bugs in 10.1 and complaints about it
To whom it may concern, if you find a bug in 10.1 (which is bad enough by itself), you should ask yourself, "why didn't I notice that in one of the various beta and RC releases?" On the other hand, lots of what's being mentioned here is really bad enough for not getting overlooked during beta and RC stage, so it sure does make one wonder how it coulnd've been possible. maybe some of those really have been introduced after the final RC? but then, whats the point in having a final RC release, when you make drastic changes after releasing what would (in an ideal world) be identical to the final master version? that being said, I'm not going to touch 10.1 with a 10ft pole, and NOT for reason of the various bugs, but solely because the non-gpl stuff has been dropped. How am I supposed to download a driver off the 'net when the driver in question is the driver I need to get oin the 'net on the first hand? madwifi/ath0 anyone? bye, MH -- gpg key fingerprint: 5F64 4C92 9B77 DE37 D184 C5F9 B013 44E7 27BD 763C
Hi, On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote:
To whom it may concern,
if you find a bug in 10.1 (which is bad enough by itself), you should ask yourself, "why didn't I notice that in one of the various beta and RC releases?"
On the other hand, lots of what's being mentioned here is really bad enough for not getting overlooked during beta and RC stage, so it sure does make one wonder how it coulnd've been possible. maybe some of those really have been introduced after the final RC? but then, whats the point in having a final RC release, when you make drastic changes after releasing what would (in an ideal world) be identical to the final master version?
that being said, I'm not going to touch 10.1 with a 10ft pole, and NOT for reason of the various bugs, but solely because the non-gpl stuff has been dropped. How am I supposed to download a driver off the 'net when the driver in question is the driver I need to get oin the 'net on the first hand? madwifi/ath0 anyone?
http://madwifi.org/suse/ has all you need. Cheers -e -- Eberhard Moenkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org)
Am Dienstag, 30. Mai 2006 21:40 schrieb Eberhard Moenkeberg:
Hi,
On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote:
has all you need.
...which is on the net, hence unreachable until i download it. but with no working network, its impossible to download. i rest my case. bye, MH
Cheers -e
-- gpg key fingerprint: 5F64 4C92 9B77 DE37 D184 C5F9 B013 44E7 27BD 763C
Hi, On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote:
Am Dienstag, 30. Mai 2006 21:40 schrieb Eberhard Moenkeberg:
On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote:
has all you need.
...which is on the net, hence unreachable until i download it. but with no working network, its impossible to download.
i rest my case.
I see - you are a "Pflegefall" or "Sozial-Schmarotzer". Behaviour like this sheds a bad light onto the other (more serious) 10.1 critics... If you were not so over-fatted and damned brain sick like you show here you would download it just now and add it under "AddOn Sources" during installation. I have two notebooks with ath_pci as the only network device, and both went step by step through the whole 10.1 beta/rc process even WITHOUT this new YUM repository with kmp packages. I just had to run "./SUSEbuild" and "./SUSEbuild install" after each kernel upgrade. You even do not need that little fingertipping anymore with their new kmp packages - it just starts working with the next reboot. Cheers -e -- Eberhard Moenkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org)
I'm new to SuSE. I just got here about a week ago because of a problem I was having with the Debian derived distributions I've been using for the last couple of years. Frankly, with the exception of the YAST problems that everyone's heard so much about and GRUB not properly recognizing my other Linux install (fixed that), everything is working very well for me technically. Maybe upgrades are harder than fresh installs, but it all worked out well for me. I'd like to thank everyone on the list who's been incessantly whining and those on the receiving end who clearly have no interest in user input or support for re-motivating me to figure out the solution to the problem that led me away from Debian in the first place. Scott K
On Tue, May 30, 2006 at 11:47:38PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote:
I'd like to thank everyone on the list who's been incessantly whining and those on the receiving end who clearly have no interest in user input or support for re-motivating me to figure out the solution to the problem that led me away from Debian in the first place.
I feel sorry that you feel that way. If you look at the list 'factory' you will see that there was a lot of interest in user input. Also people have reacted on it and solutions ARE in the making. -- houghi http://houghi.org http://www.plainfaqs.org/linux/ http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html
Today I went outside. My pupils have never been tinier...
On 30/05/06, Mathias Homann
Am Dienstag, 30. Mai 2006 21:40 schrieb Eberhard Moenkeberg:
On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote: http://madwifi.org/suse/ has all you need. ...which is on the net, hence unreachable until i download it. but with no working network, its impossible to download.
i rest my case.
I don't want to downplay any issues you might have, but you are quite clearly on the internet at the very moment that you send that mail, so why not download it and save it to a cd/flash device/floppy/punch card? Sure, it would be nice to have in the box, but I think the reasons for omitting these non OSS drivers are quite valid. I run windows and linux and I have some devices that don't have WHQL certified drivers available. They cause me endless pain and lots of system freezing. SuSE 10.1 never freezes for me. The point I want to make is this, MS resolves driver issues by testing the hell out of them and making the device manufacturer pay for the seal of approval. That isn't an option for linux where it's an uphill struggle to get a driver released at all. The only way that we can really make sure that a driver performs and doesn't mess stuff up is to have access to the source so that bugs can be fixed as the kernel changes. Non OSS drivers will cause nothing but pain in the long run, and accepting them because they are convenient sends entirely the wrong message to the device manufacturers. -- Paul
On Tuesday 30 May 2006 21:03, Mathias Homann wrote:
Am Dienstag, 30. Mai 2006 21:40 schrieb Eberhard Moenkeberg:
Hi,
On Tue, 30 May 2006, Mathias Homann wrote:
has all you need.
...which is on the net, hence unreachable until i download it. but with no working network, its impossible to download.
i rest my case.
Of course at this point I just can't help but point out that only a fool would upgrade his operating system without first checking core hardware support, right? And since you *did* check the hardware support and found the drivers were dropped you would have done some research and already dowloaded the packages or source you needed, right? So not being a fool and checking before you upgrade, and then being prepared before you start your upgrade there is no problem, right? Just some thoughts... Cheers Graham
Mathias Homann wrote:
...which is on the net, hence unreachable until i download it. but with no working network, its impossible to download.
how do you write this, so? jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://dodin.org/galerie_photo_web/expo/index.html http://lucien.dodin.net http://fr.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Gérer_ses_photos
Mathias Homann wrote:
that being said, I'm not going to touch 10.1 with a 10ft pole, and NOT for reason of the various bugs, but solely because the non-gpl stuff has been dropped. How am I supposed to download a driver off the 'net when the driver in question is the driver I need to get oin the 'net on the first hand? madwifi/ath0 anyone?
Simple. Help reverse engineering the non-gpl kernel modules and/or test its free replacements. That will fix all your problems after some time. Oh, and non-gpl userspace is still shipped. Only the illegal non-gpl kernel modules vanished. Regards, Carl-Daniel -- http://www.hailfinger.org/
participants (8)
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Carl-Daniel Hailfinger -
Eberhard Moenkeberg -
Graham Anderson -
houghi -
jdd -
Mathias Homann -
Paul Howie -
Scott Kitterman