is: send-mail: warning: inet_protocols: IPv6 support is disabled: Address family not supported by protocol send-mail: warning: inet_protocols: configuring for IPv4 support only postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: IPv6 support is disabled: Address family not supported by protocol postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: configuring for IPv4 support only Help enough to get this working would be much appreciated. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message.
One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird.
This is wrong, the command line Tools all depend on Postfix/Sendmail to provide the command line binary /usr/sbin/sendmail to put the mail into the local Mailserver queue. If you don't want that you should use mini_sendmail. That is a command line tool to send an email directly to a remote smtp server.
One simplifying factor is that I need only to send an email-- don't have to read any.
The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL.
Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to. -- Sandy List replies only please! Please address PMs to: news-reply2 (@) japantest (.) homelinux (.) com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
I need to email from the command line a previously created file.
If you want to e-mail a file vs. just a message look at the "nail" command, very handy.
(The
finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???). Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message. One complicating factor s that I don't want to set up a local mail
There is no reason not to setup the local MTA to use the central relay; it will save you allot of grief.
server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird. This is wrong, the command line Tools all depend on Postfix/Sendmail to provide the command line binary /usr/sbin/sendmail to put the mail into the local Mailserver queue. If you don't want that you should use mini_sendmail. That is a command line tool to send an email directly to a remote smtp server.
Yast will setup postfix to do basic delivery to a central mail repository; just run through the setup. There is no reason not to have the local MTA configured. You do not need to accept connections.
One simplifying factor is that I need only to send an email-- don't have to read any. The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL. Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to.
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On 04/17/2007 08:34 AM somebody named Adam Tauno Williams wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file.
If you want to e-mail a file vs. just a message look at the "nail" command, very handy.
Yeah. I was already there. See the paragraph below (from my original post).
(The
finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???). Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message. One complicating factor s that I don't want to set up a local mail
There is no reason not to setup the local MTA to use the central relay; it will save you allot of grief.
I've set up sendmail a few times, so I know what's involved. As I said in my original post, it isn't necessary and (for several reasons too detailed to go into here) I don't want to do it.
server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird. This is wrong, the command line Tools all depend on Postfix/Sendmail to provide the command line binary /usr/sbin/sendmail to put the mail into the local Mailserver queue. If you don't want that you should use mini_sendmail. That is a command line tool to send an email directly to a remote smtp server.
Yast will setup postfix to do basic delivery to a central mail repository; just run through the setup. There is no reason not to have the local MTA configured. You do not need to accept connections.
Yeah, I know.
....
-- "Genius might be described as a supreme capacity for getting its possessors into trouble of all kinds." -- Samuel Butler -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/17/2007 08:03 AM somebody named Sandy Drobic wrote:
ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message.
One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird.
This is wrong, the command line Tools all depend on Postfix/Sendmail to provide the command line binary /usr/sbin/sendmail to put the mail into the local Mailserver queue.
"Wrong" is way too strong a word... actually inappropriate (unless "Tools" has some highly obscure, highly qualitative meaning). (1) One essential characteristic of client-server technology is that the physical locations of the client and server are irrelevant as long as they can connect via a network. (2) Tbird (a client) doesn't require a local MTA to send email to a remote server. Nor does mew, an emacs library for email. (3) The nail (a command line MUA) manpage has an "smtp-use-starttls" setting, which indicates to me that it is intended to be used to connect to a remote mail server. See (1).
If you don't want that you should use mini_sendmail. That is a command line tool to send an email directly to a remote smtp server.
One simplifying factor is that I need only to send an email-- don't have to read any.
The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL.
Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to.
I mentioned port 993 only because a login to a server is sometimes required in order for a client to send email; 993 indicates the use of SSL. So, yes, it is an IMAPS port, but knowing about the use of SSL may be relevant to sending mail. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL. Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to.
I mentioned port 993 only because a login to a server is sometimes required in order for a client to send email; 993 indicates the use of SSL. So, yes, it is an IMAPS port, but knowing about the use of SSL may be relevant to sending mail.
Mail is sent via SMTP, not via IMAP. So you can not use Port 993 to SEND mails. If you have a look at your Thunderbird settings you will see that there are separate fields for IMAP server and SMTP server. Use the server that is configured in your smtp settings. You will probably have to authenticate before you are able to send mails. Unfortunately, mini_sendmail can't authenticate to a remote server. It is possible to configure Postfix to authenticate to a relayserver. Another way would be to use a mail client that can be configured to send mail without user interaction. -- Sandy List replies only please! Please address PMs to: news-reply2 (@) japantest (.) homelinux (.) com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/17/2007 10:29 AM somebody named Sandy Drobic wrote:
ken wrote:
The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL. Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to. I mentioned port 993 only because a login to a server is sometimes required in order for a client to send email; 993 indicates the use of SSL. So, yes, it is an IMAPS port, but knowing about the use of SSL may be relevant to sending mail.
Mail is sent via SMTP, not via IMAP. So you can not use Port 993 to SEND mails. If you have a look at your Thunderbird settings you will see that there are separate fields for IMAP server and SMTP server.
Yes, I know all that. They are actually two separate protocols. Yes. As I already said, I only mentioned port 993 to indicate that I'm using an encrypted connection, in addition to authentication.
Use the server that is configured in your smtp settings. You will probably have to authenticate before you are able to send mails. Unfortunately, mini_sendmail can't authenticate to a remote server.
I don't need to run a local server anyway, not even a "mini" server.
It is possible to configure Postfix to authenticate to a relayserver.
I'm sure it is, but I don't want to do it that way.
Another way would be to use a mail client that can be configured to send mail without user interaction.
