[opensuse] Re: Getting tired of personal attacks and bad behaviour on thi s list
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 14:29:05 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
Jim Henderson wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jun 2012 17:00:48 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
I'm merely stating historical facts which are well document in the archives of this list.
Your objection is that I wrote something which isn't all happy happy joy joy about the KDE4 team.
No. My objection is that you decided to engaged in a protracted personal attack against one member of the KDE4 team.
I never did any such thing. Not only that, but you specifically got your nose all out of joint BEFORE I replied to C's smug "how dare you talk about the past behavior of us on the KDE4 team" reponse.
Look, Aaron, you have called that member of the KDE4 team a liar in the past. You've been stumping on that (and have been thrown off this list multiple times) for years. (Yes, I knew who I was actually talking to some time ago - your MO is unmistakeable.) What's more, there's nothing one who you have tarred with that label can do to have it removed in your mind. They can't undo the past. They can only acknowledge it (which you claim they have done) and move forward.
Now you're one of the liars, too, Jim. However, that you would eventually join the chorus of lies doesn't surprise me. Your very first reply to me was over your objection to anybody writing the truth.
No, it was not an objection to anybody writing the truth. It was about your overly offensive way of presenting your view of the truth. As it has been in the past, and as it probably will continue to be in the future. Your first reply was essentially "you need to install KDE3 to get this functionality back". Completely helpful and useful advice. When asked about getting it in KDE4, instead of saying something like "No, that functionality won't be part of KDE4 according to the dev team", you launched into a tired old rant that gave you away. What you fail to understand is that even if one assumes you have a valid point, your way of presenting that point does absolutely nothing to help your credibility in doing that. You continue to be offensive and engage in ad hominem attacks to try to get your point across. As I have said to you in the past, you spend a LOT of energy on this and surely you must expect to get something out of it. So use your energy in a way that actually changes things rather than in the way that you do - which changes NOTHING. You clearly have passion about openSUSE, or you wouldn't (a) continually try to work around the fact that you've been banned from this list multiple times, and (b) continue to bring up things you see as a problem. If you expect something to change, you can't bludgeon your way to fixing it. Shouting "You are all liars!" into a room full of people you want to convince to change a behaviour for is counterproductive, and is likely to get you thrown out of the room (again). If you don't expect anything to change and can't be bothered to employ a technique that actually can effect a change, then you should find something that DOES make you happy. Unless getting banned from the list repeatedly is some sort of trophy for you that brings you tremendous joy and satisfaction - in which case, I'm sure the list admins will be more than happy to oblige you with again. Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Jim Henderson wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 14:29:05 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
Jim Henderson wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jun 2012 17:00:48 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
I'm merely stating historical facts which are well document in the archives of this list.
Your objection is that I wrote something which isn't all happy happy joy joy about the KDE4 team.
No. My objection is that you decided to engaged in a protracted personal attack against one member of the KDE4 team.
I never did any such thing. Not only that, but you specifically got your nose all out of joint BEFORE I replied to C's smug "how dare you talk about the past behavior of us on the KDE4 team" reponse.
Look, Aaron, you have called that member of the KDE4 team a liar in the past. You've been stumping on that (and have been thrown off this list multiple times) for years. (Yes, I knew who I was actually talking to some time ago - your MO is unmistakeable.)
The KDE4 team admitted to it. In fact, they proclaimed it. Now stop acting like a fool. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 16:21:37 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
Look, Aaron, you have called that member of the KDE4 team a liar in the past. You've been stumping on that (and have been thrown off this list multiple times) for years. (Yes, I knew who I was actually talking to some time ago - your MO is unmistakeable.)
The KDE4 team admitted to it. In fact, they proclaimed it.
So, assuming your assertion is correct, what do you hope to achieve by continuing to bring this up? If, as you assert, they admitted to it, there's nothing more to be done. They "came clean". So continuing to resurrect that old debate is pointless and counterproductive. They can't undo what they did. They can acknowledge it and move on, which you seem to admit they have done. Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Jim Henderson wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 16:21:37 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
Look, Aaron, you have called that member of the KDE4 team a liar in the past. You've been stumping on that (and have been thrown off this list multiple times) for years. (Yes, I knew who I was actually talking to some time ago - your MO is unmistakeable.)
