Well, pretty much Solaris and SuSE are layed out very much the same. SuSE has always taken the SysV layout..ie..using /opt and other directories as Solaris does. I only know this because I've been an admin on about 150 Sun servers (4 clusters) for the last year. It's pretty close. You have understand that it won't be exact because SuSE's trying very hard to adhere to the LSB which of course Sun will not do with Solaris. For the most part this is why I picked SuSE all those years ago..because it was the closest Linux distribution to Solaris which is SystemV. Cheers! * gahn (ipfreak@yahoo.com) [020419 01:26]: ::Hi: :: ::Thanks for the replay. :: ::here is why I feel it was chaotic ... ::I know a bit of SUN solaris structure, but by no means ::as an expert. actually I didn't talk about those top ::directories, those top directories are pretty puch of ::same for all UNIX or alike systems. i meant those ::software being installed ... :: ::--- Anders Johansson ::wrote: ::> On Friday 19 April 2002 07:18, gahn wrote: ::> > Hi: ::> > ::> > My suse linux came with the second hand machine. ::> One ::> > thing I noticed is that the chaotic file ::> structure: ::> ::> Chaotic compared to what? ::> ::> > ::> > host :# find / -name lib -print ::> > ::> > /lib ::> ::> System libraries essential to get the system ::> booting. :: ::ok, but why not conbine with /usr/lib? Sun OS used to ::be like that ...very detailed and complicated... :: ::> ::> > /opt/kde/lib ::> > /opt/kde2/lib ::> ::> These have been debated. SuSE believes that kde is ::> an "optional extra" and the ::> Filesystem Hierarchy Standard (FHS) dictates that ::> such software store its ::> executables and libraries in their own directory ::> under /opt. This is as ::> opposed to windows where everything under the sun ::> goes into C:\WINDOWS. See ::> info on the net about the FHS on ::> http://www.pathname.com/fhs/ ::> ::> Other distributions, notably RedHat and Mandrake, ::> hold that kde and gnome are ::> essential parts of the system, and store the files ::> in the /usr directory. ::> ::> Both sides have valid points and only time, and some ::> fiery debates in the LSB ::> community, will tell who's right. :: ::Thanks for telling me this. what is the default ::desktop for Suse? Suse shoudl choose one default ::desktop and put it under /usr/whateverdesktop. then ::put other types of desktops under /opt :: ::I just looked redhat file structure and it was sort of ::like sun's /usr/openwin ... :: ::> ::> > /opt/kde2/share/apps/ksgmltools2/docbook/xsl/lib ::> > /opt/gnome/lib ::> > ::> ::/opt/gnome/share/sgml/docbock/xsl-stylesheets-1.29/lib ::> > /opt/dosemu/freedos/help/lib ::> > /opt/netscape/plugins/java2/lib :: ::Well this was what i felt "chaotic". never mind, i am ::newbie here, but just my opinon....:) :: ::> > /var/lib :: ::well, the way of naming confused me ...I thought it ::was some sort of library directory ... :: ::> ::> The /var hierarchy contains files that can vary in ::> size and content. The idea ::> is that trees like /usr and /etc can, after the ::> initial config, be mounted ::> read-only, say from a CD-rom for instance, to limit ::> the damage that crackers ::> can cause. /var/lib, according to the fhs contains ::> data about a system's or ::> program's state. ::> ::> > /var/X11R6/lib :: ::/var should really be reserved for thsoe dynamic files :: ::> ::> /var/X11R6/lib shouldn't exist according to the FHS. ::> It is I believe a SuSE ::> idea to handle X 3.x, where you had several ::> different X-servers, one for each ::> graphics card. It shouldn't be necessary anymore ::> with X 4. ::> :: ::Thanks. I was confused on this too .. :: ::> > /usr/lib ::> ::> /usr/lib and its subdirectories hold essential ::> internal libraries the system ::> needs to run. Some packages create subdirectories ::> for the things they and no ::> other package use, hence the multitude below. ::> :: ::yeah .. thanks. :: ::> > /usr/lib/qt/lib ::> > ::> :: ::here was what I really think it was confusing ...why ::qt needs own sudirectory ... lib under /usr/lib? my ::understanding was qt is a part of kde and why not stay ::in /opt/kde2/lib? or has own directory under /opt/qt ::but soft links its files in /opt/kde2/lib? ::just a thought ... :: ::>>/usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.6.1/i586-linux/Tk/demos/widtrib/lib :: ::well, the "perl" and "tk/tcl" may not belong to the ::core here. Should they stay either in /opt or ::/usr/local? they are not credical in any means ... :: :: ::> > /usr/lib/apache/lib ::> > /usr/lib/heimdal/lib ::> > /usr/lib/qt-2.3.2/lib ::> > /usr/lib/jdk1.1.8/lib ::> > /usr/lib/jdk1.3.1/jre/lib ::> > /usr/lib/jdk1.3.1/lib ::> > /usr/lib/JSDK2.0/lib :: ::I really don't see how those packages have become a ::part of UNIX core system. apache is web server; any ::unix susyem won't need java and its tool kits to ::survive; I would like to see them either in /usr/local ::or /opt :: ::> > /usr/src/linux-2.4.16.SuSE/lib ::> ::> /usr/src are source files. The naming of source ::> files varies from developer to ::> developer. It has no effect at all on the running ::> system. ::> :: ::Maybe those files shoudl be in /opt/sources or just ::/sources so that users can make a separate partion ::just to store those sources files. It would be a lot ::of easier to manage file system ... :: :: ::> > /usr/i686-pc-linux-gnu/lib ::> ::> No idea about this. Presumably it's some hot, ::> optimized version of glibc that ::> the previous owner compiled. ::> :: ::I see ... thanks :: ::> > /usr/X11R6/lib ::> ::> libraries relating to the X window system and ::> packages running under X. ::> :: ::like /usr/openwin ... /usr/X11 in BSD system? :: ::> > /usr/games/lib ::> ::> Libraries belonging to games (and educational ::> packages) ::> :: ::yeah ..solaris also use this directory, but i think it ::would be better to put under /opt :: ::> > /usr/local/lib ::> ::> /usr/local is a tree where you put software you ::> install yourself, as opposed ::> to software you get from the distributor. /usr/local ::> is guaranteed to not be ::> overwritten by system upgrades. /usr/local/lib are ::> libraries belonging to ::> such software. ::> :: ::I agree, but here is the problem. some packages on my ::system I am using has multiple copies ... in /usr, ::/usr/local ... :: ::when i was in grad school (i majored in ::telecommunication), one of classes was operating ::system, whcih actually was UNIX system (there was no ::windows back then). i remeber taht unix core was very ::small and efficient ... :: :: ::> > /usr/share/doc/susehilf/lib ::> > /usr/share/ssl/lib ::> > ::> :: ::thsoe files seem to me should be in /usr/local :: ::>>/usr/share/sgml/docbook/docbook-dsssl-stylesheets-1.72/doc/lib ::> > ::> ::/usr/share/sgml/docbook/docbook-dsssl-stylesheets-1.72/lib ::> > ::> ::/usr/share/sgml/docbook/docbook-xsl-stylesheets-1.42/doc/lib ::> > ::> ::/usr/share/sgml/docbook/docbook-xsl-stylesheets-1.42/lib ::> > ::> ::/usr/share/sgml/docbook/docbook-xsl-stylesheets-1.42/docsrc/lib ::> > /usr/share/vtcl/lib ::> > /usr/share/ghostscript/6.51/lib ::> ::> /usr/share is for read-only data that isn't ::> architecture dependant. ::> :: ::thanks. again why don't put them under /usr/local? ::make a separate partiton for /usr/local :: ::> > /usr/i486-suse-linux/lib ::> > /usr/i486-linux/lib ::> ::> These are for compatibility with older systems. They ::> contain libc5 libraries. ::> :: ::ok ... thanks. :: ::> > ::> > This is just one example. Is this specific for ::> suse ::> > linux or linux in general? Or it was the work of ::> > previous owner of the machine? ::> ::> What you describe as chaotic I would describe as ::> structured and sorted. It's ::> just a question of knowing what everything means. ::> read up on the FHS I linked ::> to above. I think you'll come away with a new ::> appreciation of Unix, and ::> understand why this is better than simply lumping ::> everything in C:\WINNT ::> :: ::Thanks, i will read them .... honestly I have put a ::lot of hours on linux and did a lot of readings on the ::net ... my problem is that I don't CDs so that i don't ::want mess up. of course i can reinstall it via ::internet, but it would be hassle for me right now. :: ::btw, by no means I am good at UNIX. The reason I know ::a bit is that I have been using UNIX for years. For my ::group, we have one sun station and one pc for each ::engineer. Most of my work are done via UNIX station, ::pc is just for documetes. :: ::Thanks for the help. I will keep learning from your ::guys ..... :: :: ::best regards :: ::_gahn :: :: :: ::__________________________________________________ ::Do You Yahoo!? ::Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax ::http://taxes.yahoo.com/ :: ::-- ::To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com ::For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com ::Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com :: -=Ben --=====-----=====-- mailto:ben@whack.org --=====-- "I've never been quarantined. But the more I look around the more I think it might not be a bad thing." -GC --=====-----=====--

