On 4/17/06, Chuck Davis wrote:

This whole discussion is nonsense. What is the motive? If Oracle wanted a Linux distro why not grab openSuse and start adding their goodies? Why pay millions for Novell? Or Redhat? I don't see it happening. Maybe testing the waters to see what the reaction to an Oracle distro might be but I don't think they're going to buy Novell for SUSE Linux -- maybe OpenExchange or something but not Linux which already is so readily available.

That's my $.02.

Chuck

Oracle is a very expensive DB, so if a customer is spending $100K for the DB they would probably appreciate getting a quality Linux distro thrown in for another couple thousand. If Oracle decides they want to distribute a Linux Distro then I suspect they will buy a company that has all the support infrastructure in place. Why would they want to recreate that particular wheel. Greg -- Greg Freemyer The Norcross Group Forensics for the 21st Century

On Monday 17 April 2006 04:53 pm, Chuck Davis wrote:

On 4/17/06, Chuck Davis wrote:

...

This whole discussion is nonsense. What is the motive?

Rather than nonsense, it makes total sense. I see Oracle buying Novell over Red Hat or any another distro. Here's why (similar things to what I mentioned on /. this morning)... 1. Novell has a World-Class enterprise server management product - ZenWorks - which has some name-recognition and a decent customer base. 2. Novell and Oracle are already partnering on the Accelerator service (http://www.novell.com/news/press/item.jsp?id=572) so are familiar with each other. "Oracle and Novell share a common vision of providing a low-cost, high-performance computing platform for world-class enterprise data centers", said Dave O'Neill, group vice president, Oracle Technology Business Unit. "In combination with SUSE Linux Enterprise Server from Novell, we provide our customers with grid infrastructure including Oracle Database 10g, Oracle Real Application Clusters, Oracle Application Server 10g and Oracle Grid Control to support the demands of a modern business." 3. Novell has a still active base of people - a few of whom I know - who are running NetWare and are putting that together with databases such as Oracle and others. 4. Novell has SUSE Linux and is very active in developing both Gnome (with the traitor Miguel De Icaza on the payroll) and KDE. In addition, they've got GroupWise and Evolution. Plus, SUSE is recognized both on the desktop (by us geeks) and on the server. Look at IBM and HP, who both certify running SLES on their high-end servers and even Mainframes. (My ex-employer had SLES running next to MVS and Z/OS on the z890 mainframe.) 5. Novell is in a less-than-optimal situation. They are floundering a bit trying to get a foothold in the enterprise market. That shows a company ripe for the picking. Novell's stock is hovering between $5 and $8 a share. (Aside from today's bump.) This in comparison to the leader - Red Hat - who probably doesn't even want to be bought. Their stock is in the high $20's a share, even with today's drop due to the news. 6. Novell has a Chameleon named Geeko. 'nuff said. <snip>

...

One other thought. IF it turns out Novell actually holds the copyrights to Unix THAT could be a motvie for buying Novell since Solaris is the 64 bit platform of choice for Oracle. Oracle has a vested interest in making sure MS doesn't buy Unix by picking up the pieces of either a decimated SCO or weakened Novell. Only time will tell.

Hehe - that's an interesting point.

Ultimately the GNOME boys in charge at Novell are going to kill SUSE Linux as we've come to love it anyway.

Do tell us how you REALLY feel, Chuck. Don't hold back, now... :P -- kai - www.perfectreign.com www.livebeans.com - the new NetBeans community 43...for those who require slightly more than the answer to life, the universe and everything.

El Martes, 18 de Abril de 2006 06:03, kai escribió:

the traitor Miguel De Icaza on the payroll

Please, can you explain that?. jose a.

On Tue, 2006-04-18 at 10:34 +0200, Dave Cotton wrote:

On Tue, 2006-04-18 at 10:18 +0200, jafc01 wrote:

...

El Martes, 18 de Abril de 2006 06:03, kai escribió:

...

the traitor Miguel De Icaza on the payroll

Please, can you explain that?.

Perhaps he's referring to this

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2002/02/01/gnome_to_be_based/

The date of the article is Friday 1st February 2002 17:56 GMT. Get real. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998

Dave Cotton wrote:

On Tue, 2006-04-18 at 08:44 -0400, Ken Schneider wrote:

...