Yes! You got it!!! And this was my original question!!!! Which mail client? Remember, I already mentioned mail/mailx/nail. The problem is that the documentation for these is worthless. So if anyone knows how to set up an account using ~/.nailrc and/or ~/.mailrc and/or CL args to set up the connection for /sending/ mail (WithOut a Local Server), we might be able to accomplish something. thanks. -- "Genius might be described as a supreme capacity for getting its possessors into trouble of all kinds." -- Samuel Butler -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
The remote server I'm using listens on port 993, uses SSL. Not good. 993 is the ImapS port, not an smtp port. Use a SMTP server to send the mail to. I mentioned port 993 only because a login to a server is sometimes required in order for a client to send email; 993 indicates the use of SSL. So, yes, it is an IMAPS port, but knowing about the use of SSL may be relevant to sending mail. Mail is sent via SMTP, not via IMAP. So you can not use Port 993 to SEND mails. If you have a look at your Thunderbird settings you will see that there are separate fields for IMAP server and SMTP server.
Yes, I know all that. They are actually two separate protocols. Yes. As I already said, I only mentioned port 993 to indicate that I'm using an encrypted connection, in addition to authentication.
So you need a program that supports SMTP AUTH and TLS.
Use the server that is configured in your smtp settings. You will probably have to authenticate before you are able to send mails. Unfortunately, mini_sendmail can't authenticate to a remote server.
I don't need to run a local server anyway, not even a "mini" server.
mini_sendmail is not a server. It is merely a replacement for /usr/sbin/sendmail to address the need for a command line tool to send mails to a remote server.
It is possible to configure Postfix to authenticate to a relayserver.
I'm sure it is, but I don't want to do it that way.
Although it would probably be the easiest way. Is there any special reason why you don't want to use Postfix. The resource consumption is pretty low.
Another way would be to use a mail client that can be configured to send mail without user interaction.
Yes! You got it!!! And this was my original question!!!! Which mail client? Remember, I already mentioned mail/mailx/nail. The problem is that the documentation for these is worthless. So if anyone knows how to set up an account using ~/.nailrc and/or ~/.mailrc and/or CL args to set up the connection for /sending/ mail (WithOut a Local Server), we might be able to accomplish something.
All normal full-featured mailclients seem to be focussed on interaction, the command line capable seem to be missing the smtp auth/TLS features. The only option I currently see is to use a php or perl script, there are enough modules you can use that provide smtp auth and TLS. I assume you have already used some search engines in that direction? -- Sandy List replies only please! Please address PMs to: news-reply2 (@) japantest (.) homelinux (.) com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-04-17 at 16:39 -0400, ken wrote:
I don't need to run a local server anyway, not even a "mini" server.
But the system is not designed that way, and fighting the design is not easy. There are many commands and daemons in Linux that rely on having a local mail server; for instance, using the command "sendmail", be it from the real sendmail, or from anything else that provides a sendmail binary. Anyway... mail (= mailx = nail) has a long man page, and it does support smtp. There is a "smtp-use-starttls" binary option mentioned. I can't say how you have to combine all those variables to get it working, because I have never used "mail" in that way. maybe they have a mail help list, I dunno. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGJWxztTMYHG2NR9URAvW2AJsG2KA0gRcY6BhQMFhjTdrcpx0MHQCcDRzK E7M+6Q0nXtDjVAn9GyBKgqY= =izD8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
Yes! You got it!!! And this was my original question!!!! Which mail client? Remember, I already mentioned mail/mailx/nail. The problem is that the documentation for these is worthless. So if anyone knows how to set up an account using ~/.nailrc and/or ~/.mailrc and/or CL args to set up the connection for /sending/ mail (WithOut a Local Server), we might be able to accomplish something.
The nail man page has an example for using the smtp clause in an account definition. Did you read about that clause? Did you try it? If it didn't work, what did "nail -v" output when you attempted to send mail? I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen. Therefore I was never in your situation. But when I just called "man nail" on my 10.0 system and simply searched for smtp, the example with an external SMTP server was the 5th match, there I saw that there is an smtp clause which looked like the obvious configuration option; and the smtp clause itself has promptly a good description as well. It took me more time to write this post than to find the relevant information. Look, if you can identify that information in the nail man page, if you think that it is worthless and not understandable, then you seem to be a newbie to such class of tasks -- and then you should stick to the recommended way of doing it (configure your local mail system). Or you invest in RTFM and ask _specific_ questions when you don't get that option to work. Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Joachim Schrod wrote:
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen.
Just to make sure to emphasize that point, since you might have misunderstood that in other emails: Configuring a local mail systems means to configure and start a local service that can send email (and deliver email from the local to the local system, which is needed for other system services like cron). Most service implementations (postfix, sendmail) involve a running daemon process or at least a cron job to clean up the mail queue. That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".) Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/17/2007 09:51 PM somebody named Joachim Schrod wrote:
Joachim Schrod wrote:
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen.
Just to make sure to emphasize that point, since you might have misunderstood that in other emails:
Configuring a local mail systems means to configure and start a local service that can send email (and deliver email from the local to the local system, which is needed for other system services like cron). Most service implementations (postfix, sendmail) involve a running daemon process or at least a cron job to clean up the mail queue.
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".)
Joachim
Joachim, You are so kind to correct the misunderstanding which you imagined I had. Be assured that no one is thinking you are retracting your previous proposition that a mail server is required on every machine on which a mail client is installed. So, what is this software which needs to be installed to avoid "sure disaster", this MTA (no longer a mail server)? -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".)
You are so kind to correct the misunderstanding which you imagined I had. Be assured that no one is thinking you are retracting your previous proposition that a mail server is required on every machine on which a mail client is installed.
Since you haven't really explained why you think it is undesirable to let Postfix take care of sending the mail it is difficult to help you. And no, simply saying "I want a mail client to do that" does not constitute a reason. It can't be resource consumption since the memory footprint and cpu consumption of Postfix is very low. I have my doubts about security concerns, since Postfix isn't known for exploitable bugs, especially since we are talking about a sending only solution, a "null client" configuration. If you have the cron daemon installed and running how are reports or cron errors delivered? Any server software on your machine either expects to send reports/mails via a local sending null client configuration of Postfix/Sendmail or must be manually configured send directly via smtp. Not every Server software can be configured to send directly. Something about your situation and your explanations/requirements doesn't add up. So, what is the reason why the mail can't be send by Postfix? What is the advantage of doing it with a mail client (a solution that has yet to be found)?
