Hi all, Am Mittwoch, 4. Februar 2004 05:30 schrieb Linuxjim:

For anyone interested, you can do the following:

        telnet relay-test.mail-abuse.org Jim Flanagan This is the by far funniest thread for a long time, with the questioner answering himself in the end ...ROFL. Jim, you could also telnet from a non-local machine to port 25 and conduct a raw smtp session:

telnet mailhost 25 EHLO sending.host.com MAIL FROM: any@sender.com RCPT TO: someone@nonlocal.domain.com DATA some data . quit ---- If it gets sent, you are an open relay. FWIW. Regards Dan -- buddha 2.4.21-166-default 10:51am up 18:50, 7 users, load

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first. I'm new to linux and would rather check to see if I can get the base install workign first. I really hesitate to install a large package like qmail. Several reasons. 1. I'm not sure what I"m doing with a mail server in the first place, so installing another app seems like too much complication for now. 2. I've only been successful installing rpm's, not source. 3. I have looked into qmail in the past, but have questions as to how it intergrates with suse/yast/kde, being installed without rpm. 4. If qmail is so good, why does suse not include it with the distro? I have seen (somewhere) that qmail can support web browser access, which is a very attractive feature. Thanks for the tips though, I may try it sometime. Jim Flanagan On Tuesday 03 February 2004 21:02, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 04.01, W.D.McKinney wrote:

...

On Tue, 2004-02-03 at 17:35, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Hi,

How do I make sure I am not running an open relay? I have Suse 8.2 pro configured mostly as default running KDE 3.1.5. Postfix with all YOU patches up to date.

Is there an internal command or log, or perhaps a telnet command from "outside" my local net?

Best regards,

Jim Flanagan

It's actually very easy. de-install Postfix and install qmail per http://www.lifewithqmail.org and you will the best MTA and no open relay.

Ohyesthat'sright

Q: How do I check if my postfix is an open relay A; Install qmail

Oh please put that in the faq, it really is such a useful answer

On Wed, 2004-02-04 at 00:04, Gary wrote:

On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 10:38:10PM -0600 or thereabouts, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first. I'm new to linux and would rather check to see if I can get the base install workign first.

Welcome to Linux... <g>

Please read all you can. You will only benefit from it.. BTW, I notice your Earthlink account... Do you have your own domain name, or will you be using your Earthlink account? The reason I ask is that if you have your own domain name, normally you will be able to send and receive mail from your server. However, Earthlink blocks port 25 (SMTP), so you will not be able to use your server for sending/receiving email for your domain. The only way you can use your Postfix server is to relay mail to Earthlink's SMTP server, using their domain, and your email address with them. All incoming mail will be from their server too.. So you will have to POP your mail to receive it...

I am also with earthlink (DSL) at home and have no problems with blocked ports. Email and web work fine. -- Ken Schneider unix user since 1989 linux user since 1994 SuSE user since 1998 (5.2)

On Tuesday 03 February 2004 23:04, Gary wrote:

On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 10:38:10PM -0600 or thereabouts, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first. I'm new to linux and would rather check to see if I can get the base install workign first.

Welcome to Linux... <g>

...

I really hesitate to install a large package like qmail. Several reasons.

Actually, it is a small package, several small packages, that integrate, and do one thing, and one thing well, the *nux philosophy... It is much smaller than Postfix.

...

1. I'm not sure what I"m doing with a mail server in the first place, so installing another app seems like too much complication for now.

Please read all you can. You will only benefit from it.. BTW, I notice your Earthlink account... Do you have your own domain name, or will you be using your Earthlink account? The reason I ask is that if you have your own domain name, normally you will be able to send and receive mail from your server. However, Earthlink blocks port 25 (SMTP), so you will not be able to use your server for sending/receiving email for your domain. The only way you can use your Postfix server is to relay mail to Earthlink's SMTP server, using their domain, and your email address with them. All incoming mail will be from their server too.. So you will have to POP your mail to receive it...

...

2. I've only been successful installing rpm's, not source.

I personally like installing from source...

...

3. I have looked into qmail in the past, but have questions as to how it intergrates with suse/yast/kde, being installed without rpm.

You don't integrate it.. It runs from its own scripts, using its own service, and it never goes down or fails. I run it on SUSE, and RH, and FreeBSD.

...