The date of the article is Friday 1st February 2002 17:56 GMT. Get real.

Perhaps you should get real. Some say Judas was a traitor and his actions happened around 2000 years ago.

It's still fiction.

On Tuesday 18 April 2006 01:34 am, Dave Cotton wrote:

On Tue, 2006-04-18 at 10:18 +0200, jafc01 wrote:

...

El Martes, 18 de Abril de 2006 06:03, kai escribió:

...

the traitor Miguel De Icaza on the payroll

Please, can you explain that?.

Perhaps he's referring to this

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2002/02/01/gnome_to_be_based/

No, not exactly. I was more because of this... http://lists.kde.org/?m=88665502614202&w ...grrrr.... -- kai - www.perfectreign.com www.livebeans.com - the new NetBeans community 43...for those who require slightly more than the answer to life, the universe and everything.

On Tue, 2006-04-18 at 06:14 -0700, kai wrote:

No, not exactly. I was more because of this...

http://lists.kde.org/?m=88665502614202&w

Oh dear, this is even older. The Qt licencing has changed, and very little of what he wrote still aplies today. I don't see how this is relevant. Hans

On Tuesday 18 April 2006 04:26 am, Stephen Boddy wrote:

On Tuesday 18 April 2006 05:03, kai wrote:

...

5. Novell is in a less-than-optimal situation. They are floundering a bit trying to get a foothold in the enterprise market. That shows a company ripe for the picking.  Novell's stock is hovering between $5 and $8 a share. (Aside from today's bump.) This in comparison to the leader - Red Hat - who probably doesn't even want to be bought. Their stock is in the high $20's a share, even with today's drop due to the news.

Share price is irrelevant. Market capitalisation is where you need to look. That's how much it would "cost" to "buy" the company. In reality you would rarely "buy" the company. At the moment you're looking at: NOVL $2.99B RHAT $5.10B which suggests that although Novell share price is lower, they also have more shares. If the number of shares were equal to Red Hat's, then Novell would be more like $18. Just for perspective: ORCL $70.93B IBM $127.96B and our favourite old whipping post: MSFT $277.35B

Yes, thanks for the clarification. It has been over eight years since I took a finance class and - due to my almost daily flight schedule at the time, I ended up becoming a grad school dropout.

Personally I'd prefer Oracle to stay out of Novell.

Oh, I agree throughly!! I have no desire to move on to another distribution. Though it appears Novell has been somewhat hands-off in terms of adding corporate bloat to the product and supply chain, I cannot imagine Oracle would be so easygoing. On the other hand, Oracle has been doing some cool stuff by releasing their latest to the world for free. I haven't used it yet - and have no plans to - but that shows a good sign. In addition, their failed takeover of JBoss (whatever that does) shows at least a recognition that OSS is a viable solution.

So far Novell haven't done anything to massively upset me.

Nah, me either. At least they haven't turned into a closed of elitist ivory tower like they did with NetWare back in the early '90s.

They've made a lot of the right moves, and seem to be genuine about reinventing themselves and fighting the good fight (OSS not religion ;-). I don't really trust Oracle to continue that state of affairs.

Seems to be a common thread in what I've been reading the past to days in the world. -- kai

On Mon, 2006-04-17 at 23:56 -0500, Greg Wallace wrote:

On Monday, April 17, 2006 @ 6:28 PM, Don wrote:

...

Hi all, just my 2 cents worth into the fray. Larry E. is getting use to getting his way and with his strong dislike of Bill G and MS, I wouldn't be surprised at all that Novell is bought by Oracle. They, Oracle, have a VP in charge of Linux product development, SuSE is the next piece of the puzzle for them, I think. Do they have the $'s, probably. -- Don N7NKJ SuSE 9.3 Because it keeps on working! and it's open source!

So would Oracle SuSE Linux come with an Oracle database server package as part of the distro (scaled back, of course, but still ...)? Now that would be cool.

