Hi folks, I am looking to start learning java programming , and have been wondering about both jbuilder from borlanmd and visialage from ibm. I know that borland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop. So as a novice leval programmer wnating to jump intpo java and who will be learing it from the start which is mpore suited to this situation ? I mainlly what to make a few databse apps and was leaning towards borland duento there data source type components. Do they both work well with postgress amnd other open source simple sql databses ? Like I said I am somewhere betrwwen newbie and novicee on the experiance scale and have mostly worked with application generates which I have found to be lacking when you need to make them do what yoiu want and not what they do want. I have also dablled with and made a few delphi apps as well. Delphi I realy like but its not out on Linux yet. I was aslo looking to Python/gaby but its only text based and there were not printing tools foe gaby and that rout would seem to meen hand coding evertthing as opesed to an ide/component level type tool like jbuilder/visualage that can be dropped and modified to what you want. Feel free to correct me on the python thing maybe I over looked somthing ? -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
Samy Elashmawy wrote:
Hi folks,
I am looking to start learning java programming , and have been wondering about both jbuilder from borlanmd and visialage from ibm. I know that borland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop.
I was aslo looking to Python/gaby but its only text based and there were not printing tools foe gaby and that rout would seem to meen hand coding evertthing as opesed to an ide/component level type tool like jbuilder/visualage that can be dropped and modified to what you want. Feel free to correct me on the python thing maybe I over looked somthing ?
I havn't tried it, but Python has a couple of IDE's going. One is listed at python.org, and the other is called BOA and is listed on freshmeat. BOA seemed to look like Visual Basic in it's screenshots. -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
orland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop.
I was aslo looking to Python/gaby but its only text based and there were not printing tools foe gaby and that rout would seem to meen hand coding evertthing as opesed to an ide/component level type tool like jbuilder/visualage that can be dropped and modified to what you want. Feel free to correct me on the python thing maybe I over looked somthing ?
Shucks I havve been all over www.python.org and could not find any , Will go back and look for it or soem refrence to it. Hope some one will stumble on the thread who has used any of these.
I havn't tried it, but Python has a couple of IDE's going. One is listed at python.org, and the other is called BOA and is listed on freshmeat. BOA seemed to look like Visual Basic in it's screenshots.
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Samy Elashmawy wrote:
orland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop.
Shucks I havve been all over www.python.org and could not find any , Will go back and look for it or soem refrence to it.
Hope some one will stumble on the thread who has used any of these.
I havn't tried it, but Python has a couple of IDE's going. One is listed at python.org, and the other is called BOA and is listed on freshmeat. BOA seemed to look like Visual Basic in it's screenshots.
Samy et al,
I've been using the Python IDE (called Idle). It is quite good, but
lacks some of the features (like dot-notation) of the Win version
(called PythonWin).
As well as teaching at the local TAFE College, I'm also studying
programming. We started with VB (sorry!), then went on to Python. As a
language, I have to say that Python is by far the better of the two,
though VB has the RAD part down to a tee. I read an interesting quote
the other day about VB - " It creates average programmers. Anyone with a
minimum of ability can build an average program with it, but someone
with far greater ability is restricted to building average programs by
the inherent limitations built into it."
I'll take "the Snake" anyday!
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SQIT Warwick
At 08:07 PM 10/24/2000 +1000, Don Hansford wrote:
Samy Elashmawy wrote:
orland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop.
Shucks I havve been all over www.python.org and could not find any , Will go back and look for it or soem refrence to it.
Hope some one will stumble on the thread who has used any of these.
I havn't tried it, but Python has a couple of IDE's going. One is listed at python.org, and the other is called BOA and is listed on freshmeat. BOA seemed to look like Visual Basic in it's screenshots.
