hi folks, I have been living with a little irritation for some time now, and it finally dawned on me to ask someone about it. duh. Since upgrading my machines to the suse 9.2 professional boxed set, all of the machines began taking 5 minutes to boot-up... hanging around for a very long time "creating devices" and "setting up kernel module dependencies (if required)". What is the system waiting for? What is the trick to get the boot-up process to fly by like before? This is very consistent from machine to machine; however, once they are booted everything runs great and performance is good. Please help me understand. Thanks. -- Kind regards, Mark H. Harris <><
On Thursday 27 April 2006 23:14, Mark H. Harris wrote:
Since upgrading my machines to the suse 9.2 professional boxed set, all of the machines began taking 5 minutes to boot-up... hanging around for a very long time "creating devices" and "setting up kernel module dependencies (if required)".
What is the system waiting for? What is the trick to get the boot-up process to fly by like before?
Usually such a wait during boot is due to something it wants from the network... before the network is working. A DNS lookup, or a time sync using NTP. Next time it hangs.... besides looking very carefully at what the last message was (which may or may not be helpful) try doing a CTL-C to kill a process. If this lets it continue, look at the NEXT message that was displayed. It may tell you what got killed and give you a clue.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2006-04-28 at 08:26 -0400, Bruce Marshall wrote:
Next time it hangs.... besides looking very carefully at what the last message was (which may or may not be helpful) try doing a CTL-C to kill a process. If this lets it continue, look at the NEXT message that was displayed. It may tell you what got killed and give you a clue.
There is also a method to make init start each script one by one, asking the user for confirmation for each. Thus the culprit should be evident. I think it is activated by typing "confirm" at the boot grub or lilo menu prompt. - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEUqlvtTMYHG2NR9URAplGAKCCCDqVr7myqrRmRlogyGOcytGS7wCgg5yL vKWZIzyeXJRge5kH+zahjq8= =L+8p -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
While bootup times on my system - AMD Sepmron 1.6 GHz + 1GB RAM are not that slow - about 1 minute. It's still very slow compared to Windows XP that boot at under 30 seconds. Maybe we can accelerate that ? By optimizing the boot process - perhaps by using initng ? I have tried installing initng - and it was no go - it is not compatible with SUSE - but since it's open-source one man can stand up and make it compatible. I can't do this because I understand poorly the init procedure. Also I do not understand how init is correlated with inird (that is loaded together with the kernel). I could NOT find any serious but easy to read documentation about it. Any volunteers to port initng to SUSE?
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-04-29 at 10:32 +0200, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
While bootup times on my system - AMD Sepmron 1.6 GHz + 1GB RAM are not that slow - about 1 minute. It's still very slow compared to Windows XP that boot at under 30 seconds.
There was a long discussion about that time ago. I think you see that mainly because XP doesn't fully boot everything before it lets you log in. Ie, you can log in and use it (somehow) before it fully boots. Also, linux starts a lot of services, like for example, mail server, you don't usually have in windows. My solution is that I never halt, nor boot my system: I suspend to disk, and awake it. Much faster. - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEU1nztTMYHG2NR9URAkrQAJ9SKAWaOZmEr+0EaHhIh+/Smt18IQCbB0Qu mw1GswB108YVnkUlvL9uJeU= =ibz8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
There was a long discussion about that time ago. I think you see that mainly because XP doesn't fully boot everything before it lets you log in. Ie, you can log in and use it (somehow) before it fully boots.
Also, linux starts a lot of services, like for example, mail server, you don't usually have in windows.
Why can't we do the same ? Start using SUSE before it fully boots and have non-needed services disabled unless configured.
My solution is that I never halt, nor boot my system: I suspend to disk, and awake it. Much faster.
This is known as "hibernate" in Windows XP. I don't like this feature.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-04-29 at 15:17 +0200, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Also, linux starts a lot of services, like for example, mail server, you don't usually have in windows.
Why can't we do the same ? Start using SUSE before it fully boots and have non-needed services disabled unless configured.
