[opensuse] NO PERSONAL REPLIES TO POSTINGS ON THIS LIST!!
On Thursday 07 December 2006 08:44, you wrote:
its workin fine here.
For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies. You have to be subscribed to post, hence its always completely redundant to send a direct copy in a reply. Desist! RRS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 08:51:11 -0800 From: Randall R Schulz <rschulz@sonic.net> To: opensuse@opensuse.org Subject: [opensuse] NO PERSONAL REPLIES TO POSTINGS ON THIS LIST!!
On Thursday 07 December 2006 08:44, you wrote:
its workin fine here.
For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies.
You have to be subscribed to post, hence its always completely redundant to send a direct copy in a reply.
Desist!
Fix the mailing list. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 07/12/06, Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list. -- Michael Leuty Nottingham, UK -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 09:40, Michael Leuty wrote:
On 07/12/06, Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list.
Fix gmail. X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org> KMail knows how to handle a list. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
On 12/7/06, John Andersen <jsa@pen.homeip.net> wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 09:40, Michael Leuty wrote:
On 07/12/06, Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
I think there was a discussion on this I do not remember all the arguments but should be in the archives :). I am guilty of doing that too by mistake or when I am in a hurry so sorry if you are offended by it. george
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list.
Fix gmail.
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list.
-- _____________________________________ John Andersen
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 07/12/06 19:44, John Andersen wrote:
Fix the mailing list. Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list. Fix gmail.
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list. Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client. --
Hoper (aka QED) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
On 07/12/06 19:44, John Andersen wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list.
Fix gmail.
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list.
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client. --
Hoper (aka QED)
Thunderbird extension (for SUSE patched thunderbird) http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse/2006-11/msg03582.html The link for the .xpi is currently dead, but google should be able to pick it up on keyword: replytolist-0.2.0.xpi /Sylvester
Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
[...] Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client.
Please don't start this discussion again. Thunderbird has an extension which provides a list-reply functionality. See the November archive of this list for details (threads named "Seamonkey 1.0.6 rpm?" and "Thunderbird reply to list feature"). Cheers, Th. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Fix the mailing list. Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list. Fix gmail.
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list.
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client.
And neither PINE: either reply-to-From, reply-to-Reply-To or reply-to-all. Which is why the old one was better. But Bleh. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 7 Dec 2006, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
And neither PINE: either reply-to-From, reply-to-Reply-To or reply-to-all. Which is why the old one was better. But Bleh.
If you are using procmail this receipe will add a Reply-To: header :0f * ^X-Mailinglist: suse-linux-e | /usr/bin/formail -bfi "Reply-To:opensuse@opensuse.org" :0 a: $HOME/Mail/IN-OpenSuse In pine it will give the this option Use "Reply-To:" address instead of "From:" address? -- Regards, | Lions District 201 Q3 Rob Unsworth | IT & Internet Chairman Ipswich, Australia | http://www.lionsq3.asn.au ------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 7 Dec 2006, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
And neither PINE: either reply-to-From, reply-to-Reply-To or reply-to-all. Which is why the old one was better. But Bleh.
If you are using procmail this receipe will add a Reply-To: header :0f * ^X-Mailinglist: opensuse | /usr/bin/formail -bfi "Reply-To:opensuse@opensuse.org" :0 a: $HOME/Mail/IN-OpenSuse In pine it will give the this option Use "Reply-To:" address instead of "From:" address? -- Regards, | Lions District 201 Q3 Rob Unsworth | IT & Internet Chairman Ipswich, Australia | http://www.lionsq3.asn.au ------------------------------------------------- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2006-12-08 at 08:54 +1000, Rob Unsworth wrote:
If you are using procmail this receipe will add a Reply-To: header
I have been using that one for years: some one told me that here. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFFeLJStTMYHG2NR9URAplHAJsG6Xk619aoajSFlqKUpDMJd0tHKACeMkpY 4IOfEBflNvjTIoSKFlw9LfE= =gjDP -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
If you are using procmail this receipe will add a Reply-To: header
I have been using that one for years: some one told me that here.
Even comp.mail.pine suggested the/a procmail recipe. I wonder what's wrong in this world? :P -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2006-12-08 at 11:54 +0100, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
If you are using procmail this receipe will add a Reply-To: header
I have been using that one for years: some one told me that here.
Even comp.mail.pine suggested the/a procmail recipe. I wonder what's wrong in this world? :P
By the way, I have another recipe to put direct replies out of sight ;-) (three recipe types: list, copy, direct (order is important)) :0f * ^X-Mailinglist: opensuse-es | /usr/bin/formail -bfi 'Reply-To:"OS-es" <opensuse-es@opensuse.org>' :0 a: $HOME/Mail/lists/opensuse-es ... :0f * ^X-Mailinglist: opensuse | /usr/bin/formail -bfi 'Reply-To:"OpenSuSE-en" <opensuse@opensuse.org>' :0 a: $HOME/Mail/lists/opensuse # Duplicates (ie, cced) :0 * ^TO_((opensuse|opensuse-factory|opensuse-project|opensuse-es|opensuse-security)@opensuse.org) $HOME/Mail/lists/in_dups # --- resto --------- :0 $HOME/Mail/lists/in_rsto So... I really don't care if people send me a reply to the list and a private copy, I don't see them - unless I want to. And real direct replies I also have in another folder, so I don't confuse them. No problem. Unless the mail is big, I don't really bother bothering ;-) - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFFexwTtTMYHG2NR9URAsjyAJ46WOQI7u9FybQwxp63Nt6rjQ0yngCghqA5 eVKhog2W4oxB0kpwLGyl23U= =wltp -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
* Carlos E. R. <robin.listas@telefonica.net> [12-09-06 15:30]:
By the way, I have another recipe to put direct replies out of sight ;-)
Or just remove duplicate list/direct replies and be done with it: # ------------------------------------------------------- # remove duplicate messages # ------------------------------------------------------- LOCKFILE = msgid.cache.lock :0 Whc: msgid.lock | $FORMAIL -D 16384 msgid.cache LOCKFILE ### save duplicates in case of error :0 a: $MAILDIR/duplicates # ------------------------------------------------------- -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Saturday 2006-12-09 at 18:24 -0500, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
Or just remove duplicate list/direct replies and be done with it:
...