So, what is this software which needs to be installed to avoid "sure disaster", this MTA (no longer a mail server)?
No idea what you are talking about. -- Sandy List replies only please! Please address PMs to: news-reply2 (@) japantest (.) homelinux (.) com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/19/2007 07:40 AM somebody named Sandy Drobic wrote:
ken wrote:
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".) You are so kind to correct the misunderstanding which you imagined I had. Be assured that no one is thinking you are retracting your previous proposition that a mail server is required on every machine on which a mail client is installed.
Since you haven't really explained why you think it is undesirable to let Postfix take care of sending the mail it is difficult to help you. And no, simply saying "I want a mail client to do that" does not constitute a reason.
It can't be resource consumption since the memory footprint and cpu consumption of Postfix is very low.
I have my doubts about security concerns, since Postfix isn't known for exploitable bugs, especially since we are talking about a sending only solution, a "null client" configuration.
If you have the cron daemon installed and running how are reports or cron errors delivered?
Any server software on your machine either expects to send reports/mails via a local sending null client configuration of Postfix/Sendmail or must be manually configured send directly via smtp. Not every Server software can be configured to send directly.
Something about your situation and your explanations/requirements doesn't add up.
So, what is the reason why the mail can't be send by Postfix? What is the advantage of doing it with a mail client (a solution that has yet to be found)?
Actually, I've already found two working solutions (mentioned in a previous posting in this thread). The only problem is that neither of them makes use of SSL out of the box. Nail, one of these solutions, would need to be recompiled, as the version distributed by suse doesn't support SSL. Another poster mentioned he'd used mutt to accomplish what I'm seeking to do, but I suspect that the binary version of mutt from suse might not have SSL compiled in either. (Or?) In the past I've used pine from the command line to send an email from within a shell script. Emacs can send mail too and can be used in batch mode. Perl and Tcl, I'm told, are a couple other possibilities, but I don't see the sense in reinventing the wheel unless it's absolutely necessary. So there are a number of solutions, two of which already work. I just need to implement one which does SSL. If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email. The question shouldn't be "Why not use postfix?", but rather "Why use it?" All I've heard so far are a couple voices that I *must* use it and loud pronouncements of disaster if I don't, but no specific and compelling reasons in favor of it. If there were such reasons, then every little email workstation would have a mail server running on it.
So, what is this software which needs to be installed to avoid "sure disaster", this MTA (no longer a mail server)?
No idea what you are talking about.
Joachim was retreating from his claim that I needed to set up a mail server, articulating a mouthful of theory that all I needed really was an MTA (mail transfer agent). Trying to bring the conversation back to practical reality, I was asking what/which MTA software package this was that I'd need to install. :) -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
So, what is the reason why the mail can't be send by Postfix? What is the advantage of doing it with a mail client (a solution that has yet to be found)?
So there are a number of solutions, two of which already work. I just need to implement one which does SSL.
In other words, you don't have a solution that fits all requirements?
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email. The question shouldn't be "Why not use postfix?", but rather "Why use it?" All I've heard so far are a couple voices that I *must* use it and loud pronouncements of disaster if I don't, but no specific and compelling reasons in favor of it. If there were such reasons, then every little email workstation would have a mail server running on it.
Since I see no reason/explanation here not to use Postfix I'll depart from this thread and wish you good look for the future.
So, what is this software which needs to be installed to avoid "sure disaster", this MTA (no longer a mail server)? No idea what you are talking about.
Joachim was retreating from his claim that I needed to set up a mail server, articulating a mouthful of theory that all I needed really was an MTA (mail transfer agent). Trying to bring the conversation back to practical reality, I was asking what/which MTA software package this was that I'd need to install. :)
You must have seen something different in his reply. But don't mind Joachim and me and continue your approach. -- Sandy List replies only please! Please address PMs to: news-reply2 (@) japantest (.) homelinux (.) com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Thursday 2007-04-19 at 13:28 -0400, ken wrote:
So there are a number of solutions, two of which already work. I just need to implement one which does SSL.
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email.
We disagree.
The question shouldn't be "Why not use postfix?", but rather "Why use it?"
Because unix and linux are designed that way, to have and use it. It's trivial, and in fact, you do have postfix installed.
All I've heard so far are a couple voices that I *must* use it and loud pronouncements of disaster if I don't, but no specific and compelling reasons in favor of it. If there were such reasons, then every little email workstation would have a mail server running on it.
You are so convinced that you are right that you simply ignore reasons to the contrary. This list is full of very experienced sysadmins, and you are ignoring their advice. In fact, you re trying to reinvent the wheel.
Joachim was retreating from his claim that I needed to set up a mail server, articulating a mouthful of theory that all I needed really was an MTA (mail transfer agent). Trying to bring the conversation back to practical reality, I was asking what/which MTA software package this was that I'd need to install. :)
No, he hasn't retreated from what he said. He is just saying that by installing and using an MTA, part of the software installed in a Mail Server Computer, you do not make that particular computer a Mail Server. He is retreating from the conversation as useless. You need to transfer email from your machine to another machine, and that's precisely the task of the MTA. And an MTA is installed by default on all SuSE distros: be it servers, workstations, home computers, everything. You want to do it without? Well... do as you wish, it's your system. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGJ7UytTMYHG2NR9URAp4EAKCNWC4cjz+EGWUOIhF2OtIDtlcJqQCfWIQd cwGbPobcRSG9HluqAvUEvus= =QJ0P -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
* ken
Actually, I've already found two working solutions (mentioned in a previous posting in this thread). The only problem is that neither of them makes use of SSL out of the box. Nail, one of these solutions, would need to be recompiled, as the version distributed by suse doesn't support SSL. Another poster mentioned he'd used mutt to accomplish what I'm seeking to do, but I suspect that the binary version of mutt from suse might not have SSL compiled in either.
