-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2016-09-03 23:09, Dave Howorth wrote:

My first annoyance was gimp. It seems to have decided that when I open a jpg, I haven't 'opened' it, I have 'imported' it. More practically annoying is that when I select part of a jpg image and try to save it, it doesn't. It tries to save some xcf thing and I have to 'export' to a jpg. Which wouldn't be too bad except it still keeps the image status as unsaved, giving me one more piece of information I have to hold in my head instead of having the computer remember the obvious stuff for me. So how do I open a jpg, cut a bit out of it, and save that as jpg with least grief?

Yes, it is a nuisance.

My second annoyance is photo management. I use LXDE, not KDE and not Gnome. I use a couple of photo managers for different purposes. Tonight I'm experimenting with the use where I've historically used f-spot. So my first guess was to use shotwell.

That's the one I use.

But I'm stuck at the first hurdle. It apparently can import f-spot data, but it seems to expect me to know where that is. I don't; why can't it find it? Plus (a) it keeps wingeing about dconf not working and (b) the help won't popup because it tries to launch firefox and it doesn't have permission (and I'm not going to give it permission!). So any advice on how to drive shotwell, particularly importing an f-spot database, or where to find help, or alternative programs that could be a substitute would be gratefully received.

Well, you have to allow it to use firefox if you want to read the help. You might create a new user and try there. It appears that different programs save data about the photos differently, yes. Some inside the photos, some outside in a directory, some in a database in a completely different place (kde tools). - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlfLPgAACgkQja8UbcUWM1yDkAD+IqudOuaN4/FVXlIA3D/gS0Yi EJ6a8u7rB4/UrH6fR4gA/RdTK5fytCKEO83ouoDB6kaBh52O23i/HlU9wuTFPZ50 =wWHD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Sat, 3 Sep 2016 22:09:43 +0100 Dave Howorth wrote:

My second annoyance is photo management. I use LXDE, not KDE and not Gnome. I use a couple of photo managers for different purposes. Tonight I'm experimenting with the use where I've historically used f-spot. So my first guess was to use shotwell. But I'm stuck at the first hurdle. It apparently can import f-spot data, but it seems to expect me to know where that is. I don't; why can't it find it? Plus (a) it keeps wingeing about dconf not working and (b) the help won't popup because it tries to launch firefox and it doesn't have permission (and I'm not going to give it permission!). So any advice on how to drive shotwell, particularly importing an f-spot database, or where to find help, or alternative programs that could be a substitute would be gratefully received.

OK. So I browsed the web a bit and found that f-spot keeps its database in photos.db but not in the place the web claimed. So find found it for me and I used it to import the existing database. Which seems to have worked modulo not having checked the error listing yet. So then I imported some photos I took today, which seemed to work. But it didn't let me tag them whilst importing like f-spot did. So it seems I have to tag every photo individually, which I can do but is a pain. Is there a better way to do that? Then worse, the photos don't actually turn up in the view of all photos, though they do in the list of most recently imported. So what's with that? Or in the list of photos with the tag that I just applied. Grr!? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2016-09-03 23:34, Dave Howorth wrote:

OK. So I browsed the web a bit and found that f-spot keeps its database in photos.db but not in the place the web claimed. So find found it for me and I used it to import the existing database. Which seems to have worked modulo not having checked the error listing yet. So then I imported some photos I took today, which seemed to work.

In shotwell?

But it didn't let me tag them whilst importing like f-spot did. So it seems I have to tag every photo individually, which I can do but is a pain. Is there a better way to do that? Then worse, the photos don't actually turn up in the view of all photos, though they do in the list of most recently imported. So what's with that? Or in the list of photos with the tag that I just applied. Grr!?