:0 Whc: msgid.lock | $FORMAIL -D 16384 msgid.cache
No, I don't like that method, and I tried it years ago. It will keep the first copy you get and discard the rest, whereas I want to ensure keeping the email that was sent to the list. I can delete the copy myself: after all, 1500 dups (7.1 Mb) in 3 years isn't that much :-P It is similar to what gmail does: it even considers duplicated the sent email and the received copy from the list. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFFe14xtTMYHG2NR9URAv1iAKCR+D1hmYzL4DbtSnL4Dmc0+hFfbgCfeP0I WIPWJvOmaOvmoTxkOglOFyo= =suA5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
* Carlos E. R. <robin.listas@telefonica.net> [12-09-06 20:11]:
It is similar to what gmail does: it even considers duplicated the sent email and the received copy from the list.
I work around that with gmail by using fetchmail from gmail and my provider for smtp rather than gmail. That way I see my posts to the list, but ..... choice is choice and your's is respected :^).. -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 19:04, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
On 07/12/06 19:44, John Andersen wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list.
Fix gmail.
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list.
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client. --
Hoper (aka QED) well wada you expect the windBloZe infection again webmail total dire crap ..
Pete Kmail 1.9.3 and no proplems with list mail member of around 15 lists . -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client.
well wada you expect the windBloZe infection again webmail total dire crap ..
Pete Kmail 1.9.3 and no proplems with list mail member of around 15 lists .
Just cut it already if you are not going to produce something useful (like the procmail recipe - thanks at this point to Rob Unsworth). It's interesting to see _you_ talking about "windbloze" though you are using kmail -- a click-and-colorful GUI like ... Windows users use. Even unrelated to that, saying things like "winbloze" reveals the naiveness and FUD that hides behind "windows sucks linux rocks" statements. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Jan Engelhardt wrote:
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client. well wada you expect the windBloZe infection again webmail total dire crap ..
Pete Kmail 1.9.3 and no proplems with list mail member of around 15 lists .
Just cut it already if you are not going to produce something useful (like the procmail recipe - thanks at this point to Rob Unsworth). It's interesting to see _you_ talking about "windbloze" though you are using kmail -- a click-and-colorful GUI like ... Windows users use.
But he's running it a unix OS, not windoze... Claiming that anything GUI is somehow like windoze is just plain silly.
Even unrelated to that, saying things like "winbloze" reveals the naiveness and FUD that hides behind "windows sucks linux rocks" statements.
IMHO there's nothing naive about saying that windoze sucks, rather it' a sign of sentient life! 8-0 Joe -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 16:43, J Sloan wrote:
Jan Engelhardt wrote:
<snip>
Just cut it already if you are not going to produce something useful (like the procmail recipe - thanks at this point to Rob Unsworth). It's interesting to see _you_ talking about "windbloze" though you are using kmail -- a click-and-colorful GUI like ... Windows users use.
But he's running it a unix OS, not windoze... Claiming that anything GUI is somehow like windoze is just plain silly.
I througoughly agree! I just posted a similar response yesterday on linuxquestions as well. That fact that most of us want an easy to use, intuitive GUI for our daily tasks does not mean we like or advocate Windows. Microsoft - as usual - took many ideas from other companies and combined them into a very easy to use and somewhat standardized GUI format. This format is easily recognizable and transferrable to different OS platforms - Windows, KDE, GNOME, MACOS - for example. If I were running on my old SPARC 5 with SUN OS and XWindows, you'd see similar functionality. (Though the GUI wasn't as nice.) For those few who want to stick with non GUI interfaces, that's just fine. I don't blame you and will let you pass on your way. For the rest of us, please let us be!
Even unrelated to that, saying things like "winbloze" reveals the naiveness and FUD that hides behind "windows sucks linux rocks" statements.
IMHO there's nothing naive about saying that windoze sucks, rather it' a sign of sentient life!
Again, I concur. Using terms like Winblows, or Wintendo (my favorite) or Microshaft or other derogatory terms is just fine. It does not show any naiveness or spread FUD. It is opinion, nothing more. -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.4thedadz.com a turn signal is a statement, not a request -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 17:19, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
... "windows sucks linux rocks"
Now you're catching on! -- Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented worker', is like calling a home intruder an 'unwanted houseguest'. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/7/06, John Andersen <jsa@pen.homeip.net> wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 10:04, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
KMail knows how to handle a list.
Not Thunderbird nor any webmail client. --
So pop gmail with kmail. Reply via smtp thru gmail.
-- _____________________________________ John Andersen
I had this discussion about 2 months ago, I am subscribed to about 2 dozen lists and within the last 2 months this list default changed. In every other list that I am subscribed to I just hit the reply button in gmail and mail goes to the list. This list also worked this way until about 2 months ago when it changed. I opened that discussion because what had been working one way suddenly changed behavior. I opted for gmail because of the web interface as my employer does not run linux (windows only) and I wanted to be able to keep an eye on the lists from work. John -- Registered Linux User 263680, get counted at http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
You know... I don't really care one way or the other how the reply-to works on this list... and we've thrashed it to death a dozen times per year... and the more vocal members of this list all yell and shout about how this list is configured correctly yadda yadda... we even had a vote, and the majority spoke. Which is fine with me. I have a serious question though. Are there actually any other mailing lists that are configured the way the opensuse mailing lists are? I'm currently a member of a couple dozen mailing lists, and not one has ever behaved the way this list's reply-to is set. Not one. Not once in roughly 20 years of internet, usenet and BBS use. So.. can anyone point to any other mailing list that has Reply-to set the same as the opensuse lists? I would really like to see it... I'm not asking this list to change - it's been like this for as long as I can remember, and I don't mind it cuz I'm used to having to always correct the To: address field when I reply. I would just like some point of reference... to see other mailing lists that behave the same way as ours does. C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 2006/12/08 07:57 (GMT+0100) Clayton apparently typed:
So.. can anyone point to any other mailing list that has Reply-to set the same as the opensuse lists? I would really like to see it...
I subscribe to about 40 lists. Among the 40 are a substantial number of Yahoogroups lists, which all set a reply-to header back to the list. Of the remainder, at most one quarter do not set a reply-to header back to the list. Among those that do set a reply-to header back to the list: Debian, Mandriva, Ubuntu, Fedora, Fontconfig, KDE, MC. Among those that do not: Samba. -- "Let your conversation be always full of grace." Colossians 4:6 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
the remainder, at most one quarter do not set a reply-to header back to the list. Among those that do set a reply-to header back to the list: Debian, Mandriva, Ubuntu, Fedora, Fontconfig, KDE, MC. Among those that do not: Samba.
