[SLE] Where to install new programs?
Hello, where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place. George -- My personal website http://www.firstnethou.com/gz/welcome.htm -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Hello, where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
Normally, when it's a compile-yourself program make install installs under /usr/local. This is the best location to place any programs not included in your package. /Mattias -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Mattias Hermansson wrote:
Hello, where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
Normally, when it's a compile-yourself program make install installs under /usr/local. This is the best location to place any programs not included in your package.
That's what I do too, but it's not an entirely satifying solution, particularly when something you've put into /local later appears in a new SuSE distribution. Then you have to get rid of all its droppings, which may be scattered in obscure places hither and yon. Linux software is not strong on uninstall procedures. A better solution is to convert the tarball [tar.gz file] (assuming that's what you got) into an RPM package. Instructions on how to do that have been posted here, and you can probably also figure it out from the RPM How-To. But I'll admit that even though I think that's the right way, I haven't yet taken the time to learn precisely how to do it. If your add-ons are all in the form of rpm packages, you can keep them in one place and then either reinstall them when needed or delete them when they're superseded by something in the latest distribution. Paul Abrahams -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Hello, OK. So when I download tarballs, should I run 'tar xzf' in the /usr/local directory, so that the programs create directories off of this extension, so that I get: /usr/local/tarball_1 /usr/local/tarball_2 /usr/local/tarball_3 Now /usr/local/bin seems to be the place to throw executables. Why? In Win for instance, I preferred that each program had it's own directory. The rpm idea sounds great, but I have a heck of a time just getting the tarballs installed. The README files I've seen are quick paragraphs with "do this" "do that" and "have fun", as if I knew what the heck they were talking about. But that's tangent ranting. Thanks George -- My personal website http://www.firstnethou.com/gz/welcome.ht -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
Hello, OK. So when I download tarballs, should I run 'tar xzf' in the /usr/local directory, so that the programs create directories off of this extension, so that I get: /usr/local/tarball_1 /usr/local/tarball_2 /usr/local/tarball_3
That's reasonable, but over-simplified. Usually, I get applications in source and compile them myself, thereby avoiding complications with poor library compatibility. I have a ~/src directory, and that's where I put my source tarballs. `make install' usually puts things in /usr/local/bin, and I am fine with that. The problem with using `/usr/local/tarball_1' is that for a regular user to use these programs, you would have to either add that location to the users' PATH or make a symlink in /usr/local/bin (which isn't a bad idea at all, assuming that all other environmental/library variables were handled accordingly). For instance, RealPlayerG2 installed to /usr/local/RealPlayerG2, and I created a symlink in /usr/local/bin to make `realplay' more readily accessable.
Now /usr/local/bin seems to be the place to throw executables. Why? In Win for instance, I preferred that each program had it's own directory.
UNIX is not Windows, and Linux isn't, either. UNIX standards point to /bin being the location of binaries needed by root, /sbin being the location of binaries needed by the system or daemons, and /usr/bin and /usr/sbin being the location of binaries everyone needs. /usr/local/bin and /usr/local/sbin were created so that the administrator would have a place to locate the applictions that his user needs, but were not included on the installation medium. /opt was introduced by AT&T some number of years ago for commercial applications, and can be reasonably compaired to C:\Program Files\ on a Windows system. /opt is good for things like KDE, Netscape, and similar commercial/third-party packages. I don't recall the URL (LenZ usuall posts it :( ), but you might want to do some reading on the FHS, or Linux Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. There's probably some useful linkage at http://www.linuxdoc.org.
The rpm idea sounds great, but I have a heck of a time just getting the tarballs installed. The README files I've seen are quick paragraphs with "do this" "do that" and "have fun", as if I knew what the heck they were talking about. But that's tangent ranting.
I've been there, and come back to visit often. ;) -- -=|JP|=- Jon Pennington | Atipa Linux Solutions -o) jpennington@atipa.com | Kansas City, MO /\\ 816-241-2641 x107 | http://www.atipa.com _\_V -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Hi, On Thu, Feb 24, 2000 at 13:50 -0600, Jon Pennington wrote:
I don't recall the URL (LenZ usuall posts it :( ), but you might want to do some reading on the FHS, or Linux Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. There's probably some useful linkage at http://www.linuxdoc.org.