http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/unixnut3/desc.html Solaris would fall under this and to some extent Linux. I could write a book on the subject..oh wait O'Reilly already did. The other standard in Unix is BSD.. The difference is usually in the inits and filesystem layout..among other things. SysV is a classification for Unix systems. Cheers! and Happy reading. * Bryan Tyson (bryantyson@earthlink.net) [020419 20:28]: ::On Friday 19 April 2002 15:02, Ben wrote: :: ::> SuSE's trying very hard to adhere to the LSB which of course Sun will ::> not do with Solaris. For the most part this is why I picked SuSE all ::> those years ago..because it was the closest Linux distribution to ::> Solaris which is SystemV. :: ::What is System V? An OS, or some sort of standard? Thank you. -=Ben --=====-----=====-- mailto:ben@whack.org --=====-- "I've never been quarantined. But the more I look around the more I think it might not be a bad thing." -GC --=====-----=====--

There are several System V standards (eg svid 3 and svid 4). The other Unix standard is Unix95 and Unix98. The Open Group (http://www.opengroup.org/) owns the Unix brand. These standards are primarily BSD. The problem in the Unix areana is that each vendor took either the AT&T System V branch or the Berkeley (BSD) branch (With branched off of Unix Version 6 which predates System V). Many BSD innovations were imported to System V. Additionally, each vendor did its own thing. Today, most of the commercial Unixen brand either System V or Unix95 or Unix98. Branding is expensive and requires a suite of tests. The tests cover the behavior of commands, the location of the commands, the various APIs, and to some extent system administration. While there is an effort to standardize Linux, each distro has its own quirks. On 19 Apr 2002 at 21:50, gahn wrote:

I thnik that the possible reasons for thsoe chaotic linux file structure is not the problem of whether complying the standard or not. Those vendores want to sell their products, so they combine vast number of software apckeges and claim those are credical for linux. look, they even put apache

server under /usr, or perl, or tk/tcl... The original unix core was small and efficient ...

Ben Rosenberg wrote: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/unixnut3/desc.html

Solaris would fall under this and to some extent Linux. I could write a book on the subject..oh wait O'Reilly already did.

The other standard in Unix is BSD..

The difference is usually in the inits and filesystem layout..among other things. SysV is a classification for Unix systems.

Cheers! and Happy reading.

* Bryan Tyson (bryantyson@earthlink.net) [020419 20:28]: ::On Friday 19 April 2002 15:02, Ben wrote: :: ::> SuSE's trying very hard to adhere to the LSB which of course Sun will ::> not do with Solaris. For the most part this is why I picked SuSE all ::> those years ago..because it was the closest Linux distribution to ::> Solaris which is SystemV. :: ::What is System V? An OS, or some sort of standard? Thank you.

-=Ben

--=====-----=====-- mailto:ben@whack.org --=====-- "I've never been quarantined. But the more I look around the more I think it might not be a bad thing." -GC --=====-----=====--

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--------------------------------- Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more

-- Jerry Feldman Portfolio Partner Engineering 508-467-4315 http://www.testdrive.compaq.com/linux/ Compaq Computer Corp. 200 Forest Street MRO1-3/F1 Marlboro, Ma. 01752

* Patrick (tracerb@sprintmail.com) [020419 08:04]:

He is a walking encyclopedia of Linux knowledge and SuSE Linux in particular! I think SuSE should hire him as a standard help desk contact! :o)

I wish. -- -ckm