I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux. This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark? - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
On Thu, 28 Jan 1999, you wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark?
You know, I've been pretty concerned about this myself. In general, the linux community seems to be taking this as a Good Thing, but I don't know. Red Hat does not seem to have garnered some support from the big guys, but has garnered *all* the support from the big guys. You do realize that the companies who get involved in Linux have the greatest incentive to proprieterize linux for their own gains, right? Doing this allows them to "partner" with one company that holds all the balls and not worry about this zany free software thing. Perhaps a well worded article to Linux Journal and Slashdot on the subject is in order. -- lunaslide * PGP key->pgpkeys.mit.edu port 11371 * * * * * * In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is * getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity. * -Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas * * * * * * - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
Kaare Rasmussen wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark?
I think SuSE is like Beta VCR's, OS/2, Word Perfect, and the Amiga computer - a technically superior product being squashed by someone else's superior marketing. That's how it's done in the US. Red Hat is smoozing with the money and the press, and that's what makes the US economy tick. George - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
On 28 Jan, George Toft wrote:
Kaare Rasmussen wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark?
I think SuSE is like Beta VCR's, OS/2, Word Perfect, and the Amiga computer - a technically superior product being squashed by someone else's superior marketing. That's how it's done in the US. Red Hat is smoozing with the money and the press, and that's what makes the US economy tick.
George - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
Good commentary George!! OS/2 has always been inherently superior to NT or 95/98. Its multitasking abilities drive huge markets that are invisible to us end users for the most part. Its unfortunate that some of these companies like the one I worked for have moved toward NT. Many of the IT types have remarked that OS/2 was easier to support, more stable, easier to rebuild. I do think though that RedHat offers a new person a certain attraction which is manifested by their ads. They also target ads toward IT managers and other decision makers in the MIS/IT/developer chain. I think RedHat provided the ability for people like me to learn linux with its rpm packaged software. When I first started with linux, I was able to grab these packages and get things working. -- Michael E. Perry mperry@basin.com ------------------ - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
Kaare Rasmussen wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark?
I'm not worried. I chose to go with Linux , "to get away from the big guys". Once those giants get their hands on Redhat, it will become " a non-configurable-totally controlled" system, designed for their benefit. It will be OK, but not the free-wheeling" OS we all love. You will have to stick with Suse, Slakware, or Debian, to get the "complete-user-control" that we all want. By the way, I found it very interesting, that the day after IBM's announcement, their stock prices dropped sharply. Coincidence? Did some Microsoft allies send a message? - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
Kaare Rasmussen <kar@webline.dk> writes:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark?
That's a good point. Redhat has been the most popular distro for a long time now, at least in the US. I've never tried it, but lot of people seem to like it. More and more big commercial names are jumping on the Linux bandwagon. They're going to rally around whatever looks like a standard. At the moment, as far as they're concerned, that's Redhat. As the teeming hordes desert M$ and come to Linux, they in turn will tend to go where the action is. Taken altogether, that amounts to a lot of momentum moving toward Redhat, possibly at the expense of all the other distros. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If it's a bad thing, what can/should be done about it? -- Bud Rogers <budr@sirinet.net> <A HREF="http://www.sirinet.net/~budr/zamm.html"><A HREF="http://www.sirinet.net/~budr/zamm.html</A">http://www.sirinet.net/~budr/zamm.html</A</A>> - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
Bud Rogers wrote:
Taken altogether, that amounts to a lot of momentum moving toward Redhat, possibly at the expense of all the other distros. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If it's a bad thing, what can/should be done about it?
It's not a bad thing that there is alot of movement toward Redhat. It's better than keeping everyone locked into Windows. At least it is going to make unix programming more popular and reduce the Microsoft monopoly. Think of all the people who will be able to learn about shell scripts,perl,c, and X windows. Suse is more popular in Europe, and eventually the European and African market may become more important than the US market. If the big companies start promoting their software as Redhat RPM's, we will still be able to use the source RPM's. Which is probably a wiser thing to do anyways. - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
On 28 Jan 1999, Bud Rogers wrote:
Taken altogether, that amounts to a lot of momentum moving toward Redhat, possibly at the expense of all the other distros. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If it's a bad thing, what can/should be done about it?