It's in the fhs package as well.
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
The rpm idea sounds great, but I have a heck of a time just getting the tarballs installed. The README files I've seen are quick paragraphs with "do this" "do that" and "have fun", as if I knew what the heck they were talking about. But that's tangent ranting.
Fortunately, most packages make use of autoconf/automake. So it just takes ./configure make make install to get them compiled and installed. To make deinstallation of software you compiled yourself painless, check out instmon: http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/admin/instmon-1.5.tar.gz Instmon monitors the installation process and keeps a list of installed files so they can easily be deleted when needed. Ciao, Stefan -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Il gio, 24 feb 2000, Stefan Troeger ha scritto:
Hi, [...] to get them compiled and installed. To make deinstallation of software you compiled yourself painless, check out instmon:
http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/admin/instmon-1.5.tar.gz
Instmon monitors the installation process and keeps a list of installed files so they can easily be deleted when needed.
Actually there is a new version of instmon (2.0, URL: http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/admin/instmon-2.0.tar.gz) which use the installwatch program written by a friend of mine Pancrazio 'Ezio' De Mauro. This latter program can be downloaded at http://datanord.datanord.it/~pdemauro/installwatch/installwatch-0.5.5.tar.gz Maurizio -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Hi, On Fri, Feb 25, 2000 at 10:08 +0100, Maurizio Firmani wrote:
Actually there is a new version of instmon (2.0, URL: http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/admin/instmon-2.0.tar.gz) which use the installwatch program written by a friend of mine Pancrazio 'Ezio' De Mauro. This latter program can be downloaded at http://datanord.datanord.it/~pdemauro/installwatch/installwatch-0.5.5.tar.gz
Ah, thanks for the pointer. Do you know if there's any important new feature that makes it worth upgrading? Ciao, Stefan -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Ciao,
From man instmon:
" In monitoring mode, instmon has three different methods for detecting changes on the filesystem. These are the following: Find method. This is the only method that existed in instmon 1.x. This method records the time, runs the installation program, and then searches the filesystem with find(1), in order to detect all the files that their status changed after the recorded time. Trace method. When this method is selected, the installa tion program is monitored with strace(1), so all the filesystem-related system calls it makes are trapped and logged. This is much better than the find method, because it detects changes the moment they happen. Watch method. This method uses the installwatch program, written by Pancrazio `Ezio' de Mauro. It is a program which overrides all the system calls that alter the filesystem and provides logging. This is probably the best method, as installwatch is a highly specialized program written specifically for this kind of tasks." Maurizio Il ven, 25 feb 2000, Stefan Troeger ha scritto:
Hi,
On Fri, Feb 25, 2000 at 10:08 +0100, Maurizio Firmani wrote:
Actually there is a new version of instmon (2.0, URL: http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/admin/instmon-2.0.tar.gz) which use the installwatch program written by a friend of mine Pancrazio 'Ezio' De Mauro. This latter program can be downloaded at http://datanord.datanord.it/~pdemauro/installwatch/installwatch-0.5.5.tar.gz
Ah, thanks for the pointer. Do you know if there's any important new feature that makes it worth upgrading?
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Jon Pennington wrote:
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
Hello, OK. So when I download tarballs, should I run 'tar xzf' in the /usr/local directory, so that the programs create directories off of this extension, so that I get: /usr/local/tarball_1 /usr/local/tarball_2 /usr/local/tarball_3
That's reasonable, but over-simplified. Usually, I get applications in source and compile them myself, thereby avoiding complications with poor library compatibility. I have a ~/src directory, and that's where I put my source tarballs. `make install' usually puts things in /usr/local/bin, and I am fine with that. The problem with using `/usr/local/tarball_1' is that for a regular user to use these programs, you would have to either add that location to the users' PATH or make a symlink in /usr/local/bin (which isn't a bad idea at all, assuming that all other environmental/library variables were handled accordingly). For instance, RealPlayerG2 installed to /usr/local/RealPlayerG2, and I created a symlink in /usr/local/bin to make `realplay' more readily accessable.
Now /usr/local/bin seems to be the place to throw executables. Why? In Win for instance, I preferred that each program had it's own directory.
