xawtv and frequencies

Constant Brouerius van Nidek

29 Nov 2001 29 Nov '01

14:03

I have the latest stable xawtv installed on my Suse 7.2. Does somebody know why there are only two frequency lists in the xawtv package and where they are used for. The choices in xawtv are 3 cable and 12 broadcast ranges. Does xawtv uses these frequency ranges? Is the sound frequency always a certain value away from the image frequency and would playing around with sound frequency in such a list influence the sound reception, in other words, could I get sound by playing around with the distance between the two frequencies? At the moment I have a good image but the sound is some 20 ticks away from the accompanying picture.

Show replies by date

Geoff

29 Nov 29 Nov

14:43

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

On Thu, 29 Nov 2001 21:03:04 +0700 Constant Brouerius van Nidek wrote:

...

I have the latest stable xawtv installed on my Suse 7.2. Does somebody know why there are only two frequency lists in the xawtv package and where they are used for. The choices in xawtv are 3 cable and 12 broadcast ranges. Does xawtv uses these frequency ranges? Is the sound frequency always a certain value away from the image frequency and would playing around with sound frequency in such a list influence the sound reception, in other words, could I get sound by playing around with the distance between the two frequencies? At the moment I have a good image but the sound is some 20 ticks away from the accompanying picture.

Constant, I am afraid that I may not be able to help very much this time, but I am curious about your problem. I suppose that you are running xawtv 3.65 which was released a couple of days ago. I just downloaded and installed it, as I have for about the last 10 revisions (I have been using xawtv every day for more than a year). It runs perfectly and I have never had any problems at all with sound. May I ask: (1) did you run the scantv utility to set up your xawtv config? : (2) can you include your config in a post for us to look at -or email it to me if you prefer? Geoff _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Doug McGarrett

30 Nov 30 Nov

00:09

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

...

I have the latest stable xawtv installed on my Suse 7.2. Does somebody know why there are only two frequency lists in the xawtv package and where they are used for. The choices in xawtv are 3 cable and 12 broadcast ranges. Does xawtv uses these frequency ranges? Is the sound frequency always a certain value away from the image frequency and would playing around with sound frequency in such a list influence the sound reception, in other words, could I get sound by playing around with

Forgive me if I don't understand the question, since I am not familiar with xawtv. However, I am somewhat familiar with TV. In the US, the sound carrier is always exactly 4.5 MHz above the picture carrier. In Europe, they use a different number, but I don't have the information at my fingertips. (I may have it at work. If you need to know the values, I will look, just ask. You will get an answer no later than Monday, assuming I have the information.) OTOH, the information is surely on the 'Net. Try "sound carrier" on Google and see what it brings. BTW, don't use the expression "image frequency" to mean the freq of the picture carrier. "Image frequency" has a specific meaning in the RF world, and has to do with superheterodyne systems. --doug At 21:03 11/29/2001 +0700, Constant Brouerius van Nidek wrote: the

...

distance between the two frequencies? At the moment I have a good image but the sound is some 20 ticks away from the accompanying picture.

-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com

...

Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and the archives at http://lists.suse.com

Geoff

07:44

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

On Thu, 29 Nov 2001 19:09:07 -0500 Doug McGarrett wrote:

...

Forgive me if I don't understand the question, since I am not familiar with xawtv. However, I am somewhat familiar with TV. In the US, the sound carrier is always exactly 4.5 MHz above the picture carrier. In Europe, they use a different number, but I don't have the information at my fingertips. (I may have it at work. If you need to know the values, I will look, just ask. You will get an answer no later than Monday, assuming I have the information.) OTOH, the information is surely on the 'Net. Try "sound carrier" on Google and see what it brings.

BTW, don't use the expression "image frequency" to mean the freq of the picture carrier. "Image frequency" has a specific meaning in the RF world, and has to do with superheterodyne systems.

