Tim's Upgrade Rant: October Edition or Why SuSE has financial problems.
Okay I'll admit it, I'm excited about SuSE 7.3. I'm running SuSE 7.1, and I can't wait to get my shiny new copy. BUT, SuSE is really getting crazy this time around. I noticed that the upgrade version of 7.3 is still $49.95, but the description says "SuSE Linux 7.3 Update Edition, is a full version of 7.3 Professional Edition, but without the manuals." Am I reading this right? No manuals. Okay, I thought that the Update Edition came with some manuals, and I still thought it was expensive. Now lets do the math: Ten cents per CD times 7 cds equals seventy cents. Lets say the DVD costs a whopping five dollars. Okay. Now we have $5.70. Hmm... Okay, lets say the box costs another $5. That's $10.70. Now, that means in an upgrade version material costs likely add up to less than 1/4 of the price (only about a 1/5 actually!). What exactly is SuSE doing with the other $40? SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!! <ahhhhh> I feel better now, I'm good for at least a few months... -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 0:10 am, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
You mean you really don't want them to get paid for doing all the work of making up a new release????? DO you want a version 7.4, 7.5, etc in the future??
<ahhhhh> I feel better now, I'm good for at least a few months...
Go count your pennies. -- +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ + Bruce S. Marshall bmarsh@bmarsh.com Bellaire, MI 10/03/01 00:28 + +----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ 'Eat, drink, and lighten up, for tomorrow you might get audited!' ALF
Bruce Marshall wrote:
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 0:10 am, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
You mean you really don't want them to get paid for doing all the work of making up a new release?????
Yeah, go to http://www.linuxfromscratch.org and see what it takes to make your own distro. By the time you read thru the docs, you'll be willing to pay for Suse's excellent work.
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 06.10, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
Okay I'll admit it, I'm excited about SuSE 7.3. I'm running SuSE 7.1, and I can't wait to get my shiny new copy. BUT, SuSE is really getting crazy this time around.
I noticed that the upgrade version of 7.3 is still $49.95, but the description says "SuSE Linux 7.3 Update Edition, is a full version of 7.3 Professional Edition, but without the manuals." Am I reading this right? No manuals. Okay, I thought that the Update Edition came with some manuals, and I still thought it was expensive. Now lets do the math: Ten cents per CD times 7 cds equals seventy cents. Lets say the DVD costs a whopping five dollars. Okay. Now we have $5.70. Hmm... Okay, lets say the box costs another $5. That's $10.70. Now, that means in an upgrade version material costs likely add up to less than 1/4 of the price (only about a 1/5 actually!). What exactly is SuSE doing with the other $40?
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
<ahhhhh> I feel better now, I'm good for at least a few months...
-Tim
paying wages for the people working full-time to put it together? I think it's worth it. I've never been a great fan of Richard Stallman's philosophy, but even he said it was OK to charge for work done, and suse does a lot IMHO. SuSE employs a lot of people working on the various projects (KDE, the kernel, etc) and even though they're linux geeks, I'm sure at least some of them have lives, and I'm almost certain most of them eat. And if companies like SuSE didn't pay them to work full-time on OS software, the development of those projects wouldn't be at the fast pace it is. So let's do the math: $50 a box and you have a box. $11 a box and you have a bankrupcy. Of course you still have a box, only now it says Microsoft Anders
Gee this list is starting to be like a game of whack-a-mole. No
sooner we have dampened one pointless, unending thread than we start
on another. Hey -- I have an idea! Let's have the same discussion
about pricing we have everytime SuSE releases a new version! Won't
that be fun!
More topics for discussion:
Why aren't the full set of ISO's on the ftp site?
Why is there a delay between release of the CD's and ftp release of
the distro?
Why is YaST1 being phased out?
Why do replies go to sender, and not list?
Why doesn't Fred post here anymore?/Why is Fred still posting here?
Here are some arguments you can use:
If SuSE doesn't make its distros cheaper, I won't download them for
free anymore! I am a valued customer, they should respect my opinion.
If SuSE doesn't make its distro available sooner, I will download
RedHat for free instead of SuSE. And I will keep saying it with every
new release of SuSE. Nyah-nyah!
If YaST is phased out, I will switch to RedHat or Debian for their
ease of configuration. Take that!
