[opensuse] Why so many 32bit packages on 64bit install?

Larry Stotler

4 Dec 2017 4 Dec '17

14:01

I just did a fresh install of 42.3 64bit. I had the dvd to do the install, but had to update on a very metered connection, so I went through the installed packages to find out what I could remove to save data. Now, I thought this had been addressed before, but after searching around the archive of this list, I didn't find anything. Why are like 80 some 32bit packages installed by default? I ended up removing and the taboo-ing all of them to save my data allowance. I do not have any 32bit programs installed at all, no WINE or anything else, so I am not sure why so many packages got installed. I allowed YaST to break the dependencies and have not had any issues so far but I am concerned that I may end up with some. So my question is, are there really any 32bit packages that need to be a dependency on a pure 64bit install? If not, then why are they added by default during the install, when no 32bit programs are selected? I've been running S.u.S.E. since v5.3 and I think my biggest frustration has been unwanted packages installed by default as dependencies, or failing to install due to an unsolvable dependency(tho this has gotten rarer over the years, but boy was it a pain when I was on dailup at the beginning). I never install stuff like pulseaudio, avahi, libreoffice, etc. but I'm always warned I may be breaking the install when I taboo a lot of them. Thanx -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

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Vojtěch Zeisek

4 Dec 4 Dec

14:12

Dne pondělí 4. prosince 2017 15:01:35 CET, Larry Stotler napsal(a):

...

I just did a fresh install of 42.3 64bit. I had the dvd to do the install, but had to update on a very metered connection, so I went through the installed packages to find out what I could remove to save data.

Now, I thought this had been addressed before, but after searching around the archive of this list, I didn't find anything.

Why are like 80 some 32bit packages installed by default? I ended up removing and the taboo-ing all of them to save my data allowance. I do not have any 32bit programs installed at all, no WINE or anything else, so I am not sure why so many packages got installed. I allowed YaST to break the dependencies and have not had any issues so far but I am concerned that I may end up with some.

So my question is, are there really any 32bit packages that need to be a dependency on a pure 64bit install? If not, then why are they added by default during the install, when no 32bit programs are selected?

I've been running S.u.S.E. since v5.3 and I think my biggest frustration has been unwanted packages installed by default as dependencies, or failing to install due to an unsolvable dependency(tho this has gotten rarer over the years, but boy was it a pain when I was on dailup at the beginning).

I never install stuff like pulseaudio, avahi, libreoffice, etc. but I'm always warned I may be breaking the install when I taboo a lot of them.

IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST). HTH, V. -- Vojtěch Zeisek https://trapa.cz/

Larry Stotler

15:18

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Vojtěch Zeisek wrote:

...

IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST).

There is no way to do this via the ncurses or graphical YaST? While I don't have a problem editing the files, I know some may. Just curious as to why it would not be if that is the case. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Knurpht - Gertjan Lettink

15:24

Op maandag 4 december 2017 16:18:47 CET schreef Larry Stotler:

...

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Vojtěch Zeisek

wrote:

...
IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST).

There is no way to do this via the ncurses or graphical YaST? While I don't have a problem editing the files, I know some may. Just curious as to why it would not be if that is the case.

It is. On the top "menu", under Dependencies. Simply uncheck the appropriate item. Found by simply checking. -- Gertjan Lettink, a.k.a. Knurpht openSUSE Board Member openSUSE Forums Team -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

18:48

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Content-ID: On Monday, 2017-12-04 at 16:24 +0100, Knurpht - Gertjan Lettink wrote:

...

Op maandag 4 december 2017 16:18:47 CET schreef Larry Stotler:

...
On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Vojtěch Zeisek <> wrote:

...
IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST).

There is no way to do this via the ncurses or graphical YaST? While I don't have a problem editing the files, I know some may. Just curious as to why it would not be if that is the case.

It is. On the top "menu", under Dependencies. Simply uncheck the appropriate item. Found by simply checking.

Is that accessible while installing from the DVD? Options are limited, I am not doing an install anytime soon to check... The OP is installing a new system from DVD and wants to reduce amount of downloads. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. (from openSUSE 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iEYEARECAAYFAlolmGoACgkQtTMYHG2NR9Ut2wCcCcogG56FWg2DYc98Zl9Ns5Zx tsYAmQF6eZP13bopp1j48r2cu8VJ0nbq =bgfm -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Vojtěch Zeisek

15:26

Dne pondělí 4. prosince 2017 16:18:47 CET, Larry Stotler napsal(a):

...