Doug, No doubt Constant will provide more information in due course, but FWIW so far as I can see there is no ability in xawtv to tune the sound frequency separately from the picture carrier. There is the usual ability to fine-tune what I will call the overall frequency (-128 or +127), and that can affect the quality of sound, but I am not aware of anything else. There is a choice from 16 frequency tables, including various cable options and the europe-west that I use. There is also a choice from several TV-norm settings, including the various PALs NTSC and SECAM. The config file is in simple form. I am including mine below. Regards, Geoff [global] freqtab = europe-west pixsize = 128 x 96 pixcols = 1 jpeg-quality = 75 mjpeg-quality = 75 toggle-mouse = 0 keypad-ntsc = no osd = yes # [Station name] # capture = overlay | grabdisplay | on | off # input = Television | Composite1 | S-Video | ... # norm = PAL | NTSC | SECAM | ... # channel = # # fine = # (-128..+127) # key = keysym | modifier+keysym # color = # # bright = # # hue = # # contrast = # [defaults] norm = PAL capture = grabdisplay input = Television [C5] channel = 48 [BBC2] channel = 62 fine = -5 [ITV] channel = 59 [C4] channel = 65 [BBC1] channel = 55 contrast = 40% _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Constant Brouerius van Nidek

13:33

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

On Friday 30 November 2001 14:44, you wrote:

...

On Thu, 29 Nov 2001 19:09:07 -0500

Doug McGarrett wrote:

...
Forgive me if I don't understand the question, since I am not familiar with xawtv. However, I am somewhat familiar with TV. In the US, the sound carrier is always exactly 4.5 MHz above the picture carrier. In Europe, they use a different number, but I don't have the information

...

Doug,

No doubt Constant will provide more information in due course, but FWIW so far as I can see there is no ability in xawtv to tune the sound frequency separately from the picture carrier. There is the usual ability to fine-tune what I will call the overall frequency (-128 or +127), and that can affect the quality of sound, but I am not aware of anything else.

There is a choice from 16 frequency tables, including various cable options and the europe-west that I use. There is also a choice from several TV-norm settings, including the various PALs NTSC and SECAM.

The config file is in simple form. I am including mine below.

Dear Doug, dear Geof, If the sound carrier in the USA is always 4,5 mHz from the picture carrier and in Europe it is different, than xawtv must have some information as to where the sound should be as you are able to make a choice between USA Europe, Australia and many others. So I had the hope that the distance between the two could be adjusted manually ;-(. By the way, in what mHz reach I would find UHF-H because I am still missing two stations in my silent TV ;-).

Geoff

13:57

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

On Fri, 30 Nov 2001 20:33:36 +0700 Constant Brouerius van Nidek wrote:

...

...
Dear Doug, dear Geof, If the sound carrier in the USA is always 4,5 mHz from the picture carrier and in Europe it is different, than xawtv must have some information as to where the sound should be as you are able to make a choice between USA Europe, Australia and many others. So I had the hope that the distance between the two could be adjusted manually ;-(. By the way, in what mHz reach I would find UHF-H because I am still missing two stations in my silent TV ;-).