Samy et al, I've been using the Python IDE (called Idle). It is quite good, but lacks some of the features (like dot-notation) of the Win version (called PythonWin). As well as teaching at the local TAFE College, I'm also studying programming. We started with VB (sorry!), then went on to Python. As a language, I have to say that Python is by far the better of the two, though VB has the RAD part down to a tee. I read an interesting quote the other day about VB - " It creates average programmers. Anyone with a minimum of ability can build an average program with it, but someone with far greater ability is restricted to building average programs by the inherent limitations built into it." I'll take "the Snake" anyday!
what I found lacking in python is that it lacks xwin suport , database dooks and mosltly component based aproach , hence I am leaning to java / jbuilder as its rad , and just drop and connect components ect.. It is a little more involved than say pyhthon but is a real rad tool. I am realy short on time as well , and figure I can carry most of what I learn to c/c++ if I ever want to go down that raod.
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Hi, On Tue, Oct 24 2000 at 14:42 +0000, Samy Elashmawy wrote:
what I found lacking in python is that it lacks xwin suport , database
Python supports TK, Gtk, Qt, WxWindows, Fltk and a few more GUI toolkits. Database interfaces exist as well. See http://www.vex.net/parnassus/ Ciao, Stefan -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
At 02:17 AM 10/25/2000 +0200, Stefan Troeger wrote:
Hi,
On Tue, Oct 24 2000 at 14:42 +0000, Samy Elashmawy wrote:
what I found lacking in python is that it lacks xwin suport , database
TK , GTK , ect... These are plugins/interface tie ins right ? Means you need to learn TK and GTK ot TCL/TK to use them with Python ? Right? Same with the Databaase hooks . Gaby looked interesting but is still a bit cryptic to me , and I was REALY disapionted on its lack of printing ability. There was just no easy way for a beginer to deal with printing/reporting. What I do like about Jbuilder is the component way of dropping them , hooking them together and modifieng the code when needed. Borlands back and forth technology between the visual tools and the editer being two ways is realy super. I have used delphi and am realy itching for kylx. So far Jbuilder has been the closest.
Python supports TK, Gtk, Qt, WxWindows, Fltk and a few more GUI toolkits. Database interfaces exist as well. See http://www.vex.net/parnassus/
Ciao, Stefan
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TK , GTK , ect... These are plugins/interface tie ins right ? Means you need to learn TK and GTK ot TCL/TK to use them with Python ? Right?
Same with the Databaase hooks . Gaby looked interesting but is still a bit cryptic to me , and I was REALY disapionted on its lack of printing ability. There was just no easy way for a beginer to deal with printing/reporting.
What I do like about Jbuilder is the component way of dropping them , hooking them together and modifieng the code when needed. Borlands back and forth technology between the visual tools and the editer being two ways is realy super. I have used delphi and am realy itching for kylx. So far Jbuilder has been the closest.
I agree. For major tasks in a short time-span (aren't they all?), Python
still needs some development in the RAD area. However, the amount of
development going on in this area is staggering. I would hazard a guess
that in six months time, you will face an even tougher choice as to
which language to use. Use the tools that do the job, that's the name of
the game. (But keep an eye out for "the Snake").
:-)
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Regards Don Hansford
ECKYTECH COMPUTING/
SQIT Warwick
At 05:54 AM 10/26/2000 +1000, Don Hansford wrote:
TK , GTK , ect... These are plugins/interface tie ins right ? Means you need to learn TK and GTK ot TCL/TK to use them with Python ? Right?
Same with the Databaase hooks . Gaby looked interesting but is still a bit cryptic to me , and I was REALY disapionted on its lack of printing ability. There was just no easy way for a beginer to deal with printing/reporting.
What I do like about Jbuilder is the component way of dropping them , hooking them together and modifieng the code when needed. Borlands back and forth technology between the visual tools and the editer being two ways is realy super. I have used delphi and am realy itching for kylx. So far Jbuilder has been the closest.
