[opensuse] Writing a small book... what should I use?
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless. Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook. Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers. If others are going to submit significant amounts, then maybe a wiki would be useful. -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
John Andersen said the following on 01/09/2012 06:18 PM:
On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless. Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook. Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers.
+1 At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of characters, places, events, chronology, if *AND I SAY IF* you book is something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards. Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in the technology than the production of a book. And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction. As John says, focus on the content not the mechanics. -- If people were really trying to just reduce risk, they would be running on OpenBSD rather than windows. So what we are generally trying to do is not really Risk Assessment, but Risk Justification. We don't want to reduce risk so much as justify why we are allowing our assets to be so exposed. - Bill Royds, 16th September 2005 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 1/9/2012 4:20 PM, Anton Aylward wrote:
At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of characters, places, events, chronology, if*AND I SAY IF* you book is something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards.
I assumed the work was to be more technically oriented for some reason. There are a several commercial packages used by writers of novels and such for plot and character management. You can tell these works, because the often have way more characters in the plot than is necessary to tell the story, and the spend way too much time developing the characters of non-essential characters. These are the favorite tools of the formula novelists that crank out a book every 6 months. Basically if the Author's name is printed larger on the cover than the title of the novel, you are in this ballpark. -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 19:20 -0500, Anton Aylward wrote:
John Andersen said the following on 01/09/2012 06:18 PM:
On 1/9/2012 2:58 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
If you are writing it, farting around with a wiki like software seems pointless. Get a good word processor package, a good to-do list and a paper notebook. Otherwise you get bogged down in the mechanics and the content suffers.
+1
At the limit, you might need a wiki-like tool to keep track of characters, places, events, chronology, if *AND I SAY IF* you book is something like a crime thriller with a complicated plot. But then most authors seem to get along fine with a paper notebooks and some index cards.
Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in the technology than the production of a book.
And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction.
As John says, focus on the content not the mechanics.
-- If people were really trying to just reduce risk, they would be running on OpenBSD rather than windows. So what we are generally trying to do is not really Risk Assessment, but Risk Justification. We don't want to reduce risk so much as justify why we are allowing our assets to be so exposed. - Bill Royds, 16th September 2005 Nothing like that really. At most I'll need to track historical references. I'm writing a political treatise.
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On 10/01/12 00:20, Anton Aylward wrote:
[...] Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in the technology than the production of a book.
And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction.
That's your opinion, nothing more than that. Don't pretend to own the truth. LaTeX is designed so an author can focus on the content and not on the layout or other issues because that's automatically handled by the typesetting system. Saying that somebody using LaTeX is more focussed on technology than the production of a book is just plainly ignoring reality, I'm afraid (I've written lots of papers and some books and book chapters with LaTeX, so I know what I am talking about). I'm not here to convince anybody of using LaTeX, certainly not if the task at hand is simply sharing a few pages and not the production of a professionally looking book. But LaTeX was definitely worth a shot given the original inquiry which lacked some detail. Thomas -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 21:42 +0000, Thomas Hertweck wrote:
On 10/01/12 00:20, Anton Aylward wrote:
[...] Anything more than that and its an indicator you are more interested in the technology than the production of a book.
And please also ignore anyone who recommends word processors or formatters, latex, docbooks, and other distraction.
That's your opinion, nothing more than that. Don't pretend to own the truth. LaTeX is designed so an author can focus on the content and not on the layout or other issues because that's automatically handled by the typesetting system. Saying that somebody using LaTeX is more focussed on technology than the production of a book is just plainly ignoring reality, I'm afraid (I've written lots of papers and some books and book chapters with LaTeX, so I know what I am talking about). I'm not here to convince anybody of using LaTeX, certainly not if the task at hand is simply sharing a few pages and not the production of a professionally looking book. But LaTeX was definitely worth a shot given the original inquiry which lacked some detail.
Thomas
I'm not sure what the publishing scheme will be. I may need LaTeX at some point, but likely not. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though. Th. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck <Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/ hth & regards, Carl -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck <Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/
hth & regards,
Carl Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
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On 1/9/2012 4:25 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck<Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/
hth& regards,
Carl Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
But it looks like you could build it from source in about 15 minutes. -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 16:28 -0800, John Andersen wrote:
On 1/9/2012 4:25 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck<Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/
hth& regards,
Carl Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
But it looks like you could build it from source in about 15 minutes.
-- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- I'm not a programmer.