16:04 wahoo:~ > mutt -v Mutt 1.5.13 (2006-08-11) Copyright (C) 1996-2006 Michael R. Elkins and others. Mutt comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type mutt -vv'. Mutt is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it under certain conditions; type mutt -vv' for details. System: Linux 2.6.18.8-396-default (x86_64) [using ncurses 5.5] [using libidn 0.6.0 (compiled with 0.6.0)] Compile options: -DOMAIN -DEBUG -HOMESPOOL -USE_SETGID +USE_DOTLOCK -DL_STANDALONE +USE_FCNTL -USE_FLOCK -USE_INODESORT +USE_POP +USE_NNTP +USE_IMAP +USE_GSS +USE_SSL_OPENSSL -USE_SSL_GNUTLS +USE_SASL +HAVE_GETADDRINFO +HAVE_REGCOMP -USE_GNU_REGEX ... 16:04 wahoo:~ > rpm -qi mutt Name : mutt Relocations: (not relocatable) Version : 1.5.13 Vendor: openSUSE Build Service Release : 35.1 Build Date: Tue 21 Nov 2006 10:27:32 PM EST Install Date: Wed 22 Nov 2006 08:33:24 AM EST Build Host: build06 Group : Productivity/Networking/Email/Clients Source RPM: mutt-1.5.13-35.1.src.rpm Size : 4522536 License: GNU General Public License (GPL) Signature : DSA/SHA1, Tue 21 Nov 2006 09:52:07 PM EST, Key ID 3b3011b76b9d6523 URL : http://www.mutt.org Summary : Mail Program Description : A very powerful mail user agent. It supports (among other nice things) highlighting, threading, and PGP. It takes some time to get used to, however. Guess you really need to do some looking instead of telling everyone that they are definitely wrong and don't know what they are talking about. Mutt will do what you wish and openSUSE supplied does have SSL (openssl) compiled. -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 OpenSUSE Linux http://en.opensuse.org/ Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email.
I don't know. It depends on how you look at it. To me it's like asking, "Why should I have to run a print spooler service just to print? Each program should talk to the printer directly, using its own drivers." Often it just makes sense to centralize functionality like this instead of requiring individual programs to carry around a lot of baggage. It's especially handy if you have more than one program that sends mail, since you only have to configure everything once, in postfix. Postfix isn't really acting as a server in any real sense, here; more like a middleman for the mail client. Hence the term "mail transfer agent." -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/20/2007 03:45 PM somebody named David Brodbeck wrote:
ken wrote:
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email.
I don't know. It depends on how you look at it. To me it's like asking, "Why should I have to run a print spooler service just to print? Each program should talk to the printer directly, using its own drivers."
Often it just makes sense to centralize functionality like this instead of requiring individual programs to carry around a lot of baggage. It's especially handy if you have more than one program that sends mail, since you only have to configure everything once, in postfix. Postfix isn't really acting as a server in any real sense, here; more like a middleman for the mail client. Hence the term "mail transfer agent."
No argument. Being the original poster, I should probably repeat the solution I was after: One user on one machine sends out (via a script run from a cron job) one email per day. This user is serviced by a quite robust remote mail server (actually a cluster of eight mail servers dispersed around the US). For me to set up my own mail server would not likely improve the reliability of this system. Of course there could be a network outage, or a local problem preventing delivery. But this would be noticed by a human at the email's destination. And there will be some kind of error message on the source side; nail, for example, seems to return an error code in the event of failure. I could be wrong, but I just don't see how one outgoing email per day (and no incoming mail) warrants a mail server. -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Fri, 20 Apr 2007, by gebser@speakeasy.net:
On 04/20/2007 03:45 PM somebody named David Brodbeck wrote:
ken wrote:
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email.
I don't know. It depends on how you look at it. To me it's like asking, "Why should I have to run a print spooler service just to print? Each program should talk to the printer directly, using its own drivers."
Often it just makes sense to centralize functionality like this instead of requiring individual programs to carry around a lot of baggage. It's especially handy if you have more than one program that sends mail, since you only have to configure everything once, in postfix. Postfix isn't really acting as a server in any real sense, here; more like a middleman for the mail client. Hence the term "mail transfer agent."
No argument. Being the original poster, I should probably repeat the solution I was after:
One user on one machine sends out (via a script run from a cron job) one email per day. This user is serviced by a quite robust remote mail server (actually a cluster of eight mail servers dispersed around the US). For me to set up my own mail server would not likely improve the reliability of this system. Of course there could be a network outage, or a local problem preventing delivery. But this would be noticed by a human at the email's destination. And there will be some kind of error message on the source side; nail, for example, seems to return an error code in the event of failure.
I could be wrong, but I just don't see how one outgoing email per day (and no incoming mail) warrants a mail server.
It doesn't. Like I said; you only need an SMTP (sending) capable program that you can feed header- and body data from stdin and that connects to the SMTP server of your choise. Either the original Sendmail, or the Postfix/Exim/Qmail drop-in can do that. No need to start an MTA from e.g. /etc/init.d Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 10.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.18 + See headers for PGP/GPG info. Claimer: any email I receive will become my property. Disclaimers do not apply. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
On 04/20/2007 03:45 PM somebody named David Brodbeck wrote:
ken wrote:
If I needed a mail server, well then, yes, I'd use it. But I don't need that. It just seems ridiculous to set up a mail server on every machine on which somebody sends out an email.
I don't know. It depends on how you look at it. To me it's like asking, "Why should I have to run a print spooler service just to print? Each program should talk to the printer directly, using its own drivers."