OK, interesting. I don't subscribe to Fedora, Mandriva etc, and with my Ubuntu stuff I use the forums. Well, at least the openSUSE list isn't alone in the Reply-to formatting... and that's a good point for all involved who are grousing about how this list is set up. This list isn't the only one, as Felix kindly indicated several others - and not obscure mailing lists either - that use the same Reply-to formatting as we do here. Thanks, I appreciate your info on this :-) (I wonder if there is the same degree of moaning and gnashing of teeth over the Reply-to formatting on these other lists as there is here?) C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2006-12-08 at 08:40 +0100, Clayton wrote:
the remainder, at most one quarter do not set a reply-to header back to the list. Among those that do set a reply-to header back to the list: Debian, Mandriva, Ubuntu, Fedora, Fontconfig, KDE, MC. Among those that do not: Samba.
OK, interesting. I don't subscribe to Fedora, Mandriva etc, and with my Ubuntu stuff I use the forums.
Well, at least the openSUSE list isn't alone in the Reply-to formatting... and that's a good point for all involved who are grousing about how this list is set up. This list isn't the only one, as Felix kindly indicated several others - and not obscure mailing lists either - that use the same Reply-to formatting as we do here.
Thanks, I appreciate your info on this :-)
(I wonder if there is the same degree of moaning and gnashing of teeth over the Reply-to formatting on these other lists as there is here?)
C.
in evolution it's just ctrl-l -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 21:57, Clayton wrote:
You know... I don't really care one way or the other how the reply-to works on this list... and we've thrashed it to death a dozen times per year... and the more vocal members of this list all yell and shout about how this list is configured correctly yadda yadda... we even had a vote, and the majority spoke. Which is fine with me.
I have a serious question though. Are there actually any other mailing lists that are configured the way the opensuse mailing lists are? I'm currently a member of a couple dozen mailing lists, and not one has ever behaved the way this list's reply-to is set. Not one. Not once in roughly 20 years of internet, usenet and BBS use.
So.. can anyone point to any other mailing list that has Reply-to set the same as the opensuse lists? I would really like to see it...
Well, when I look at message source I'm not seeing any reply-to header on this list. I do see: List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> When I look at the spamassassin list I don't see one there either. I do see List-Post: <mailto:users@spamassassin.apache.org> Those are the two I have at hand that I can check. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
On 12/08/2006 01:57 AM somebody named Clayton wrote:
You know... I don't really care one way or the other how the reply-to works on this list... and we've thrashed it to death a dozen times per year... and the more vocal members of this list all yell and shout about how this list is configured correctly yadda yadda... we even had a vote, and the majority spoke. Which is fine with me.
I have a serious question though. Are there actually any other mailing lists that are configured the way the opensuse mailing lists are? I'm currently a member of a couple dozen mailing lists, and not one has ever behaved the way this list's reply-to is set. Not one. Not once in roughly 20 years of internet, usenet and BBS use.
So.. can anyone point to any other mailing list that has Reply-to set the same as the opensuse lists? I would really like to see it...
I'm not asking this list to change - it's been like this for as long as I can remember, and I don't mind it cuz I'm used to having to always correct the To: address field when I reply. I would just like some point of reference... to see other mailing lists that behave the same way as ours does.
C.
Clayton, Very well put. I've been on mailing lists since before there was linux, and I've set up and managed dozens of mailing lists, and I'm currently a member of about 40 lists, and over these decades on these various lists, *none* of them functioned/functions the way this one does. (Well, about a decade ago one of them sent replies to the OP, this was pointed out to the list management, and it was fixed in a day.) Advocates of the nonsensical suse method of list operations have told us and continue to tell us (tossing in insults along the way) that they're smarter than the rest of the world and so to change things to a sensible configuration would be making an admission they can't make. So this list will never change and people will never stop pointing out that it should be changed, users will continue to hear that they need to use some particular mail client in some singular way to read and reply to this particular list and that if they don't, they're stupid and all other lists in the world are stupid too. So we can't harbor any illusions that way this list (mal)functions will change. We're just going to have to live with it and the huge noise ratio it spawns. I've adopted a sense of humor about the whole thing. The so-called "experts" continually provide me a good chuckle. In fact, I'm hoping this list continue to operate in its peculiar fashion long enough for it to make it into a comedy sketch on TV (like one of the experts using ALL CAPS to make a simple technical misconfiguration, one he advocates, into a netiquette issue). Then, when my friends and acquaintances try to tell me about some hilarious show they saw on TV, I'll be able to say I was there and, yeah, it was really a hoot. -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Hi, On Friday 08 December 2006 17:05, ken wrote:
Advocates of the nonsensical suse method of list operations have told us and continue to tell us (tossing in insults along the way) that they're smarter than the rest of the world and so to change things to a sensible configuration would be making an admission they can't make. So this list will never change and people will never stop pointing out that it should be changed, users will continue to hear that they need to use some particular mail client in some singular way to read and reply to this particular list and that if they don't, they're stupid and all other lists in the world are stupid too.
So we can't harbor any illusions that way this list (mal)functions will change. We're just going to have to live with it
Right. Please "just live with it". It doesn't really matter what you or I or any other individual is convinced is the right way to do it (and there are arguments for both sides). It also doesn't matter how other list admins run their lists. What matters is what the list admin of this lists feels is the right setup. Nothing else really. That is unless ... ... unless he invites people to vote on this. And guess what: he did. And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago. Stop arguing about this please. Greetings from Stuhr hartmut -- Hartmut Meyer, NTS EMEA Partner Relationship Manager SUSE LINUX GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, D-90409 Nuernberg T: +49 421 3064385 - M: +49 179 2279480 F: +49 421 3064387 - hartmut.meyer@novell.com ---------------------------------------------------- SUSE® Linux Enterprise 10 - Your Linux is ready http://www.novell.com/linux
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
A perfect example of why democracy sucks. There are always some users who don't care, don't vote, vote wrong or whatnot. Oh, and you are not including all those future users that will subscribe later in the vote. (We could re-vote on a regular basis to workaround this.) Personally, I would have been more fine if the list administrator(s) dictated the new mode. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/08/2006 12:00 PM somebody named Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
A perfect example of why democracy sucks. There are always some users who don't care, don't vote, vote wrong or whatnot. Oh, and you are not including all those future users that will subscribe later in the vote. (We could re-vote on a regular basis to workaround this.) Personally, I would have been more fine if the list administrator(s) dictated the new mode.