Hello Constant, As I have implied in my earlier posts, I am out of my depth here, but curious (which is sometimes a dangerous condition to be in ;-) I have, however, been digging around in the sources, which you will have but Doug does not. I am therefore going to quote the full text of frequencies.h below, because it may give Doug a hint as to what you might do. I apologise to those not following this thread for the length of this post. Regards, Geoff /* * Worldwide channel/frequency list * * Nathan Laredo (laredo@broked.net) * * Frequencies are given in kHz */ #define NTSC_AUDIO_CARRIER 4500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_I 6000 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_BGHN 5500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_MN 4500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_D 6500 #define SEACAM_AUDIO_DKK1L 6500 #define SEACAM_AUDIO_BG 5500 /* NICAM 728 32-kHz, 14-bit digital stereo audio is transmitted in 1ms frames containing 8 bits frame sync, 5 bits control, 11 bits additional data, and 704 bits audio data. The bit rate is reduced by transmitting only 10 bits plus parity of each 14 bit sample, the largest sample in a frame determines which 10 bits are transmitted. The parity bits for audio samples also specify the scaling factor used for that channel during that frame. The companeded audio data is interleaved to reduce the influence of dropouts and the whole frame except for sync bits is scrambled for spectrum shaping. Data is modulated using QPSK, at below following subcarrier freqs */ #define NICAM728_PAL_BGH 5850 #define NICAM728_PAL_I 6552 /* COMPREHENSIVE LIST OF FORMAT BY COUNTRY (M) NTSC used in: Antigua, Aruba, Bahamas, Barbados, Belize, Bermuda, Bolivia, Burma, Canada, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, Cuba, Curacao, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, El Salvador, Guam Guatemala, Honduras, Jamaica, Japan, South Korea, Mexico, Montserrat, Myanmar, Nicaragua, Panama, Peru, Philippines, Puerto Rico, St Christopher and Nevis, Samoa, Suriname, Taiwan, Trinidad/Tobago, United States, Venezuela, Virgin Islands (B) PAL used in: Albania, Algeria, Australia, Austria, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belgium, Bosnia-Herzegovinia, Brunei Darussalam, Cambodia, Cameroon, Croatia, Cyprus, Denmark, Egypt, Ethiopia, Equatorial Guinea, Finland, Germany, Ghana, Gibraltar, Greenland, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Kenya, Kuwait, Liberia, Libya, Luxembourg, Malaysa, Maldives, Malta, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zeland, Nigeria, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Papua New Guinea, Portugal, Qatar, Sao Tome and Principe, Saudi Arabia, Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovenia, Somali, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzeland, Syria, Thailand, Tunisia, Turkey, Uganda, United Arab Emirates, Yemen (N) PAL used in: (Combination N = 4.5MHz audio carrier, 3.58MHz burst) Argentina (Combination N), Paraguay, Uruguay (M) PAL (525/60, 3.57MHz burst) used in: Brazil (G) PAL used in: Albania, Algeria, Austria, Bahrain, Bosnia/Herzegovinia, Cambodia, Cameroon, Croatia, Cyprus, Denmark, Egypt, Ethiopia, Equatorial Guinea, Finland, Germany, Gibraltar, Greenland, Iceland, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Kenya, Kuwait, Liberia, Libya, Luxembourg, Malaysia, Monaco, Mozambique, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Papa New Guinea, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovenia, Somalia, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Swaziland, Sweeden, Switzerland, Syria, Thailand, Tunisia, Turkey, United Arab Emirates, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe (D) PAL used in: China, North Korea, Romania, Czech Republic (H) PAL used in: Belgium (I) PAL used in: Angola, Botswana, Gambia, Guinea-Bissau, Hong Kong, Ireland, Lesotho, Malawi, Nambia, Nigeria, South Africa, Tanzania, United Kingdom, Zanzibar (B) SECAM used in: Djibouti, Greece, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Mali, Mauritania, Mauritus, Morocco (D) SECAM used in: Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Bulgaria, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Zazakhstan, Lithuania, Mongolia, Moldova, Russia, Slovak Republic, Ukraine, Vietnam (G) SECAM used in: Greecem Iran, Iraq, Mali, Mauritus, Morocco, Saudi Arabia (K) SECAM used in: Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bulgaria, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Kazakhstan, Lithuania, Madagascar, Moldova, Poland, Russia, Slovak Republic, Ukraine, Vietnam (K1) SECAM used in: Benin, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Chad, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Comoros, Congo, Gabon, Madagascar, Niger, Rwanda, Senegal, Togo, Zaire (L) SECAM used in: France */ /* --------------------------------------------------------------------- */ struct CHANLIST { char *name; int freq; }; struct CHANLISTS { char *name; struct CHANLIST *list; int count; }; #define CHAN_COUNT(x) (sizeof(x)/sizeof(struct CHANLIST)) /* --------------------------------------------------------------------- */ extern struct CHANLISTS chanlists[]; extern struct STRTAB chanlist_names[]; extern int chantab; extern struct CHANLIST *chanlist; extern int chancount; _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