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On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 16:25:45 -0800 Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck <Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/
hth & regards,
Carl Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
I'm running openSUSE 11.4 x86_64 and Zim 0.54 here (I just upgraded Zim) Use the package manager to ensure the prerequisites are installed: gtk+ >= 2.6 python >= 2.5 python-gtk python-gobject python-simplejson (for python < 2.6) python-xdg (optional, but recommended) xdg-utils (optional, but recommended) Download the tarball and decompress it in your home directory. Add a launcher to your panel... Name: "Zim - a desktop wiki" Command: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/zim.py" Icon: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/icons/zim16.svg" You're done. Spend a little time reading the FAQ and related docs on the website. Play around with it a little bit. If you don't use it for the book you might just use it for other things, as I do. It's not too simple, not too complicated... it just gets the job done. regards, Carl -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 20:02 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 16:25:45 -0800 Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 18:28 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 23:21:43 +0000 Thomas Hertweck <Thomas.Hertweck@web.de> wrote:
On 09/01/12 22:58, Roger Luedecke wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
Th.
I'd recommend checking out Zim 0.52, "A desktop wiki" http://www.zim-wiki.org/
hth & regards,
Carl Looks good, but not available for openSUSE.
I'm running openSUSE 11.4 x86_64 and Zim 0.54 here (I just upgraded Zim)
Use the package manager to ensure the prerequisites are installed:
gtk+ >= 2.6 python >= 2.5 python-gtk python-gobject python-simplejson (for python < 2.6) python-xdg (optional, but recommended) xdg-utils (optional, but recommended)
Download the tarball and decompress it in your home directory.
Add a launcher to your panel... Name: "Zim - a desktop wiki" Command: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/zim.py" Icon: "/home/<you>/zim-0.54/icons/zim16.svg"
You're done.
Spend a little time reading the FAQ and related docs on the website. Play around with it a little bit. If you don't use it for the book you might just use it for other things, as I do. It's not too simple, not too complicated... it just gets the job done.
regards,
Carl Groovy. I got it installed. For some reason it doesn't want to be pinned to docky though.
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On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 17:42:45 -0800 Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote: 8<---- snipped ----
Groovy. I got it installed. For some reason it doesn't want to be pinned to docky though.
Um, don't think I can help you there... sorry. I run GNOME and Zim is parked comfortably in my panel. Did you say which DE you're running? I'm assuming KDE? What version? Maybe someone more proficient in oS/KDE setups can help. Have fun and good luck on your book! Carl -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-01-09 at 20:57 -0500, Carl Hartung wrote:
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 17:42:45 -0800 Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote: 8<---- snipped ----
Groovy. I got it installed. For some reason it doesn't want to be pinned to docky though.
Um, don't think I can help you there... sorry. I run GNOME and Zim is parked comfortably in my panel. Did you say which DE you're running? I'm assuming KDE? What version? Maybe someone more proficient in oS/KDE setups can help.
Have fun and good luck on your book!
Carl 12.1 KDE was giving me too much trouble, so I rolled back to Gnome in 11.4.
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-01-10 00:21, Thomas Hertweck wrote:
You are supposed to write a book? LaTeX should do fine. If you don't know about LaTeX yet, it will be a steep learning curve though.
LyX smooths that curve. It is the WYMIWYG. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk8LhKgACgkQtTMYHG2NR9XWLgCfXLk/QA5rcgh7QHOdnHdzKpO0 NoMAn1sfEZhWXhcZlz5dkjsVoBTjSU8p =DkNf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation. Stuart Sent from my iPhone On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
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Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.
Stuart
Sent from my iPhone
On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote: there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 1/9/2012 3:31 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.
Stuart
Sent from my iPhone
On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke<roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote: there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.
Latex is more about typesetting than writing, and its aimed mostly at technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go down that path. Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office. You need something that is transportable if others are to edit. And its best if chapters are separate documents, allowing multiple concurrent editing. Its too bad that Google Docs is at such a primitive state, because wit would be good for collaborative editing if it were a little more advanced. -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 01/09/2012 06:41 PM, John Andersen wrote:
On 1/9/2012 3:31 PM, Roger Luedecke wrote:
Would it be written in XML? I use Serna Free to edit the openSUSE books for translation.
Stuart
Sent from my iPhone
On 9 Jan 2012, at 23:58, Roger Luedecke<roger.luedecke@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 00:26 +0100, Bolton Linux wrote: there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.
Latex is more about typesetting than writing, and its aimed mostly at technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go down that path.
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office.
You need something that is transportable if others are to edit. And its best if chapters are separate documents, allowing multiple concurrent editing.
Its too bad that Google Docs is at such a primitive state, because wit would be good for collaborative editing if it were a little more advanced.
I haven't yet tried installing WordPerfect in Wine, but maybe that would work, if you have it. --doug -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
John Andersen <jsamyth@gmail.com> writes:
Latex is more about typesetting than writing,
You have the wrong impression of LaTeX. The whole point of LaTeX is that the author should not have to worry about formatting/typesetting once the class of the document is defined.
and its aimed mostly at technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go down that path.