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Vojtěch Zeisek wrote:

...
IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST).

There is no way to do this via the ncurses or graphical YaST? While I don't have a problem editing the files, I know some may. Just curious as to why it would not be if that is the case.

I don't see such an option in YaST SW manager. For zypper, of course, install sub-command has options --recommends and --no-recommends. If You are unable or do not wish to fight with these settings, then installing also recommended packages can be good idea. :-) -- Vojtěch Zeisek https://trapa.cz/

jdd＠dodin.org

15:44

Le 04/12/2017 à 16:18, Larry Stotler a écrit :

...

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Vojtěch Zeisek wrote:

...
IMHO this is because also recommended (so not only required) packages are installed by default. My solution is to edit /etc/zypp/zypp.conf and change solver.onlyRequires = false to true. It'll stop installation of recommended packages (unless stated otherwise in zypper or YaST).

There is no way to do this via the ncurses or graphical YaST? While I don't have a problem editing the files, I know some may. Just curious as to why it would not be if that is the case.

in yast, updates are managed through "you"n (Yast Online Update), may be this module is not installed? jdd -- http://dodin.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Anton Aylward

14:25

On 04/12/17 09:01 AM, Larry Stotler wrote:

...

So my question is, are there really any 32bit packages that need to be a dependency on a pure 64bit install? If not, then why are they added by default during the install, when no 32bit programs are selected?

[...]

I never install stuff like pulseaudio, avahi, libreoffice, etc. but I'm always warned I may be breaking the install when I taboo a lot of them.

OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine. OK, so I don't WINE I *DO have all of pulseaudio, avahi, libreoffice and few other goodies, but they are the 64-bit versions and I don't have any problems with them. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Larry Stotler

15:21

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...

OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine.

Did you explicitly exclude them? Good to know that stability shouldn't be an issue. I realize that some programs even now may not have migrated to 64bit, but having to update unneeded packages on a metered connection is not desirable, Thanx -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

16:49

* Larry Stotler [12-04-17 10:24]:

...

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...
OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine.

Did you explicitly exclude them?

Good to know that stability shouldn't be an issue. I realize that some programs even now may not have migrated to 64bit, but having to update unneeded packages on a metered connection is not desirable,

do: zypper -vv rm *32bit* zypper will issue complaints if it requires one of the subject pkgs. -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA @ptilopteri http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member facebook/ptilopteri Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://linuxcounter.net Photos: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/piwigo paka @ IRCnet freenode -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Anton Aylward

17:00

On 04/12/17 11:49 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Larry Stotler [12-04-17 10:24]:

...
On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...
OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine.

Did you explicitly exclude them?

Good to know that stability shouldn't be an issue. I realize that some programs even now may not have migrated to 64bit, but having to update unneeded packages on a metered connection is not desirable,

[snip]

Of the 2013 32-bit packages in all the repositories I use I have only 66 that I've explicitly had to lock out at some time, probably while clearing out other 32 bit garbage. I probably don't need those locks any more unless I take a 'recommended'. I can't think of anything I have installed that would want any. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

C. Brouerius van Nidek

5 Dec 5 Dec

05:02

On Monday, December 4, 2017 11:49:52 PM WIB Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Larry Stotler [12-04-17 10:24]:

...
On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...
OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine.

Did you explicitly exclude them?

Good to know that stability shouldn't be an issue. I realize that some programs even now may not have migrated to 64bit, but having to update unneeded packages on a metered connection is not desirable,

do: zypper -vv rm *32bit*

zypper will issue complaints if it requires one of the subject pkgs.

Unbelievable, Looked into my system and found 147 32mit packaged . They all were deleted without any protest :). -- opensuse:tumbleweed:20171202 Qt: 5.9.2 KDE Frameworks: 5.40.0 kf5-config: 1.0 KDE Plasma: 5.11.3 plasmashell 5.11.3 Kernel: 4.14.2-1-default Linux User 183145 working on a Pentium IV . -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Anton Aylward

11:03

On 05/12/17 12:02 AM, C. Brouerius van Nidek wrote:

...

...
zypper will issue complaints if it requires one of the subject pkgs.

...

Unbelievable, Looked into my system and found 147 32mit packaged . They all were deleted without any protest :).