The KDE4 team admitted to it. In fact, they proclaimed it.
So, assuming your assertion is correct, what do you hope to achieve by continuing to bring this up? If, as you assert, they admitted to it, there's nothing more to be done. They "came clean".
So continuing to resurrect that old debate is pointless and counterproductive. They can't undo what they did. They can acknowledge it and move on, which you seem to admit they have done.
It speaks to character -- or in this case, the lack of it. They weren't apologetic -- they were proud of their lies. And they still haven't owned up to the lie that KDE4 was missing KDE3 functionality because it was "written from scratch". You don't have to "rip out code" for desktop icons or anything else, if, as they claimed, they were writing the code from scratch. Nope, that was another lie that Suse employees on the KDE4 team trotted out. And that was still hasn't been acknowledged, even though Aaron Segio's proud cry of achievement (I worked all night and finally ripped the desktop icon code out of the KDE4 codebase) is a smoking gun. And as noted, the KDE4 has been hostile to the KDE userbase, despite obvious problems with the overall concept. There KDE4 developers who, to this day, continue to use KDE3 as their primary desktop. When, after 4-5 years of development, some of the devs still won't "eat their own dogfood" that's a telling sign about what is going on within the dev team. Once again, I remind you, I merely gave the original poster information as to a reasonable expectation as to weather he could ever get a "greyed out" indicator for reduced windows, by giving him insight into the behavior and mentality of the KDE4 team and its leader, Aaron Segio. I would have left it at that, but YOU got your undies in a bunch and threw a hissy fit, dishonestly claiming that I was wrong. If you don't like how this discussion of the low character of the KDE4 organization, and feel that the KDE4 dev team has been dragged through the mud, you have NOBODY but yourself to blame by creating the conditions such that an reasonable person would back up the original claims with more complete expectations. At a campaign speech, one of Harry Truman's supporters once said, "Give 'em Hell, Harry!" Truman replied, "I'm not giving them hell. I'm merely reading the record." The same applies for this thread. if you don't like the subject, then DROP IT, and stop making excuses for the inexcusable, defending the indefensible, and denying the undeniable, like a fool -- because right now, that's all many on this list view you as: a lying, "see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil" fool. If you have a problem with that, then I suggest you consider these gems pf wisdom from Abraham Lincoln: "You can fool some of the people all the time, and you can fool all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all of the people all the time." "It's better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt." -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 17:11:28 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
I would have left it at that, but YOU got your undies in a bunch and threw a hissy fit, dishonestly claiming that I was wrong.
I didn't "throw a hissy fit". Nor did I claim that you were wrong. I merely pointed out that you don't need to be offensive in making an assertion. "The KDE4 team has said that this functionality will not be brought forward from KDE3" would have communicated the same thing. But you decided that it was appropriate to be offensive and judgmental. As for people's opinion of me on this list and in the project - you've stated your opinion. Others have stated theirs over the years, and I'll let my record speak for itself. Your opinion of me doesn't concern me. Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 6/7/2012 5:38 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 17:11:28 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
I would have left it at that, but YOU got your undies in a bunch and threw a hissy fit, dishonestly claiming that I was wrong. I didn't "throw a hissy fit". Nor did I claim that you were wrong.
I merely pointed out that you don't need to be offensive in making an assertion.
"The KDE4 team has said that this functionality will not be brought forward from KDE3" would have communicated the same thing.
But you decided that it was appropriate to be offensive and judgmental.
As for people's opinion of me on this list and in the project - you've stated your opinion. Others have stated theirs over the years, and I'll let my record speak for itself. Your opinion of me doesn't concern me.
Jim
Dear list; I originally subscribed to this list to learn and share with others experiences and help with openSUSE. However, in the last four or five days all I've seen is posts with this unfortunate topic. Is it necessary to continue this? Is it helpful to anyone? Could this please be taken off the list and handled by the participants directly? I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same. Jon -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 17:46:15 -0400, Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
Is it necessary to continue this?
No. I'm finished with it now.
Is it helpful to anyone?
At this stage, unlikely.
Could this please be taken off the list and handled by the participants directly?