-`J'
As Churchill said, democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other forms of government. And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.' Well, at least we don't have all those nasty vacation mails clogging up our emailboxes! :) -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 19:12, ken wrote:
On 12/08/2006 12:00 PM somebody named Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
A perfect example of why democracy sucks. There are always some users who don't care, don't vote, vote wrong or whatnot. Oh, and you are not including all those future users that will subscribe later in the vote. (We could re-vote on a regular basis to workaround this.) Personally, I would have been more fine if the list administrator(s) dictated the new mode.
-`J'
As I have said many many times before: I wish people who felt this strongly about these petty things would voice their complaints OFF-LINE. THESE "¤#"#¤" ¤% THREADS TAKE UP 50 MILLION PERCENT MORE BANDWIDTH AND IS A TRILLION TIMES MORE ANNOYING. "¤#¤%"Q¤% STOP IT
As Churchill said, democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other forms of government.
The actual quote is "No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms that have been tried from time to time" (Hansard, Nov. 11 1947) The main distinction being that something that has yet to be tried may be better. Personally I'm in favour of Plato's enlightened despot. it's just a pity that it doesn't work in practice Except on this mailing list, of course :)
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
This quote however I can't find. Nor any reference that the theory of relativity was renounced in Germany (there are many many things said about Germany in this period of history, but ineptitude in the physical sciences isn't one of them) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 2006/12/08 19:50 (GMT+0100) Anders Johansson apparently typed:
On Friday 08 December 2006 19:12, ken wrote:
As Churchill said, democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other forms of government.
The actual quote is "No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms that have been tried from time to time" (Hansard, Nov. 11 1947)
The main distinction being that something that has yet to be tried may be better.
The US Constitution didn't create a democracy. It created a republic. The only real powers its people have lie in the right to sue, and the power to vote for someone else next time, after the current bums have already taxed & spent into oblivion. -- "Let your conversation be always full of grace." Colossians 4:6 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/08/2006 03:33 PM somebody named Felix Miata wrote:
On 2006/12/08 19:50 (GMT+0100) Anders Johansson apparently typed:
On Friday 08 December 2006 19:12, ken wrote:
As Churchill said, democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other forms of government.
The actual quote is "No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms that have been tried from time to time" (Hansard, Nov. 11 1947)
The main distinction being that something that has yet to be tried may be better.
The US Constitution didn't create a democracy. It created a republic. The only real powers its people have lie in the right to sue, and the power to vote for someone else next time, after the current bums have already taxed & spent into oblivion.
Apparently you believe Churchill was referring to the US. Where did this belief come from? -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/08/2006 01:50 PM somebody named Anders Johansson wrote:
On Friday 08 December 2006 19:12, ken wrote:
On 12/08/2006 12:00 PM somebody named Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
...
As I have said many many times before: I wish people who felt this strongly about these petty things would voice their complaints OFF-LINE. THESE "¤#"#¤" ¤% THREADS TAKE UP 50 MILLION PERCENT MORE BANDWIDTH AND IS A TRILLION TIMES MORE ANNOYING. "¤#¤%"Q¤% STOP IT
Yes. Of course. (Except for the first person.)
....
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
This quote however I can't find. Nor any reference that the theory of relativity was renounced in Germany (there are many many things said about Germany in this period of history, but ineptitude in the physical sciences isn't one of them)
Anders, see <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein#World_War_II>: "In 1933, the Nazis passed "The Law of the Restoration of the Civil Service," which forced all Jewish university professors out of their jobs. Throughout the 1930s, a campaign to label Einstein's work as "Jewish physics"—in contrast with "German" or "Aryan physics"—was led by Nobel laureates Philipp Lenard and Johannes Stark. With the assistance of the SS, the Deutsche Physik supporters worked to publish pamphlets and textbooks denigrating Einstein's theories and attempted to politically blacklist German physicists who taught them, notably Werner Heisenberg." -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Dec 8 2006 13:12, ken wrote:
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
Haha I knew it! -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 08/12/06, Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 13:12, ken wrote:
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
Haha I knew it! -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law
I wonder why there is no reference to Stalin, Mao Tse Tung, Pol Pot, et al, and their arguably equally, or even, worse behaviour, on the majority of web lists. I also wonder why the site quoted, and apparently all the liberal left, can only cite Hitler and the Nazi party regime as being abhorrent. Perhaps we should be told. (Shields up) Terence -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 12:05, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 13:12, ken wrote:
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
Haha I knew it! -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law
I don't think this qualifies as a trigger of Godwin's law. No participant in the discussion was called a Nazi by another. Randall Schulz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Dec 8 2006 12:28, Randall R Schulz wrote:
On Friday 08 December 2006 12:05, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 13:12, ken wrote:
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
Haha I knew it! -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law
I don't think this qualifies as a trigger of Godwin's law. No participant in the discussion was called a Nazi by another.
True dat, but as you can no doubt see, it's always converging towards 1.0 ;-) -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 12:05, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 13:12, ken wrote:
And Einstein, when told that 2000 Nazi scientists had voted that the theory of relativity was wrong, said 'You cannot vote on what is the truth.'
Haha I knew it! -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law
I don't think this qualifies as a trigger of Godwin's law. No participant in the discussion was called a Nazi by another.
Randall Schulz So, if I understand the wikipedia article, if I call everyone involved with this discussion (except me of course) I lose automaticly and this
Randall R Schulz wrote: thread ends? Good! you're all post nazis!!! -- One day at a time, one second if that's what it takes -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 08:00, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
A perfect example of why democracy sucks. ... (We could re-vote on a regular basis to workaround this.)
So even the denouncer of democracy has nothing to suggest but more democracy!? -- _____________________________________ John Andersen
On Dec 8 2006 09:33, John Andersen wrote:
On Friday 08 December 2006 08:00, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
A perfect example of why democracy sucks. ... (We could re-vote on a regular basis to workaround this.)
So even the denouncer of democracy has nothing to suggest but more democracy!?
If we gonna stay with that mailing list democracy, at least make it more liberal. I can also vote every 4 years or so, as can all the people that have become 18 until then. OTOH, some elders died in that timespan. I say we need re-votes to update the position (as in Real World), _in case we stay with democracy_. That still allows me to prefer a non-democratic approach. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 11:00, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
A perfect example of why democracy sucks.