In the view of recently imported, select all the photos, then edict comment or tags, will apply to all of them. By default it sorts the photos by /year/month/day7 directories. I changed that to /year/month/. But in the program it displays by event, and normally an event is a day. But you can rename them to anything like "wedding 2016". The "Library view" corresponds to the view of all photos. There is also a folder view. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On Sat, 3 Sep 2016 17:18:59 -0400 Patrick Shanahan wrote:

Have a look at darktable. Dev's are on irc, #darktable (freenode), and there is a mail list.

Built for openSUSE (and several others) by darix (Marcus Rueckert), http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/darix:/darktable:/

highly recommended.

Thanks, I'll give that a try. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Sat, 3 Sep 2016 23:52:41 +0200 "Carlos E. R." wrote:

In shotwell?

Correct.

In the view of recently imported, select all the photos, then edict comment or tags, will apply to all of them.

Ah, thanks. That's worse than the f-spot behaviour but better than my first attempt.

By default it sorts the photos by /year/month/day7 directories. I changed that to /year/month/.

But in the program it displays by event, and normally an event is a day. But you can rename them to anything like "wedding 2016".

The problem seems to be that it hasn't assigned an 'event' to the photos I imported. Whereas all pre-existing photos have the date assigned to them automatically as an event, despite the whole concept never having existed in f-spot. Perhaps there's a way to tell it that the photos I imported today, that were saved today, that were taken today, should have 'today' associated with them without me having to do too much (preferably nothing!)

The "Library view" corresponds to the view of all photos. There is also a folder view.

Haven't found that yet. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2016-09-04 00:21, Dave Howorth wrote:

On Sat, 3 Sep 2016 23:52:41 +0200 "Carlos E. R." <> wrote:

...

In shotwell?

Correct.

...

In the view of recently imported, select all the photos, then edict comment or tags, will apply to all of them.

Ah, thanks. That's worse than the f-spot behaviour but better than my first attempt.

...

By default it sorts the photos by /year/month/day7 directories. I changed that to /year/month/.

But in the program it displays by event, and normally an event is a day. But you can rename them to anything like "wedding 2016".

The problem seems to be that it hasn't assigned an 'event' to the photos I imported.

I don't remember if it does for preexisting files, or only for those take from the camera. And those from the camera wait till you hit the "import" button.

Whereas all pre-existing photos have the date assigned to them automatically as an event, despite the whole concept never having existed in f-spot. Perhaps there's a way to tell it that the photos I imported today, that were saved today, that were taken today, should have 'today' associated with them without me having to do too much (preferably nothing!)

No, it uses the internal date inside the photo files. EXIF. I don't have leap, so it might display a bit different in there. There is a panel on the left with several main level entries: Library Flagged Last Import Events \ 2016 \ August Fri Aug 26, 2016 July ... Folders \ cer Tags Albacete Madrid ... Trash O Missing files Have a look at your preferences setup. You really need to read the help file! :-P -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On 09/03/2016 06:29 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

For the record, on my XFCE desktop it fires a small browser, not firefox, that displays help. I think it is called "yelp".

Indeed. https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E23824_01/html/E24676/glmei.html

I guess you get firefox because you have the desktop configured that way.

I would think so. I have Firefox as my default in both the KDE config and the Gnome-style config. The former required explicit action on my part, the latter was just there. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 09/03/2016 05:18 PM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

Have a look at darktable.

Oh I don't know; yes it can tag, yes you can create 'filmrolls', but it first and foremost an editor. I use the file system and a file system browser (Konqueror or Dolphin in KDE, Thunar in Xfce, ther's also pcmanf, nautilus, and the minimalist rox-filer). -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2016-09-04 00:53, Anton Aylward wrote:

...

PS now I'm annoyed with claws as well. Because you send signed messages (for reasons I understand and respect) claws decided I wanted to send a signed reply, despite me never having given it any credentials. Stupid program!

Hmm. Sending a signed reply to a signed message seems reasonable enough to me, but as you say, if you haven't set up the credentials it does seem futile?