I've no desire to continue this off-list (or on the list at this point. I've made my point and the matter is closed as far as I'm concerned). Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-06-07 23:46, Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Don't. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk/RJLgACgkQIvFNjefEBxqAwACg03ny94ZofBWKGUmcEdVwtoxB j5QAoLH4doJZbYrC3YDEb1l18YQbmT8c =2l0l -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 05:46 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Jon
I'm with you, Jonathan. --dg -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Dennis Gallien wrote:
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 05:46 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Jon
I'm with you, Jonathan.
Unsubscribing on the existance of one branch of one thread? Seriously, take the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up. By the way, "I'm going to unsubscribe" is not a threat. It's a childish temper-tantrum. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 6/7/2012 11:19 PM, Dirk Gently wrote:
Dennis Gallien wrote:
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 05:46 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Jon I'm with you, Jonathan.
Unsubscribing on the existance of one branch of one thread?
Seriously, take the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up.
By the way, "I'm going to unsubscribe" is not a threat. It's a childish temper-tantrum.
Frankly, I don't see how this type of post is helpful either. It wasn't a threat as I'm sure you guys can survive without me. It was expressed with a sense of regret. Jonathan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-06-08 05:24, Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
Frankly, I don't see how this type of post is helpful either. It wasn't a threat as I'm sure you guys can survive without me. It was expressed with a sense of regret.
Do not feed the trolls :-) - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk/R6H8ACgkQIvFNjefEBxpKCQCgpBeH+3RkiPG86NGXDPq4VfGW HegAoKuJiPUScG2kpOfJjjLXGG2lBey1 =HgHB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 06/07/12 23:24, Jonathan Dlouhy pecked at the keyboard and wrote:
On 6/7/2012 11:19 PM, Dirk Gently wrote:
Dennis Gallien wrote:
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 05:46 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Jon I'm with you, Jonathan.
Unsubscribing on the existance of one branch of one thread?
Seriously, take the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up.
By the way, "I'm going to unsubscribe" is not a threat. It's a childish temper-tantrum.
Frankly, I don't see how this type of post is helpful either. It wasn't a threat as I'm sure you guys can survive without me. It was expressed with a sense of regret.
Jonathan
Jonathan, Please disregard anything from "Dirk Gently" as he has been banded from this list in the past under many different email addresses for harassment. It seems his main purpose is to cause trouble. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 11:24 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
On 6/7/2012 11:19 PM, Dirk Gently wrote:
Dennis Gallien wrote:
On Thursday, June 07, 2012 05:46 PM Jonathan Dlouhy wrote:
I'm about to un-subscribe and I have to wonder how many others are contemplating the same.
Jon
I'm with you, Jonathan.
Unsubscribing on the existance of one branch of one thread?
Seriously, take the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up.
By the way, "I'm going to unsubscribe" is not a threat. It's a childish temper-tantrum.
Frankly, I don't see how this type of post is helpful either. It wasn't a threat as I'm sure you guys can survive without me. It was expressed with a sense of regret.
Jonathan
Exactly, Jonathan. Thanks again. The response is relevant because people will understandably become eventually exasperated with such abusive rantings, and therefore look elsewhere for where to invest their time. Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect. Mr. Gently's personal, confrontational, and insulting remarks are not worthy of response. --dg -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
* Dennis Gallien
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect.
Given the ease with obtaining email addresses and subscribing to our lists, banning at most is a very temporary situation. Anything further requries some diligence and effort.
Mr. Gently's personal, confrontational, and insulting remarks are not worthy of response.
local solution requiring similar diligence (if you use procmail): # ------------------------------------------------------- ### kill file :0 * ^From.*akulkis|\ ^From.*Dirk\ Gently\@gmail\.com /dev/null # ------------------------------------------------------- but you will still see answers to his rants :^( -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-06-08 16:53, Dennis Gallien wrote:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect.
How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily? - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk/STAwACgkQIvFNjefEBxp0pwCfZoqvTtcxPyb2LSzVBXLdUDsc 7JMAn0rJVX1DQQNSJColl119xD5QFep7 =dkXM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Friday, June 08, 2012 03:01 PM Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2012-06-08 16:53, Dennis Gallien wrote:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect.
How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily?
