On Sat, 2009-06-27 at 02:02 -0500, David C. Rankin wrote:

On Friday 26 June 2009 09:50:32 am Bogdan Cristea wrote:

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I am new to compiz and I am trying to learn to use 3D effects in KDE. I have enabled the desktop cube effect in openSuSE 11.1, KDE 4.1.3, but when pressing ctrl+alt and moving the mouse with button 1 pressed nothing happens. Could someone give me some directions ?

Bogdan,

kde4 desktop effects cube != compiz desktop cube

In kde4 ctrl+F11 activates the cube

In compiz ctrl+alt+button1 activates the cube

This turned out to be the problem I had a while back. I could not figure out why I could not get most effects to work, when everything was set up correctly. I thought it was changing from an unsupported ATI to a supported NVIDIA card that confused something. What confuses me is why there are three programs for configuring the desktop for compiz, but only one works with KDE. The other two have no effect. OK - I understand why there is a program for Gnome and one for KDE. But I think it would make sense to call one of them the GNOME CCSM and one the KDE CCSM. Add to the confusion that the two that are together in the Utilities->Desktop menu (ccsm and simple-ccsm-kde) are both the ones that do not have any effect on KDE. simple-ccsm-kde is a real mystery. What is it for if it does not effect KDE? The only way to configure the compiz stuff for KDE is via systemsettings (i.e., "Personal Settings Configure Desktop" in the KDE menu) in Desktop->All Effects). ccsm and simple-ccsm-kde are useless for this. -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, 2009-06-29 at 22:56 +0930, Rodney Baker wrote:

On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:52:03 Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

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[...] and one the KDE CCSM. Add to the confusion that the two that are together in the Utilities->Desktop menu (ccsm and simple-ccsm-kde) are both the ones that do not have any effect on KDE. simple-ccsm-kde is a real mystery. What is it for if it does not effect KDE?

The only way to configure the compiz stuff for KDE is via systemsettings (i.e., "Personal Settings Configure Desktop" in the KDE menu) in Desktop->All Effects). ccsm and simple-ccsm-kde are useless for this.

That is because compiz and kde-win are 2 different window managers. If you use compiz as your window manager (which runs on top of the kde desktop) you use ccsm. If, OTOH, you use kde-win (which now has its own desktop effects completely independent of compiz), you use the KDE configurator.

I guess I was confused by a name like 'simple-ccsm-kde' not meaning that it was actually configuring something for use by kde. I guess the 'kde' in the name really means the configuration program is written to run under KDE, but it does not change anything KDE actually uses. OOC, is there an up-to-date (openSUSE 11.1, kde 4.2.4 or newer) description of using compiz as the window manager rather than kwin? I went through all this a year or so ago with Autostart files and other it-is-not-really-integrated-yet stuff. Is this still the case? In fact, is there any reason to use compiz over kwin? -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Krukmakargatan 21 P.O. Box 17009 SE-104 62 Stockholm, Sweden Office: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Mobile: Int +46 70-815 1696 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Monday 29 June 2009 09:51:59 am Rodney Baker wrote:

On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 23:42:49 Roger Oberholtzer wrote: [...]

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That is because compiz and kde-win are 2 different window managers. If you use compiz as your window manager (which runs on top of the kde desktop) you use ccsm. If, OTOH, you use kde-win (which now has its own desktop effects completely independent of compiz), you use the KDE configurator.

I guess I was confused by a name like 'simple-ccsm-kde' not meaning that it was actually configuring something for use by kde. I guess the 'kde' in the name really means the configuration program is written to run under KDE, but it does not change anything KDE actually uses.

OOC, is there an up-to-date (openSUSE 11.1, kde 4.2.4 or newer) description of using compiz as the window manager rather than kwin? I went through all this a year or so ago with Autostart files and other it-is-not-really-integrated-yet stuff. Is this still the case? In fact, is there any reason to use compiz over kwin?

Not IMHO, no (but that is just my taste), unless you want to run emerald as the window decorator. That only works with compiz.

In my experience, compiz is way better integrated (and more stable) with gnome rather than kde, however I've not tried it with kde4. Kwin works fine for my purposes.

Others on this list have used it with kde4, however, so they might like to comment (David?).

Regards,

For desktop effects in KDE4 -- Compiz is still the way to go. All of the built in KDE4 desktop effects that mimic what the compiz desktop effects do (do just that "mimic" less than stellarly I might add). I have worked with every KDE4 "Desktop Effect" (hereafter KDE4 DE) tweaked every setting and animation duration, etc.. and I can get them to work with close to the "polish" of the compiz effects, but that is as close as you can ever get. The biggest shortcomings of the KDE4 desktop effects are the lack of the compiz "Expo" effect and lack of the compiz "Scale" effect (usually activated by mouse top-left and mouse top-right, respectively). I greatly prefer the desktop rotation in the cylinder form. That, along with the sphere is broken in the KDE DE. Further, the KDE4 DE cube is quite awkward to manipulate compared to the same compiz effect. In KDE4 DE, there is no mouse "initiation" of cube rotation, you are stuck starting the rotation with ctrl+f11 then grab the cube with the mouse. In compiz it's just ctrl+alt plus left-button with the mouse. (a really cool and convenient change to compiz is to set cube rotate initiation to the Super(windows) key plus left-button) On balance, I like the 4-up pager effect in KDE4 DE, but I don't consider it a replacement for the compiz Expo plugin. The Expo plugin gives a much better and intuitive view of your desktops IMHO. All in all, it looks like the KDE devs are working to integrate the Compiz effects into KDE4, but the current state of DE integration is where compiz was in it 5.X releases (over a year and a half ago. What the KDE4 devs need is some input and direction on what the community needs with the DEs. It appears to me that some KDE4 group was tasked with making KDE4 have some DEs similar to Compiz and what we see now is just the Devs 1st attempt at making a cube rotate and making a shift-switcher and a vista-like switcher. I recommend you try both the KDE4 DEs and Compiz-fusion. The "Fusion-Icon" script and systray icon still allow for switching between compiz and kwin painlessly. For me, compiz is far ahead of the "fit, finish and function" curve while the KDE4 DEs are just starting to claw their way up the back side of the ladder. I have been very please that in openSuSE the 7.8x version of Compiz-Fusion has continued to work great on my 11.0 box even with factory kde4 beta 2 installed. I am equally impressed that Compiz-Fusion 8.2 works great with kde4 beta 2 on my Archlinux box also, showing that Compiz-Fusion is really here to stay with kde4. Yes, emerald themes continue to work great in 8.2. Go investigate and try for yourselves, but from what I see, KDE4 Desktop Effects have a lot of catching up to do. -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. Rankin Law Firm, PLLC 510 Ochiltree Street Nacogdoches, Texas 75961 Telephone: (936) 715-9333 Facsimile: (936) 715-9339 www.rankinlawfirm.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org