Son son has a MB with and integrated ethernet port. A couple of nights ago, we had a really bad thunderstorm. Now it does not connect to the internet. It keeps saying (in Windows) that no cable is connected.
Is there a way to test the port ? (BIOS says its enabled, we tried to reload the driver and still nothing)
Duaine
On Monday 28 July 2008 23:56:29 Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Son son has a MB with and integrated ethernet port. A couple of nights ago, we had a really bad thunderstorm. Now it does not connect to the internet. It keeps saying (in Windows) that no cable is connected.
Is there a way to test the port ? (BIOS says its enabled, we tried to reload the driver and still nothing)
What MB brand? What manner of NIC? Any interesting/relevant output in dmesg or /var/log/messages?
Kurt
Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Son son has a MB with and integrated ethernet port. A couple of nights ago, we had a really bad thunderstorm. Now it does not connect to the internet. It keeps saying (in Windows) that no cable is connected.
Is there a way to test the port ? (BIOS says its enabled, we tried to reload the driver and still nothing)
Just display it with e.g. "ip addr" - that'll show the cable status. Or try ethtool, that'll show the same.
/Per Jessen, Zürich
Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Son son has a MB with and integrated ethernet port. A couple of nights ago, we had a really bad thunderstorm. Now it does not connect to the internet. It keeps saying (in Windows) that no cable is connected.
Is there a way to test the port ? (BIOS says its enabled, we tried to reload the driver and still nothing)
Duaine
Most NICs have an LED near the ethernet connector. Is it on? Do you have another computer you can test with? How about a PCI NIC? If the NIC is indeed blown, you can disable it in the BIOS and use a plug in card.
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 01:56:29 am Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Son son has a MB with and integrated ethernet port. A couple of nights ago, we had a really bad thunderstorm. Now it does not connect to the internet. It keeps saying (in Windows) that no cable is connected.
Is there a way to test the port ? (BIOS says its enabled, we tried to reload the driver and still nothing)
Did you tested that computer on cable (connection) that works for another computer, or checked that cable with another computer that works? In other words, did you make sure that MB is at fault and not cable or router.
When thunderstorm strikes electronics is first to die, but high voltage hits usually come from outside. That means modem, or router modem are first exposed. Long Ethernet line in house is next possible place that can catch high voltage discharge and then all components are exposed, computer and router, or modem.
On router, or router-modem combo, side can be damaged single port, so fact that other computers have connection doesn't prove that router is completely functional.
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:29 AM, Rajko M. rmatov101@charter.net wrote:
When thunderstorm strikes electronics is first to die, but high voltage hits usually come from outside. That means modem, or router modem are first exposed.
Mostly right, except for the fact that there are no rules where lightning is concerned.
Its not unusual for lighting to do truly mind boggling stuff, frying stuff far away while sparing things close. Not all damage is done by the strike itself, some is done by induced currents (lightning is pulsed DC) in long cable runs, and surges FROM (not TO) ground.
I've had ligntning blow the chips completly off a NIC in the server and leave EVERYTHING else in the network running. The same strike fried a motorized pencil sharpener (it started smoking) in the building next door, and harmed nothing else in the building. Mind Boggling.
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 10:34, John Andersen wrote:
...
Its not unusual for lighting to do truly mind boggling stuff, frying stuff far away while sparing things close. Not all damage is done by the strike itself, some is done by induced currents (lightning is pulsed DC) in long cable runs, and surges FROM (not TO) ground.
I've had ligntning blow the chips completly off a NIC in the server and leave EVERYTHING else in the network running. The same strike fried a motorized pencil sharpener (it started smoking) in the building next door, and harmed nothing else in the building. Mind Boggling.
Out of curiosity, did these things happen in Alaska? I wonder if there might be added phenomena or properties of lightening in areas where geomagnetic and solar effects are sometimes stronger (sometimes much stronger).
----------JSA---------
Randall Schulz
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Randall R Schulz rschulz@sonic.net wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 10:34, John Andersen wrote:
...