Now you are talking as though the sale has been completed. Does anyone on this list have a working crystal ball so the question can be answered? Everything about the purchase of Novell is pure speculation, treat it as such. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998

I think that it would be a good thing if Oracle bought Novell. I am no business-buff, but since Oracle is a big company, it probably has big $. I think that the only way to replace M$ in the desktop would be advertising, which needs big $. I think that having Oracle owning Novell (or another Linux distro) may be good or bad depending on how you see things. I'm not so sure that advertising alone is needed. One of the things that would help is if one or more of the major PC vendors would offer Linux installed as an option. But, that probably will not happen. The contracts

On Wednesday 19 April 2006 3:13 pm, Steven Pasternak wrote: that these companies have with Microsoft would be jeopardized. HP did offer one of their business laptops with Linux preinstalled, but no longer. But, both IBM, HP, and SGI offer Linux preinstalled on their servers. -- Jerry Feldman Boston Linux and Unix user group http://www.blu.org PGP key id:C5061EA9 PGP Key fingerprint:053C 73EC 3AC1 5C44 3E14 9245 FB00 3ED5 C506 1EA9

On Wednesday 19 April 2006 4:05 pm, Jerry Feldman wrote:

On Wednesday 19 April 2006 3:13 pm, Steven Pasternak wrote: that these companies have with Microsoft would be jeopardized. HP did offer one of their business laptops with Linux preinstalled, but no longer. But,

They still have a PDF available "Linux Installation and Configuration on HP Commercial Mobile Products" http://h10018.www1.hp.com/wwsolutions/linux/products/clients/HP_whitepaper_M... -- Open Source Weekend http://www.osw.ca

Can someone tell me what is the name of the Apache module I have to enable in Yast, besides dav, dav-fs?? to have access to a Subversion repository from Apache through WebDAV. I am using SuSE 10.0 boxed version. Thanks in advance, George __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Hi Sunny, --- Sunny wrote:

On 4/18/06, George Stoianov wrote:

...

Can someone tell me what is the name of the Apache module I have to enable in Yast, besides dav, dav-fs?? to have access to a Subversion repository from Apache through WebDAV. I am using SuSE 10.0 boxed version.

Thanks in advance, George

Package: subversion-server Section: Development/Tools/Version Control Installed Size: 123109 Maintainer: http://www.suse.de/feedback Version: 1.2.3-2 Pre-Depends: rpmlib(PayloadFilesHavePrefix) (<= 4.0-1), rpmlib(CompressedFileNames) (<= 3.0.4-1), rpmlib(PayloadIsBzip2) (<= 3.0.5-1) Depends: subversion (= 1.2.3), apache2, libc.so.6, libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.0), libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.1.3), libpthread.so.0, libpthread.so.0(GLIBC_2.0), libsvn_delta-1.so.0, libsvn_fs-1.so.0, libsvn_repos-1.so.0, libsvn_subr-1.so.0, libz.so.1 Provides: mod_authz_svn.so, mod_dav_svn.so, subversion-server (= 1.2.3-2) Architecture: i586 Size: 70328 MD5Sum: 2dacbf79502bfadfe55e37006351679e Filename: subversion-server-1.2.3-2.i586.rpm Description: Apache server module for Subversion server The subversion-server package adds the Subversion server Apache module to the Apache directories and configuration.

Thank you very much that was exactly what I was looking for. I have another question I am trying to set it up so my repository is available on the web, served by Apache through WebDAV, I have the modules loaded thanks to you, but I cannot find how to add a Location directive using YaST. I am using this as a guideline http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8596. Here are the steps I am taking: 1. Start YaST 2. Go to Network services 3. Start the HTTP Server 4. Go to Default host. 5. Click on Add I get a list of directives and not one of them is called Location, what am I missing? I can add one myself but I don't know how I can proceed from there to enter the necessary parameter? What is the right way of doing this? Should I just edit httpd.conf adding the directive?? Thanks again, George

-- -- Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny)

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--- Allister wrote:

...

have another question I am trying to set it up so my repository is available on the web, served by Apache through WebDAV, I have the modules loaded thanks to you, but I cannot find how to add a Location directive using YaST. I am using this as a guideline http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8596.