Yeah, give the *minority* what they want or else! sheesh. Go find a little chunk of land somewhere and become a dictator, but don't go telling the rest of us how things *should* be, just because *you* want it that way. -- Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented worker', is like calling a home intruder an 'unwanted houseguest'. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Fri December 8 2006 5:09 pm, JB skratched these words onto a coconut shell, hoping for an answer:
On Friday 08 December 2006 11:00, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
On Dec 8 2006 17:47, Hartmut Meyer wrote:
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
A perfect example of why democracy sucks.
Yeah, give the *minority* what they want or else! sheesh. Go find a little chunk of land somewhere and become a dictator, but don't go telling the rest of us how things *should* be, just because *you* want it that way.
"I want it that way is the only arbiter of truth" .... else we live someone else's lives. OTH , why is death a bar to voting? They even re-register to vote from their coffins in Chi as I recall... Humans are so petty... ;-D -- j Let freedom ring! Let the white dove sing. Let the whole world know that today is the day of reckoning. Let the weak be strong , let the might be wrong , throw the stones away, it's Independence Day. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/08/2006 11:47 AM somebody named Hartmut Meyer wrote:
Hi,
On Friday 08 December 2006 17:05, ken wrote:
Advocates of the nonsensical suse method of list operations have told us and continue to tell us (tossing in insults along the way) that they're smarter than the rest of the world and so to change things to a sensible configuration would be making an admission they can't make. So this list will never change and people will never stop pointing out that it should be changed, users will continue to hear that they need to use some particular mail client in some singular way to read and reply to this particular list and that if they don't, they're stupid and all other lists in the world are stupid too.
So we can't harbor any illusions that way this list (mal)functions will change. We're just going to have to live with it
Right. Please "just live with it".
It doesn't really matter what you or I or any other individual is convinced is the right way to do it (and there are arguments for both sides). It also doesn't matter how other list admins run their lists.
What matters is what the list admin of this lists feels is the right setup. Nothing else really. That is unless ...
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
Stop arguing about this please.
Greetings from Stuhr hartmut
I hope you feel better now... after telling me to do something I already said I was going to do. Thanks for the humor. Secondly, I wasn't arguing... said-- at length-- that, as silly as it is, we'd just have to live with it. That wasn't arguing. And guess what..? I didn't start this thread. (As if your haughty commands matter) am I not allowed to follow up on a post here? Moreover, I was about to let it drop... until you chose to reply to my post. (But I guess you can reply to my post, but I can't reply to someone else's post?!) You must believe you are the sole arbiter of who's allowed to post and/or reply. How Mitty-esque.... Thanks for the humor. Finally, I didn't mention anything about voting, but as long as you wish to expand the discussion to that, I didn't vote because I didn't hear about it because there's too much noise on this list to read every post or even every subject line (most of which have no relation to the content of the respective email anyway). So add one more vote (mine) for "Reply is reply to the list" (as if we could vote away non-sense). You have my permission to reply to this. :) -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 11:57, ken wrote:
On 12/08/2006 11:47 AM somebody named Hartmut Meyer wrote:
Hi,
On Friday 08 December 2006 17:05, ken wrote:
Advocates of the nonsensical suse method of list operations have told us and continue to tell us (tossing in insults along the way) that they're smarter than the rest of the world and so to change things to a sensible configuration would be making an admission they can't make. So this list will never change and people will never stop pointing out that it should be changed, users will continue to hear that they need to use some particular mail client in some singular way to read and reply to this particular list and that if they don't, they're stupid and all other lists in the world are stupid too.
So we can't harbor any illusions that way this list (mal)functions will change. We're just going to have to live with it
Right. Please "just live with it".
It doesn't really matter what you or I or any other individual is convinced is the right way to do it (and there are arguments for both sides). It also doesn't matter how other list admins run their lists.
What matters is what the list admin of this lists feels is the right setup. Nothing else really. That is unless ...
... unless he invites people to vote on this.
And guess what: he did.
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
Stop arguing about this please.
Greetings from Stuhr hartmut
<snip BS>
You have my permission to reply to this. :)
Great! Thank you, oh lord and dictator! Here is my reply, oh dreaded one who would have us whipped with cat-o'-nine tails if we do not follow your orders or question what must only be the correct sense to have in anything: <PLONK> -- Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented worker', is like calling a home intruder an 'unwanted houseguest'. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Hartmut Meyer wrote:
And guess again: the majority of voters wanted it the way it is now (the setup you disagree with). Go and search in the archives. It's just a few months ago.
??? I'm reading the suse-linux-e list since quite some time. I haven't seen a request for vote there. So I searched the archive at gmane, no result. There are regular discussions on that configuration, though. May it be that you forget that two lists were merged? And that quite some users have not been involved in any vote on the opensuse list? Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2006-12-08 at 11:05 -0500, ken wrote:
On 12/08/2006 01:57 AM somebody named Clayton wrote:
Clayton,
Very well put. I've been on mailing lists since before there was linux, and I've set up and managed dozens of mailing lists, and I'm currently a member of about 40 lists, and over these decades on these various lists, *none* of them functioned/functions the way this one does. (Well, about a decade ago one of them sent replies to the OP, this was pointed out to the list management, and it was fixed in a day.) Advocates of the nonsensical suse method of list operations have told us and continue to tell us (tossing in insults along the way) that they're smarter than the rest of the world and so to change things to a sensible configuration would be making an admission they can't make. So this list will never change and people will never stop pointing out that it should be changed, users will continue to hear that they need to use some particular mail client in some singular way to read and reply to this particular list and that if they don't, they're stupid and all other lists in the world are stupid too.
Thirty people jumped off of a cliff and killed themselves does this mean it is the right thing to do? Just because thirty other lists don't want to use the proper headers for lists doesn't make them right and this one wrong. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2006-12-08 at 07:57 +0100, Clayton wrote:
So.. can anyone point to any other mailing list that has Reply-to set the same as the opensuse lists? I would really like to see it...
sourceforge lists do not set it; yahoogroups does. Is yahoo linux or windows oriented? ;-) - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFFez8stTMYHG2NR9URApC9AJ9+SKgjIUYFjWcoGDM/zlx1lnNWzQCfcgZu D0112Yso8kR0hhhhj9ku+Wo= =SBmG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
* John Andersen <jsa@pen.homeip.net> [12-08-06 00:13]:
So pop gmail with kmail. Reply via smtp thru gmail.