Good grief. What is this, a conspiracy? I didn't realize there wasn't an automated and/or administrative solution available for this purpose. My mistake. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Somehow by IP address ! That is how I block my SPAM mail. For example, just yesterday I got tons of SPAM mail - seemingly coming from the US, I did a whois on the Originating IP and found out that all of the mail came from Mongolia. So I added the "base root" of the IP address to my mail filters. Or, like my ISP, use a mail proxy, SpamExperts. My 2cents, Duaine On 06/08/2012 02:01 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
On 2012-06-08 16:53, Dennis Gallien wrote:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect. How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily?
- -- Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/
iEYEARECAAYFAk/STAwACgkQIvFNjefEBxp0pwCfZoqvTtcxPyb2LSzVBXLdUDsc 7JMAn0rJVX1DQQNSJColl119xD5QFep7 =dkXM -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-- Duaine Hechler Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ Tuning, Servicing& Rebuilding Reed Organ Society Member Florissant, MO 63034 (314) 838-5587 dahechler@att.net www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com -- Home& Business user of Linux - 11 years -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 09/06/12 06:58, Duaine Hechler wrote:
Somehow by IP address !
That is how I block my SPAM mail. For example, just yesterday I got tons of SPAM mail - seemingly coming from the US, I did a whois on the Originating IP and found out that all of the mail came from Mongolia. So I added the "base root" of the IP address to my mail filters.
Or, like my ISP, use a mail proxy, SpamExperts.
My 2cents, Duaine So that is what has happened! :-(
I sent you 2 e-mails and they were both returned as undeliverable because my ISP's domain address is blocked because of "abuse". My ISP didn't know anything about it. BC -- Using openSUSE 12.1 x86_64 KDE 4.8.3 and kernel 3.4.1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX550Ti 1GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 06/09/2012 12:15 AM, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 09/06/12 06:58, Duaine Hechler wrote:
Somehow by IP address !
That is how I block my SPAM mail. For example, just yesterday I got tons of SPAM mail - seemingly coming from the US, I did a whois on the Originating IP and found out that all of the mail came from Mongolia. So I added the "base root" of the IP address to my mail filters.
Or, like my ISP, use a mail proxy, SpamExperts.
My 2cents, Duaine So that is what has happened! :-(
I sent you 2 e-mails and they were both returned as undeliverable because my ISP's domain address is blocked because of "abuse". My ISP didn't know anything about it.
BC
I don't think I was blocking yours. I am currently blocking (1) 203.88.118.... (2) 125.7...... Duaine -- Duaine Hechler Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ Tuning, Servicing& Rebuilding Reed Organ Society Member Florissant, MO 63034 (314) 838-5587 dahechler@att.net www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com -- Home& Business user of Linux - 11 years -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 09/06/12 15:39, Duaine Hechler wrote:
On 06/09/2012 12:15 AM, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 09/06/12 06:58, Duaine Hechler wrote:
Somehow by IP address !
That is how I block my SPAM mail. For example, just yesterday I got tons of SPAM mail - seemingly coming from the US, I did a whois on the Originating IP and found out that all of the mail came from Mongolia. So I added the "base root" of the IP address to my mail filters.
Or, like my ISP, use a mail proxy, SpamExperts.
My 2cents, Duaine So that is what has happened! :-(
I sent you 2 e-mails and they were both returned as undeliverable because my ISP's domain address is blocked because of "abuse". My ISP didn't know anything about it.
BC
I don't think I was blocking yours. I am currently blocking (1) 203.88.118....
If you care to check you will find that this address is part of what covers most if not all of Australian ISPs.
(2) 125.7......
Duaine
-- Using openSUSE 12.1 x86_64 KDE 4.8.3 and kernel 3.4.1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX550Ti 1GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, 2012-06-09 at 18:16 +1000, Basil Chupin wrote:
I don't think I was blocking yours. I am currently blocking (1) 203.88.118....
If you care to check you will find that this address is part of what covers most if not all of Australian ISPs.
(2) 125.7......