Here are the steps I am taking: 1. Start YaST 2. Go to Network services 3. Start the HTTP Server 4. Go to Default host. 5. Click on Add I get a list of directives and not one of them is called Location, what am I missing? I can add one myself but I don't know how I can proceed from

On Tuesday 18 April 2006 19:57, George Stoianov wrote: there

...

to enter the necessary parameter?

What is the right way of doing this? Should I just edit httpd.conf adding the directive??

Have just this minute finished doing the same, and it works a treat. Helpfully there is a small howto (including setting up Location directives in the correct configuration files) which you can find at /usr/share/doc/packages/subversion/README.SuSE (assuming that you installed the ViewCVS rpm). Let me know if you have any problems. Allister

Thank you Allister, This document is exactly what I needed. I am running in abit of problem with getting it complete. Following the instructions I have done the following: 1. I have added the svn user and group 2. Set up svnserve through the runlevels 3. added the directories under /srv 4. created the repositories 5. editted the subversion.conf file to include directives for the 2 projects 6. when I try to add the include for subversion.conf and click Finish in Yast I get: "Error Cannot adjust 'apache2' service." I am sure I have messed up something but what?? Thanks. George

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--- Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

While on the SUSE 10/apache/svn topic, can anyone suggest a nice server-side web-based repository browser? There are a few out there to try. But is there any one of them that cries out to be used? Did I miss one already packaged in SUSE 10.0?

Don't know how valid that is, maybe Allister, can confirm. I am almost there with the Subversion setup with apache and I installed one package to make the repo available through WebDAV with apache. The name is ViewCVS there were some python scripts and my wild guess is that they run the functionality of viewcvs to display the pages. So take a look at subversion with apache2 and you may find what you are looking for. ViewCVS is in SuSE 10.0. Regards, George

-- Roger

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"Joe Zitnik" wrote on 04/18/2006 07:22:48 AM:

That last quote I read said Ellison had been thinking of buying Novell, but decided against it. The reasons to buy Novell are plenty. They are cash rich, even with the recent attempts by Novell management to destroy the company with lousy business decisions and lack of marketing, they still have a ton o' cash. Remember as well, few people hate MS the way Ellison does. Oracle's purchase of Novell would give them plenty. First, a messaging product (GroupWise) to go against Exchange, a couple of different operating systems at the network level, Netware and SuSE, and a desktop platform. Throw in some of Novell's excellent products like ZenWorks and Identity Manager, which are always winning best in show awards, but poorly marketed as the rest of Novell offerings are, and it makes all kinds of sense. All of the sudden, Oracle goes from a company seen mainly as a database provider, to a company that has both server and desktop operating systems, desktop management and messaging solutions, as well as a world class database. Sound like anyone else out there? Now Oracle can go head to head with MS at every level. Plus both of them use red as their primary logo color :-)

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On 4/17/2006 at 7:28 PM, Dwerts wrote: Hi all, just my 2 cents worth into the fray. Larry E. is getting use to getting his way and with his strong dislike of Bill G and MS, I wouldn't be surprised at all that Novell is bought by Oracle. They, Oracle, have a VP in charge of Linux product development, SuSE is the next piece of the puzzle for them, I think. Do they have the $'s, probably. -- Don N7NKJ SuSE 9.3 Because it keeps on working! and it's open source!

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety". Benjamin Franklin

The same article, same rumors about Oracle buying Novell have been around for at least 12-14 years, and get trotted out every 3-4 years. The same concepts, same arguments still get applied. Oracle won't buy Novell because Oracle is a database company. Novell is a networking company. Oracle has enough problems trying to protect their own world right now without the complication that purchasing another company like Novell would bring. Novell would add nothing but more products to manage, and Novell has a huge amount of products, none of which integrate very well with what Oracle is about. It's interesting to note that after 10 years of the same, Oracle isn't dead, and neither is Novell (although Novell looked dead three to four years ago). Sun isn't dead either. Neither is Apple. Wasn't Microsoft supposed to kill all these companies? Jon Johnston Creative Business Solutions IBM, Microsoft, Novell/Suse and Sophos Consulting 952-544-1108 http://www.cbsol.com Blog:http://bingo.cbsol.com