Its not unusual for lighting to do truly mind boggling stuff, frying stuff far away while sparing things close. Not all damage is done by the strike itself, some is done by induced currents (lightning is pulsed DC) in long cable runs, and surges FROM (not TO) ground.
I've had ligntning blow the chips completly off a NIC in the server and leave EVERYTHING else in the network running. The same strike fried a motorized pencil sharpener (it started smoking) in the building next door, and harmed nothing else in the building. Mind Boggling.
Out of curiosity, did these things happen in Alaska? I wonder if there might be added phenomena or properties of lightening in areas where geomagnetic and solar effects are sometimes stronger (sometimes much stronger).
Yes, during one of exactly 4 occurrences of Lightning I've ever seen in Juneau in 30 years.
Closely ringed by mountains, Juneau seldom ever gets lightning.
Solar effects happen much higher than lightning if my rudimentry understanding of the atmospheric model does not fail me.
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 11:21, John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Randall R Schulz wrote:
...
I've had ligntning blow the chips completly off a NIC in the server and leave EVERYTHING else in the network running. The same strike fried a motorized pencil sharpener (it started smoking) in the building next door, and harmed nothing else in the building. Mind Boggling.
Out of curiosity, did these things happen in Alaska? I wonder if there might be added phenomena or properties of lightening in areas where geomagnetic and solar effects are sometimes stronger (sometimes much stronger).
Yes, during one of exactly 4 occurrences of Lightning I've ever seen in Juneau in 30 years.
Closely ringed by mountains, Juneau seldom ever gets lightning.
Solar effects happen much higher than lightning if my rudimentry understanding of the atmospheric model does not fail me.
Most of the time, yes, but during solar storms the flux of ions in the solar wind can attain magnitudes that deflect and compress the geomagnetic field to the point where it induces huge currents in power distribution lines (at high latitudes) and that can cause power transformers to overheat and even explode.
There are also bizarre phenomenon associated with lightening that occur on the tops of and / or above the clouds. They're called Red Sprites and Blue Jets.
High-voltage, high-current electrical discharge in gasses and in the presence of large-scale magnetic fields can be pretty funky things, it seems.
----------JSA---------
Randall Schulz
John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Randall R Schulz rschulz@sonic.net wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 10:34, John Andersen wrote:
...
Its not unusual for lighting to do truly mind boggling stuff, frying stuff far away while sparing things close. Not all damage is done by the strike itself, some is done by induced currents (lightning is pulsed DC) in long cable runs, and surges FROM (not TO) ground.
I've had ligntning blow the chips completly off a NIC in the server and leave EVERYTHING else in the network running. The same strike fried a motorized pencil sharpener (it started smoking) in the building next door, and harmed nothing else in the building. Mind Boggling.
Out of curiosity, did these things happen in Alaska? I wonder if there might be added phenomena or properties of lightening in areas where geomagnetic and solar effects are sometimes stronger (sometimes much stronger).
Yes, during one of exactly 4 occurrences of Lightning I've ever seen in Juneau in 30 years.
Closely ringed by mountains, Juneau seldom ever gets lightning.
Solar effects happen much higher than lightning if my rudimentry understanding of the atmospheric model does not fail me.
I just lost an ethernet port and several ports of my wired router to a lightning strike on Long Island. Does anybody know where I can get a new (or used, working) Linksys BEFSX41. Everybody wants to sell you an RF router, which I don't want. The Linksys was an excellent firewall, but I think only one poprt is still operative. (This computer seems to have been lucky.) --doug
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On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:15 PM, Doug McGarrett dmcgarrett@optonline.net wrote:
Why is your post sent as part of an attachment...
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
I just lost an ethernet port and several ports of my wired router to a lightning strike on Long Island. Does anybody know where I can get a new (or used, working) Linksys BEFSX41. Everybody wants to sell you an RF router, which I don't want. The Linksys was an excellent firewall, but I think only one poprt is still operative. (This computer seems to have been lucky.) --doug
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
Yes and no - that the MB NIC is blown and we found a spare card to put in and we're up and running
Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
Yes and no - that the MB NIC is blown and we found a spare card to put in and we're up and running
Good, now remember that if it (a connection) comes into your computer from the outside world, it too must be surge protected. Electricity, telephone, and cable. Most of your good ups now have surge protection for them all.