Doug McGarrett

1 Dec 1 Dec

00:09

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

I hate to requote a large post like this, but I think I should, in this case. It would appear to me, from the #define statements, that the audio carrier (what we usually call the "sound carrier" here in the States) is either 4.5 MHz, 5.5 MHz, 6.0 Mhz, or 6.5 MHz above the picture carrier. The frequencies are #define'd in KHz, which is 1/1000 of MHz. (You guys in Europe, etc. all understand Kilo and Mega and so on, anyway.) I am not good at all with ASCII graphics, or I would illustrate what I'm writing about. It would take about 10 lines, and I'd never get it right. NTSC is what we use in the US, and as you can see by the list below, other places. Europeans like to say that NTSC means "Never The Same Color." But it works pretty well in modern sets. --doug At 13:57 11/30/2001 +0000, Geoff wrote:

...

On Fri, 30 Nov 2001 20:33:36 +0700 Constant Brouerius van Nidek wrote:

...
...
Dear Doug, dear Geof, If the sound carrier in the USA is always 4,5 mHz from the picture carrier and in Europe it is different, than xawtv must have some information as to where the sound should be as you are able to make a choice between USA Europe, Australia and many others. So I had the hope that the distance between the two could be adjusted manually ;-(. By the way, in what mHz reach I would find UHF-H because I am still missing two stations in my silent TV ;-).

Hello Constant,

As I have implied in my earlier posts, I am out of my depth here, but curious (which is sometimes a dangerous condition to be in ;-) I have, however, been digging around in the sources, which you will have but Doug does not. I am therefore going to quote the full text of frequencies.h below, because it may give Doug a hint as to what you might do. I apologise to those not following this thread for the length of this post.

Regards,

Geoff

/* * Worldwide channel/frequency list * * Nathan Laredo (laredo@broked.net) * * Frequencies are given in kHz */ #define NTSC_AUDIO_CARRIER 4500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_I 6000 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_BGHN 5500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_MN 4500 #define PAL_AUDIO_CARRIER_D 6500 #define SEACAM_AUDIO_DKK1L 6500 #define SEACAM_AUDIO_BG 5500 /* NICAM 728 32-kHz, 14-bit digital stereo audio is transmitted in 1ms frames containing 8 bits frame sync, 5 bits control, 11 bits additional data, and 704 bits audio data. The bit rate is reduced by transmitting only 10 bits plus parity of each 14 bit sample, the largest sample in a frame determines which 10 bits are transmitted. The parity bits for audio samples also specify the scaling factor used for that channel during that frame. The companeded audio data is interleaved to reduce the influence of dropouts and the whole frame except for sync bits is scrambled for spectrum shaping. Data is modulated using QPSK, at below following subcarrier freqs */ #define NICAM728_PAL_BGH 5850 #define NICAM728_PAL_I 6552

/* COMPREHENSIVE LIST OF FORMAT BY COUNTRY (M) NTSC used in: Antigua, Aruba, Bahamas, Barbados, Belize, Bermuda, Bolivia, Burma, Canada, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, Cuba, Curacao, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, El Salvador, Guam Guatemala, Honduras, Jamaica, Japan, South Korea, Mexico, Montserrat, Myanmar, Nicaragua, Panama, Peru, Philippines, Puerto Rico, St Christopher and Nevis, Samoa, Suriname, Taiwan, Trinidad/Tobago, United States, Venezuela, Virgin Islands (B) PAL used in: Albania, Algeria, Australia, Austria, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belgium, Bosnia-Herzegovinia, Brunei Darussalam, Cambodia, Cameroon, Croatia, Cyprus, Denmark, Egypt, Ethiopia, Equatorial Guinea, Finland, Germany, Ghana, Gibraltar, Greenland, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Kenya, Kuwait, Liberia, Libya, Luxembourg, Malaysa, Maldives, Malta, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zeland, Nigeria, Norway, Oman, Pakistan,

...