Ummm, as one who has been a systems and network admin for businesses and ISP's in Australia for two decades, I can assure you those two ranges given shouldn't stop any ISP mail. The first being hosting company aussiehq/jumba which are populated with nutters, and the second is another hosting company, neither of those ranges are used by anyone of consequence, and they most certainly are not used by iinet so would not interfere with your mail. If Duaine has blocked those ranges because of spam, he should visit the acma.gov.au website, Australia has very strict laws about spamming by Aus based persons/organisations, if he has blocked them because of L-users, well, in (1)'s case, probably justified, in (2), can't say I've noticed any problems with them before. The fact he mentioned his provider uses an outsource spam method, is where the problem probably exists, those places are like ionports, good for one thing, boat anchors! Cheers
On 09/06/12 20:23, Noel Butler wrote:
On Sat, 2012-06-09 at 18:16 +1000, Basil Chupin wrote:
I don't think I was blocking yours. I am currently blocking (1) 203.88.118.... If you care to check you will find that this address is part of what covers most if not all of Australian ISPs.
(2) 125.7......
Ummm, as one who has been a systems and network admin for businesses and ISP's in Australia for two decades, I can assure you those two ranges given shouldn't stop any ISP mail.
The first being hosting company aussiehq/jumba which are populated with nutters, and the second is another hosting company, neither of those ranges are used by anyone of consequence, and they most certainly are not used by iinet so would not interfere with your mail.
If Duaine has blocked those ranges because of spam, he should visit the acma.gov.au website, Australia has very strict laws about spamming by Aus based persons/organisations, if he has blocked them because of L-users, well, in (1)'s case, probably justified, in (2), can't say I've noticed any problems with them before.
The fact he mentioned his provider uses an outsource spam method, is where the problem probably exists, those places are like ionports, good for one thing, boat anchors!
Cheers Thanks for this info, Noel. Seems that the problem has now been resolved.
BC -- Using openSUSE 12.1 x86_64 KDE 4.8.3 and kernel 3.4.1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX550Ti 1GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Wasn't going to bother with this thread, but it's a bleak day outside so I got bored.... On Fri, 2012-06-08 at 21:01 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect.
How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily?
An effective, but slightly time consuming way (and certainly not 100% foolproof) is for moderator approval on all new subscriptions, a stated policy of refusal to approve sub requests from freemail services that hide and protect abusive L-users, that way they have to use their real IP, which can be traced back to their ISP who can use the big bat under their AUP. They wont give a rats if gmail go "norty norty boy", but they WILL care and take notice if their ISP issues them with a breach of AUP and risks account termination, especially if they use cable or DSL. As I said, not foolproof, there will be some miscreants who will seek out and spoof, but their numbers would be minimal compared to overall number of jackasses. This way is overall rather effective, I've done it myself with lists I've ran (as well as use DNSBL's for rejecting messages from known proxies, TOR project prevents SMTP IIRC, but there is a DNSBL with TOR exit nodes, so that can be used as well, along with better and tighter anti-spam rules) Time for likes of Google to stop aiding and abetting these so and so's, and put X Sender IP in the headers.
Noel Butler wrote:
Wasn't going to bother with this thread, but it's a bleak day outside so I got bored.... On Fri, 2012-06-08 at 21:01 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect.
How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily?
An effective, but slightly time consuming way (and certainly not 100% foolproof) is for moderator approval on all new subscriptions, a stated policy of refusal to approve sub requests from freemail services that hide and protect abusive L-users, that way they have to use their real IP, which can be traced back to their ISP who can use the big bat under their AUP. They wont give a rats if gmail go "norty norty boy", but they WILL care and take notice if their ISP issues them with a breach of AUP and risks account termination, especially if they use cable or DSL.
As I said, not foolproof, there will be some miscreants who will seek out and spoof, but their numbers would be minimal compared to overall number of jackasses.
This way is overall rather effective, I've done it myself with lists I've ran (as well as use DNSBL's for rejecting messages from known proxies, TOR project prevents SMTP IIRC, but there is a DNSBL with TOR exit nodes, so that can be used as well, along with better and tighter anti-spam rules)
Time for likes of Google to stop aiding and abetting these so and so's, and put X Sender IP in the headers.