The first is not interesting (some things would not work if some service wasn't up), and the second, services that do start have at least a usable default configuration. Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
My solution is that I never halt, nor boot my system: I suspend to disk, and awake it. Much faster.
This is known as "hibernate" in Windows XP. I don't like this feature.
I didn't like it in windows. I love it in linux. It simply works. - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEU3ektTMYHG2NR9URAghQAJ0bEh8Pb2W1mIWQ23XQxB+rGAGizQCfU0IN 7CntgOAYhY3UFhh6pMzZ4C8= =gnAY -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
Why not just have KDM start sooner? -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:13 am, Ken Schneider wrote:
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
Why not just have KDM start sooner?
Not sure if that is the only thing. People (like me) tend to compare against WinXP in terms of booting. There are a few tricks the MS folks do to get XP to boot "faster" than it otherwise might. I know there are the projects working on this - I think SUPER is the only one - http://en.opensuse.org/SUPER#SUPER._SUSE_Performance_Enhanced_Release - but I'd love to see these changes in the actual release. I, too, boot my laptop at least once per day. Sometimes twice a day. I've had issues with the suspend process where I lose the session - ever since 10.0 - so I don't use it anymore. -- k
kai wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:13 am, Ken Schneider wrote:
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting. SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements. There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions Why not just have KDM start sooner?
Not sure if that is the only thing. People (like me) tend to compare against WinXP in terms of booting. There are a few tricks the MS folks do to get XP to boot "faster" than it otherwise might.
One thing they do, is give the appearance of booting faster, by displaying the desktop early. However, you can't do much, until well after the desktop appears.
On Sunday 30 April 2006 02:26, James Knott wrote:
kai wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:13 am, Ken Schneider wrote:
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
Why not just have KDM start sooner?
Not sure if that is the only thing. People (like me) tend to compare against WinXP in terms of booting. There are a few tricks the MS folks do to get XP to boot "faster" than it otherwise might.
One thing they do, is give the appearance of booting faster, by displaying the desktop early. However, you can't do much, until well after the desktop appears.
Indeed. I like to have a /usable/ desktop when it appears. IMHO the best thing one can do for now (apart from tweaking /etc/sysconfig/boot) to cut off some time from the boot process is to fire up 'yast runlevel' and disable those services you don't need. Carefull though, do not disable e.g. kbd. ;) Cheers, Leen
On Sunday 30 April 2006 01:46 am, Leendert Meyer wrote:
On Sunday 30 April 2006 02:26, James Knott wrote:
kai wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:13 am, Ken Schneider wrote:
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
> Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and > months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
Why not just have KDM start sooner?
Not sure if that is the only thing. People (like me) tend to compare against WinXP in terms of booting. There are a few tricks the MS folks do to get XP to boot "faster" than it otherwise might.
One thing they do, is give the appearance of booting faster, by displaying the desktop early. However, you can't do much, until well after the desktop appears.
Indeed. I like to have a /usable/ desktop when it appears.
IMHO the best thing one can do for now (apart from tweaking /etc/sysconfig/boot) to cut off some time from the boot process is to fire up 'yast runlevel' and disable those services you don't need. Carefull though, do not disable e.g. kbd. ;)
Yeah, I put up with a bit longer time because I run MySQL, Apache, Postfix, Tomcat and a few other things on my laptop. This is - after all -a development "server." :) -- kai - www.perfectreign.com
On Sunday 30 April 2006 20:34, kai wrote:
On Sunday 30 April 2006 01:46 am, Leendert Meyer wrote:
On Sunday 30 April 2006 02:26, James Knott wrote:
kai wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:13 am, Ken Schneider wrote:
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:39 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote: >> Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and >> months without booting. > > SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. > Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
There is a huge amount of research going on in this area, it's not something you can just do with one package, if it were that simple it would have been done long ago. But people are working on it. 10.0 was a great improvement to previous versions
Why not just have KDM start sooner?
Not sure if that is the only thing. People (like me) tend to compare against WinXP in terms of booting. There are a few tricks the MS folks do to get XP to boot "faster" than it otherwise might.