No. LaTeX is meant for documents that does not require precise layout (like an ad). It is definitely a good tool for a novel. A good class to use is "memoir": http://ctan.org/pkg/memoir
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office.
The only good outliner is org-mode (outlining is only part of what it does) in Emacs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Org-mode http://orgmode.org/manual/index.html However, it has a very steep learning curve. Charles -- "Whip me. Beat me. Make me maintain AIX." (By Stephan Zielinski)
On 1/9/2012 6:16 PM, Charles Philip Chan wrote:
John Andersen<jsamyth@gmail.com> writes:
Latex is more about typesetting than writing,
You have the wrong impression of LaTeX. The whole point of LaTeX is that the author should not have to worry about formatting/typesetting once the class of the document is defined.
and its aimed mostly at technical/scientific writing. It would be a huge distraction to go down that path.
No. LaTeX is meant for documents that does not require precise layout (like an ad). It is definitely a good tool for a novel. A good class to use is "memoir":
LaTeX is a high-quality typesetting system; it includes features designed for the production of technical and scientific documentation. LaTeX is the de facto standard for the communication and publication of scientific documents. LaTeX is available as free software. Your argument is not with me, you appear to be as odds with http://www.latex-project.org/ -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
John Andersen <jsamyth@gmail.com> writes:
LaTeX is a high-quality typesetting system; it includes features designed for the production of technical and scientific documentation.
You mean TeX. LaTeX is simply a set of macros to make the production of documents easier. There are other newer systems available, for example, XeTeX.
LaTeX is the de facto standard for the communication and publication of scientific documents. LaTeX is available as free software.
I never said that it wasn't. However, it is not limited to scientific documents- just because the system is good for typesetting maths does not make it less useful for anything else. The behaviour of LaTeX changes in accordance with the document class used and new/user defined document classes are created everyday. The reason why Knuth wrote TeX is because of the poor quality of Phototypesetting system used for his book: ,----[ From http://www.tug.org/whatis.html ] | In the late 1970s, Donald Knuth was revising the second volume of his | multivolume magnum opus The Art of Computer Programming, got the | galleys, looked at them, and said (approximately) "blecch"! He had just | received his first samples from the new typesetting system of the | publisher's, and its quality was so far below that of the first edition | of Volume 2 that he couldn't stand it. Around the same time, he saw a | new book by Patrick Winston that had been produced digitally, and | ultimately realized that typesetting meant arranging 0's and 1's (ink | and no ink) in the proper pattern, and said (approximately), "As a | computer scientist, I really identify with patterns of 0's and 1's; I | ought to be able to do something about this", so he set out to learn | what were the traditional rules for typesetting math, what constituted | good typography, and (because the fonts of symbols that he needed really | didn't exist) as much as he could about type design. He figured this | would take about 6 months. (Ultimately, it took nearly 10 years, but | along the way he had lots of help from some people who are well known to | many readers here—Hermann Zapf, Chuck Bigelow, Kris Holmes, Matthew | Carter and Richard Southall are acknowledged in the introduction to | Volume E, Computer Modern Typefaces, of the Addison-Wesley Computers & | Typesetting book series.) `---- Charles -- "Problem solving under linux has never been the circus that it is under AIX." (By Pete Ehlke in comp.unix.aix)
On 1/9/2012 9:09 PM, Charles Philip Chan wrote:
John Andersen<jsamyth@gmail.com> writes:
LaTeX is a high-quality typesetting system; it includes features designed for the production of technical and scientific documentation.
You mean TeX. LaTeX is simply a set of macros to make the production of documents easier. There are other newer systems available, for example, XeTeX.
Sigh... I took that quote directly off the Latex web page, so NO I DON'T mean Tex. Please stop arguing we me and go to http://www.latex-project.org/ and argue with them and explain to them how they don't have a clue what their own project is all about. -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office. That is why I am reluctantly still using an old copy of Word 2003 for my 'little books' since the 90's, now with wine on openSUSE. I've been onto the OOo issues (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=3959) trail for many years to get Outlining into the OOo Writer, but no one seems to want to incorporate it. As you say, what is pointed out to be outline and navigator is useless for serious work in OOo and its derivatives. All capable Outliners are not free or open source. Very few are as good and easy to use as M$-Word outline mode for non-technical users.
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On 1/10/2012 4:52 AM, LLLActive@GMX.Net wrote:
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office. That is why I am reluctantly still using an old copy of Word 2003 for my 'little books' since the 90's, now with wine on openSUSE. I've been onto the OOo issues (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=3959) trail for many years to get Outlining into the OOo Writer, but no one seems to want to incorporate it. As you say, what is pointed out to be outline and navigator is useless for serious work in OOo and its derivatives. All capable Outliners are not free or open source. Very few are as good and easy to use as M$-Word outline mode for non-technical users.