Thunderbird does the same by default. It also asks for your pgp password when it is going to save a draft on the imap server, so that it is safe. You have to either create the certificate, or disable those default actions. It is intentionally done by the devs to /hint/ that you need a PGP password for your own security. It does not make sense not to trust firefox, then to trust email servers by not having and using PGP/GPG >;-) - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlfLW/QACgkQja8UbcUWM1zNWQD/c1lLIt1iqCsLFnIdA5RrWA/D NJauZg5JeYZft9lmWtsA/22Q5NyAsX54QeFUnkjbxJHKp0DoAEx3D2F6QUA2cI7W =0sXV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Sun, 04 Sep 2016 11:35:31 +0200 Per Jessen wrote:

open, select area, copy, paste as new, export as jpg.

Hi Per, A minor clarification: open ('import') file, select and copy area then 'File' -> 'Create from Clipboard,' export as .jpg :) regards, Carl -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2016-09-04 11:35, Per Jessen wrote:

This isn't specific to Leap, it's GIMP that has changed. I' pretty certain it behaves the same way in 13.1 and 13.2. I have grown used ot it long ago.

Correct, it behaves that way in 13.1. There was an addon that added a menu entry for "export clean" or similar wording. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On 09/04/2016 04:35 AM, Per Jessen wrote:

Dave Howorth wrote:

...

My first annoyance was gimp. It seems to have decided that when I open a jpg, I haven't 'opened' it, I have 'imported' it. More practically annoying is that when I select part of a jpg image and try to save it, it doesn't. It tries to save some xcf thing and I have to 'export' to a jpg. Which wouldn't be too bad except it still keeps the image status as unsaved, giving me one more piece of information I have to hold in my head instead of having the computer remember the obvious stuff for me. This isn't specific to Leap, it's GIMP that has changed. I' pretty certain it behaves the same way in 13.1 and 13.2. I have grown used ot it long ago.

...

So how do I open a jpg, cut a bit out of it, and save that as jpg with least grief? open, select area, copy, paste as new, export as jpg.

It is the same and very annoying. -- Fast is fine, but accuracy is final. You must learn to be slow in a hurry. -Wyatt Earp- _ _... ..._ _ _._ ._ ..... ._.. ... .._ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Sun, 4 Sep 2016 07:53:46 -0500 Billie Walsh wrote:

I forgot to mention. On the up side your original image is not changed so if you make a mistake you can always go back to it. That can come in handy on occasion.

Exactly! :) You stated this use case more elegantly than I did, Billie. It's somewhat comparable to opening a .doc or .xls file in LibreOffice. When saving after making a change in that use case, you're prompted to select to either overwrite the original or save in the appropriate native LO open file format. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 09/04/2016 08:53 AM, Billie Walsh wrote:

I forgot to mention. On the up side your original image is not changed so if you make a mistake you can always go back to it. That can come in handy on occasion.

Let me add a variation to that. I use Darktable which stores the changes to the original in a 'sidebar' file. I also use RAW format :-) So I make the changes and 'export' to GUF or PNG or whatever as needed and can step back and forth though the changes I've made. I can also rename the sidebar file, create a history not of changes but of different sidebar files, different TYPES of changes. Since Darktable is support by a library of user-applied changes termed 'styles' much in the same way that GIMP has a library of user supplied macros, I have a very great deal of flexibility in my image changing. I realise Dave said he could keep iterations, generation of the GIF files, but I see two downsides to that which go hand in hand. The first is that GIF is a lossy format. In order to step back though all the micro changes it means saving a lot of images, probably at high resolution. They way I work the GIFS and JPGS seem to come out at least 3.5M sometimes as much as 5M in size. I submit them for printing and scaling, often 10x8, sometimes 8x12 or 11x`14. I understand there is 12x16 and 16x24, but I've not tried anything that size. maybe if I get some artistic shots of the city that I feel worth framing, possibly selling. Anyway, my point is that that the changes are stored as sidebar files. If I find a change that I like I could 'export' it to any size. if I only saved a GIFs or JPGs I couldn't come back later and scale up. Saving revisions as GIFs or JPGs or even PNGs is not a smart idea. Its wasteful and removes flexibility and options for the future. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On Sat, 3 Sep 2016 23:52:41 +0200 "Carlos E. R." wrote:

On 2016-09-03 23:34, Dave Howorth wrote:

...