Often it just makes sense to centralize functionality like this instead of requiring individual programs to carry around a lot of baggage. It's especially handy if you have more than one program that sends mail, since you only have to configure everything once, in postfix. Postfix isn't really acting as a server in any real sense, here; more like a middleman for the mail client. Hence the term "mail transfer agent."
No argument. Being the original poster, I should probably repeat the solution I was after:
One user on one machine sends out (via a script run from a cron job) one email per day. This user is serviced by a quite robust remote mail server (actually a cluster of eight mail servers dispersed around the US). For me to set up my own mail server would not likely improve the reliability of this system. Of course there could be a network outage, or a local problem preventing delivery. But this would be noticed by a human at the email's destination. And there will be some kind of error message on the source side; nail, for example, seems to return an error code in the event of failure.
I could be wrong, but I just don't see how one outgoing email per day (and no incoming mail) warrants a mail server.
Whether or not you see it, mail transfer agents have been standard equipment on unix systems for decades. Suse provides a postfix MTA which works nicely out of the box. Would one ftp transfer per day "warrant" an ftp client? Would one scheduled cron job per day "warrant" a cron daemon? Well, in any case, feel free to reinvent the wheel if you don't like the standard solutions. Joe -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2007-04-20 at 17:44 -0400, ken wrote:
I could be wrong, but I just don't see how one outgoing email per day (and no incoming mail) warrants a mail server.
Yes, it does warrant an MTA, because it is simpler. Linux/unix are made up of many programs that do specialized tasks well and safely. Sending email is the job of the MTA, and it doesn't mean you would be setting up a full fledged mail server. In fact, it won't be a mail server as it won't be capable of receiving (external) mail. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGKT1LtTMYHG2NR9URAr+1AJ4lHnpbhdhblSX0MmxieqJG0gP12gCfWEAO DRncoVAA6CQK+juY2sRjVyg= =3Ump -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/20/2007 06:23 PM somebody named Carlos E. R. wrote:
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The Friday 2007-04-20 at 17:44 -0400, ken wrote:
I could be wrong, but I just don't see how one outgoing email per day (and no incoming mail) warrants a mail server.
Yes, it does warrant an MTA, because it is simpler. Linux/unix are made up of many programs that do specialized tasks well and safely. Sending email is the job of the MTA, and it doesn't mean you would be setting up a full fledged mail server. In fact, it won't be a mail server as it won't be capable of receiving (external) mail.
Carlos, First, "simpler" is a subjective term and situational. What is simpler for one person or in one situation might not be simpler for another person or in another situation. And generally it isn't of pivotal importance how simple a technology is. A more important consideration is how appropriate a technology is to the situation. There's at least one other consideration which overrides both of these. But that's an off-list topic. Second, I hope we can agree that "mail server" and "MTA" are not the same thing. When I was first told by people here that I needed a *mail server*, I didn't think this was true for the particular issue I was asking about. Mail servers are great, but I just didn't think it was an appropriate solution to my issue. Nor did I think it was necessary to run postfix as a daemon to send an email from a mail client to a remote mail server. I agree with what you say about Linux/UNIX and the way they handle large tasks with suites of relatively small utilities (though in the past ten years or so there's been quite an increase in larger apps). This is one of the major advantages of Linux/UNIX over other OSs. This same sort of modularity is what makes postfix preferable to sendmail. And, yes, generally speaking, and depending upon the definition we give to "MTA", an MTA is commonly necessary to deliver mail. But much depends on how we define "MTA". Mutt, for example, has-- let's just call it "code"-- which delivers email to a remote mail server and which its documentation insists is *not* an MTA. Emacs also has its own code for delivering email to a remote mail server. Nail and sylpheed and pine too. I haven't checked, but I'm pretty sure that Thunderbird does as well. And there may very well be others I don't know about which don't require a postfix daemon to send an email. And this very last part is what I was originally asking about. Talking about theory, mail servers, cron error reporting, and general systems administration is fine. But all these are a bit off-topic from my original question. Repeating my original request again here would suggest more optimism on my part than is warranted, so I'll just say I appreciate by all your replies and especially thank the one guy who provided the information about mutt. -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Sunday 2007-04-22 at 11:07 -0400, ken wrote:
Yes, it does warrant an MTA, because it is simpler. Linux/unix are made up of many programs that do specialized tasks well and safely. Sending email is the job of the MTA, and it doesn't mean you would be setting up a full fledged mail server. In fact, it won't be a mail server as it won't be capable of receiving (external) mail.
Carlos,
First, "simpler" is a subjective term and situational. What is simpler for one person or in one situation might not be simpler for another person or in another situation. And generally it isn't of pivotal importance how simple a technology is. A more important consideration is how appropriate a technology is to the situation. There's at least one other consideration which overrides both of these. But that's an off-list topic.
It is simpler to use the command line "mail" coupled with a local mta to send email. I would have that running in minutes, probably. I call that simpler. :-) Not the only way, agreed.
And, yes, generally speaking, and depending upon the definition we give to "MTA", an MTA is commonly necessary to deliver mail. But much depends on how we define "MTA". Mutt, for example, has-- let's just call it "code"-- which delivers email to a remote mail server and which its documentation insists is *not* an MTA. Emacs also has its own code for delivering email to a remote mail server. Nail and sylpheed and pine too. I haven't checked, but I'm pretty sure that Thunderbird does as well. And there may very well be others I don't know about which don't require a postfix daemon to send an email.
Yes, many or all GUI type mail programs (MUAs) will have at least some capacity to talk to an smtp server (aka mail server, incorrectly), but only a few can do that from the command line. Pine will send, true, but from the command line it leaves you inside the editor. I'm not aware if it can send directly from the command line with no intervention. And all of them I know will balk out at the first failure, whereas a daemon will keep trying for days, freeing the script or program that dispatched the email. If you don't like a daemon, it's possible to do it via cron, but not as efficiently. You may get it running, but it is a solution I wouldn't use for automatic dispatch: I wouldn't consider it reliable nor traceable (no logs). I wouldn't trust it. And as all SuSE Linux systems come with an MTA readily installed, I don't see a good reason not to use it.