If replies are not sent to list automatically, I will quit this list
and won't you all be sorry then! That'll teach you for not realizing
that democracy means doing exactly as I say!
If Fred is allowed/not allowed to keep posting this list, I will spam
this list with complaints about spam/not getting enough of Fred's posts.
Now you all know how to make a valuable contribution to the list, what
are you waiting for?
Corvin
--
Corvin Russell
Today, Oct 3, Corvin Russell wrote:
Gee this list is starting to be like a game of whack-a-mole. No sooner we have dampened one pointless, unending thread than we start on another. Hey -- I have an idea! Let's have the same discussion about pricing we have everytime SuSE releases a new version! Won't that be fun!
Corvin, I haven't laughed that hard in over a week. Thanks for the sarcastic humor on this subject.. ..as for Mr. Butler, this guy obviously has some issues comprehending basic economics. My suggestion? Let's not feed the troll. Ken
Hi Ken,
..as for Mr. Butler, this guy obviously has some issues comprehending basic economics. My suggestion? Let's not feed the troll.
I'm not a troll. It's just that I rant two or three times a year on this list. :-) The rest of the time you should find me fairly calm. -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
Today, Oct 3, Timothy R. Butler wrote:
I'm not a troll. It's just that I rant two or three times a year on this list. :-) The rest of the time you should find me fairly calm.
I've seen you on this list for as long as I've been on it and I agree. Sorry if I interpreted your comment as a troll, but I felt the comments made were inflamatory enough to be construed as such. No ill feeling I hope.. ;^) Ken
Hi Ken,
I've seen you on this list for as long as I've been on it and I agree.
Thanks. :-)
Sorry if I interpreted your comment as a troll, but I felt the comments made were inflamatory enough to be construed as such.
I did cut to the chase a bit, so I understand completely.
No ill feeling I hope.. ;^)
None at all Ken. :-) One of my favorite things about the Linux community is that I've found that ill feelings simply doesn't seem to exist here after disagreements of any sort. After all, small rants are nothing in the scope of our larger mission to conqueror the world with Linux! ;-) -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
On Thu, 4 Oct 2001 05:18, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
Hi Ken,
..as for Mr. Butler, this guy obviously has some issues comprehending basic economics. My suggestion? Let's not feed the troll.
I'm not a troll. It's just that I rant two or three times a year on this list. :-) The rest of the time you should find me fairly calm.
Personally, I find Tim's concerns valid and not at all OT for this list. Simple solution: don't read them if you don't like them. Jon
I never minded the price considering how just in software the value you get I have used SuSe since version 5.2 and have never complianed about pricing because it still better all the rest. Yast alone they could have made money releasing at Adminstration software is they so wished. True at beggining the distro was much cheaper but progress as a price. If they where offering SuSe 7.3 with Kernel 2.4.10 and only the apps i would take as insult but with sofware that comes with and not mention the manuals it number 1 my list. Regards, Alex Corvin Russell wrote:
Gee this list is starting to be like a game of whack-a-mole. No sooner we have dampened one pointless, unending thread than we start on another. Hey -- I have an idea! Let's have the same discussion about pricing we have everytime SuSE releases a new version! Won't that be fun!
More topics for discussion:
Why aren't the full set of ISO's on the ftp site?
Why is there a delay between release of the CD's and ftp release of the distro?
Why is YaST1 being phased out?
Why do replies go to sender, and not list?
Why doesn't Fred post here anymore?/Why is Fred still posting here?
Here are some arguments you can use:
If SuSE doesn't make its distros cheaper, I won't download them for free anymore! I am a valued customer, they should respect my opinion.
If SuSE doesn't make its distro available sooner, I will download RedHat for free instead of SuSE. And I will keep saying it with every new release of SuSE. Nyah-nyah!
If YaST is phased out, I will switch to RedHat or Debian for their ease of configuration. Take that!
If replies are not sent to list automatically, I will quit this list and won't you all be sorry then! That'll teach you for not realizing that democracy means doing exactly as I say!
If Fred is allowed/not allowed to keep posting this list, I will spam this list with complaints about spam/not getting enough of Fred's posts.
Now you all know how to make a valuable contribution to the list, what are you waiting for?