NO, smtp thru your own provider or someone _other_ than gmail so you can see your own posts. -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 07/12/06, John Andersen <jsa@pen.homeip.net> wrote:
Fix gmail.
No problem. It might take me a few minutes though, so please be patient. :-) -- Michael Leuty Nottingham, UK -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
X-Mailinglist: opensuse List-Post: <mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org> <<<<<<<<------------<<< List-Help: <mailto:opensuse+help@opensuse.org> List-Subscribe: <mailto:opensuse+subscribe@opensuse.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org> List-Owner: <mailto:opensuse+owner@opensuse.org>
KMail knows how to handle a list.
Is this even portable? LKML sets this one X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 19:40, Michael Leuty wrote:
On 07/12/06, Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> wrote:
Fix the mailing list.
Yep. When I click on "Reply" in GMail, my reply is addressed to the individual, not the list.
-- Michael Leuty Nottingham, UK
Well, pressing 'L' in KMail automatically posts to the list :-). In GMail, you can press Reply-All and manually remove the personal address. S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 07/12/06, Stelian Iancu <stelian.iancu@gmx.net> wrote:
In GMail, you can press Reply-All and manually remove the personal address.
Thanks for the tip. -- Michael Leuty Nottingham, UK -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 18:31, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 08:51:11 -0800 From: Randall R Schulz <rschulz@sonic.net> To: opensuse@opensuse.org Subject: [opensuse] NO PERSONAL REPLIES TO POSTINGS ON THIS LIST!!
On Thursday 07 December 2006 08:44, you wrote:
its workin fine here.
For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies.
You have to be subscribed to post, hence its always completely redundant to send a direct copy in a reply.
Desist!
Fix the mailing list.
-`J' -- NOWT wrong with the list it's the crappy mail programs at fault and bone idle people that only understand the windBloZe way i spose i could say with consumate ease and safety RFTM in which ever of the 2 variants i know of you choose to pick ..
Pete Kmail 1.9.3 with no list mail problems at all and member of around 15 lists .. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Peter Nikolic wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 18:31, Jan Engelhardt wrote:
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2006 08:51:11 -0800 From: Randall R Schulz <rschulz@sonic.net> To: opensuse@opensuse.org Subject: [opensuse] NO PERSONAL REPLIES TO POSTINGS ON THIS LIST!!
On Thursday 07 December 2006 08:44, you wrote:
its workin fine here.
For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies.
You have to be subscribed to post, hence its always completely redundant to send a direct copy in a reply.
Desist!
Fix the mailing list.
-`J' --
NOWT wrong with the list it's the crappy mail programs at fault and bone idle people that only understand the windBloZe way i spose i could say with consumate ease and safety RFTM in which ever of the 2 variants i know of you choose to pick ..
Pete
Kmail 1.9.3 with no list mail problems at all and member of around 15 lists ..
Surely, some self-discipline needed here? I always try to ensure that, in my Thunderbird compose screen, the Reply-to and to addresses are always the list. It would be great if TB did it for me but once you get into the habit it comes pretty easily I find. BTW, I checked this reply VERY carefully :-) J NB a bad workman blames his tools, does a lazy programmer blame Windoze? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Gee, thank you, all-caps, extra exclamation points, angry guy for bringing up this thread again and for so vituperatively insisting that 2000+ people here change their email clients and then configure those mail clients just for the way this one, lonely mailing list is set up and which is different than all the other mailing lists in the world. Ha, ha, ha, Ho, ho, ho. -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
* ken <gebser@speakeasy.net> [12-07-06 18:44]:
Gee, thank you, all-caps, extra exclamation points, angry guy for bringing up this thread again and for so vituperatively insisting that 2000+ people here change their email clients and then configure those mail clients just for the way this one, lonely mailing list is set up and which is different than all the other mailing lists in the world.
and _you_ only show what _you_ know.... -- Patrick Shanahan Registered Linux User #207535 http://wahoo.no-ip.org @ http://counter.li.org HOG # US1244711 Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
its workin fine here. For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies. You're right, and I'm sorry to have done this stupid mistake, I hate too
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 07/12/06 17:51, Randall R Schulz wrote: this bad habit. But why the hell the list manager doesn't set reply-to header to the list? I've been member of many ML in ten years and recently I see that this simple measure is no more taken. Is this to mitigate spamming? - -- Hoper (aka QED) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFeGENH+Dh0Dl5XacRA7WsAJ4j3u8TCV53L+8mOM1CY5hu/AVF/gCffQvM M2OO+yuViRI4NoEj5gtds2U= =tqpz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 10:44, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
... But why the hell the list manager doesn't set reply-to header to the list? I've been member of many ML in ten years and recently I see that this simple measure is no more taken. Is this to mitigate spamming? --
Because then people who want to use the Reply-To header, which belongs to message originators, _not_ list reflectors, cannot do so.
Hoper (aka QED)
RRS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 11:44, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
But why the hell the list manager doesn't set reply-to header to the list?
It should not be set. Everyone that managed a mailing-list long enough knows what happens when Reply-To is set to the list and the vacation season comes. Someone sets those automatic replies telling you that they are at some beach and will return a month later. The response goes to the list and starts an infinite loop. Adding to that, list members start sending replies to the list asking why are they getting those replies and each one triggers a new reply from the guy and we all go crazy, while he is sleeping in a hammock drinking caipirinha. Oh, and this usually happens on a Friday, when all list admins also left for a deserved weekend break... Carlos FL -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Carlos F Lange wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 11:44, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
But why the hell the list manager doesn't set reply-to header to the list?
It should not be set. Everyone that managed a mailing-list long enough knows what happens when Reply-To is set to the list and the vacation season comes. Someone sets those automatic replies telling you that they are at some beach and will return a month later. The response goes to the list and starts an infinite loop.
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens. I'm on dozens of mailing list that _have_ the reply-to field set and this doesn't happen there. That's not the reason for not setting the Reply-To. The reason is that the poster cannot set it. That said -- I don't care about the configuration this list, as I read it via gmane-NNTP anyhow, and there I have proper Newsgroup functionality. :-) Cheers, Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Dec 7 2006 22:15, Joachim Schrod wrote:
Carlos F Lange wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 11:44, Hoper Edei Deixai wrote:
But why the hell the list manager doesn't set reply-to header to the list?
