I can't see mails I send to this list?? Only replies. I never know if the mails I send make it.
All, Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail. The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list. Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this? I also can't use the hyperkitty mail interface because my account still has the suddenlinkmail.com address as my e-mail and when I attempt login, it "sends a verification e-mail..." to my suddenlink address which of course bounces and I never get it. Suggestions? -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E.
On Sun, 15 May 2022 00:09:44 -0500 David C. Rankin wrote:
All,
Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail. The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list.
Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this? I also can't use the hyperkitty mail interface because my account still has the suddenlinkmail.com address as my e-mail and when I attempt login, it "sends a verification e-mail..." to my suddenlink address which of course bounces and I never get it.
Suggestions?
GMail is notorious for filtering purportedly "duplicate" e-mails out ("If you have the original in your Sent folder, why do you need to receive another copy?") I do not know of a fix for this. Can't you create a new subscription using a different e-mail address?
Hello, In the Message; Subject : Re: I can't see mails I send to this list?? Only replies. I never know if the mails I send make it. Message-ID : <20220515020048.2526f227@GT62VR-7RE> Date & Time: Sun, 15 May 2022 02:00:48 -0400 [CH] == Carl Hartung <opensuse@cehartung.com> has written: CH> On Sun, 15 May 2022 00:09:44 -0500 CH> David C. Rankin wrote: CH> > All, CH> > CH> > Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my CH> > suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail. CH> > The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or CH> > my replies to the list. CH> > CH> > Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this? I also can't use CH> > the hyperkitty mail interface because my account still has the CH> > suddenlinkmail.com address as my e-mail and when I attempt login, it CH> > "sends a verification e-mail..." to my suddenlink address which of CH> > course bounces and I never get it. CH> > CH> > Suggestions? CH> > CH> GMail is notorious for filtering purportedly "duplicate" e-mails out CH> ("If you have the original in your Sent folder, why do you need to CH> receive another copy?") I do not know of a fix for this. It would be possible to solve this problem if the ML changed the Meessage-ID of the posted email and distributed it, but this is not possible. CH> Can't youcreate a new subscription using a different e-mail CH> address? This would be the only way. Regards. --- ┏━━┓彡 野宮 賢 mail-to: nomiya @ galaxy.dti.ne.jp ┃＼／彡 ┗━━┛ "Tim Cook, the C.E.O. of Apple, said earlier this year that he would not let his nephew join social networks. Bill Gates banned cellphone until his children were teenagers, and Melinda Gates wrote that she wished they had waited even longer. Steve Jobs would not let his young children near iPads." -- The New York Times --
On 2022-05-15 07:09, David C. Rankin wrote:
All,
Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail. The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list.
Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this?
That's a feature. WONTFIX :-P Gmail intentionally deletes duplicate emails, and it detects them by checking the Message-ID header. When you send a post to the list, the copy of your email sent by the mail list server to gmail has obviously the same Message-ID as the one in your "Sent" folder, so the "copy" is deleted. Similarly, when someone replies to your post hitting "reply to all", you will get the direct copy, but not the copy from the list because it arrives seconds later, it is detected as duplicate, and deleted. Thus "Thunderbird" will not activate the "reply to list" button and you must remember to hit "reply to all", or by default you will send a personal reply instead. Sorry about that. Google is thick headed about their ways: they do things their own way. What people do is copy sent mail to inbox (on Thunderbird), or equivalent. The only way you have to verify if the mail arrived at the list is to check the archive. Or, you could use two gmail accounts, one for sending, one for receiving. Never tried that, sorry, can't vouch for it. Also, if you have an opensuse.org alias, even if you use the smtp server of gmail, their duplicate algorithm is disabled.
I also can't use the hyperkitty mail interface because my account still has the suddenlinkmail.com address as my e-mail and when I attempt login, it "sends a verification e-mail..." to my suddenlink address which of course bounces and I never get it.