And this very last part is what I was originally asking about. Talking about theory, mail servers, cron error reporting, and general systems administration is fine. But all these are a bit off-topic from my original question. Repeating my original request again here would suggest more optimism on my part than is warranted, so I'll just say I appreciate by all your replies and especially thank the one guy who provided the information about mutt.
Yes, we know and understood your question, but we don't use nor like the solution you want. As we haven't done it that way previously, we can not tell you exactly how to do it in such a way. I think it is possible to get it done with "nail", but I would have to study the manual and test it... so you'd better study it yourself than me, don't you think? ;-) Maybe they have a mail list or a FAQ. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGK60PtTMYHG2NR9URAp0AAJ9sMtsltof/fNHZVXcCaqoH9SrmHgCfUt7k SCgPJXS0XWHZlX1yz47R38s= =EMlV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/22/2007 02:44 PM somebody named Carlos E. R. wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
The Sunday 2007-04-22 at 11:07 -0400, ken wrote:
Yes, it does warrant an MTA, because it is simpler. Linux/unix are made up of many programs that do specialized tasks well and safely. Sending email is the job of the MTA, and it doesn't mean you would be setting up a full fledged mail server. In fact, it won't be a mail server as it won't be capable of receiving (external) mail. Carlos,
First, "simpler" is a subjective term and situational. What is simpler for one person or in one situation might not be simpler for another person or in another situation. And generally it isn't of pivotal importance how simple a technology is. A more important consideration is how appropriate a technology is to the situation. There's at least one other consideration which overrides both of these. But that's an off-list topic.
It is simpler to use the command line "mail" coupled with a local mta to send email. I would have that running in minutes, probably. I call that simpler. :-)
True, it would take no time at all for me to point-and-click my way through a Yast install, but there's generally some tweaking of config files needed. I already had nail installed; the challenge was just setting up the config file properly. The more difficult part is setting up the SSL encryption. This would require configuring saslauthd also. As said previously, the version of nail/mailx packaged with my suse distribution didn't do this either, so I had to download and compile a more recent version. This took only a couple minutes.
Not the only way, agreed.
And it's always good to know more than one way to accomplish something.
And, yes, generally speaking, and depending upon the definition we give to "MTA", an MTA is commonly necessary to deliver mail. But much depends on how we define "MTA". Mutt, for example, has-- let's just call it "code"-- which delivers email to a remote mail server and which its documentation insists is *not* an MTA. Emacs also has its own code for delivering email to a remote mail server. Nail and sylpheed and pine too. I haven't checked, but I'm pretty sure that Thunderbird does as well. And there may very well be others I don't know about which don't require a postfix daemon to send an email.
Yes, many or all GUI type mail programs (MUAs) will have at least some capacity to talk to an smtp server (aka mail server, incorrectly), but only a few can do that from the command line. Pine will send, true, but from the command line it leaves you inside the editor. I'm not aware if it can send directly from the command line with no intervention.
It can. At least it could in an earlier version. I recall helping a coworker to get it working several years ago. As said, mutt and nail and emacs can all send a mail from a CLI.
And all of them I know will balk out at the first failure, whereas a daemon will keep trying for days, freeing the script or program that dispatched the email. ....
True, but if this one email per day fails for some reason, I want to know about it immediately after the first failed attempt.
You may get it running, but it is a solution I wouldn't use for automatic dispatch: I wouldn't consider it reliable nor traceable (no logs). I wouldn't trust it.
Okay. But it's my own script, so nobody but me is going to know how reliable it is. And (though I'm not doing it in this app) *any* event can be logged. You just put the appropriate line into your code and configure syslogd to handle it.
And as all SuSE Linux systems come with an MTA readily installed, I don't see a good reason not to use it.
I think we already agree that there's no necessity either way. So it's a matter of preference. And all other things being equal, I prefer to have one less possible point of failure. I've done postfix a few times previously and I'm sure I'll do it again before too long. If I need help with it, I'll call on you.
And this very last part is what I was originally asking about. Talking about theory, mail servers, cron error reporting, and general systems administration is fine. But all these are a bit off-topic from my original question. Repeating my original request again here would suggest more optimism on my part than is warranted, so I'll just say I appreciate by all your replies and especially thank the one guy who provided the information about mutt.
Yes, we know and understood your question, but we don't use nor like the solution you want. As we haven't done it that way previously, we can not tell you exactly how to do it in such a way. I think it is possible to get it done with "nail", but I would have to study the manual and test it... so you'd better study it yourself than me, don't you think? ;-) Maybe they have a mail list or a FAQ.
It's already done and tested and working fine. Regards, ken -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Monday 2007-04-23 at 14:39 -0400, ken wrote:
It is simpler to use the command line "mail" coupled with a local mta to send email. I would have that running in minutes, probably. I call that simpler. :-)
True, it would take no time at all for me to point-and-click my way through a Yast install, but there's generally some tweaking of config files needed. I already had nail installed; the challenge was just setting up the config file properly.
Normal sending can be configured by Yast. It works out of the box, or almost so.
The more difficult part is setting up the SSL encryption. This would require configuring saslauthd also. As said previously, the version of
No, no. Sending is simple, no key generation is needed. Receiving is complicated (relatively), but you don't have to configure it.
nail/mailx packaged with my suse distribution didn't do this either, so I had to download and compile a more recent version. This took only a couple minutes.
Not the only way, agreed.
And it's always good to know more than one way to accomplish something.
True enough. ...
it done with "nail", but I would have to study the manual and test it... so you'd better study it yourself than me, don't you think? ;-) Maybe they have a mail list or a FAQ.
It's already done and tested and working fine.