It should not be set. Everyone that managed a mailing-list long enough knows what happens when Reply-To is set to the list and the vacation season comes. Someone sets those automatic replies telling you that they are at some beach and will return a month later. The response goes to the list and starts an infinite loop.
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens.
Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall best solution! -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
"JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
[vacation messages sent to lists]
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens.
JE> Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way JE> so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall JE> best solution! To rely on every person to configure their mail environment correctly is not a solution, IMNSHO. One needs to tackle that on the one place where one can address the problem; at the mailing list software. To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12: be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others. Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel. Actually, your email -- that you replied to me personally as well with this general discussion remark, and not only to the list as would have been proper -- showed clearly that it's of no use to rely on end users to get replies to the list right. This is a matter for mailing list software; it can be and is done properly on many mailing lists, but not on opensuse-*. QED. Regards, Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2006-12-08 at 02:04 +0100, Joachim Schrod wrote:
"JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
[vacation messages sent to lists]
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens.
JE> Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way JE> so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall JE> best solution!
To rely on every person to configure their mail environment correctly is not a solution, IMNSHO. One needs to tackle that on the one place where one can address the problem; at the mailing list software.
Wrong. Everyone _IS_ responsible for their own configuration. To do otherwise promotes sloppiness, kinda like MS does it. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Dec 8 2006 02:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12:
be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others.
Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel.
You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in less than average of the browsers. Especially when it comes to security, e.g. firewalls, it's better to turn the RFC quote: Be conservative in what you accept and be liberal in what you do. [http://jengelh.hopto.org/p/jen_ipfw/TECH.txt] Meaning: block all network packets that could potentially be harm and pro-actively try to stop any spammer using non-compliant probing techniques. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
"JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
JE> On Dec 8 2006 02:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12:
be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others.
Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel.
JE> You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting JE> broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in JE> less than average of the browsers. And, so what? It made the Internet usable for millions of users. And, for the record, I think that's a Good Thing(tm). I'm again that elitism that would have prevented my mother, aged 71, to be able to learn sending emails and surfing the Net three years ago when she retired. She will never understand that there's a difference between a Web browser and a Mail client, that's completely blurred to her, it's all `that Internet thingy' -- but so what? Who cares, as long as she can communicate with her relatives? JE> Especially when it comes to JE> security, e.g. firewalls, it's better to turn the RFC quote: JE> Be conservative in what you accept and be JE> liberal in what you do. JE> [http://jengelh.hopto.org/p/jen_ipfw/TECH.txt] I have worked for more than 10 years as CEO of a security consulting company, I work on the Internet since 1992 and have been a member of several IETF working groups, and I have planned the connection of whole countries to the Internet. From my experience, I can only say: To use that sentence in the context of firewalls is not sensible, and seems to be made tongue-in-cheek without thinking it through. Be liberal in what you do? E.g., allowing broken IP packets to leave one's network? E.g., with spoofed source IP addresses? E.g., allowing outgoing IRC packets for all systems? Or any other outgoing connections that does not conform to business and usage rules? Like, you know, those connections that enables bot networks in the first place because it allows them to be controlled from the outside. If more institutions, people, and operating systems default installations would implement egress filtering, we would have much less security problems in the first place. And you tell me that my attitude brings us bad HTML pages? Your attitude helps to build bot networks and hackers. You can guess yourself what I think is worse. Joachim PS: Please reply to the list. I don't consider this a private discussion. -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Dec 8 2006 12:21, Joachim Schrod wrote:
JE> You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting JE> broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in JE> less than average of the browsers. JE> Especially when it comes to JE> security, e.g. firewalls, it's better to turn the RFC quote:
JE> Be conservative in what you accept and be JE> liberal in what you do. JE> [http://jengelh.hopto.org/p/jen_ipfw/TECH.txt]
Be liberal in what you do?
E.g., allowing broken IP packets to leave one's network? E.g., with spoofed source IP addresses? E.g., allowing outgoing IRC packets for all systems?
Well, while not spoofing stuff. Locking out spammers is a simple combination of randomly replying and not-replying to their packets. That does not imply any of the three examples above.
And you tell me that my attitude brings us bad HTML pages?
Partly. One problem is that RFCs have too many SHOULDs in them rather than MUSTs. Another problem is that implementations sometimes don't even obey the SHOULDs and implement something as COULDs. (This is probably what I really intended to say.)
Your attitude helps to build bot networks and hackers.
What's bad in slowing down unwanted nmap scans?
PS: Please reply to the list. I don't consider this a private discussion.
PS: I did Reply-To-All (it's gone to both), since I don't yet have the procmail recipe in. -`J' -- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
Joachim Schrod wrote: I hate to reply to myself, but I forgot:
To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12:
be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others.
Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel.
JE> You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting JE> broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in JE> less than average of the browsers.
JE> Especially when it comes to JE> security, e.g. firewalls, it's better to turn the RFC quote:
JE> Be conservative in what you accept and be JE> liberal in what you do. JE> [http://jengelh.hopto.org/p/jen_ipfw/TECH.txt]
A tip: you might want to read the early RFCs at some time. They are really valuable. `To be liberal in what you accept from others' does NOT mean to accept any service request from the outside and keep every connection open. In fact, to re-interpret that sentence as meaning that one should accept all incoming connections and keep all services open is against the RFC intentions, and a blatant attempt at a history rewrite. The cited principle realizes robustness; it means to be able to handle misformed connection attempts and protocol contents properly, without going into inconsistent states of one's software. E.g., to be able to handle misformed IP packets, or to be able to handle requests that are outside the FSA of a protocol. We really don't want inconsistent states in our software because somebody violates the SSL protocol; or the SMTP protocol, for that matter. That kind of attitude leaves us without robust software and brings us security holes. Robustness, as urged by Jon Postel in this sentence, is urgently needed in all our security-related software and nothing to mock about. As it is, Jon knew more about the Internet and how to create a robust and secure network than you. (And, in fact, more than I; I met him, I know and accept it.) Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 08 December 2006 05:21, Joachim Schrod wrote:
"JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
JE> On Dec 8 2006 02:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12:
be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others.
Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel.
JE> You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting JE> broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in JE> less than average of the browsers.
And, so what? It made the Internet usable for millions of users. And, for the record, I think that's a Good Thing(tm). I'm again that elitism that would have prevented my mother, aged 71, to be able to learn sending emails and surfing the Net three years ago when she retired. She will never understand that there's a difference between a Web browser and a Mail client, that's completely blurred to her, it's all `that Internet thingy' -- but so what? Who cares, as long as she can communicate with her relatives?