4. If qmail is so good, why does suse not include it with the distro?

Because the author will not allow the code to be modified and redistributed. All files, no matter what OS is used, go into the same directories... /var/qmail, etc... Many distros would rather modify locations, etc. through RPMs, so they don't bother with it. Some of the largest servers on the net use qmail, to include Yahoo, Rediffmail with over 20 million subscribers, and all the SUSE lists, just to name a few. A single P133 or PII 350 machine will handle several hundred thousand emails a day without breaking a sweat..

...

I have seen (somewhere) that qmail can support web browser access, which is a very attractive feature.

Yes, it does, but so can Postfix I am sure. It will also handle all protocols such as STARTTLS, virus rejection at the SMTP level, so it does not even enter your system (from all MS executable viruses), support for LDAP, on and on...

...

Thanks for the tips though, I may try it sometime.

If you ever get away from Earthlink, and get your own domain(s), it would be worthwhile to take a look <g>

-- Gary

Thanks for all they input guys. Several hundred thousand emails a day?! Thats quite astounding! Im running on an old AMD K6-II-300. System wise, its steady, but certainly not fast. I do have a domain set up but not "published yet" as I'm still tweaking postfix. I plan to swithc over when I know is working reliably. For those who wish to know, earthlink is not block in port 25, or any other that I can tell. I can send/receive SMTP on it. I have some more "setup" type questions, but I'll start another thread later. Many thanks to all. Jim Flanagan

Hi Linuxjim, On Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:20:07 -0600 UTC (2/4/2004, 9:20 AM -0600 UTC my time), Linuxjim wrote: L> Do you mean by that that if I run qmail, I should uninstall postfix, then L> install qmail, from source. You can uninstall it, or just leave it, and turn it off in Yast2, so the service is not running. L> Then, is it correct that Yast will know know its there and all setup will L> be in qmail and not yast? How does the local system know where to sent L> mail to? No Yast will not know where it is... qmail is a separate service unto itself. In order to answer your above questions, regarding local and remote delivery, you should read www.lifewithqmail.org It will answer all your questions. However, since you are new to setting up a mail server, I would stay with Postfix. For one domain, it is easy to set up, and by default you will not be an open relay.. (of course, qmail will not relay either by default)... You seem to want programs that are tied into Yast2, for ease of use and setup, so I would stay with Postfix.. it will serve you well during the learning phase... and its main config file is well documented. This way you would be happier and not frustrated.. <g> -- Gary If you must choose between two evils, pick the one you've never tried before.

On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 06:12:01AM +0100 or thereabouts, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 05.38, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first.

<snip>

Q: <Question about sendmail> A: Don't use sendmail, use postfix

Q: OK, <same question about postfix> A: Don't use postfix, use qmail

Q: *sigh*, ok, <same question about qmail> A: Don't use qmail, use...

and so on, ad infinitum. It's just so pointless

Talking about MUAs always reminds me of the VIM vs emacs wars.. <g> -- Gary

On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 06:35:29AM +0100 or thereabouts, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 06.23, Gary wrote:

...

On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 06:12:01AM +0100 or thereabouts, Anders Johansson wrote:

...

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 05.38, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first.

<snip>

...

Q: <Question about sendmail> A: Don't use sendmail, use postfix

Q: OK, <same question about postfix> A: Don't use postfix, use qmail

Q: *sigh*, ok, <same question about qmail> A: Don't use qmail, use...

and so on, ad infinitum. It's just so pointless

...

Talking about MUAs always reminds me of the VIM vs emacs wars.. <g>

MUAs as well, yeah, or the gnome vs. kde, or pgsql vs. mysql vs. firebird, or opera vs. mozilla vs. konqueror vs. epiphany vs. galeon etc etc etc

There is no shortage of fuel for the flame wars

cracks me up... MUAs, MTAs, KDE, pgsql, mysql,... I need a dictionary! I will admit that I think talking about MTAs, VIM, emacs, border on holy wars... -- Gary BREAKFAST.COM Halted - Cereal port not responding.

On Tue, 2004-02-03 at 20:12, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 05.38, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Thanks for the info guys, but I'm really trying to work with Postfix first.

Yeah, I know, I was kinda going for sarcasm towards Mr. McKinney there.

Q: <Question about sendmail> A: Don't use sendmail, use postfix

Q: OK, <same question about postfix> A: Don't use postfix, use qmail

Q: *sigh*, ok, <same question about qmail> A: Don't use qmail, use...

and so on, ad infinitum. It's just so pointless

Unless you have a good sense of humor :-) Oh yea, 'Only the experienced walk with a limp'. So go ahead and use whatever MTA suits you, and have fun. Dee

On Wed, 2004-02-04 at 12:02, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Wednesday 04 February 2004 04.01, W.D.McKinney wrote:

...