Corvin
-- Corvin Russell
-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq and the archives at http://lists.suse.com
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 00:10, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
Compared to MS products, they are giving it away. *************************************************** Powered by SuSE Linux 7.2 Professional KDE 2.1.2 KMail 1.2 Bryan S. Tyson bryantyson@earthlink.net ***************************************************
( I remembered to change the address ! )
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
Compared to MS products, they are giving it away.
And some I have 10 machines to 'upgrade' but I only need to buy one copy, so I buy the expensive one and still feel guilty. -- Lester Caine ----------------------------- L.S.Caine Electronic Services
What exactly is SuSE doing with the other $40?
Trying to pay the rent, feed their kids, etc? No disrespect to Tim (valued contributor and all round good egg) here, but each time a new version is about to appear, there seems to be a sudden descent of blindness over the amount of added value SuSE has put on to downloadable Linux. What we should be surprised about is how they can possibly do all this for the money they're charging. Anyone in a hard currency country who can afford a computer can afford it. It might be nice if a way was found to supply the product to disadvantaged countries more cheaply, but the same can be said for most products. And if no-one has noticed, things are hard in the software industry. It's not just SuSE who have felt the pinch. These guys need money to live and do what they do the same as anyone else. Let those who can afford it keep supporting them. And can we make this the last complaint about the price, or, like the OT material moved out to the 'chatty' list, perhaps found a 'suse-linux-bitch-about-the-price' list for those who like to keep reading about how ripped off they are getting for their 7 CDs worth of leading edge software to put on as many machines as they like for the price of a night out. If you really can't afford it, skip a version or two - I still have 6.3 machines running doing absolutely everything I want of them. No one is pressurising anyone to buy. Best to all Fergus Fergus Wilde Chetham's Library Manchester M3 1SB UK Tel: +44 161 834 7961 Fax: +44 161 839 5797
I can see just about everyones point on this thread: The price is too high, SuSE needs our money to continue, etc. . . I really want to upgrade to 7.3 and support SuSE, but at $50 for the upgrade it's more than I paid for 7.2 Pro. I really wouldn't mind if it were a REAL upgrade, but unless I'm missing something there are little improvements in SuSE 7.3. So you get KDE 2.2.1 (which I have installed anyway), kerenel 2.4.10 (which I have), and the ability to use yast2 for LVM configuration, which works after the YOU update . . . I know there is more, but that is what jumped out at me as *cool* upgrades (cool games too, but you can download them all . . . ). I would really like to see things like these, and would pay highly for them: Yast2 online update (YOU) works like apt-get (Debian), ie you can upgrade all your packages, not just the bugfixes SuSE puts up. You would be able to upgrade your kernel or get the new version of KDE install direct from SuSE's site (or mirrors). I love apt-get (and most of the people who have used it do too), but I made the move to SuSE since Debian is too out of date for me (last release over a year ago?) . . . Yast2 written in something other than Java. I've written graphical programs in Java, and I know it's easier, but I never tried to sell them. It's pretty sad when yast2 runs slow on my PIII-850MHz machine with 1GB of ram . . . . . . It would also be really nice also if there was a subscription service, ie pay $100 a year or so and get every SuSE release. That way I get every release without sticker shock, and SuSE gets continued support. If the option was available I would sign up for at least a year, probably more. Cdrom.com used to do this with Slackware a while back, anyone heard of such a service for SuSE from a third party? Well, that's my rant. _Nick Timothy R.Butler wrote:
Okay I'll admit it, I'm excited about SuSE 7.3. I'm running SuSE 7.1, and I can't wait to get my shiny new copy. BUT, SuSE is really getting crazy this time around.
I noticed that the upgrade version of 7.3 is still $49.95, but the description says "SuSE Linux 7.3 Update Edition, is a full version of 7.3 Professional Edition, but without the manuals." Am I reading this right? No manuals. Okay, I thought that the Update Edition came with some manuals, and I still thought it was expensive. Now lets do the math: Ten cents per CD times 7 cds equals seventy cents. Lets say the DVD costs a whopping five dollars. Okay. Now we have $5.70. Hmm... Okay, lets say the box costs another $5. That's $10.70. Now, that means in an upgrade version material costs likely add up to less than 1/4 of the price (only about a 1/5 actually!). What exactly is SuSE doing with the other $40?