I can't say it surprises me. The obvious question now becomes... What is there in the basic/core install [1] of a workstation that WOULD require some 32-bit packages [1] that is an email/web-browser/writer basic setup, not audio, photo editing, no web, email-hub, FTP or SMB services. -- A: Yes. > Q: Are you sure? >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. >>> Q: Why is top posting frowned upon? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

David C. Rankin

7 Dec 7 Dec

07:31

On 12/05/2017 05:03 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...

On 05/12/17 12:02 AM, C. Brouerius van Nidek wrote:

...
...
zypper will issue complaints if it requires one of the subject pkgs.

...
Unbelievable, Looked into my system and found 147 32mit packaged . They all were deleted without any protest :).

I can't say it surprises me.

The obvious question now becomes...

What is there in the basic/core install [1] of a workstation that WOULD require some 32-bit packages

[1] that is an email/web-browser/writer basic setup, not audio, photo editing, no web, email-hub, FTP or SMB services.

For dev packages they are needed if you target 32-bit builds from your 64-bit box. I haven't counted how many I have, (OK, I just did -- 182) mostly libXXX and gcc packages. Which is fine for what I do (and with a 1T platter it's more a convenience) There are two approaches I see distros take. The openSuSE type - include 32bit libs when 64 bit libs are installed -- for this purpose, The second approach is the Arch approach -- include none and require you to go reconfigure your system to include the `multilib` repository and replace gcc, glibc, etc. with multilib versions if you ever need to target a 32bit build on your 64bit box. (this is one heck of a bit of reconfiguration just for the rarely needed 'gcc -m32 -o foo foo.c' (I actually had to do this not too long ago) So from the 1T platter standpoint, I don't mind the 32bit libs -- they are there if I need a 32bit target. If I were on a 128G SSD -- then that balance would probably tilt the other direction. The best solution is to make an easily configurable checkbox (during install Package Selection) that lets the user choose which way to go -- or provide a simple method to access the zypp.conf 'used by the installer' so this change can be made before package selection. There may be other uses for them (I don't know if setting up a VM with KVM or Zen ever needs them for a 32bit guest), but I can see if you don't ever open konsole with 8-tabs for hacking with gcc, then you probably don't need to give up the drive real-estate. -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Dave Howorth

5 Dec 5 Dec

13:53

On Tue, 05 Dec 2017 12:02:12 +0700 "C. Brouerius van Nidek" wrote:

...

On Monday, December 4, 2017 11:49:52 PM WIB Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
* Larry Stotler [12-04-17 10:24]:

...
On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Anton Aylward wrote:

...
OK, so I'm running 42.2, and OK so I have a large set of other repositories for special interests like photography.... I do a 'zypper search 32bit' and see that while I have a hole raft of them locked out, I hove none, zip, nada, absolutely no 32 bit package installed on my 64-bit machine.

Did you explicitly exclude them?

Good to know that stability shouldn't be an issue. I realize that some programs even now may not have migrated to 64bit, but having to update unneeded packages on a metered connection is not desirable,

do: zypper -vv rm *32bit*

zypper will issue complaints if it requires one of the subject pkgs.

Unbelievable, Looked into my system and found 147 32mit packaged . They all were deleted without any protest :).

I found 65 - but I changed the recommend option in YaST a while ago. What did surprise me were how many applications were actually using those 32bit packages when I deleted them! Why is systemd using a 32bit package on a 64bit machine, for example? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

4 Dec 4 Dec

21:36

Larry Stotler composed on 2017-12-04 09:01 (UTC-0500):

...

Why are like 80 some 32bit packages installed by default?

Lots of packages are "recommended" by default. IIRC, 32bit recommends on 64bit installations have their genesis in now-obsolete multimedia dependencies.

...

So my question is, are there really any 32bit packages that need to be a dependency on a pure 64bit install?

No.

...

If not, then why are they added by default during the install, when no 32bit programs are selected?

id.

...

I've been running S.u.S.E. since v5.3 and I think my biggest frustration has been unwanted packages installed by default as dependencies I was frustrated the same for years, until finally someone here poked me hard enough to look right in front of my nose, (under Dependencies) to disable

"Install Recommended Packages": http://fm.no-ip.com/SS/Suse/YaST/423/yast2-dependencies0768.png -- "Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Whatever else you get, get wisdom." Proverbs 4:7 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

Marcus Meissner

7 Dec 7 Dec