Good! - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGLfPRtTMYHG2NR9URApHtAJ9EPrdjCsxezNM2f99YgjE7IbFPsgCcC1j9 bLoB3jUiWGDEVAWbVATQdpM= =Mf6y -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Wed, 18 Apr 2007, by jschrod@acm.org:
Joachim Schrod wrote:
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen.
Just to make sure to emphasize that point, since you might have misunderstood that in other emails:
Configuring a local mail systems means to configure and start a local service that can send email (and deliver email from the local to the local system, which is needed for other system services like cron). Most service implementations (postfix, sendmail) involve a running daemon process or at least a cron job to clean up the mail queue.
Having some processes now and then sending mail hardly adds up to a queue.
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".)
There is no need for a running daemon what so ever, just for a binary that knows how to receive mail from stdin, and connect to a receiving mail server on via TCP port 25, or how to receive mail from stdin and send the data to a mailbox. Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 10.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.18 + See headers for PGP/GPG info. Claimer: any email I receive will become my property. Disclaimers do not apply. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/19/2007 06:17 PM somebody named Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Wed, 18 Apr 2007, by jschrod@acm.org:
Joachim Schrod wrote:
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen. Just to make sure to emphasize that point, since you might have misunderstood that in other emails:
Configuring a local mail systems means to configure and start a local service that can send email (and deliver email from the local to the local system, which is needed for other system services like cron). Most service implementations (postfix, sendmail) involve a running daemon process or at least a cron job to clean up the mail queue.
Having some processes now and then sending mail hardly adds up to a queue.
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".)
There is no need for a running daemon what so ever, just for a binary that knows how to receive mail from stdin, and connect to a receiving mail server on via TCP port 25, or how to receive mail from stdin and send the data to a mailbox.
Theo
Yes. Thank goodness there's at least one person here who understands the situation. I found this in the Mutt Guide, http://wiki.mutt.org/?MuttGuide/Send: 'Many MUAs provide facilities to comunicate directly with a remote server, so that you don't need to have installed and running a local server on the sending host. In those cases the mua comunicates directly with a mail server (using the SMTP/ESMTP protocol), when you specify to do it (e.g. when you push a button like "send all").' Off to install a mail server on my cell phone.... -- "This world ain't big enough for the both of us," said the big noema to the little noema. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
ken wrote:
On 04/19/2007 06:17 PM somebody named Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
Wed, 18 Apr 2007, by jschrod@acm.org:
Joachim Schrod wrote:
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen.
Just to make sure to emphasize that point, since you might have misunderstood that in other emails:
Configuring a local mail systems means to configure and start a local service that can send email (and deliver email from the local to the local system, which is needed for other system services like cron). Most service implementations (postfix, sendmail) involve a running daemon process or at least a cron job to clean up the mail queue.
Having some processes now and then sending mail hardly adds up to a queue.
That there is a running daemon process does NOT mean that the system is a mail server. Usually, the term "mail server" is only used for systems that accept email from other systems, but not for systems with a configured local mail service. (The technical meaning of "mail server" is actually "mail transfer agent that listens on the SMTP port and accepts inbound messages".)
There is no need for a running daemon what so ever, just for a binary that knows how to receive mail from stdin, and connect to a receiving mail server on via TCP port 25, or how to receive mail from stdin and send the data to a mailbox.
Theo
Yes. Thank goodness there's at least one person here who understands the situation.
I found this in the Mutt Guide, http://wiki.mutt.org/?MuttGuide/Send:
'Many MUAs provide facilities to comunicate directly with a remote server, so that you don't need to have installed and running a local server on the sending host. In those cases the mua comunicates directly with a mail server (using the SMTP/ESMTP protocol), when you specify to do it (e.g. when you push a button like "send all").'
Off to install a mail server on my cell phone....
Hmmm... I'd better install one on my Nokia N800 too! ;-) -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/17/2007 09:36 PM somebody named Joachim Schrod wrote:
ken wrote:
Yes! You got it!!! And this was my original question!!!! Which mail client? Remember, I already mentioned mail/mailx/nail. The problem is that the documentation for these is worthless. So if anyone knows how to set up an account using ~/.nailrc and/or ~/.mailrc and/or CL args to set up the connection for /sending/ mail (WithOut a Local Server), we might be able to accomplish something.
The nail man page has an example for using the smtp clause in an account definition. Did you read about that clause? Did you try it? If it didn't work, what did "nail -v" output when you attempted to send mail?
Yes. Yes. Already sent in previous posting.
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen. Therefore I was never in your situation.
So if your organization asks you to set up 2000 workstations, you install 2000 mail servers? They should give you a plaque on the wall.
....
Joachim
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ken wrote:
On 04/17/2007 09:36 PM somebody named Joachim Schrod wrote:
ken wrote:
Yes! You got it!!! And this was my original question!!!! Which mail client? Remember, I already mentioned mail/mailx/nail. The problem is that the documentation for these is worthless. So if anyone knows how to set up an account using ~/.nailrc and/or ~/.mailrc and/or CL args to set up the connection for /sending/ mail (WithOut a Local Server), we might be able to accomplish something.
I have never used a Linux (or any other Unix system, for that matter) without a locally configured mail system -- it is a sure disaster waiting to happen. Therefore I was never in your situation.
So if your organization asks you to set up 2000 workstations, you install 2000 mail servers? They should give you a plaque on the wall.
Ho hum... I think it has already been stated a mail server is a defined as machine with a capability to deliver to and accept e-Mail from other machines using SMTP, and that using SMTP internally to transmit operational information does not make the machine a mail server!!!. (In the same way that accessing a html document stored locally on a machine with a Web Browser does not make that machine a web server.!!!!) Logic 101 methinks....
....
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-04-17 at 06:53 -0400, ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message.
They are all the same physical program, using symlinks from older names.
One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird.
I don't think that's a good/wise idea. There are many applications needing it, starting with cron.