I think it's a good thing. I think it still = Linux exposure. I suppose once people get used to using Linux, some of them will try other distros ( though generally, it makes it easier to 'pick' RedHat.) I also think, that despite it all, can someone say a reason why RedHat should _not_ be used? I mean if the co's are going to put ONE dist on their machines, is their some major reason why it shouldn't be RedHat? One positive thing, is RedHat, _has_ been with glibc longer and by most reports I've read 5.2 is a really good release ( even know S.u.S.E. users who say it's better than S.u.S.E. 6.0 ). In any case, despite all the chagrin to the contrary there's nothing any can do about it. If we were just to 'complain' , inquire, the voices of the S.u.S.E. users, can't shout down the RedHat users, which to everything I've seen seem to be the largest quantity in N.A. I say, relax and enjoy the attention Linux is getting and don't worry about the threat to the distributions. S.u.S.E. isn't going anywhere. I wish RedHat the best of luck with this turn of events, and try to look at the sunny side--it does have broad gains for Linux in general even if some dists will be hurt to an extent by the user percentage gain that RedHat will obviously see when these machines really start hitting the market. -M - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
I think this is well said. I have my own preferences, but I've attempted to stay away from the mine vs yours mentality. I think that would be an error and would cause more harm than good for Linux in general. Let us not forget that where the rpm came from. This alone, I'm sure, has helped SuSE to be an excellent product. This should not be RH vs SuSE, in the end it must be Linux. I've used, and still use Debian, SuSE and RedHat. Frankly, I found RedHat more difficult to install than the first two, but in the end my personal choice was based on the configuration "out of the box." I must think that should too much infighting occur Linux will just be looked at as "still just a hacker os." The Linux community, its integrity and attitude will make Linux a standard or not a standard. In my opinion the world economy is not that great and profits are getting thinner. So how do you increase your profit? When seconds,or hours, are counted over 365 days Linux can be a standout. Bean counters, in the end, care about nothing else. And any OS that can't measure up had better look over its shoulder. There are more users looking for good alternatives. Regards, Bob Michael Johnson wrote:
On 28 Jan 1999, Bud Rogers wrote:
Taken altogether, that amounts to a lot of momentum moving toward Redhat, possibly at the expense of all the other distros. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If it's a bad thing, what can/should be done about it?
I think it's a good thing. I think it still = Linux exposure. I suppose once people get used to using Linux, some of them will try other distros ( though generally, it makes it easier to 'pick' RedHat.) I also think, that despite it all, can someone say a reason why RedHat should _not_ be used? I mean if the co's are going to put ONE dist on their machines, is their some major reason why it shouldn't be RedHat? One positive thing, is RedHat, _has_ been with glibc longer and by most reports I've read 5.2 is a really good release ( even know S.u.S.E. users who say it's better than S.u.S.E. 6.0 ). In any case, despite all the chagrin to the contrary there's nothing any can do about it. If we were just to 'complain' , inquire, the voices of the S.u.S.E. users, can't shout down the RedHat users, which to everything I've seen seem to be the largest quantity in N.A. I say, relax and enjoy the attention Linux is getting and don't worry about the threat to the distributions. S.u.S.E. isn't going anywhere. I wish RedHat the best of luck with this turn of events, and try to look at the sunny side--it does have broad gains for Linux in general even if some dists will be hurt to an extent by the user percentage gain that RedHat will obviously see when these machines really start hitting the market. -M
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On Thu, 28 Jan 1999, Kaare Rasmussen wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark? I'm seeing more and more reports manufactureres will be shipping sometime soon with Linux on machines. I wonder what the Linux will be on these machines. I suspect RedHat. Most of these companies are North American Companies, and RedHat, seems to own the Linux market in North America. I think most of the computer manufacturers that will be shipping Linux with their machines will be shipping RedHat. I did see in Linux Journal VA research, which sells Linux Workstations, ships with S.u.S.E., though. S.u.S.E. will be around, but RH, is going to be the dominant force this side fo the sea for the indefinite future, I think.
-M - To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archiv at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>
I'm in complete aggrement. I recently emailed SuSE in regards to there efforts on this side of the big pond. Two weeks ago I attended the launch of the SGI Visual Workstations. I'm not certain that I will not be building my next Linux box, but I would love to see SuSE an option from the likes of SGI. I've emailed SuSE once already with thoughts on this subject, and just got of the phone with the Oakland, CA office. I really don't know how many SuSE users there are, but as SuSE is a privately held company I would suggest that we let those, who make the decisions hear some encouragement toward making some allainces here in the States. I'm not a programmer, at least not yet, but I would think becoming a "standard" is an expensive undertaking. I owned a BMW BEFORE they became a status symbol here in the US. It was a great car and the comradery amongst the owner/drivers was great. I think SuSE is the same kind of product. I hope that SuSE will become a STANDARD not just a status symbol. Regards, Bob Meekness is the grace which, from beneath God's footstool, lifts up a candid and confiding eye, accepting God's smile of Fatherly affection, and adoring those perfections which it cannot comprehend. - James Hamilton. Michael Johnson wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 1999, Kaare Rasmussen wrote:
I'm worried about the latest announcements from the big guys HP and (not yet public) IBM that they will support RedHat Linux.
This means that Linux = RedHat for the most people, and where will that put SuSE? Alone in the dark? I'm seeing more and more reports manufactureres will be shipping sometime soon with Linux on machines. I wonder what the Linux will be on these machines. I suspect RedHat. Most of these companies are North American Companies, and RedHat, seems to own the Linux market in North America. I think most of the computer manufacturers that will be shipping Linux with their machines will be shipping RedHat. I did see in Linux Journal VA research, which sells Linux Workstations, ships with S.u.S.E., though. S.u.S.E. will be around, but RH, is going to be the dominant force this side fo the sea for the indefinite future, I think.
-M
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participants (8)
-
budr＠sirinet.net -
hekate＠intergate.bc.ca -
kar＠webline.dk -
LinuxAdvocate＠iname.com -
lunaslyd＠pacbell.net -
mperry＠basin.com -
risch＠tir.com -
zentara＠mindspring.com