Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

Jeanne***************************** ****************************'Be who you are and say what you feel...Because those that matter... don't mind...And those that mind... don't matter

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From: mike@mikenjane.net To: opensuse@opensuse.org Subject: Re: [opensuse] Repos - Rant Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 15:09:21 +0200

On Friday 10 October 2008 22:40, Ben Kevan wrote:

...

If Novell wants to get serious with their whole openSUSE push, they better damn have a much more reliable repository.

I've had 3 people today ask me "why can't I get my updates that are flashing in the corner, it just times out"

All because repos.opensuse.org is down.

Wow.. Never had a power outage at your place? Amazing..

-- 3:08pm up 2 days 18:17, 4 users, load average: 2.12, 2.34, 2.29 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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...

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

I wouldn't call the servers "so vulnerable" This was a freak occurrence... one time thing due to events well beyond openSUSE/Novell's control. There was a news item on the opensuse.org homepage that explained exactly what was going - even some photos of the power company working at repairing the 20kV lines leading into the openSUSE offices. There were regular updates on the news entry as well. A lot of people were scrambling overnight, and on their day off to get things back up and running again. There was no way to put out another email to the mailing list since the listserver was also affected. The only communication channel that was still open was the website, and Andreas had a posting there right away to let us know what was going on. So.. welcome to openSUSE. A bit of a rocky start for you, but.. this is the first time we've had an outage like this on the repositories in.. well.. ever. And.. thanks to the team that got things up and running again. Despite the grumbling from all of us from time to time, we do really appreciate the work you guys do! C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Saturday 11 October 2008 06:50, Clayton wrote:

...

I wouldn't call the servers "so vulnerable" This was a freak occurrence...

Or was it??

[a] one time thing due to events well beyond openSUSE/Novell's control.

There was a news item on the opensuse.org homepage that explained exactly what was going - even some photos of the power company working at repairing the 20kV lines leading into the openSUSE offices.

It was those Ubuntu people. I just know it. They hate SUSE. They'll stop at _nothing_ to undermine their nemesis distro!

...

So.. welcome to openSUSE. A bit of a rocky start for you, but.. this is the first time we've had an outage like this on the repositories in.. well.. ever.

Yes, but if we don't want a repeat of this tragedy, we have to hunt down those Ubuntu exteremists and take the fight to them! Next time it could be much worse!

And.. thanks to the team that got things up and running again. Despite the grumbling from all of us from time to time, we do really appreciate the work you guys do!

Yes, now it is time to crush our enemies!

C.

Do I need a disclaimer??? RRS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Saturday 11 October 2008 09:18:13 am Clayton wrote:

...

Yes, now it is time to crush our enemies!

Do I need a disclaimer???

I think you forgot the "Bwahahahaha!!"

:-)

Added in each line to cover those that doesn't read whole email. (Like me on occasions.) -- Regards, Rajko -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 6:50 AM, Clayton wrote:

...

...

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

I wouldn't call the servers "so vulnerable" This was a freak occurrence... one time thing due to events well beyond openSUSE/Novell's control.

This could be better handled by putting the re-director on a redundant service such as akamai. Even Microsoft hands stuff over to akamai when they know they are going to get hammered (new service pack release or something). On novell's case all they need is the re-director service hosted on a platform not subject to a single point of failure. Probably too much to ask for a distro provided at a massive net loss. -- ----------JSA--------- Someone stole my tag line, so now I have this rental. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hi! Am Samstag 11 Oktober 2008 schrieb Jeanne Smith:

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

Why did you think you screwed your system? Was there anything but updates that didn't work? If your TV doesn't work, do you think it's blown or do you check whether the lights work? All that didn't work was getting updates and it is nothing your system relies on to work. Regards, Matthias -- Matthias Bach www.marix.org „Der einzige Weg, die Grenzen des Möglichen zu finden, ist ein klein wenig über diese hinaus in das Unmögliche vorzustoßen.“ - Arthur C. Clarke

Jeanne Smith wrote:

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on.

Welcome to the very best of the computing world! I think

I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

...

Jeanne*****************************

Replying in reverse order: Others have responded to your misunderstanding of this unique, so far, event. Rather than assume your system is screwed, tell us what you see that appears wrong. There are many, many very helpful people here, including a number of suse/Novell employees, who both listen and contribute, and have a high tolerance for what some others might think are foolish questions. A general principle holds here, as well as in the rest of our lives: the more something can give you, the more it demands of you. Linux can give much, much more than other systems, but you have to invest some effort in learning and asking questions. The only truly foolish questions are those not asked. John Perry -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat October 11 2008 9:27:17 am Jeanne Smith wrote:

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

...

Jeanne

What you say is true, some people *are* better off with a $100 dollar an upgrade, no choices OS that doesn't come with choices of desktop environments, browsers, word processing programs, spreadsheet programs, myriads of utilities and much more all at no cost and installed by default (or not, your choice) and at no cost to you. In return for that no cost software, there is some expectation of a basic attempt to communicate and to attempt to learn before complaining. For about 100 dollars US, you can get a no-brain OS with no software other than a browser and a desktop that has some 50,000 known viruses and worms available to excite your senses and provide revenue to all of the anti-virus vendors to protect your system. You won't need any of these for SuSE or other Linux distros to protect you from the handful of viruses that could affect a Linux system if you are stupid enough to cooperate and enable it. You won't want free Word or Excel compatability for your $100 OS because that will cost you several hundreds of dollars from the same company that sells the OS and it is probably going to be compatible, but no guarantees about being bug-free. If bugs are discovered, you can buy the upgrades when they come out. Yes, for some people, SuSE *is* the wrong OS. Linux, any free distro of it is wrong. However, for many people, being able to download the SOURCE files to the OS and the utilities and most of the programs you use and modifiy and compile them to meet your own needs or desires is a major plus. Try that with the $100 OS vendor. Will they release the source code so you can change it if you don't like the way something works? No? Well, maybe there is something backwards there? I mean, for free, you can get the source, for $100, you can get the bugs. Hmmmm, I think I'll put up with the power failures..... Richard -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

* Michael S. Dunsavage [10-12-08 22:43]:

On Sun, 2008-10-12 at 22:31 -0400, Richard wrote:

...