One thing they do, is give the appearance of booting faster, by displaying the desktop early. However, you can't do much, until well after the desktop appears.
Indeed. I like to have a /usable/ desktop when it appears.
IMHO the best thing one can do for now (apart from tweaking /etc/sysconfig/boot) to cut off some time from the boot process is to fire up 'yast runlevel' and disable those services you don't need. Carefull though, do not disable e.g. kbd. ;)
Yeah, I put up with a bit longer time because I run MySQL, Apache, Postfix, Tomcat and a few other things on my laptop. This is - after all -a development "server." :)
That's only a subset of my 'all-purpose'-PC. ;) BTW, I forgot to mention filesystems: only the filesystems that are really needed should be mounted by default in fstab. I have several filesystems mounted by default, which takes time. I don't care too much, since I discovered like Carl that Suspend to Disk works. Cheers, Leen
On Saturday 29 April 2006 15:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
Excuse me ! .... -- The Labour party has changed their emblem from a rose to a condom as it more accurately reflects the government's political stance. A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you are actually being fucked. from GSM
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-04-29 at 16:35 +0200, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
X'-) I'm a home user, and I'm very happy the way it is. I would not want it to deny its inheritance and become a home user os. But before you continue complaining, remember that we are talking about 9.2. That is "obsolete". - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEU741tTMYHG2NR9URAmMZAJwNELPDKlPQ+saON1KX8YAy7f09IQCfRRUS VahxhmaWQ/Wo79vwr4VxIZc= =qssn -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On Sat, 2006-04-29 at 16:35 +0200, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
IIRC IBM was working on making Linux boot faster. I assume that it will take some time for their efforts to disseminate out into the community as a whole. Perhaps in some sort of a service pack. ;)
On Saturday 29 April 2006 10:35, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
Linux is mostly designed to be running continuosly for days and months without booting.
SUSE Linux is first & foremost an open-source operating system. Therefore it must change to meet the new Home User's requirements.
And just what have you or are you going to contribute to the Open Source community? You are making waaaay too many demands to a bunch of volunteers. And you are very pushy for a newcomer. <PLONK>
On Saturday 29 April 2006 04:32, Alexey Eremenko wrote:
While bootup times on my system - AMD Sepmron 1.6 GHz + 1GB RAM are not that slow - about 1 minute. It's still very slow compared to Windows XP that boot at under 30 seconds.
So what?? I boot linux once a month at most. If I were running XP it might be several times a day. Which system spends more time booting?? <troll>
Thu, 27 Apr 2006, by harrismh777@earthlink.net:
hi folks, I have been living with a little irritation for some time now, and it finally dawned on me to ask someone about it. duh.
Since upgrading my machines to the suse 9.2 professional boxed set, all of the machines began taking 5 minutes to boot-up... hanging around for a very long time "creating devices" and "setting up kernel module dependencies (if required)".
What is the system waiting for? What is the trick to get the boot-up process to fly by like before?
Not sure if there's a simularity here, but on my 9.2 box all of the filesystems were checked at each boot. I turned that off by inserting in /etc/sysconfig/boot: FASTBOOT="yes" RUN_PARALLELE="yes" USE_MAKE="yes" After that the box boot{ed,s} as fast as the previous 9.1 version. Theo -- Theo v. Werkhoven Registered Linux user# 99872 http://counter.li.org ICBM 52 13 26N , 4 29 47E. + ICQ: 277217131 SUSE 9.2 + Jabber: muadib@jabber.xs4all.nl Kernel 2.6.8 + See headers for PGP/GPG info. Claimer: any email I receive will become my property. Disclaimers do not apply.
I too am plagued by long bootup times under SuSE 10.0. I notice that there are lots and lots of things happening during the bootup process, most of which involve software components I never heard of and didn't know I needed - and maybe I don't need most of them. Is there a systematic way of tracking down how all those bootup actions came to be, and how to disable them? At least Linux lets you know what they are. Paul
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-04-29 at 11:39 -0400, Paul W. Abrahams wrote:
Is there a systematic way of tracking down how all those bootup actions came to be, and how to disable them? At least Linux lets you know what they are.
