Le 16/12/2014 13:49, Carlos E. R. a écrit :

On 2014-12-16 11:41, Aaron Digulla wrote:

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Am Dienstag, 16. Dezember 2014 09:02 CET, jdd <> schrieb:

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since some days, mozilla seems not to be able to store passwds

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Maybe the password database got corrupted. Look into the .mozilla folder.

I have seen other mentions of password problem related to FF 34.

I didn't found other way than creting a new profile. This is specially odd, because sync just changed (and lost many things)... thanks jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Le 16/12/2014 14:24, Robert Schweikert a écrit :

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I didn't found other way than creting a new profile.

And did this resolve the problem?

new profile on other folder solve the passwd problem, but I have to go agin for passwsd I9 could recover some extensions (copying the extension folder to the new one) and I can confirm this problem is due to firefox because recovering .mozilla from an old backup did not solve. jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Le 16/12/2014 17:43, Wolfgang Rosenauer a écrit :

anyone cared yet to ask Mozilla via support.mozilla.org or bugzilla.mozilla.org?

not yet jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 12/16/2014 09:14 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:

The idea of a profile in firefox is obsurd as well.

It doesn't need this and it provide no advantages.

The advantage is you could use different profiles for different people. Or you may want to use one profile for personal use and one for work. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Le 17/12/2014 14:14, Carlos E. R. a écrit :

Or login to two or more google accounts (personal, public, work...)

does this works? I usually use several browsers for that (firefox, konqueror, opera) I just tested: I can have two profiles and load one or the other, but not the two on two different desktop. after one profile is started, every firefox session opens with it, included if I try "firefox -p other" jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 12/17/2014 09:02 AM, jdd wrote:

Le 17/12/2014 14:14, Carlos E. R. a écrit :

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Or login to two or more google accounts (personal, public, work...)

does this works? I usually use several browsers for that (firefox, konqueror, opera)

I just tested: I can have two profiles and load one or the other, but not the two on two different desktop. after one profile is started, every firefox session opens with it, included if I try "firefox -p other"

jdd

IIRC, you can only have one profile active at a time. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 07:24:30AM -0500, James Knott wrote:

On 12/16/2014 09:14 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:

...

The idea of a profile in firefox is obsurd as well.

It doesn't need this and it provide no advantages.

The advantage is you could use different profiles for different people. Or you may want to use one profile for personal use and one for work.

NO there is no advantage. That is what Operating Systems log ons are for, so people don't step on each others working environement. And that is what I'm talking about. People like you make everything a PIA for the rest of us. FWIW, the only advantage is/was, for developers who needed to switch rapidly between setups. It is easier to do with two X11 sessions and switch between users. Or today, they can just set up a virtual machine. If they eliminate profiles, cut and paste, synch, and autoguessing they would dump a boatload of bugs. Ruben

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-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 04:14:06PM +0100, jdd wrote:

Le 17/12/2014 16:03, Ruben Safir a écrit :

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FWIW, the only advantage is/was, for developers who needed to switch rapidly between setups. It is easier to do with two X11 sessions and switch between users. Or today, they can just set up a virtual machine.

I have use of such things, it would have made my life simpler if I did know that was possible with firefox.

until now I had to use two separate browsers for, as example, check my photo gallery permissions. I need one admin session and an other user session, just to be sure I didn't forget to make a folder available to the right people.

I used to have to test sites all the time. You just open another x11 session with another user account and switch ctl alt f whatever to the desired display. Stuffing all this into firefox, which is a huge code base, was idiotic. Although I also had a set up where the development box was a server down the hall. I would ssh into the remote and run the devleopers bowser from there and the local browser from here, then these idiots screwed that up by making firefox check the local config files when ran remotely. Mozilla has always been blind to X11 which sucks. and It is also why their cut and past is sooooo broken, they didn't need to write a stitch of code for cut and paste and they had to reinvent the wheel in order to make it compatable with that crap MS software garbage. Ruben

jdd

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-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 04:33:20PM +0100, jdd wrote:

Le 17/12/2014 16:25, Ruben Safir a écrit :

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I used to have to test sites all the time. You just open another x11 session with another user account and switch ctl alt f whatever to the desired display.

it's much less friendly

I found it very usable. My kids used to run multiple X11 logins on boxes at the same time so they could flip between each others desktops and not disturb there siblings work. They never questioned it. And when they would use school computers, they were totally befuddled by stuff that doesn't work and they would come home and complain about it. Ruben

jdd

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-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 10:24:30PM +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On 2014-12-17 16:33, jdd wrote:

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Le 17/12/2014 16:25, Ruben Safir a écrit :

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I used to have to test sites all the time. You just open another x11 session with another user account and switch ctl alt f whatever to the desired display.

it's much less friendly

And uses much more resources :-P

You start another graphical session, complete, in which another firefox is also running. Compared to running _only_ a second firefox...