The only error messages this and its variations yeild is:
postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: IPv6 support is disabled: Address family not supported by protocol postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: configuring for IPv4 support only
I think you are indeed using the local mail server - postdrop is part of it :-P - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGJODRtTMYHG2NR9URAnE/AJ4sPZJBD97YYuGbV/kGwIs6CTp2hwCdEJrT 7YdWb3JKvLLkY97Dw8m2464= =eRFk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/17/2007 10:59 AM somebody named Carlos E. R. wrote:
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The Tuesday 2007-04-17 at 06:53 -0400, ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
Or maybe I should say they all fail to work in the same way, because I can't get anything to work at all or to give a helpful error message.
They are all the same physical program, using symlinks from older names.
Okay, good to know.
One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird.
I don't think that's a good/wise idea. There are many applications needing it, starting with cron.
Don't know what you mean here. The only reason I mention tbird at all is to show that I have a working mail connection, i.e., can send mail just fine already. Tbird is a GUI, not for CLI noninteractive use, not what I'd use for the task at issue.
The only error messages this and its variations yeild is:
postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: IPv6 support is disabled: Address family not supported by protocol postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: configuring for IPv4 support only
I think you are indeed using the local mail server - postdrop is part of it :-P
Postdrop may be part of it, but I don't have a local mail server running. According to the postdrop manpage, postdrop is a "Postfix mail posting utility". If nail calls a utility provided by postfix, I don't mind. But it isn't the same thing as running a mail server and doesn't mean that I need to run a mail server or that I am already running a mail server. Let me add that I don't need to run a mail server to do what I want to do right now and that I don't want to run a mail server for this particular purpose. So, anyone know how to use nail or other CLI MUA to send an email?
- -- Cheers, Carlos E. R.
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-04-17 at 21:29 -0400, ken wrote:
One complicating factor is that I don't want to set up a local mail server and according to the mail/mailx/nail manpage, I shouldn't have to. (That much I can understand of the manpage.) I have a remote mail (IMAPS/SSL) server which works perfectly fine with thunderbird.
I don't think that's a good/wise idea. There are many applications needing it, starting with cron.
Don't know what you mean here.
That removing postfix is not wise.
The only error messages this and its variations yeild is:
postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: IPv6 support is disabled: Address family not supported by protocol postdrop: warning: inet_protocols: configuring for IPv4 support only
I think you are indeed using the local mail server - postdrop is part of it :-P
Postdrop may be part of it, but I don't have a local mail server running.
Yes, you do. Unless you uninstall postfix entirely, you are running it. And the system will complain about that removal.
According to the postdrop manpage, postdrop is a "Postfix mail posting utility". If nail calls a utility provided by postfix, I don't mind. But it isn't the same thing as running a mail server and doesn't mean that I need to run a mail server or that I am already running a mail server. Let me add that I don't need to run a mail server to do what I want to do right now and that I don't want to run a mail server for this particular purpose.
I refer you to what Joachim Schrod wrote in this thread, I would only be repeating his explanation. Having postfix (or sendmail or whatever) installed and running does not means your machine is a mail server, far from it. And Linux (and unix) is designed to have that functionality in the system.
So, anyone know how to use nail or other CLI MUA to send an email?
I have sent emails using nail. For the way you want it to work, Joachim already explained it. I also saw what he did see, and I concur with him. There is large information in the man page, but I would have to study it in depth to give you a working tutorial, and I have my own problems to solve... - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFGJYLstTMYHG2NR9URAjnDAJwIqHay1gBICIXsVD4gaVilwnUmJACdGeeU p01R5j+kQr64szvY8K3d5GQ= =SC/H -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Tue, 2007-04-17 at 06:53 -0400, ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
I have used mutt to mail things via the command line. I do this inside makefiles. mutt -s "Subject" -a file_to_send. user@wherever.com My use was more complicated. But it does work. Another way is via Tcl and the mime extension. A few lines of script and you can send e-mail however you want. We run some analysis software that sends e-mail logs to a selected user when each section has completed analysis. Don't ask why. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Kapellgränd 7 P.O. Box 4205 SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden Tel: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Fax: Int +46 8-31 42 23 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 04/18/2007 07:36 AM somebody named Roger Oberholtzer wrote:
On Tue, 2007-04-17 at 06:53 -0400, ken wrote:
I need to email from the command line a previously created file. (The finished working command will go into cron and so should be completely programmatic.) Using Linux, There are a few open source apps that should work: mail, mailx, and nail. Weirdness is that they all share the same manpage. So maybe they all work exactly the same (???).
I have used mutt to mail things via the command line. I do this inside makefiles.
mutt -s "Subject" -a file_to_send. user@wherever.com
My use was more complicated. But it does work.
Roger, thanks. Hadn't thought of mutt. Does the standard suse version have SSL compiled in? (According to the docs, "mutt -v" should reveal if so.)
Another way is via Tcl and the mime extension. A few lines of script and you can send e-mail however you want.
Hmm,.. yeah, "man -k" on email-related terms spit out a lot of Tcl manpages but I've written so little Tcl. Perl is a possibility too. I've actually accomplished the basic functionality with bash (without the use of any email-specific app), but not of course employing SSL. SSL, it turns out, isn't absolutely required unless this application is to be mobile, which I'd like it to be (for the much-heralded mobile office thang). That's a two-beer conversation though. The Point: Writing code is a 90% solution, already done (so easy), frail in the face of changes made to the server, and reinvents the wheel.
We run some analysis software that sends e-mail logs to a selected user when each section has completed analysis. Don't ask why.
Yeah, I've done that sort of thing a few times. It's actually a quite elegant solution for a lot of purposes. Thanks for the ideas. And for the understanding. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
participants (12)
-
Adam Tauno Williams -
Carlos E. R. -
David Brodbeck -
G.T.Smith -
James Knott -
Joachim Schrod -
ken -
Patrick Shanahan -
Roger Oberholtzer -
Sandy Drobic -
Sloan -
Theo v. Werkhoven