Strange how not a single one of you puts ANY of the proper blame on Jim Henderson for picking a fight by getting his panties all in a kno and throwing a hissy fit full of lies, which ANY rational person would know would provoke a response in defense against his lies...and then he REPEATEDLY trotted out more lies....further provoking Gently to write more responses to defend himself. But this is so typical of Europeans... the aristocrat can murder in cold blood on the street, and the police and courts will remain immobile and silent, but if a serf defends himself against attack, all holy hell breaks lose and it's a capital crime. After 300 years, you idiots still haven't learned one damned thing from the Enlightenment, and it took a maniac from France (of all places) to overrun the entire continent to overturn the laws which made the aforementioned distinctions between aristocrat and serf a LEGAL policy of the state, in complete violation of any concept of basic human rights.). And even 200 years after Napolean ran roughshod over the continent, replacing the law of "judge by whom the accused is" with "judge on the basis of the acts committed", you all still cling to judging not on the basis of the act, but instead on nothing more than social standing. Europe civilized? Don't kid yourself. A raised pinky while drinking coffee isn't civilization, it's an "Egads! You don't do it precisely the way we do. How utterly ghastly!" form of snobbery.\ In other words, "you didn't go to the same school we did" tribalism. In other words, you still haven't risen above mob rule of the dark ages. Gossip-mongering 12-year old girls declaring secret enemies among themselves are more civilized. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Friday, June 08, 2012 11:37:47 PM Gordo Heavyfoot wrote: Back again Gently? Filter --> trash -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 09/06/12 13:37, Gordo Heavyfoot wrote:
Noel Butler wrote:
:
Given that Mr. Gently was reportedly banned more than once in the past for similar antics, I anticipated the same would occur again in this instance. For that matter, given the repetition a permanent ban would seem to be in order. Apparently I am incorrect. How would you implement a permanent ban, if he changes addresses easily? An effective, but slightly time consuming way (and certainly not 100% foolproof) is for moderator approval on all new subscriptions, a stated
Wasn't going to bother with this thread, but it's a bleak day outside so I got bored.... On Fri, 2012-06-08 at 21:01 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote: policy of refusal to approve sub requests from freemail services that hide and protect abusive L-users, that way they have to use their real IP, which can be traced back to their ISP who can use the big bat under their AUP. They wont give a rats if gmail go "norty norty boy", but they WILL care and take notice if their ISP issues them with a breach of AUP and risks account termination, especially if they use cable or DSL.
As I said, not foolproof, there will be some miscreants who will seek out and spoof, but their numbers would be minimal compared to overall number of jackasses.
This way is overall rather effective, I've done it myself with lists I've ran (as well as use DNSBL's for rejecting messages from known proxies, TOR project prevents SMTP IIRC, but there is a DNSBL with TOR exit nodes, so that can be used as well, along with better and tighter anti-spam rules)
Time for likes of Google to stop aiding and abetting these so and so's, and put X Sender IP in the headers.
Strange how not a single one of you puts ANY of the proper blame on Jim Henderson for picking a fight by getting his panties all in a kno and throwing a hissy fit full of lies, which ANY rational person would know would provoke a response in defense against his lies...and then he REPEATEDLY trotted out more lies....further provoking Gently to write more responses to defend himself.
Oh, for chrissake give it away Aaron aka Dirk aka Gordo! "...provoking Gently to write more responses to defend himself". -- Using openSUSE 12.1 x86_64 KDE 4.8.3 and kernel 3.4.1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX550Ti 1GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 9. Juni 2012, 15:19:41 schrieb Basil Chupin:
Oh, for chrissake give it away Aaron aka Dirk aka Gordo!
"...provoking Gently to write more responses to defend himself".
He is a very sad and pathetic person. Let's pity him instead. Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2012-06-08 at 23:37 -0400, Gordo Heavyfoot wrote:
Noel Butler wrote:
Wasn't going to bother with this thread, but it's a bleak day outside so I got bored....
Strange how not a single one of you puts ANY of the proper blame on Jim Henderson
Actually, I did convey that to him, in a way that it should be conveyed to him, IOW, in private mail as there's enough noise to signal on here at present, I wished to avoid generating more, and after this comment, it ends my participation in this thread. BTW, it does take TWO to tango, Dirk and Jim are both as bad as each other from where I'm sitting, time for both to build a bridge and move on, all they seem to be doing is rehashing the same stuff, if I want replays, I'll pick a track on my player and replay it over and over and over :)
On Thursday, 07 June 2012 16:38 Jim Henderson wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 17:11:28 -0400, Dirk Gently wrote:
I would have left it at that, but YOU got your undies in a bunch and threw a hissy fit, dishonestly claiming that I was wrong.