I don't know about that. Except open a ticket, asking to change your account address manually. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 15.3 x86_64 at Telcontar)
From: "Carlos E. R." <robin.listas@telefonica.net> Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 13:13:00 +0200 On 2022-05-15 07:09, David C. Rankin wrote:
All,
� Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail. The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list.
� Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this?
That's a feature. WONTFIX :-P I have a solution that WFM, but it's relatively complicated. Several years ago, I switched to Gmail from running my own MX for rgrjr.com, since it just got to be too complicated to maintain my own mail exchanger. Outgoing emails go through Google servers, and incoming emails are forwarded to my home system through a VPS that is still named rgrjr.com, which is necessary to work around my ISP's embargo of port 25. (Linode.com offers openSUSE VPS nodes for as little as $5/mo.) But I also didn't like the way they handled lists, so I now subscribe to lists with a separate domain (rogers-suse@rgrjr.homedns.org in this case), having set up the MX for rgrjr.homedns.org to point to rgrjr.com to avoid the aforementioned port 25 embargo. and have a delivery script that puts openSUSE email into its own Qmail-style incoming folder. (And can also eliminate duplicates, on request.) Gmail intentionally deletes duplicate emails, and it detects them by checking the Message-ID header . . . There is a well-known timing flaw in SMTP that can potentially result in duplicate copies being delivered, so they probably feel that silently swallowing duplicates avoids annoying users in the other direction. -- Bob Rogers http://www.rgrjr.com/
On 2022/05/14 22:09, David C. Rankin wrote:
All,
Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail.
My emails to suddenlink were always blocked, so guess your ISP is getting with some program.
The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list.
---- Yep. It's a feature! Complain to their support. Their take on it is that users prefer duplicate post suppression. If you remember some of the users on here that hated it when you replied to their email with the reply sent to the original poster, and Cc'ing the list. Well enough people complained about getting 2 copies, that google deletes any duplicate copies -- usually, the copy that comes back from the mail list is tossed as duplicate, which harms local threading and filtering. So now those who don't like getting 2 copies can move to google where the choice is enforced (also note they add 5K of google-babble to the headers. As for the mails you send - send from some other client than in google -- then your composed message won't be in their cache and either the list copy or your private copy sent directly to you will get through -- sadly google will still corrupt your email input stream. Only way to get around that is to not use google to catch your emails. You *can't* reconstruct the lost emails, as the headers will differ depending on the route. Google justifies this as part of your cost in doing business with them. In a similar way they changed the IMAP protocol -- dunno if you use their IMAP, but you can't delete all messages through their IMAP, you have to logon and delete their special "really all messages" folder manually, like 50 at a time.
Anybody else using gmail know how to fix this? I also can't use the hyperkitty mail interface because my account still has the suddenlinkmail.com address as my e-mail and when I attempt login, it "sends a verification e-mail..." to my suddenlink address which of course bounces and I never get it.
Suggestions?
On 19/06/2022 02.43, suse@tlinx.org wrote:
On 2022/05/14 22:09, David C. Rankin wrote:
All,
Since my crappy ISP started blocking mail from opensuse to my suddenlinkmail.com account I have had to switch my account to gmail.
My emails to suddenlink were always blocked, so guess your ISP is getting with some program.
The problem is I never see the mails I send, not my original post or my replies to the list.
Yep. It's a feature! Complain to their support. Their take on it is that users prefer duplicate post suppression. If you remember some of the users on here that hated it when you replied to their email with the reply sent to the original poster, and Cc'ing the list.
Well enough people complained about getting 2 copies, that google deletes any duplicate copies -- usually, the copy that comes back from the mail list is tossed as duplicate, which harms local threading and filtering.
No, AFAIR gmail had this feature since the start, right when you needed an invitation to get one of their accounts. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from openSUSE 15.3 (Legolas))
participants (6)
-
Bob Rogers -
Carl Hartung -
Carlos E. R. -
David C. Rankin -
Masaru Nomiya -
suse＠tlinx.org