And yet we did that on Pentium IIs.... NO PROBLEM. No systemd on the other hand can't load on an opteron 64 And you can't even do this any longer with systemd and the new "rootless" X Just what we need is a Rootless X. Because X is a security hole and systemd is not. Ruben

-- Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2014-12-17 21:53, Felix Miata wrote:

I certainly would be grossly inconvenienced by lack of copy & paste if I was always forced to use multiple X sessions and users to run multiple browser sessions, and I am certainly not alone in this regard.

True. But there is an intermediate way: not multiple X sessions, but only a terminal in your session in which you "su - otheruser", and there you start a second firefox. It is a different profile, running as another user, and thus, without access to your home files if you are that paranoid, but in the same graphical session, so copy-paste works. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 03:53:18PM -0500, Felix Miata wrote:

Ruben Safir composed on 2014-12-17 10:25 (UTC-0500):

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I used to have to test sites all the time.

I still do.

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You just open another x11 session with another user account and switch ctl alt f whatever to the desired display.

That's an option I routinely use for some tasks that isn't so good for others. The main reasons I ever use separate sessions are for:

1-different user, often to mitigate browser history clutter

2-To use a different screen resolution (main reason), often with panning (a nuisance in normal use)

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Stuffing all this into firefox, which is a huge code base, was idiotic.

On the contrary, most web site developers are not Linux users, and so cannot run multiple sessions simultaeously using only one computer and screen.

SO I should use crap software because web developers are flat out stupid? And that is the problem in a NUTSHELL. All the recent problems can be traced to just this problem. WE KNOW THAT WINDOWS IS CRAP IN ITS BASIC DESIGN. And so is Apple. So we break every peice of software to be just as stupid as windows. We can't cut and paste correctly. We can't have securely designed software We can't have shell scriptings running the initiation We can't have kill signal work correctly We can't have X11 network aware applications We can't have functional virtual servers and everything have to have convoluted, over bloated GARBAGE that crashes and uses gigbyte memory footprints in order to work.... because some jackass web develoeprs can't function with a really functional computer envronment. This sucks and if this is the future of opensue and linux, not to mention systemd, gnome, kde, mono and mozilla, which is all but apears to be .... then there is no future in it. The future is to be James Knotts and to stuff yourself with a bunch of jaargon that you don't even understand and let your computer marketing department tell you what to do. This goes along with a generation that sees no problem being tagged, followed, classified and delivered for consumption by large organizations from the government to CVS and Walmart.

Also, Firefox is not just Firefox. Firefox is a Gecko, which shares core components with other Gecko products. Multiple profiles enable more than just developers.

Personally, I would be severely hamstrung if no-remote were not available. Most of the time I have at least 5 different Gecko profiles in use at once, with no less than a dozen tabs in each, most with far more.

What difference does it matter. It crashes every day now... Take a hint, BTW, turn off your history.

Each has large history and is used for unique task groups than would not be possible without different profiles. I certainly would be grossly inconvenienced by lack of copy & paste if I was always forced to use multiple X sessions and users to run multiple browser sessions, and I am certainly not alone in this regard. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 12:44:20AM -0500, Felix Miata wrote:

Ruben Safir composed on 2014-12-17 17:52 (UTC-0500):

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SO I should use crap software because web developers are flat out stupid?

If they were stupid, their patches would rarely be up to acceptance standards. However, too many *are* naive.

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And that is the problem in a NUTSHELL. All the recent problems can be traced to just this problem.

Wrong. Most of the trouble is because it is assembled by a big disorganization lacking responsible management parties who can lose their jobs for doing a poor job, little different from some highly visible non-local governments.

Felix, think about the inconsistency of this argument. WHo has the big disorganized, unfireable management? Abode or Mozilla? There is a problem with Flash. But there is not a problem in FIREFOX. I'm looking at 100's of datapoints now. Firefox is crashing for everyone I know of that I can touch flesh with who runs linux, and flash just makes it worst. Firefox has gotten so bloated that they can't maintain the code base any longer or keep up with the bug reports. They are adding features (and security holes) faster than they can maintain the core product. Furthermore, the issues with chrome:: profiles and the problems with cut and past being circumvented from X11 are OLD problems and are design failures. Firefox has gotten fat and unmaintanable.

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WE KNOW THAT WINDOWS IS CRAP IN ITS BASIC DESIGN. And so is Apple. So we break every peice of software to be just as stupid as windows.

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We can't....

Can't is the wrong word. After all, it's FOSS. A big problem is shortage of people who care who are competent to fix the problems actually working on solving them. IFDEFs can avoid a lot of the junk made for those other environments, but complaining things don't work right doesn't get the fixing done.

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and everything have to have convoluted, over bloated GARBAGE that crashes

Crashing isn't a necessity for profiles that have no access to crashware like Flash. Crashes are infrequent here, in spite of having multiple Geckos open most of the time with hundreds of open tabs among them. Usually mine are related to a huge number of opened tabs gobbling physical RAM that sometimes gets exhausted. I don't see RAM consumption here being as horrid as the stories I hear about. My hundreds of tabs are getting by on only 4GB of system RAM and virtually nothing hitting swap.