I didn't "throw a hissy fit".
Yes, you did, and still are. -- Powered by Slackware 13.37 22:34:57 up 2 days, 17:29, 2 users, load average: 0.83, 0.89, 0.86 Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived. - Isaac Asimov Registered Linux user #214117 at http://linuxcounter.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
I'm tired of the seemingly never ending bantering. So, I don't know why the offenders are not banned so we can end this damned thread ????? Although, this is exactly what is going on on my pianotech list about Aural tuning vs ETD (Electronic Tuning Device) tuning - neither side is giving up ! My 2cents, Duaine -- Duaine Hechler Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ Tuning, Servicing& Rebuilding Reed Organ Society Member Florissant, MO 63034 (314) 838-5587 dahechler@att.net www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com -- Home& Business user of Linux - 11 years -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 22:31:41 -0500, Duaine Hechler wrote:
I'm tired of the seemingly never ending bantering.
So, I don't know why the offenders are not banned so we can end this damned thread ?????
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it. No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage. Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them. Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Jim Henderson wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jun 2012 22:31:41 -0500, Duaine Hechler wrote:
I'm tired of the seemingly never ending bantering.
So, I don't know why the offenders are not banned so we can end this damned thread ?????
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it.
No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage.
Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them.
In the future, try not starting a fight that you can't win due to all of the facts being against you. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Am Freitag, 8. Juni 2012, 23:39:43 schrieb Gordo Heavyfoot:
Jim Henderson wrote:
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it.
No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage.
Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them.
In the future, try not starting a fight that you can't win due to all of the facts being against you.
:D – you make me laugh. Are you another incarnation of Aaron? (rhetorical question) Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 09/06/12 18:12, Sven Burmeister wrote:
Am Freitag, 8. Juni 2012, 23:39:43 schrieb Gordo Heavyfoot:
Jim Henderson wrote:
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it.
No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage.
Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them. In the future, try not starting a fight that you can't win due to all of the facts being against you. :D – you make me laugh. Are you another incarnation of Aaron? (rhetorical question)
Yet another person who has worked it out! :-) I wonder when Henne will work it out? Anybody wants to start a "who will be the closest in guessing the day/time when Henne works it out" competition? :-D BC -- Using openSUSE 12.1 x86_64 KDE 4.8.3 and kernel 3.4.1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel Corsair "Vengeance" RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX550Ti 1GB DDR5 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Basil Chupin wrote:
On 09/06/12 18:12, Sven Burmeister wrote:
Am Freitag, 8. Juni 2012, 23:39:43 schrieb Gordo Heavyfoot:
Jim Henderson wrote:
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it.
No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage.
Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them. In the future, try not starting a fight that you can't win due to all of the facts being against you. :D – you make me laugh. Are you another incarnation of Aaron? (rhetorical question)
Yet another person who has worked it out! :-)
I wonder when Henne will work it out?
Anybody wants to start a "who will be the closest in guessing the day/time when Henne works it out" competition? :-D
BC
Are you, sir, on drugs, or just drinking heavily? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Sven Burmeister wrote:
Am Freitag, 8. Juni 2012, 23:39:43 schrieb Gordo Heavyfoot:
Jim Henderson wrote:
My initial instinct was that saying something would help nothing and solve nothing, and I ignored that instinct. I should have known better, and I was wrong to continue to try to pursue it.
No excuses, no explanations. Neither matters at this stage.
Sorry folks. I'm done with this discussion, and I will endeavour to learn from my mistakes and not repeat them.
In the future, try not starting a fight that you can't win due to all of the facts being against you.
:D – you make me laugh.
I'm happy to increase the happiness of the world, just like Mr. Trololo http://encyclopediadramatica.se/Eduard_Khil [The only person to have a biographocal page on encyclopedia dramatica without a single insult or snarky remark about him.] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (15)
-
Basil Chupin -
Carlos E. R. -
Constant Brouerius van Nidek -
Dennis Gallien -
Dirk Gently -
Duaine Hechler -
Ed Greshko -
Gordo Heavyfoot -
Insomniactoo -
Jim Henderson -
Jonathan Dlouhy -
Ken Schneider - openSUSE -
Noel Butler -
Patrick Shanahan -
Sven Burmeister