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM, David C. Rankin drankinatty@suddenlinkmail.com wrote:
Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
Yes and no - that the MB NIC is blown and we found a spare card to put in and we're up and running
Good, now remember that if it (a connection) comes into your computer from the outside world, it too must be surge protected.
Ask any electrical engineer. They will tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as protection from lightning.
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky melted your TV, set the utility poll on fire, and has your cat puffed up to the size of a panda bear, will not have a problem jumping no stinkin surge protector.
John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM, David C. Rankin
e up and running
Good, now remember that if it (a connection) comes into your computer from the outside world, it too must be surge protected.
Ask any electrical engineer. They will tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as protection from lightning.
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky melted your TV, set the utility poll on fire, and has your cat puffed up to the size of a panda bear, will not have a problem jumping no stinkin surge protector.
Quite so. Those power bar suppressors, at best, will remove large noise spikes from the power line, assuming they've got a good, solid ground connection. The U-ground is not sufficient. Everything coming into your house (power, cable TV, phone etc.) is supposed to be connected to a good ground (usually water pipe) at a common point. The purpose of having one and only one ground point is to prevent loops that will often make the problem worse.
James Knott wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM, David C. Rankin
e up and running
Good, now remember that if it (a connection) comes into your computer from the outside world, it too must be surge protected.
Ask any electrical engineer. They will tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as protection from lightning.
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky melted your TV, set the utility poll on fire, and has your cat puffed up to the size of a panda bear, will not have a problem jumping no stinkin surge protector.
Quite so. Those power bar suppressors, at best, will remove large noise spikes from the power line, assuming they've got a good, solid ground connection. The U-ground is not sufficient. Everything coming into your house (power, cable TV, phone etc.) is supposed to be connected to a good ground (usually water pipe) at a common point. The purpose of having one and only one ground point is to prevent loops that will often make the problem worse.
The author is wrong. The National Electrical Code specifies that the power ground shall be an 8 foot ground rod, driven at the point of entry to the house. The telephone company, at least in this area, drives its own ground. I don't know that the cable company does anything about grounding, and that's likely to be why I have a blown TV and ethernet connections.
--doug
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Doug McGarrett wrote:
James Knott wrote:
Quite so. Those power bar suppressors, at best, will remove large noise spikes from the power line, assuming they've got a good, solid ground connection. The U-ground is not sufficient. Everything coming into your house (power, cable TV, phone etc.) is supposed to be connected to a good ground (usually water pipe) at a common point. The purpose of having one and only one ground point is to prevent loops that will often make the problem worse.
The author is wrong. The National Electrical Code specifies that the power ground shall be an 8 foot ground rod, driven at the point of entry to the house. The telephone company, at least in this area, drives its own ground. I don't know that the cable company does anything about grounding, and that's likely to be why I have a blown TV and ethernet connections.
I don't know about where you live, but around here (Canada) the water supply line from the street is commonly used for grounding. Cable TV & telephone lines are supposed to have properly grounded surge suppressors too.
On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 6:51 PM, James Knott james.knott@rogers.com wrote:
Doug McGarrett wrote:
James Knott wrote:
Quite so. Those power bar suppressors, at best, will remove large noise spikes from the power line, assuming they've got a good, solid ground connection. The U-ground is not sufficient. Everything coming into your house (power, cable TV, phone etc.) is supposed to be connected to a good ground (usually water pipe) at a common point. The purpose of having one and only one ground point is to prevent loops that will often make the problem worse.
The author is wrong. The National Electrical Code specifies that the power ground shall be an 8 foot ground rod, driven at the point of entry to the house. The telephone company, at least in this area, drives its own ground. I don't know that the cable company does anything about grounding, and that's likely to be why I have a blown TV and ethernet connections.