So it's better to just hop out to the computer store and get an old person a $600 phone (re computer)? My mom's 68, and she pays attention to what I explain about something like this and then corrects her behavior. She doesn't want to just have a $600 phone, she also wants to do many other things with a computer...and does! All you're perpetuating is laziness, stupidity and sloppiness, by telling anyone who has the money to just 'go get a computer and screw how things are and should be done, just do whatever the hell you want and be a grinning happy idiot'. -- Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented worker', is like calling a home intruder an 'unwanted houseguest'. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
JB wrote:
On Friday 08 December 2006 05:21, Joachim Schrod wrote:
> "JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
JE> On Dec 8 2006 02:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
To quote Jon Postel in RFC 761, the TCP definition from Januay 1980, the last two lines on page 12:
be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others.
Words to keep in mind, they served us well in more than 25 years -- RIP Jon Postel.
JE> You know where this RFC attitude brought us - Web browsers accepting JE> broken HTML, resulting in sloppy non-standard pages that display in JE> less than average of the browsers.
And, so what? It made the Internet usable for millions of users. And, for the record, I think that's a Good Thing(tm). I'm again that elitism that would have prevented my mother, aged 71, to be able to learn sending emails and surfing the Net three years ago when she retired. She will never understand that there's a difference between a Web browser and a Mail client, that's completely blurred to her, it's all `that Internet thingy' -- but so what? Who cares, as long as she can communicate with her relatives?
So it's better to just hop out to the computer store and get an old person a $600 phone (re computer)?
What you're writing is complete and utter garbage. Read my words again -- I never wrote that my mother uses her computer only as a phone. I wrote that she doesn't care for technical implementation details because the _functionality_ is important to her, and not _how_ it is done. And that's the right way for users who are not geeks. I don't know how my BMW works in detail either; and I doubt that I could learn it in acceptable time. And I don't know the technical difference to a Mercedes or an Audi either. Nevertheless I'm able to drive more than 40,000km per year, without any accident for many years. It's long time that computers have that kind of user experience as well, and that we only need to know what's "below the hood" when we are really interested in it. Joachim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 19:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
"JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
[vacation messages sent to lists]
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens.
JE> Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way JE> so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall JE> best solution!
To rely on every person to configure their mail environment correctly is not a solution, IMNSHO. One needs to tackle that on the one place where one can address the problem; at the mailing list software.
So the app programmer has to make those who aren't lazy or stupid, pay by making an app just *for* lazy and stupid people? Doesn't that just condone and perpetuate laziness and stupidity? -- Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented worker', is like calling a home intruder an 'unwanted houseguest'. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 12/08/2006 04:21 PM somebody named JB wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 19:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
> "JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes: [vacation messages sent to lists]
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens. JE> Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way JE> so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall JE> best solution!
To rely on every person to configure their mail environment correctly is not a solution, IMNSHO. One needs to tackle that on the one place where one can address the problem; at the mailing list software.
So the app programmer has to make those who aren't lazy or stupid, pay by making an app just *for* lazy and stupid people? Doesn't that just condone and perpetuate laziness and stupidity?
Joachim, you make a great point, one which should be obvious. Apparently, quite a few people here believe that the more difficult it is to configure something, e.g., a mail client, the better. JB, laziness and stupidity have nothing to do with Joachim's argument. Someone might be an artistic genius or a history scholar or some other quite intelligent person and not conversant with mail client configuration and not inclined to spend time and energy on something which should be easy. More complicated is not better. Joachim is right. Who would want to buy a car or radio or TV or binoculars if, when they got it home, they had to mess with it to get it functioning properly? Your understanding of technology is rather myopic. -- "Peace hath her victories no less renown'd than war." --John Milton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
JB wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 19:04, Joachim Schrod wrote:
> "JE" == Jan Engelhardt <jengelh@linux01.gwdg.de> writes:
[vacation messages sent to lists]
Any decent mailing list software will filter out these messages. Get a better mailing list software if that happens.
JE> Or better yet: have the user configure their mail blurb in a way JE> so that it does not autoreply to lists, which would be the overall JE> best solution!
To rely on every person to configure their mail environment correctly is not a solution, IMNSHO. One needs to tackle that on the one place where one can address the problem; at the mailing list software.
So the app programmer has to make those who aren't lazy or stupid, pay by making an app just *for* lazy and stupid people? Doesn't that just condone and perpetuate laziness and stupidity?
Of course, I hope that laziness is perpetuated. Every good programmer is lazy, that's why he writes programs - to let computers do the work that I abhor. Why should I do something that a computer can do as well? And if you think that `the need to avoid thinking how to use an application because it Just Works(tm)' is `perpetuating stupidity' because the users are not forced to think deeply how to use their MUA any more -- well, yes, then I'm for perpetuating stupidity as well. I don't think that this kind of thinking is time well spent and I would rather read a good book instead. When I read these kind of arguments, I understand why Apple users are so snobists when they look at Linux -- and they are right, damned! Joachim PS: As I wrote already, the solution is actually to use gmane, where a sane interface as a newsgroup is available. -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Joachim Schrod Email: jschrod@acm.org Roedermark, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 07 December 2006 16:51, Randall R Schulz wrote:
On Thursday 07 December 2006 08:44, you wrote:
its workin fine here.
For god's sake, stop sending me direct replies.
You have to be subscribed to post, hence its always completely redundant to send a direct copy in a reply.
Desist!
RRS
In the name of all that's holy please don't start this evil thread again. -- Fergus Wilde Chetham's Library Long Millgate Manchester M3 1SB Tel: 0161 834 7961 Fax: 0161 839 5797 http://www.chethams.org.uk -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
participants (31)
-
Anders Johansson -
Bruce Ferrell -
Carlos E. R. -
Carlos F Lange -
Clayton -
Felix Miata -
Fergus Wilde -
George Stoianov -
Hartmut Meyer -
Hoper Edei Deixai -
J Sloan -
James Tremblay -
Jan Engelhardt -
JB -
jfweber＠gilweber.com -
Joachim Schrod -
John -
John Andersen -
John Pierce -
Kai Ponte -
ken -
Kenneth Schneider -
Michael Leuty -
Patrick Shanahan -
Peter Nikolic -
Randall R Schulz -
Rob Unsworth -
Stelian Iancu -
Sylvester Lykkehus -
Terence -
Thomas Hertweck