RE: [opensuse] Last Week we had a discussion on IRC and another o ne is planned.
After Anders J. noted that RedHat offers a similar pledge to their customers, Sunny [mailto:sloncho@gmail.com] demands: [...]
Yes, and there is the difference - RedHat does this by themselves - we sell you software - we'll help you if there is a problem - plain and fair.
Novell - on the other hand - says: We sign an agreement with the people who started this FUD, so they will not go after you. If they [Novell] were so sure they do not have patent problems, why just not promise the same as RH to their customers? And still besides this question, actually what for Novell are paid for by MS??? What does MS receive, except the weakening of the community. Divide and conqueror!
This one sounds pretty simple to me, from a business perspective: a) any big company with deep pockets can bring suit, even knowing in advance that it's not winnable, and tie up the poor defendant for years - this hurts a target that has shallower pockets (and can't afford to have their limited resources diverted by such an attack) and it has a chilling effect on others who read about it b) MS is as big as they come and has deeper pockets than anybody, and they've demonstrated willingness to harrass people in the courts, directly or by proxy c) MS is one of, if not _the_ most likely to offer legal threat to others, just because of their size and the number and variety of interests they have in the software/ip world d) What RH did was phrased to cover almost anybody who might bring suit against their customers - even though MS might be the most likely merely because of size, power and ubiquity, the very offer by RH opens RH to potentially unlimited drains on their coffers from all directions (not just MS, though MS is the one that'll give most IT purchasers the shivers) - it's not the actuality (how many are actually suing right now?), it's the unknown potential that's nervous-making for investors and e) What Novell did accomplishes the same thing (reassures customers by setting aside some protection money), but ensures, by tying up the biggest bully on the block, that Novell's expense for the gesture is: a) known and predictable for the next several years b) deductible/write-off-able ( I made up that word, just now) So, as an investor or customer, which approach gives you better warm fuzzies? RedHat's or Novell's? I'd say that Novell's move makes their risk much lower and much less open-ended than RedHat's, and accomplishes at least as much. Given how much of the rest of the discussion seems to be free of actual facts, and partakes of the fuzzy (but not warm) nature of FUD, one wonders if the supposed OSS/GPL defenders who protest the loudest might not be on MS payroll. If not, they've missed an opportunity to get paid for a job well done. Kevin The information contained in this electronic mail transmission may be privileged and confidential, and therefore, protected from disclosure. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and deleting it from your computer without copying or disclosing it. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On 11/15/06, mlist@safenet-inc.com
After Anders J. noted that RedHat offers a similar pledge to their customers,
<big snip> Kevin, I do agree that if you take only this fact, and look at Novell's perspective - it is a good business. What I do really say, is that I do not understand MS move. There should be some other reason for them - and no one tells what is it. I do not believe them to do this just because they care about Novell's customers, neither that they just like Novell, and want to provide them with some funding. In MS history they have always acted as predators, and every their partnership with somebody have ended as acquisition or killing this partner. Also, they were never a software retailer, so I do not think they are after the "big" money they can get from selling SLES. So, until someone tells us some reasonable motif for MS to get in this agreement, there will always be "conspiracy theories". I do not argue Novell's move as a business strategy, I just question their morale because they do not tell the whole truth, and the parts they tell does not make sense. Without the missing parts the only conclusions one can make are: 1. MS will pay Novell for nothing. 2. MS will bully their customers to prefer only SUSE among other distributions, and thats not because SuSE is much better, but because they have "extra" protection. 3. This will lead to disappearing of the support for other distros either by reducing the funding, or by limiting the sales 4. The end result will be loosing the diversity and the competition, thus weakening the whole linux world. Yes, it sounds a little bit paranoid, etc., but everything secret sounds like this. And that's not the way the FOSS world works - where everything is open and under the oversight of the community. I guess I have too low acceptance of business BS-ing. -- Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny) Even the most advanced equipment in the hands of the ignorant is just a pile of scrap. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 15 November 2006 12:03, mlist@safenet-inc.com wrote:
So, as an investor or customer, which approach gives you better warm fuzzies? RedHat's or Novell's? I'd say that Novell's move makes their risk much lower and much less open-ended than RedHat's, and accomplishes at least as much.
No. It only protects Paid Open Source developers if they work for Novell. It only protects other open source developers if they STOP DEVELOPING OPEN SOURCE. See: As the light begins to come up over the horizon, Microsoft admits patent peace is not perfect http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20061115124430626 -- _____________________________________ John Andersen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 15 November 2006 15:03, mlist@safenet-inc.com wrote:
And still besides this
question, actually what for Novell are paid for by MS??? What does MS receive, except the weakening of the community. Divide and conqueror!
from wiki-pedia: <clip> More recently, Microsoft has issued statements about the "viral nature" of the GNU General Public License (GPL), which Open Source proponents purport to be FUD. Microsoft's statements are often directed at the GNU/Linux community in particular, to discourage widespread Linux adoption, which could hurt Microsoft's marketshare. </clip> M$ FUD isn't working these days... in fact... having thought this out for a few days now... I'm beginning to think that what we see on the surface might just actually be true: M$ may be *afraid* that if they don't play fair, and play soon, they might be in a near position of not being able to play at all. SuSE may have actually hit critical mass... and M$ may actually be recapitulating... ok... maybe I won't hold my breath or anything... and I'm still angry with navell... but who knows... time will tell. hmm -- Kind regards, M Harris <>< -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 15 November 2006 20:48, M Harris wrote:
M$ FUD isn't working these days... in fact... having thought this out for a few days now... I'm beginning to think that what we see on the surface might just actually be true: M$ may be *afraid* that if they don't play fair, and play soon, they might be in a near position of not being able to play at all.
You might be right. Early reports on the street was that Novell caught MS in a clear infringement in Vista, and this deal had to be hurried up so Vista could be sent to manufacturing. That might explain why MS will pay Novell WAY more than Novell will pay MS, with the latter payments being a face-saving measure for MS. Oddly enough, this story was printed far and wide, but most trace back to http://blogs.sun.com/webmink/entry/the_morning_after so it might just be made up. -- _____________________________________ John Andersen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org
participants (4)
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John Andersen -
M Harris -
mlist＠safenet-inc.com -
Sunny