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
<ahhhhh> I feel better now, I'm good for at least a few months...
-Tim
.
It would also be really nice also if there was a subscription service, ie pay $100 a year or so and get every SuSE release. That way I get every release without sticker shock, and SuSE gets continued support. If the option was available I would sign up for at least a year, probably more. Cdrom.com used to do this with Slackware a while back, anyone heard of such a service for SuSE from a third party? A comment on this: The past few Suse new versions have been coming out at 2 a year so that $100 for a subscribtion would equate to $50 each for a year of subscriptions. So your still be paying the $50 for each upgrade.
To me I would gladdly pay the 79.99 or what ever it turns out to be even it i do upgrade twice a year. I get the new books an If i want to then i can pass the old version down to someone that wants to jump into linux an they still get the books. just my 2 cents worth. Another way of looking at this is that if you have more then one machine like I do that you plan to put suse on then you are free to do that with just one copy, but not that way with a microsoft upgrade, you are forced to buy a copy for each machine an you do not get a break for multiply copies unless you buy in volumn, so to me im still coming out cheaper with suse at buy 2 releases a year then I would ever be with microsoft. jack malone Network Administrator EAST TEXAS LIGHTHOUSE FOR THE BLIND dba HORIZON INDUSTRIES 903-595-3444 http://www.horizonind.com
Hi Nick,
I can see just about everyones point on this thread: The price is too high, SuSE needs our money to continue, etc. . . I really want to upgrade to 7.3 and support SuSE, but at $50 for the upgrade it's more than I paid for 7.2 Pro. I really wouldn't mind if it were a REAL upgrade, but unless I'm missing something there are little improvements in SuSE 7.3. So you get KDE 2.2.1 (which I have installed anyway), kerenel 2.4.10 (which I have), and the ability to use yast2 for LVM configuration, which works after the YOU update . . . I know there is more, but that is what jumped out at me as *cool* upgrades (cool games too, but you can download them all . . . ).
Exactly my point Nick! $150 a year or more so that we can keep the latest goodies we already have probably downloaded for free seems kinda odd. Granted it's a lot more convenient to get them on DVD or CD's, but $150 (for three releases per year) is a whole lot for some convenience that quickly wears out as new stuff comes out. It would be really great if SuSE would come out with a "real" upgrade as you put it, so it's existing customers didn't end up paying more for an upgrade then they would if they went to the store and bought the pro version. -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
Just to clarify I meant "real" upgrade as in more updates, not a 1 CD patch to 7.2 (I think that is what you ment?). I would hate it if SuSE had an upgrade that you have to install 7.2 and then 7.3 over the top of it. Sure, the option is a good one to have (you can upgrade 7.2 to 7.3 without re-installing everything), but what if you get a new machine, then you would have to slap on 7.2 just to upgrade it to 7.3. Almost all "upgrade" versions of any software product is simply the new version, but at a discount for people who bought the previous version. The way it should be ;) _Nick
It would be really great if SuSE would come out with a "real" upgrade as you put it, so it's existing customers didn't end up paying more for an upgrade then they would if they went to the store and bought the pro version.
-Tim
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 02:28 pm, Nick Webb wrote:
Just to clarify I meant "real" upgrade as in more updates, not a 1 CD patch to 7.2 (I think that is what you ment?). I would hate it if SuSE
No I meant the same thing you did, I think. Uhm, well sorta. To me, the current "upgrade" isn't a real upgrade because it costs nearly as much when I finally get it as the full version. I also agree that the upgrades should have more updates to make them worth while - at least if they are going to charge $50 + S&H for the upgrade. -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
On Thu, 4 Oct 2001 02:47, Nick Webb wrote:
I can see just about everyones point on this thread: The price is too high, SuSE needs our money to continue, etc. . . I really want to upgrade to 7.3 and support SuSE, but at $50 for the upgrade it's more than I paid for 7.2 Pro. I really wouldn't mind if it were a REAL upgrade, but unless I'm missing something there are little improvements in SuSE 7.3. So you get KDE 2.2.1 (which I have installed anyway), kerenel 2.4.10 (which I have), and the ability to use yast2 for LVM configuration, which works after the YOU update . . . I know there is more, but that is what jumped out at me as *cool* upgrades (cool games too, but you can download them all . . . ).