UNIX is not Windows, and Linux isn't, either. UNIX standards point to /bin being the location of binaries needed by root, /sbin being the location of binaries needed by the system or daemons, and /usr/bin and /usr/sbin being the location of binaries everyone needs. /usr/local/bin and /usr/local/sbin were created so that the administrator would have a place to locate the applictions that his user needs, but were not included on the installation medium. /opt was introduced by AT&T some number of years ago for commercial applications, and can be reasonably compaired to C:\Program Files\ on a Windows system. /opt is good for things like KDE, Netscape, and similar commercial/third-party packages.
I don't recall the URL (LenZ usuall posts it :( ), but you might want to do some reading on the FHS, or Linux Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. There's probably some useful linkage at http://www.linuxdoc.org.
The rpm idea sounds great, but I have a heck of a time just getting the tarballs installed. The README files I've seen are quick paragraphs with "do this" "do that" and "have fun", as if I knew what the heck they were talking about. But that's tangent ranting.
I usually get applications in source form and copy then to the /working directory (for root type things, like new qt, etc.) or to ~/working for more mundane things. I do the untarring and compilation there. Ususally when you do a make install, it will copy the necessary files to /usr/local, and if it doesn't I sometimes do it by hand. I put commercial apps or big things in /opt (e.g. OSS, Netscape, SO, WP, ...). Just my thoughts, Chris -- __ _ -o)/ / (_)__ __ ____ __ Chris Reeves /\\ /__/ / _ \/ // /\ \/ / ICQ# 22219005 _\_v __/_/_//_/\_,_/ /_/\_\ -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
Hello, whoa! Lot of feedback. Unfortunately, I am having a hard time following. Here are some more questions: Thu, 24 Feb 2000, ÷Ù ÎÁÐÉÓÁÌÉ:
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
Hello, OK. So when I download tarballs, should I run 'tar xzf' in the /usr/local directory, so that the programs create directories off of this extension, so that I get: /usr/local/tarball_1 /usr/local/tarball_2 /usr/local/tarball_3
That's reasonable, but over-simplified. What does that mean? They are simply directories in which I do the make install, thus throwing the executable into the bin, and keeping the other files nice and neat in their respective directories. What' wrong with that?
Usually, I get applications in source and compile them myself, thereby avoiding complications with poor library compatibility. I have a ~/src directory, and that's where I put my source tarballs. OK. But what do you have after source, since untarring creates directories like ~/src/tarball_1 ~/src/tarball_2 etc Seems like the same method as I suggest, just in a different place.
`make install' usually puts things in /usr/local/bin, and I am fine with that. The problem with using `/usr/local/tarball_1' is that for a regular user to use these programs, you would have to either add that location to the users' PATH or make a symlink in /usr/local/bin (which isn't a bad idea at all, assuming that all other environmental/library variables were handled accordingly). You lost me here. Why would a regular user have problems with my method of /usr/local/tarball_1, etc? And why does your method ~/src directory not have the problems your referring to. What enables you to not add location to users PATH and make symlinks. Does it have something to do with the owner and group permissions of the directories. And what are your directories before usr "src" directory. I would rather avoid this symbolic link stuff your talking about, since I have never set one before in my life. Does this symlink stuff have to do with my not doing my untarring off of the /usr directory?
Maybe you misunderstood me. When I untar a file, I do it in /usr/local . This creates the following directory /usr/local/tarball_1 for instance. Then when I do the make install , it throws the executable into the /usr/local/bin directory. But I would still have the /usr/local/tarball_1 directory in case I ever wanted to do make uninstall . Besides, aren't there files in the /usr/local/tarball_1 directory which the executable will need to use? I know it's a lot of questions. Thanks George -- My personal website http://www.firstnethou.com/gz/welcome.htm -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
Besides, aren't there files in the /usr/local/tarball_1 directory which the executable will need to use?