Then read them up, study, and decide. You are the system administrator, you decide what you run or not... Sorry, it can not be a general decission. Only you knows what you will not need. - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEU77PtTMYHG2NR9URAn3oAJ9yARedLURwaUIsSr5DqQa5mFH1kwCdEwMt rWel0WHSQEJKa8QmHmk7v3o= =0iLJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On Saturday 29 April 2006 16:39, Paul W. Abrahams wrote:
Is there a systematic way of tracking down how all those bootup actions came to be, and how to disable them? At least Linux lets you know what they are.
Well, if you look at /var/boot.msg (in a text editor or using YaST>Miscellaneous>View Start-up Log) you will see what is being done in great detail. You will find documentation about almost every package installed on the machine in /use/share/doc/packages - at least a README file with a reference to further information. Also, in YaST>System>/etc/sysconfig Editor you can set System>Boot>PROMT_FOR_CONFIRM to "yes" which will allow you to disable individual services at boot time to see what effect that has on the system. Lastly, YaST>System>System Services (Runlevel) will let you enable and disable services permanently. Dylan -- "The man who strikes first admits that his ideas have given out." (Chinese Proverb)
On Saturday 29 April 2006 4:30 pm, Dylan wrote:
Well, if you look at /var/boot.msg (in a text editor or using YaST>Miscellaneous>View Start-up Log) you will see what is being done in great detail. You will find documentation about almost every package installed on the machine in /use/share/doc/packages - at least a README file with a reference to further information.
I'm familiar with those messages -- but the problem is that unless you're already very well informed about such things, there's no obvious way to tell what package generated a particular message. Some examples: Starting CapiSuite done Starting SubDomain Event daemon done
Also, in YaST>System>/etc/sysconfig Editor you can set System>Boot>PROMT_FOR_CONFIRM to "yes" which will allow you to disable individual services at boot time to see what effect that has on the system.
That may well be the answer.
Lastly, YaST>System>System Services (Runlevel) will let you enable and disable services permanently.
Provided you know which services you want to disable. Paul
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-04-29 at 16:45 -0400, Paul W. Abrahams wrote:
Starting CapiSuite done
isdn faxing.
Starting SubDomain Event daemon done
dunno.
Lastly, YaST>System>System Services (Runlevel) will let you enable and disable services permanently.
Provided you know which services you want to disable.
We could request a new "feature" for 10.2: that editor showing a small help text about what is that service needed for and the possible impact of removing it. - -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFEU+6btTMYHG2NR9URAkNoAJ9k2Yhly4VR+kNb4cgtLuf3XUvSOwCeK/ld oRpW8k09f4Vs8+MqrgWyJ44= =Z9uE -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
On Saturday 29 April 2006 6:54 pm, Carlos E. R. wrote:
We could request a new "feature" for 10.2: that editor showing a small help text about what is that service needed for and the possible impact of removing it.
A very good idea. You're referring to the runlevel editor, right? Paul
On Saturday 29 April 2006 06:08, Theo v. Werkhoven wrote:
FASTBOOT="yes" RUN_PARALLELE="yes" USE_MAKE="yes"
Thank you kindly... there it is! This one machine uses a 40gig drive with 10 partitions (8 of them reiserfs) and all of them were being checked at each bootup. These changes brought the bootup down from 5 1/2 minutes to about 1 1/2 minutes... way better. Thanks again. -- Kind regards, Mark H. Harris <>< harrismh777@earthlink.net
participants (14)
-
Alexey Eremenko -
Anders Johansson -
Bruce Marshall -
Carlos E. R. -
Dylan -
James Knott -
kai -
Ken Schneider -
Leendert Meyer -
Mark H. Harris -
Mike McMullin -
Paul W. Abrahams -
Peter Nikolic -
Theo v. Werkhoven