Think yourself lucky - in Australia the 7.2 Pro boxed set was $130.... Only one company is providing the upgrade packages, and they're about $80 I think.
Yast2 written in something other than Java. I've written graphical programs in Java, and I know it's easier, but I never tried to sell them. It's pretty sad when yast2 runs slow on my PIII-850MHz machine with 1GB of ram . . .
I'd have to agree with this one - so much so that I use YAST1 most of the time.
It would also be really nice also if there was a subscription service, ie pay $100 a year or so and get every SuSE release. That way I get every release without sticker shock, and SuSE gets continued support. If the option was available I would sign up for at least a year, probably more. Cdrom.com used to do this with Slackware a while back, anyone heard of such a service for SuSE from a third party?
That would be a great idea - I tend to purchase the Pro version of every second or third release, unless there's comething MAJOR in the manuals, etc. A colleague at work and I usually take turns and then burn copies of the CDs (not having a DVD burner...YET !!!) so it works out cheaper for us both - otherswise we'd never upgrade (in fact, my firewall and server at home are running 7.0, and the workstation is running 7.2 - I think the Libretto was running 7.1 before it kacked itself - bloody Toshiba hardware !!) Having an update subscriprion service for the CD-ROMs only would be great as well - OK, you miss the nicities in the manuals, but is solves the problem of burning 6 or 7 CDs, plus SuSE get financial support as well. I'd still buy the boxed set probably every third release or so, but not every one (sounds too much like a Windows upgrade then !!!) I believe the Upgrade Subscription Service in Germany is something like 50 Euro, and it's Europe only- maybe the service as CDs only for the rest of the wworld would be the way to go - you could then buy the boxed set if you really wanted the manuals. Jon Senior Network Manager Marsh Pty Ltd Sydney, Australia P.S. How do you convince PHB's to let you put a Linux server on the network that looks like a Netware box to prove a point without getting fired ?
still buy the boxed set probably every third release or so, but not every one (sounds too much like a Windows upgrade then !!!)
Exactly my point! I figured out the costs, and especially after a few years, if you bought every Windows upgrade for three PC's and the same with Linux... Windows was actually cheaper! -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
At 02:49 PM 10/3/2001 -0500, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
still buy the boxed set probably every third release or so, but not every one (sounds too much like a Windows upgrade then !!!)
Exactly my point! I figured out the costs, and especially after a few years, if you bought every Windows upgrade for three PC's and the same with Linux... Windows was actually cheaper! You do not have to buy an upgrade for each pc for suse, you can legally install the one upgrade on all 3 of those pc's so where do you get that its cheaper for windows. just currious.
jack jack malone Network Administrator EAST TEXAS LIGHTHOUSE FOR THE BLIND dba HORIZON INDUSTRIES 903-595-3444 http://www.horizonind.com
Hi Jack,
You do not have to buy an upgrade for each pc for suse, you can legally install the one upgrade on all 3 of those pc's so where do you get that its cheaper for windows. just currious.
Let's see if I can figure this out again. This is a cost analysis over four years for a small business with three computers. Windows: $600 ($100 every two years, buying every retail upgrade, for three PC's) SuSE Linux: $720 ($60 [upgrade + S&H] three times a year) Both have StarOffice, so both do not need any more commerical software to work in a basic office. Now, granted SuSE Pro comes with a lot of great stuff Windows does not have. However, SuSE develops sizably less of the system than the Redmonians, so they should be able to offer more for less. It is worth noting, that the larger the company, the less it costs to use SuSE, but the point is, SuSE in some cases may actually cost more than Windows. That's a scary thought. -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
On October 3, 2001 04:06 pm, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
Hi Jack,
You do not have to buy an upgrade for each pc for suse, you can legally install the one upgrade on all 3 of those pc's so where do you get that its cheaper for windows. just currious.
Let's see if I can figure this out again. This is a cost analysis over four years for a small business with three computers.
Windows: $600 ($100 every two years, buying every retail upgrade, for three PC's)
SuSE Linux: $720 ($60 [upgrade + S&H] three times a year)
SuSE, but the point is, SuSE in some cases may actually cost more than Windows. That's a scary thought.