Papua New Guinea, Portugal, Qatar, Sao Tome and Principe, Saudi Arabia, Seychelles, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovenia, Somali, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Swaziland, Sweden, Switzeland, Syria, Thailand, Tunisia, Turkey, Uganda, United Arab Emirates, Yemen (N) PAL used in: (Combination N = 4.5MHz audio carrier, 3.58MHz burst) Argentina (Combination N), Paraguay, Uruguay (M) PAL (525/60, 3.57MHz burst) used in: Brazil (G) PAL used in: Albania, Algeria, Austria, Bahrain, Bosnia/Herzegovinia, Cambodia, Cameroon, Croatia, Cyprus, Denmark, Egypt, Ethiopia, Equatorial Guinea, Finland, Germany, Gibraltar, Greenland, Iceland, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Kenya, Kuwait, Liberia, Libya, Luxembourg, Malaysia, Monaco, Mozambique, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Papa New Guinea, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Slovenia, Somalia, Spain, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Swaziland, Sweeden, Switzerland, Syria, Thailand, Tunisia, Turkey, United Arab Emirates, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe (D) PAL used in: China, North Korea, Romania, Czech Republic (H) PAL used in: Belgium (I) PAL used in: Angola, Botswana, Gambia, Guinea-Bissau, Hong Kong, Ireland, Lesotho, Malawi, Nambia, Nigeria, South Africa, Tanzania, United Kingdom, Zanzibar (B) SECAM used in: Djibouti, Greece, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Mali, Mauritania, Mauritus, Morocco (D) SECAM used in: Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Bulgaria, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Zazakhstan, Lithuania, Mongolia, Moldova, Russia, Slovak Republic, Ukraine, Vietnam (G) SECAM used in: Greecem Iran, Iraq, Mali, Mauritus, Morocco, Saudi Arabia (K) SECAM used in: Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bulgaria, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Kazakhstan, Lithuania, Madagascar, Moldova, Poland, Russia, Slovak Republic, Ukraine, Vietnam (K1) SECAM used in: Benin, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Chad, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Comoros, Congo, Gabon, Madagascar, Niger, Rwanda, Senegal, Togo, Zaire (L) SECAM used in: France */

/* --------------------------------------------------------------------- */

struct CHANLIST { char *name; int freq; };

struct CHANLISTS { char *name; struct CHANLIST *list; int count; };

#define CHAN_COUNT(x) (sizeof(x)/sizeof(struct CHANLIST))

/* --------------------------------------------------------------------- */

extern struct CHANLISTS chanlists[]; extern struct STRTAB chanlist_names[];

extern int chantab; extern struct CHANLIST *chanlist; extern int chancount;

_________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com

...

Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and the archives at http://lists.suse.com

Geoff

11:08

New subject: [SLE] xawtv and frequencies

On Fri, 30 Nov 2001 19:09:43 -0500 Doug McGarrett wrote:

...

I hate to requote a large post like this, but I think I should, in this case. It would appear to me, from the #define statements, that the audio carrier (what we usually call the "sound carrier" here in the States) is either 4.5 MHz, 5.5 MHz, 6.0 Mhz, or 6.5 MHz above the picture carrier. The frequencies are #define'd in KHz, which is 1/1000 of MHz. (You guys in Europe, etc. all understand Kilo and Mega and so on, anyway.)

Constant, That is what I thought. If I were you I could not resist the temptation to experiment by changing those #define'd constants. Keep us posted. Regards, Geoff _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

8182

Age (days ago)

8184

Last active (days ago)

List overview

Download

7 comments

3 participants

participants (3)

Constant Brouerius van Nidek
Doug McGarrett
Geoff