I don't know about where you live, but around here (Canada) the water supply line from the street is commonly used for grounding. Cable TV & telephone lines are supposed to have properly grounded surge suppressors too.
Someone gave a direct order to move this conversation to Off-topic.
Be that as it may...
Doug is right, the NATIONAL electrical code has outlawed waterpipe ground for over 10 years. There is just too much PVC pipe segments being used these days to trust a pipe. (Actually outlawed is the wrong word, it just does not recognize or allow pipe as the principal or only ground).
I capitalized NATIONAL because, James, your country MAY have different standards, but I doubt it because I believe Canada as well as the US are participants in the international residential electrical/plumbing code committees. Look at NEW construction to know for sure.
On Wed, 2008-07-30 at 21:51 -0400, James Knott wrote:
Doug McGarrett wrote:
James Knott wrote:
I don't know about where you live, but around here (Canada) the water supply line from the street is commonly used for grounding. Cable TV & telephone lines are supposed to have properly grounded surge suppressors too.
Regulations vary through time. Here, Netherlands it used to be exactly the same for decades. nowadays however, using the water-supplyline for grounding is specicaly forbidden, as it is based on the assumption that copper is used as transport medium, which is no longer the case (often pvc is used).
So for good grounding a proper stake must be used, (just like with vampires ;-)
Doug McGarrett wrote:
James Knott wrote:
John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM, David C. Rankin
e up and running
Good, now remember that if it (a connection) comes into your computer from the outside world, it too must be surge protected.
Ask any electrical engineer. They will tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as protection from lightning.
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky melted your TV, set the utility poll on fire, and has your cat puffed up to the size of a panda bear, will not have a problem jumping no stinkin surge protector.
Quite so. Those power bar suppressors, at best, will remove large noise spikes from the power line, assuming they've got a good, solid ground connection. The U-ground is not sufficient. Everything coming into your house (power, cable TV, phone etc.) is supposed to be connected to a good ground (usually water pipe) at a common point. The purpose of having one and only one ground point is to prevent loops that will often make the problem worse.
The author is wrong. The National Electrical Code specifies that the power ground shall be an 8 foot ground rod, driven at the point of entry to the house. The telephone company, at least in this area, drives its own ground. I don't know that the cable company does anything about grounding, and that's likely to be why I have a blown TV and ethernet connections.
--doug
That's why I personally drove an 8 foot 1/2 inch diameter copper rod into the ground with a 2 pound sledge directly below my server install to provide an immediate solid ground to everything that enters the server closet.....
It is the best you can do, but... a good lightning strike will still melt everything attached like it was made out of butter. But, it still provides much better ground protection than a ground attached 100' away.
You can protect against some of the strikes all of the time but not even come close to protecting against all of the strikes even some of the time......
On Thursday 31 July 2008 10:00, David C. Rankin wrote:
...
That's why I personally drove an 8 foot 1/2 inch diameter copper rod into the ground with a 2 pound sledge directly below my server install to provide an immediate solid ground to everything that enters the server closet.....
...
-- David C. Rankin, J.D., P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961
It would seem you've just told the world where they can go to steal a very good-sized chunk of copper. And people have been doing things like ripping up empty homes and taking apart street-lighting to get copper, so I don't think it's so far-fetched...
Randall Schulz
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 10:11 AM, Randall R Schulz rschulz@sonic.net wrote:
On Thursday 31 July 2008 10:00, David C. Rankin wrote:
...
That's why I personally drove an 8 foot 1/2 inch diameter copper rod into the ground with a 2 pound sledge directly below my server install to provide an immediate solid ground to everything that enters the server closet.....
...
-- David C. Rankin, J.D., P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961
It would seem you've just told the world where they can go to steal a very good-sized chunk of copper. And people have been doing things like ripping up empty homes and taking apart street-lighting to get copper, so I don't think it's so far-fetched...
But he didn't tell the copper thieves anything they didn't already know, since every building has at least one of these rods already. It took a sledge hammer to get it in the ground and it will take a great deal of time and effort to get it out.
