Hi James,

In response to the suggestion "the CD contains GPL software, so you >can redistribute the whole CD under whatever terms you see fit..."

*BUZZ" Wrong answer! Would you like to go again?

If people want to remove all the non-GPL software off the CDs ,make copies containing the remainder, and sell CDs of them, fine, go >ahead, although people may find it a little difficult to install without >YaST!

True.

You also seem to think that since YaST is on the same CDs as >software that is GPL, then YaST must also be GPL - not so in the slightest, please understand what the GPL says and means before you make such assumptions.

Also true. But how was YaST created? Was GCC used? Or did SuSE create their own compiler/interpreter for this?

Oh yeah, not to mention all the purely proprietary software on the >CDs that is licensed to SuSE for inclusion, under certain terms (which basically boil down to agreeing to them being included on CDs >covered by the YaST license I guess)

Good point. ~~Nick --- On Sun 04/13, James Ogley < james@usr-local-bin.org > wrote: From: James Ogley [mailto: james@usr-local-bin.org] To: suse-linux-e@suse.com Date: 13 Apr 2003 21:22:03 +0100 Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: [SLE] SuSE 8.2 copies already on sale at EBay] Full text included, because it was sent to me by mistake, not to the<br>list...<br><br>In response to the suggestion "the CD contains GPL software, so you can<br>redistribute the whole CD under whatever terms you see fit..."<br><br>*BUZZ" Wrong answer! Would you like to go again?<br><br>If people want to remove all the non-GPL software off the CDs ,make<br>copies containing the remainder, and sell CDs of them, fine, go ahead,<br>although people may find it a little difficult to install without YaST!<br><br>You also seem to think that since YaST is on the same CDs as software<br>that is GPL, then YaST must also be GPL - not so in the slightest,<br>please understand what the GPL says and means before you make such<br>assumptions.<br><br>Oh yeah, not to mention all the purely proprietary software on the CDs<br>that is licensed to SuSE for inclusion, under certain terms (which<br>basically boil down to agreeing to them being included on CDs covered by<br>the YaST license I guess )<br><br>On Sun, 2003-04-13 at 13:08, Thomas Jones wrote:<br>> On Sunday 13 April 2003 02:49, James Ogley wrote:<br>> > > Ugh - direct replied again instead of to the list. Sorry for the direct<br>> > > reply James.<br>> ><br>> > No probs - I do it all the time myself ;)<br>> ><br>> > > Fair enough and understood, but honestly if I hadn't bought a copy of<br>> > > 8.1 off of ebay I never would have tried SuSE in the first place. Now<br>> > > that I have, I'll likely purchase 8.2 down the road (although 8.1 with<br>> > > updated xf86 and kde packages works good for me here). I prefer the old<br>> > > "try before you buy" method. It gives me the opportunity to try out a<br>> > > product without locking myself into an investment. Heck, I would have<br>> > > been pretty annoyed if I ever paid for Mandrake. (sorry, I just like to<br>> > > bash Mandrake since I had such a bad time with the distro)<br>> ><br>> > By all means try before you buy, but do it through the legal means - d o<br>> > an FTP install, get hold of the live evaluation CD, or get a gratis CD<br>> > set burnt by someone.<br>> ><br>> > Glad you're a SuSE convert, hope you enjoy your stay :)<br>> <br>> Everyone here should really take the time to read the licensing provided with <br>> the SuSE distribution. <br>> <br>> First, and foremost, the Linux kernel is provided to the masses via the GPL <br>> license. This provides the means for end-users to alter, redistribute, as <br>> they may seem neccessary. This is completely legal.<br>> <br>> Second, SuSE has altered various parts of the kernel to it's liking. Which i <br>> might say, have been very good. However, they too have utilized the GPL <br>> licensing of the linux kernel to their advantage. They are legally authorized <br>> to distribute copies of the kernel for free just as any end-user is. <br>> <br>> Third, the charges that are applied from SuSE (i.e. $80.00 or so for the <br>> professional version) are not for the kernel. It i s for their work in <br>> hacking, altering, configuration, and packaging of everything that comes with <br>> it. Which as you probably already know; is also provided under certain <br>> licensing terms. Mostly GPL as you can imagine. You are simply paying for <br>> their work making it all work together. And publishing those swesome, newbie <br>> configuration manuals and the such!<br>> <br>> Fourth, SuSE has provided their own applications within the distribution. <br>> These also are considered GPL. Anything that is applied to GPL software must <br>> also be held under that same licensing. So, in essence; if i have a program <br>> and need some changes made. I can code the functionality that i need, apply <br>> it to the original and will then be required to provide that "new" <br>> application under the GPL. <br>> <br>> You will notice that there is a BIG stink about these clauses within the <br>> corporate environment. They love the fact that they can utilize GPL softwa re <br>> wihtout any licensing restrictions.........however, if they need to do some <br>> proprietary alterations....they must then provide their proprietary code <br>> under the same license. Hence, they have been slow to jump on the GPL and <br>> Open Source bandwagon.<br>> <br>> I believe in giving back to the community. That is why i started my website; <br>> as well as provided numerous pieces of my own software to the public via the <br>> GPL. So i understand the confusion here. I am an avid SuSE user...i've bought <br>> every version since 7.0....(off the shelf by the way).<br>> <br>> But, users selling the distributions on Ebay are not wrong. They are fully <br>> within their rights to sell their work in providing that software. When you <br>> buy a CD/DVD set from Ebay...you are not paying for the kernel...or it's <br>> secondary applications. You are paying for that persons time and work in <br>> providing that CD or DVD to you. You pay them to burn it for you.. ..and take <br>> the time to mail it to you. That's it! If they state they are selling you the <br>> software itself...WRONG! They then are in breach of the GPL license.<br>> <br>> I know, i know....it's all just wording; but that is the way it is. I don't <br>> fault someone for buying SuSE products off of Ebay. I think that under <br>> certain circumstances it may be a good idea. But i would hope that those <br>> individuals would have the respect and desire to give back to the great Linux <br>> community by purchasing a OTS copy of the distro after they have "<br>> test-driven" it for awhile.<br>-- <br>James Ogley, Webmaster, Rubber Turnip james@rubberturnip.org.uk<br>http://www.rubberturnip.org.uk Jabber: riggwelter@myjabber.net<br>Using Free Software since 1994, running GNU/Linux (SuSE 8.1).<br>GNOME updates for SuSE: http://www.usr-local-bin.org<br><br><br>-- <br>Check the headers for your unsubscription address<br>For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-h elp@suse.com<br>Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com<br>Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com<br><br><br> _______________________________________________ Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com The most personalized portal on the Web!