What you say is true, some people *are* better off with a $100 dollar an upgrade

I want to know where you're getting an upgrade for Windows for $100.

I have five that I will let you have for $100 total, and they are all called "linux". -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sunday 12 October 2008 07:31:16 pm Richard wrote:

On Sat October 11 2008 9:27:17 am Jeanne Smith wrote:

...

Well I am a newby, I had no idea what the heck was going on. I think I have really screwed my system because of lack of communication and my ignorance. If the system depends on a server that is so vulnerable maybe I need another system.

...

Jeanne

What you say is true, some people *are* better off with a $100 dollar an upgrade, no choices OS that doesn't come with choices of desktop environments, browsers, word processing programs, spreadsheet programs, myriads of utilities and much more all at no cost and installed by default (or not, your choice) and at no cost to you. In return for that no cost software, there is some expectation of a basic attempt to communicate and to attempt to learn before complaining. For about 100 dollars US, you can get a no-brain OS with no software other than a browser and a desktop that has some 50,000 known viruses and worms available to excite your senses and provide revenue to all of the anti-virus vendors to protect your system. You won't need any of these for SuSE or other Linux distros to protect you from the handful of viruses that could affect a Linux system if you are stupid enough to cooperate and enable it. You won't want free Word or Excel compatability for your $100 OS because that will cost you several hundreds of dollars from the same company that sells the OS and it is probably going to be compatible, but no guarantees about being bug-free. If bugs are discovered, you can buy the upgrades when they come out.

Yes, for some people, SuSE *is* the wrong OS. Linux, any free distro of it is wrong. However, for many people, being able to download the SOURCE files to the OS and the utilities and most of the programs you use and modifiy and compile them to meet your own needs or desires is a major plus. Try that with the $100 OS vendor. Will they release the source code so you can change it if you don't like the way something works? No? Well, maybe there is something backwards there? I mean, for free, you can get the source, for $100, you can get the bugs. Hmmmm, I think I'll put up with the power failures.....

Richard

I spend good money on SLED in the enterprise. Along with SLED I support a pretty nice environment of RHEL (switching over to SLES), and you can imagine the price of that move. So obviously I (not I personally buy my company) spends good money on the Enterprise Distributions which are built by the use of the openSUSE products. I use openSUSE products not only because I prefer them over other distributions, BUT, because I get to see "what to expect" on the next version of the Enterprise product (which keeps me one step ahead of the game). I have turned others from Windows and Ubuntu to openSUSE to help widen their experience and know what to expect in SLED 11 (which will be the pilot part of me rolling out SLED in more locations then "training rooms"). So negative experiences like this, can and do reflect badly. Ben ps. I'm not going to follow this thread anymore.. as it's gotten un-necessarily hostile. :o) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Mike wrote:

On Friday 10 October 2008 22:40, Ben Kevan wrote:

...

If Novell wants to get serious with their whole openSUSE push, they better damn have a much more reliable repository.

I've had 3 people today ask me "why can't I get my updates that are flashing in the corner, it just times out"

All because repos.opensuse.org is down.

Wow.. Never had a power outage at your place? Amazing..

They are pretty rare in many places. Over the last seven years we've had maybe 5 short (<10min) outages. /Per Jessen, Zürich -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Sat, 2008-10-11 at 20:30 +0700, medwinz wrote:

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 3:40 AM, Ben Kevan wrote:

...

If Novell wants to get serious with their whole openSUSE push, they better damn have a much more reliable repository.

I've had 3 people today ask me "why can't I get my updates that are flashing in the corner, it just times out"

All because repos.opensuse.org is down.

There are many mirror out there is up and running, though the re-director is affected by this outage. but you can type it manually, don't you?

Hmmm Original poster has a very valid point. I can't really fathom an excuse to be honest.. You have a redirector that is supposed to protect things when a site goes down - but this redirector is at the site in question ????? Oh come on - that is like buying a nice fireguard, and then mounting it to the fire with chocolate.. AM -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Saturday 11 October 2008 10:09:09 pm Rajko M. wrote:

On Saturday 11 October 2008 03:33:02 pm Angus MacGyver wrote: ....

...

Hmmm

Original poster has a very valid point.

I can't really fathom an excuse to be honest..

You have a redirector that is supposed to protect things when a site goes down - but this redirector is at the site in question ?????

Hmm. One of us doesn't understand what openSUSE redirector is doing.

It is redirecting download traffic to mirrors, not protecting site from outages. This is not Akamai net, this is a free service that should cost as little as possible, and doubled power feed is already good enough.

Besides: http://en.opensuse.org/Libzypp/Failover explains what is planned to make package management more robust.

Yes, It is a "free service", but it's a free service to help build their pay service (SLED / SLES). -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On 2008-10-11T22:54:03, Ben Kevan wrote:

...

Besides: http://en.opensuse.org/Libzypp/Failover explains what is planned to make package management more robust. Yes,

It is a "free service", but it's a free service to help build their pay service (SLED / SLES).

I have a distinct plan to pilot my attempt at extending the Open Source cluster stack with split-site functionality on the openSUSE Project next year, yes. ;-) Regards, Lars -- SuSE Labs, Research and Development SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes." -- Oscar Wilde -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org