And why would a company upgrade 3 times a year? Give me one good reason to even upgrade the whole system once year. If it works you don't break it just because SuSE brings out a new version. How many of the people are upgrading because they need to and not because they want to? Nick
Let's see if I can figure this out again. This is a cost analysis over four years for a small business with three computers.
Windows: $600 ($100 every two years, buying every retail upgrade, for three PC's)
Join the developers network (MSDN). That will costs me $900 this year - they have just put it up. Add Borland Builder at $2000 per upgrade. It's all just money down the drain, but I have to pay it to stay in business.
SuSE Linux: $720 ($60 [upgrade + S&H] three times a year)
Both have StarOffice, so both do not need any more commerical software to work in a basic office.
There is just no comparison. I may well scrap MSDN this year as I do not want to pay the 40% increase and I don't want their compilers even if they are throwing them in 'for free', so I will have plenty of money spare to pay for the convenience of the latest SUSE disk set. -- Lester Caine ----------------------------- L.S.Caine Electronic Services
Hi there,
There is just no comparison. I may well scrap MSDN this year as I do not want to pay the 40% increase and I don't want their compilers even if they are throwing them in 'for free', so I will have plenty of money spare to pay for the convenience of the latest SUSE disk set.
Definately, I agree. My therotical office is the typical office - one of my clients, actually - who doesn't have a need for MSDN or any other type of development related resource. -Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
Let's see if I can figure this out again. This is a cost analysis over four years for a small business with three computers.
Windows: $600 ($100 every two years, buying every retail upgrade, for three PC's)
Correct-ish...
SuSE Linux: $720 ($60 [upgrade + S&H] three times a year)
Kaching !! Wrong !! Thanks for playing.... Try $120 - $60 x 3 per year - NOT PER MACHINE... You forget the licencing model.
Both have StarOffice, so both do not need any more commerical software to work in a basic office.
Free anyway, so a non-starter here.
Now, granted SuSE Pro comes with a lot of great stuff Windows does not have. However, SuSE develops sizably less of the system than the Redmonians, so they should be able to offer more for less.
Yes, the biggest being that IT WORKS !!
It is worth noting, that the larger the company, the less it costs to use SuSE, but the point is, SuSE in some cases may actually cost more than Windows. That's a scary thought.
Wrong.... Less than 1/4.... Jon
SuSE Linux: $720 ($60 [upgrade + S&H] three times a year)
Kaching !! Wrong !! Thanks for playing....
Try $120 - $60 x 3 per year - NOT PER MACHINE... You forget the licencing model.
Actually I figured 3 releases not 3 machines per year. Now so long as SuSE doesn't take a que from Caldera we don't have to worry about per machine licensing. ;-) Best, Tim -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks tbutler@uninetsolutions.com ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm Free/Open Source Web Tools: http://www.uninetsolutions.com Christian Portal and Search Tool: http://www.faithtree.com ============== "Christian Web Services Since 1996" ==============
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 18.47, Nick Webb wrote:
Yast2 written in something other than Java. I've written graphical programs in Java, and I know it's easier, but I never tried to sell them. It's pretty sad when yast2 runs slow on my PIII-850MHz machine with 1GB of ram . . .
AFAICS Yast2 is written in C++ Anders
* Nick Webb [Wed, 03 Oct 2001 09:47:16 -0700]:
Yast2 written in something other than Java.
It is ;-) The main part is a QT using program written in C++. Parts of YaST2 are written in a scripting language and thus interpreted. Philipp -- Penguins to save the dinosaurs -- Handelsblatt on Linux for S/390
On Wednesday 03 October 2001 04:10, Timothy R.Butler wrote:
SuSE is charging too much for 7.3 Upgrade!!!!
I don't agree. SuSE is the best all-round distro you can get, with tons of software to try, and a very nicely-packaged system. I don't need to upgrade to 7.3, but I'm going to buy a copy anyway, because they do a wonderful job. Kevin
participants (16)
-
Alex -
Anders Johansson -
Bruce Marshall -
Bryan Tyson -
Corvin Russell -
Fergus Wilde -
Jack Malone -
Jon Biddell -
Ken Hughes -
Kevin Donnelly -
lester＠lsces.co.uk -
Nick Webb -
Nick Zentena -
philippt＠t-online.de -
Timothy R.Butler -
zentara