I've got a strange one here. I've got two laptops. On one, I did a 'clean' install of SuSE 7.1 personal. On the second, I had SuSE 6.4 running, which I updated with the 7.1 personal CDs, then updated again from the SuSE FTP server (over 500 packages which I had installed from 6.4, which were not included in the 'personal' package) Now the problem: On the system which I 'updated' twice, I now can't dialout from a user account. I got 'permission denied', and I noticed that /dev/modem wasn't owned by group 'dialout', so I changed that, but I continued to get the same error. The user is in group 'dialout'. I tried kppp, and it returned an error 'can't create modem lock file', which also sounds like a permission problem. Checking the logs, I see a note about 'can't find module char-major-108', which upon checking /etc/modules.conf, I find is an alias for ppp-async.o . A 'locate ppp-async.o' turns up no hits on the upgraded system, but is present on the 'clean' 7.1 install. Checking rpm -qf, I find it was part of the k_deflt package. Now here's where it gets strange - I can't find that package anywhere on the 7.1 personal CDs! I looked thru the base packages, and the net packages, and even browsed thru the 'index of all packages' (in yast1), and I find no packages beginning 'k_' at all! But I know that it must be there, since I only used those CD's when installing 7.1 on the other laptop. Anyone with an idea where I should look next? -- Rick Green "I have the heart of a little child, and the brain of a genius. ... and I keep them in a jar under my bed"