Outlining is in OpenOffice 3.3, but its just not as smooth as it was in 8 year old Word. It is not as swift to switch between modes. It does work, but it took a lot of digging to get comfortable with it (which I'm still not). -- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 15:43 -0800, John Andersen wrote:
On 1/10/2012 4:52 AM, LLLActive@GMX.Net wrote:
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office. That is why I am reluctantly still using an old copy of Word 2003 for my 'little books' since the 90's, now with wine on openSUSE. I've been onto the OOo issues (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=3959) trail for many years to get Outlining into the OOo Writer, but no one seems to want to incorporate it. As you say, what is pointed out to be outline and navigator is useless for serious work in OOo and its derivatives. All capable Outliners are not free or open source. Very few are as good and easy to use as M$-Word outline mode for non-technical users.
Outlining is in OpenOffice 3.3, but its just not as smooth as it was in 8 year old Word. It is not as swift to switch between modes. It does work, but it took a lot of digging to get comfortable with it (which I'm still not).
-- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- How do I use outlining in LibreOffice, and what does it do? Generally I just use a bulleted list for smaller document outlines.
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On Tue, 2012-01-10 at 15:43 -0800, John Andersen wrote:
On 1/10/2012 4:52 AM, LLLActive@GMX.Net wrote:
Outlining is something I use as well, and sadly its pretty much missing/useless in OOo and Libre Office. That is why I am reluctantly still using an old copy of Word 2003 for my 'little books' since the 90's, now with wine on openSUSE. I've been onto the OOo issues (https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=3959) trail for many years to get Outlining into the OOo Writer, but no one seems to want to incorporate it. As you say, what is pointed out to be outline and navigator is useless for serious work in OOo and its derivatives. All capable Outliners are not free or open source. Very few are as good and easy to use as M$-Word outline mode for non-technical users.
Outlining is in OpenOffice 3.3, but its just not as smooth as it was in 8 year old Word. It is not as swift to switch between modes. It does work, but it took a lot of digging to get comfortable with it (which I'm still not).
-- _____________________________________ ---This space for rent--- How do I use outlining in LibreOffice, and what does it do? Generally I just use a bulleted list for smaller document outlines.
The outlining in OOo and derivatives are NO outliners; i.e. it does not work - they are no outliners. Try M$-Word's outline view, use it, and see what I mean. OOo & co. only do outline formatting. That is it. Do not mention navigator, it is none either. Outliners existed since the dos days. I used it back then already. Look at this old link: http://outliners.scripting.com/ - It was originally used for programming as well: http://davewiner.userland.com/outlinersProgramming Outlining is a writing tool, not a formatting tool like it is used in OOo & co. Look here to see what an outliner does: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outliner. Look at the way it works. Here you will find some tool that you can use for writing a small (collaborative) book. Dreiel -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Roger Luedecke said the following on 01/09/2012 06:31 PM:
The idea is I'm going to write what is essentially a draft, then others will edit it. I tend to work best with an outline, and was wondering if there was something wikiish that would facilitate it. I think Kjots may have been what I was seeing. I'm not even remotely familiar with Latex.
Having used KJots my recommendation is DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME If others have to deal with this they your best bet is plain text. If you need an outliner there are macros for VIM. -- I have no faith, very little hope, and as much charity as I can afford. Thomas H. Huxley -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> writes:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
This article should be of interest to you: http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/tools-create-your-next-great-novel Charles -- "It's God. No, not Richard Stallman, or Linus Torvalds, but God." (By Matt Welsh)
2012. január 9. 23:58 napon Roger Luedecke <roger.luedecke@gmail.com> írta:
I'm commissioned to start a small book project, and vaguely remember seeing a wikilike piece of software that would facilitate this well. I intend to start with a conceptual outline, and then flesh each section out. Any recommendations?
Hello: I suppose that a professional will typeset your document. In this case you have to focus on content (as other already suggested). I guess a regular text editor which you are got used to is the best. Avoid complicated and different styles to keep your document layout consistent. I guess the best is to higlight (eg bold text) the titles. To make difference between hierarchical levels I would use simple numbering, like 1, 1.1, 1.1.1 etc. It can be easily removed if not needed during typesetting. Istvan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (11)
-
Anton Aylward -
Bolton Linux -
Carl Hartung -
Carlos E. R. -
Charles Philip Chan -
doug -
Istvan Gabor -
John Andersen -
LLLActive＠GMX.Net -
Roger Luedecke -
Thomas Hertweck