On Tue, 2004-02-03 at 17:35, Linuxjim wrote:

...

Hi,

How do I make sure I am not running an open relay? I have Suse 8.2 pro configured mostly as default running KDE 3.1.5. Postfix with all YOU patches up to date.

Is there an internal command or log, or perhaps a telnet command from "outside" my local net?

Best regards,

Jim Flanagan

It's actually very easy. de-install Postfix and install qmail per http://www.lifewithqmail.org and you will the best MTA and no open relay.

Ohyesthat'sright

Q: How do I check if my postfix is an open relay A; Install qmail

Oh please put that in the faq, it really is such a useful answer

-- Check the headers for your unsubscription address For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the archives at http://lists.suse.com Please read the FAQs: suse-linux-e-faq@suse.com

http://www.abuse.net/relay.html -- David Blomberg AIS, APS, ASE, CCNA, LCP, LCA, Linux+, LPI I, MCP, MCSA, MCSE, RHCE, Server+ dblomber@davelinux.com www.davelinux.com -------------------- Nihon Libertec dblomber@libertec.com

On Tue, 2004-02-03 at 22:50, Mads Martin Joergensen wrote:

* W.D.McKinney [Feb 04. 2004 04:01]:

...

...

How do I make sure I am not running an open relay? I have Suse 8.2 pro configured mostly as default running KDE 3.1.5. Postfix with all YOU patches up to date.

Postfix cannot be configured as an open relay. In order for that to happen you would have to go through a lot of hazzle and know what you're doing.

...

...

Is there an internal command or log, or perhaps a telnet command from "outside" my local net?

It's actually very easy. de-install Postfix and install qmail per http://www.lifewithqmail.org and you will the best MTA and no open relay.

Well, that's very bad advice. Remember the lists.suse.com being an open relay problem? Well, that was qmail, and the problem is qmail does accept and relay mail like this: iashh@yahoo.com@suse.com to iashh@yahoo.com.

The only way to turn that off is to find some patch floating on the internet, and apply that.

So unless people really know what they're doing, they shouldn't run qmail.

No, it's excellent advice. I am a running postfix, sendmail & qmail on servers. qmail is by far my choice. Due to a non standard install of qmail Mads, you have an open relay. CKM admitted this. If you follow Life With Qmail you will not have an open relay. And you will know more about how your MTA works than installing by rpm. Yahoo runs on qmail and is not an open relay either. I have had people test our qmail MTA repeatedly also. nada, not an open relay. Also a much better & faster MTA than postifix, IMHO. Cheers, Dee Alaska Wireless Systems

Mads Martin Joergensen said:

* W.D.McKinney [Feb 04. 2004 09:54]:

...

...

Well, that's very bad advice. Remember the lists.suse.com being an open relay problem? Well, that was qmail, and the problem is qmail does accept and relay mail like this: iashh@yahoo.com@suse.com to iashh@yahoo.com.

The only way to turn that off is to find some patch floating on the internet, and apply that.

So unless people really know what they're doing, they shouldn't run qmail.

No, it's excellent advice. I am a running postfix, sendmail & qmail on servers. qmail is by far my choice.

Due to a non standard install of qmail Mads, you have an open relay. CKM admitted this. If you follow Life With Qmail you will not have an open relay. And you will know more about how your MTA works than installing by rpm. Yahoo runs on qmail and is not an open relay either.

So how did CKM say it was nonstandard?

Well, another thing that's so ridiculous is that it cannot reload certain parts of it's configuration without a restart. That mean that if we shut down qmail gracefully to change the max amount of concurrent connections on lists.suse.com for instance, we'll see a stop of all lists for 30-60 minutes.

This thread is getting rather silly, in my experience Postfix and I'm sure most other MTAs will only relay email from clients on the defined internal network i.e. local users can send SMTP through the server, but no email can be relayed from an address outside of the defined internal network. What everyone needs to be aware of is the fact that some broadband routers that perform inbound port forwarding, Linksys for instance, translate the source address to the router's own internal address. This has the effect of making postfix and I'm sure qmail and other MTAs think the email has come from a device on the internal network and hence it will relay the email. I learnt the hard way about this, but it's something worth bearing in mind. David -- David Bottrill david@bottrill.org www.bottrill.org Registered Linux user number 330730