But copper thieves are getting pretty aggressive. Not smarter, mind you.... http://baudrillardsbastard.blogspot.com/2007/07/sign-of-times-hardtimes-hit-... (warning - gross image)
Randall R Schulz wrote:
It would seem you've just told the world where they can go to steal a very good-sized chunk of copper. And people have been doing things like ripping up empty homes and taking apart street-lighting to get copper, so I don't think it's so far-fetched...
Nope, not at all - over here they're also ripping out the wiring along the railway lines. At least the stupid ones get electrocuted ...
/Per Jessen, Zürich
On Wednesday 30 July 2008 12:09:15 pm John Andersen wrote:
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky
...
If you want to discuss this further post it on off-topic list, please.
John Andersen wrote:
... Ask any electrical engineer. They will tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as protection from lightning.
Something that just jumped 10,000 feet out the sky melted your TV, set the utility poll on fire, and has your cat puffed up to the size of a panda bear, will not have a problem jumping no stinkin surge protector.
Well, actually, John, there is no protection from a direct lightning strike. We can agree there.
But direct lightning strikes are vanishingly rare events -- and lightning has no will of its own. We can influence the path lightning takes (this is why direct strikes on consumers are vanishingly rare), and we can suppress its side effects. This is why surge protection is good. And while more is better, the principle of diminishing returns rules here, too.
All utilities go to substantial lengths to redirect the effects of lightning away from their customers. Their efforts are expensive and very effective. Thus, a nearby strike will be diverted to ground without harming nearby customers. But the nearer the strike, the more the side effects get through to customers.
The point of surge protection is to suppress the fairly rare event that hits a power wire a hundred yards away and induces a large spike in the power line or nearby telephone wires. And these events, though not common, are common enough to occasionally damage unprotected devices.
Now, having said that, I don't have any surge suppressors in my home :-). Dominion Power and Cox Telephone and their predecessors have done quite well for me for 40+ years.
You decide for yourself what risk you're willing to accept in life, and how much you're willing to pay to avoid more.
John Perry Electronics engineer, who has done a good deal of electrical engineering, too.
On Wednesday 30 July 2008 12:14:56 am Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
Yes and no - that the MB NIC is blown and we found a spare card to put in and we're up and running
I guess that you are very lucky. The surge voltage was induced in cables inside the house by lightning that was quite close.
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
I guess this is addressed to Duaine and Laura, but as you have seen, I have a similar problem. The MOBO problem has not been solved. The ethernet port is blown, and I can only access part of the BIOS, so it is unlikely that I can plug in an ethernet board and have it recognized. This is a Fries computer purchased about 2 years ago. (When I try to get into the BIOS, I can access a screen with a bunch of function key options, but they don't work.)
--dm
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On Wednesday 30 July 2008 08:21:00 pm Doug McGarrett wrote:
Rajko M. wrote:
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 08:02:44 pm Duaine & Laura Hechler wrote:
WOW, I have the same router in St. Louis, MO - with 2 bad ports.
Is the motherboard problem solved?
I guess this is addressed to Duaine and Laura, but as you have seen, I have a similar problem. The MOBO problem has not been solved. The ethernet port is blown, and I can only access part of the BIOS, so it is unlikely that I can plug in an ethernet board and have it recognized.
If you have some spare NIC, just plug it in and see what happens. It can't be worse than it is.
On Tuesday 29 July 2008 12:34:30 pm John Andersen wrote:
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:29 AM, Rajko M. rmatov101@charter.net wrote:
When thunderstorm strikes electronics is first to die, but high voltage hits usually come from outside. That means modem, or router modem are first exposed.
Mostly right, except for the fact that there are no rules where lightning is concerned.
Well, as any rule that deals with statistical parameters, it is mostly right, I know that much, but there are more and less probable events.
In this particular example, Duaine has to post answer with more details before any discussion can continue.
-
David C. Rankin -
Doug McGarrett -
Duaine & Laura Hechler -
Hans Witvliet -
James Knott -
John Andersen -
John E. Perry -
Kurt Wall -
Per Jessen -
Rajko M. -
Randall R Schulz