I will agree that there is a whole lot of stuff coming down the pipe line , but t hat does not help me today. I would venrture tosay that the only rad tools are jbuilder , visualage and omnis for linux. The Omnis language is just to propitery as far as I am concerned even considering its gotten top reviews. So thaat leaves the java tools which at least I can carry with me to c/c++. I would like to see python with a case statement and more typical / traditioand type styntax ie function/methed start with and _ kind of funy , and a morerad type visual componet architecture would be neet. Kylx would be nice too <>
I agree. For major tasks in a short time-span (aren't they all?), Python still needs some development in the RAD area. However, the amount of development going on in this area is staggering. I would hazard a guess that in six months time, you will face an even tougher choice as to which language to use. Use the tools that do the job, that's the name of the game. (But keep an eye out for "the Snake").
:-)
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Regards Don Hansford ECKYTECH COMPUTING/ SQIT Warwick
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Hi, On Wed, Oct 25 2000 at 06:07 +0000, Samy Elashmawy wrote:
TK , GTK , ect... These are plugins/interface tie ins right ? Means you need to learn TK and GTK ot TCL/TK to use them with Python ? Right?
Right. But isn't this true for every language feature you want to use? Ciao, Stefan -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
At 04:50 PM 10/26/2000 +0200, Stefan Troeger wrote:
Hi,
On Wed, Oct 25 2000 at 06:07 +0000, Samy Elashmawy wrote:
TK , GTK , ect... These are plugins/interface tie ins right ? Means you need to learn TK and GTK ot TCL/TK to use them with Python ? Right?
Right. But isn't this true for every language feature you want to use?
No what I was getting to is that each of these are third party scripting languages , each with a diffrent syntax/language model , and each requiring to some how add in a third party libray and sepereate third party wrapper to interface with python. where as with delphi or java , you just suck in a library or drop a component , and deal with itn in delphi/pascal or java code.
Ciao, Stefan
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Samy Elashmawy wrote:
At 04:50 PM 10/26/2000 +0200, Stefan Troeger wrote:
Hi,
On Wed, Oct 25 2000 at 06:07 +0000, Samy Elashmawy wrote:
No what I was getting to is that each of these are third party scripting languages , each with a diffrent syntax/language model , and each requiring to some how add in a third party libray and sepereate third party wrapper to interface with python.
Hey Samy, this new Python ide just popped up on Freshmeat.net, check it out. http://archaeopteryx.com/wingide/ -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
Samy Elashmawy wrote:
Shucks I havve been all over www.python.org and could not find any , Will go back and look for it or soem refrence to it.
Hope some one will stumble on the thread who has used any of these.
On python.org click on the link to IDLE For BOA go to www.freshmeat.net and search for BOA -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq
I use VA at work and home. VA is the only java environment that I have
experience with, that being said. I have found it very easy to pickup and
use. The only real problem that I have run into is trying to create data
beans off a mySQL db, but other than that it has worked great. VA is a
resource hog though.
-trjl
----- Original Message -----
From: "Samy Elashmawy"
Hi folks,
I am looking to start learning java programming , and have been wondering about both jbuilder from borlanmd and visialage from ibm. I know that borland is a "programmers" shop while ibm is more of a corperate shop.
So as a novice leval programmer wnating to jump intpo java and who will be learing it from the start which is mpore suited to this situation ? I mainlly what to make a few databse apps and was leaning towards borland duento there data source type components. Do they both work well with postgress amnd other open source simple sql databses ?
Like I said I am somewhere betrwwen newbie and novicee on the experiance scale and have mostly worked with application generates which I have found to be lacking when you need to make them do what yoiu want and not what they do want. I have also dablled with and made a few delphi apps as well. Delphi I realy like but its not out on Linux yet.
I was aslo looking to Python/gaby but its only text based and there were not printing tools foe gaby and that rout would seem to meen hand coding evertthing as opesed to an ide/component level type tool like jbuilder/visualage that can be dropped and modified to what you want. Feel free to correct me on the python thing maybe I over looked somthing ?
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participants (5)
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donh＠halenet.com.au -
samelash＠ix.netcom.com -
stefan.troeger＠wirtschaft.tu-chemnitz.de -
suselinux＠bugboysworld.com -
zentara＠gypsyfarm.com