I want to say, it is true what you say.... or it was untiol recently. Despite design problems with Firefox, it was rock solid stable until just recently. It might be because I was using SuSE packages. Other people started to complain around me and I sort of shrugged my shoulders. Now I can see the problem. It is a nightmare now. And have you tried to compile firefox of late. It is a monster and it's compiling requires a PhD.

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What difference does it matter. It crashes every day now...

Sounds like you need to do some house cleaning. More than one crash a week here is infrequent. More than one a *month* is infrequent.

More than once a year would be a shock. I'd had firefox workjing continually for years until recently.

...

Take a hint, BTW, turn off your history.

History is lifeblood here.

Better hint: turn off or uninstall Flash, and complain to the backwards, poor usability web sites still using that anachronism. http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html

So you basically are arguing my point :) Ruben

-- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Anton Aylward composed on 2014-12-18 10:26 (UTC-0500):

Ruben Safir wrote:

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Felix, think about the inconsistency of this argument. WHo has the big disorganized, unfireable management? Abode or Mozilla?

Wrong argument.

"Who is interested in supporting Linux & FOSS?" is more pertinent.

IOW, the flipside of getting what you pay for. With trivial money being paid for FOSS, most of which is directed to specific areas affecting profitability, there's equally little of the profit incentive that is the conventional motivation to produce improvement in other areas. If you want something fixed, either you fix it yourself, wait on someone else to pay a developer to fix it, or pay a developer yourself. Without money, organization and management don't happen. Adobe has profit motive driving it. Mozilla is "non-profit". -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

if they ripped out systemd I would HAPPILY shell out upto $200 for a current release. On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 06:24:53PM +0100, jdd wrote:

Le 18/12/2014 17:48, Felix Miata a écrit :

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Without money, organization and management don't happen. Adobe has profit motive driving it. Mozilla is "non-profit".

bad example, mozilla is one of the richest FOSS :-)

but it's possible through quite standard mechanisms to allow some money on a regular basis to any project.

I spend presently $15 (each month) paying a server to my linux user group. I would happily do the same for openSUSE, but AFAIK money was discussed when discussing foundation and this was not considered.

And many people could give let only $1 a month

note that: I pay $6 approx for insuring I phone I do not have anymore, just because I didn't find the time to phone the insurance company and take the numerous steps I have to do to resign... and many people do the same

jdd -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-- So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998 http://www.mrbrklyn.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive http://www.coinhangout.com - coins! http://www.brooklyn-living.com Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2014-12-18 19:37, Lew Wolfgang wrote:

Hm,,, I wonder what init system Android uses? Does my phone use systemd?

I doubt it, no need. They are conservative, the root os they change little. They develop mostly on the top layer. I'm looking at the /etc directory of my tablet, and I see no init* files nor directories, nor rc. Not that it means much, though. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On 12/18/2014 12:44 AM, Felix Miata wrote:

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and everything have to have convoluted, over bloated GARBAGE that crashes Crashing isn't a necessity for profiles that have no access to crashware like Flash. Crashes are infrequent here, in spite of having multiple Geckos open most of the time with hundreds of open tabs among them. Usually mine are related to a huge number of opened tabs gobbling physical RAM that sometimes gets exhausted. I don't see RAM consumption here being as horrid as the stories I hear about. My hundreds of tabs are getting by on only 4GB of system RAM and virtually nothing hitting swap.

Same here. A lot more than 40 tabs. Used to 'hang' (which some people misinterpret as 'crash' but isn't) when I had a single core machine and limited memory, but what does one expect? With an 8 core machine and 64G of memory any crashes with Mozilla are going to be http://www.kickinthehead.org/kickinthehead3/comics/2005-12-08-problem-exists...

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What difference does it matter. It crashes every day now... Sounds like you need to do some house cleaning. More than one crash a week here is infrequent. More than one a *month* is infrequent.

All "out of service" here in the last year have been equipment problems, primarily a dying mobo, some other with SATA/ATA interfaces. That and PEBKAC, of course :-)

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Take a hint, BTW, turn off your history. History is lifeblood here.

Sometimes you don't realise what you need until its gone ... -- /"\ \ / ASCII Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML Mail / \ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

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"Carlos" == Carlos E R writes:

Carlos> On 2014-12-16 11:41, Aaron Digulla wrote: >> Am Dienstag, 16. Dezember 2014 09:02 CET, jdd <> schrieb: >>> since some days, mozilla seems not to be able to store passwds >> Maybe the password database got corrupted. Look into the .mozilla >> folder. Carlos> I have seen other mentions of password problem related to FF 34. IIRC either the password file was changed or the sql moved to json or whatever. The only way to recover the passwords for me was to downgrade to the original version in 13.1 and then use Password Exporter add on to export all passwords, then upgrade firefox and using the addon import all passwords. -- Life is endless possibilities -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org