OK. So I browsed the web a bit and found that f-spot keeps its database in photos.db but not in the place the web claimed. So find found it for me and I used it to import the existing database. Which seems to have worked modulo not having checked the error listing yet. So then I imported some photos I took today, which seemed to work.

In shotwell?

...

But it didn't let me tag them whilst importing like f-spot did. So it seems I have to tag every photo individually, which I can do but is a pain. Is there a better way to do that? Then worse, the photos don't actually turn up in the view of all photos, though they do in the list of most recently imported. So what's with that? Or in the list of photos with the tag that I just applied. Grr!?

In the view of recently imported, select all the photos, then edict comment or tags, will apply to all of them.

By default it sorts the photos by /year/month/day7 directories. I changed that to /year/month/.

But in the program it displays by event, and normally an event is a day. But you can rename them to anything like "wedding 2016".

But it seems I can't create an event, assign it to photos, and rename it as a date that appears in the list like all the other photos. I've given up on shotwell.

The "Library view" corresponds to the view of all photos. There is also a folder view.

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Dave Howorth wrote:

On Sun, 4 Sep 2016 12:11:44 +0200 Daniel Bauer wrote:

...

Don't now what's annoying you in digikam. I use it for many years now, with thousands and thousands of images. I tried many photo management applications and never found something that only comes close to the functionality of digikam, not even on Mac's.

I started installing it but it wanted to install what seemed like thousands of KDE packages. Just to display photos! That is a first and sufficient annoyance, IMHO.

For just reviewing photos, I kind of like gwenview. My photos are 6000x4000, and take about a second to load - a little slow, but not annoyingly so. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (21.7°C) http://www.dns24.ch/ - your free DNS host, made in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2016-09-04 17:44, Dave Howorth wrote:

But it seems I can't create an event, assign it to photos, and rename it as a date that appears in the list like all the other photos.

Not that way. You select the photos, then click on menu Event/new event. They get into the newly created event, which you can rename. Or create event, select photos, drag and drop to another event. Just tested here. All programs have a learning curve, and shotwell is quite good at organizing and displaying photos. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlfMbOMACgkQja8UbcUWM1yF8gEAk8jAl+3552jDYKEtpB0t6SAN fx0IrhWZ+ak6/sbbQRIBAJIkD/RBRGb1i2WiGbNIk8xLQwiAOK5ZMr5MI3hDE6t6 =SSa3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256 On 2016-09-04 17:51, Dave Howorth wrote:

On Sun, 4 Sep 2016 12:11:44 +0200 Daniel Bauer wrote:

...

Don't now what's annoying you in digikam. I use it for many years now, with thousands and thousands of images. I tried many photo management applications and never found something that only comes close to the functionality of digikam, not even on Mac's.

I started installing it but it wanted to install what seemed like thousands of KDE packages. Just to display photos! That is a first and sufficient annoyance, IMHO.

To use any KDE application you need to install all the KDE libraries it uses, even if you don't use KDE. That's normal and expected, and not an issue. I also do not use KDE, yet I have it installed in order to use its good applications.

I'm currently trying thunar, which seems to do most of what I want. Especially using feh as the viewer.

Thunar is XFCE file manager. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith)) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iF4EAREIAAYFAlfMbqEACgkQja8UbcUWM1x9nAD6A1kvxkJHK08bNCHMmSYa6PZu 0w8DvITk4+85kafAtc0BAJeuVHFJNC83Nt5hDoGIWgXN6o/BeITCMvn1+tPEka9q =wF4T -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org