Okay, George, we're getting there ;). The process is like this... I (as a user) download whizbang-0.98a.tar.bz2 into my home directory. In my home directory (or anywhere else, for that matter), I quickly `tar xIvf whizbang-0.98a.tar.bz2', which creates /home/luser/whizbang-0.89a/. I can then cd into ~/whizbang-0.98a/ and configure and build the source into something usable. When I su and `make install', all of the binaries go to /usr/local/bin, and libraries go to /usr/local/lib, and shared files go to /usr/local/share. After that, I can `rm -rf ~/whizbang-0.98a/' without any fear of doing any damage. This entire thread has been based on the assumption on my part that you have been installing the *final* binaries in /usr/local/whizbang-98a/, which you clearly are not. ;) Sorry for the confusion. -- -=|JP|=- Jon Pennington | Atipa Linux Solutions -o) jpennington@atipa.com | Kansas City, MO /\\ 816-241-2641 x107 | http://www.atipa.com _\_V -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote: gz> Hello, gz> OK. So when I download tarballs, should I run 'tar xzf' in the gz> /usr/local directory, so that the programs create directories off of this gz> extension, so that I get: gz> /usr/local/tarball_1 gz> /usr/local/tarball_2 gz> /usr/local/tarball_3 gz> gz> gz> Now /usr/local/bin seems to be the place to throw executables. Why? gz> In Win for instance, I preferred that each program had it's own directory. gz> gz> The rpm idea sounds great, but I have a heck of a time just getting the gz> tarballs installed. The README files I've seen are quick paragraphs with "do gz> this" "do that" and "have fun", as if I knew what the heck they were talking gz> about. But that's tangent ranting. gz> Well, you can always install them into their own respective directories, then create a symlink within /usr/local/bin just remember its there if you ever change the orioginal in some way. gz> Thanks gz> George gz> -- My personal website gz> http://www.firstnethou.com/gz/welcome.ht gz> gz> gz> -- S.Toms - tomas@primenet.com - www.primenet.com/~tomas SuSE Linux v6.3+ - Kernel 2.2.14 Simon's Law: Everything put together falls apart sooner or later. -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, George Zeigler wrote:
Hello, where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
A well-made source tarball will install its files to /usr/local/. If it's going somewhere else, contact the maintainer and notify him/her that they're violating your disk ;). -- -=|JP|=- Jon Pennington | Atipa Linux Solutions -o) jpennington@atipa.com | Kansas City, MO /\\ 816-241-2641 x107 | http://www.atipa.com _\_V -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
genz1968@mtu-net.ru writes:
Hello, where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
George
I usually put my new stuff in /opt which is on it's own partition. L8R -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
"Ian M. Moore" wrote:
genz1968@mtu-net.ru writes:
where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
I usually put my new stuff in /opt which is on it's own partition.
Why do you use /opt rather than /local? If you use /local for something else, how do you distinguish between stuff that goes in /local and stuff that goes in /opt? Paul Abrahams -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
abrahams@acm.org writes:
Why do you use /opt rather than /local? If you use /local for something else, how do you distinguish between stuff that goes in /local and stuff that goes in /opt?
Paul Abrahams
I use both if i download a file say Star Office or OSS_SMP or something like that I just toss it in opt. I have done that since I started using linux and haven't had a problem. If this is improper I wish someone would let me know but if it works why change. Mainly I put files I download in there and if for some reason like a sys upgrade or a freak accident I still have my files in /opt. "A well-made source tarball will install its files to /usr/local/." Jon Pennington L8R Ian -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
I tend to put certain things in /usr/local like GNU software and commercial software goes in /opt. I guess this stems from my years of Solaris use. Solaris usually puts new software packages in /opt so I just got use to it...it's what /opt is for or so I am told. just my 0.02 "Paul W. Abrahams" wrote:
"Ian M. Moore" wrote:
genz1968@mtu-net.ru writes:
where you guys installing new programs that your download off the net? I would like to keep mine in one area, but haven't a clue where is a good place.
I usually put my new stuff in /opt which is on it's own partition.
Why do you use /opt rather than /local? If you use /local for something else, how do you distinguish between stuff that goes in /local and stuff that goes in /opt?
-- Ben Rosenberg mailto:ben@whack.org SuSE Linux 6.3 (2.2.14) ICQ UIN:49268667 ------------------------------------------------------------ " Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom " --Gen. George Patton -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/
participants (10)
-
abrahams＠valinet.com -
ben＠whack.org -
chris.reeves＠iname.com -
genz1968＠mtu-net.ru -
imm＠KidsCare.Net -
jpennington＠atipa.com -
mattias＠hemmet.chalmers.se -
maurizio＠adriatico.prisma.rm.cnr.it -
stefan.troeger＠wirtschaft.tu-chemnitz.de -
tomas＠primenet.com