[opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's

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Bob S

8 Sep 2007 8 Sep '07

04:49

Hello SuSE people, This is especially for you guys/gals that run 3or 4 os's on a big hard drive. How do you handle the primary and extended partitions? A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive) Now, I guess I could move my /home and /swap into the extended partition to free up two primary partitions. Hopefully that would give me access to the rest of the unused space on the drive. I always liked having my /home on it's own partition to guard it from mishap. Now, here are some of my questions: Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition? I could never delete or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right? Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition? Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?) How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions? Love to hear your individual strategies. Anxiously awaiting the final 10.3 so I can try Compiz-Fusion, Beryl whatever and be able to fall back to 10.2 when I screw it up. Bob S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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Felix Miata

8 Sep 8 Sep

05:15

On 2007/09/08 00:49 (GMT-0400) Bob S apparently typed:

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A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

Not exactly dumb. Without "sacrificing" a primary for use as an extended, you're limited to 4 partitions total. There are only two ways to be out of available unpartitioned space to add a logical if an extended already exists: 1-100% of freespace is already allocated to partitions 2-all existing freespace is located in between two primary partitions neither of which is an extended partition If the latter is your problem, all primaries need to be made adjacent.

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Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition?

The difference between logical and primary partitions only matters to boot loaders and legacy DOS and windoz operating systems. Linux once booted sees partitions as partitions without distinction between logical & primary, which means there's no difference in "safety", whatever that means.

...

I could never delete or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?

The "extended partition" is nothing but a series of marker sectors pointing to partitions that don't have table entries in the MBR, plus a primary partition table entry that starts the marker chain by pointing to the first logical partition.

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Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition?

Linux doesn't care. Generally the best place for swap is wherever your disk's fastest access exists, usually but not always at or near the "front".

...

Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?)

Linux installers generally will use every swap partition they can find. If you have multiple swap partitions, you'll have to manually change each new fstab to use whichever swap partitions you want used for that Linux.

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How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

I doubt anyone does. There's no reason to. I usually have a maintenance and/or boot partition on the first, a boot manager on the second, a small primary type 0x06 for DOS and/or windoz, and everything else as logicals, typically more than 20 total per disk. On partitioning generally: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/partitioningindex.html -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob S

9 Sep 9 Sep

05:30

On Saturday 08 September 2007 01:15, Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2007/09/08 00:49 (GMT-0400) Bob S apparently typed:

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A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

Not exactly dumb. Without "sacrificing" a primary for use as an extended, you're limited to 4 partitions total. There are only two ways to be out of available unpartitioned space to add a logical if an extended already exists:

Felix, Rajko, Mike, Thanks for responding. You each have contributed something to me. For Felix

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1-100% of freespace is already allocated to partitions 2-all existing freespace is located in between two primary partitions neither of which is an extended partition

Neither of those are the problem. The fourth primary (sda4) is the extended and all of the free space is after that. However, Yast partitioner will not allow me to create or edit it because of the extended partition size restrictions. It will not let me resize it neither because supposedly it is the wrong file system type. So, now all of the free space is lost behind it. Does this mean I have to delete the extended partition and make it extend to the end of the disk and lose all of my present logical partitions?

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Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition?

The difference between logical and primary partitions only matters to boot loaders and legacy DOS and windoz operating systems. Linux once booted sees partitions as partitions without distinction between logical & primary, which means there's no difference in "safety", whatever that means.

OK, understood. I always just liked my /home separate and secure from all other vagaries of the system.

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I could never delete or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?

The "extended partition" is nothing but a series of marker sectors pointing to partitions that don't have table entries in the MBR, plus a primary partition table entry that starts the marker chain by pointing to the first logical partition.

...

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Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition?

Linux doesn't care. Generally the best place for swap is wherever your disk's fastest access exists, usually but not always at or near the "front".

OK again

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Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?)

Linux installers generally will use every swap partition they can find. If you have multiple swap partitions, you'll have to manually change each new fstab to use whichever swap partitions you want used for that Linux.

Do you mean that if there are two separate swap partitions they can be combined?

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How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

I doubt anyone does. There's no reason to. I usually have a maintenance and/or boot partition on the first, a boot manager on the second, a small primary type 0x06 for DOS and/or windoz, and everything else as logicals, typically more than 20 total per disk.

OK, but that means you have used up two very small primary partitions and one larger one for DOS/Windows, right? That leaves the fourth as an extended for everything else.

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On partitioning generally: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/partitioningindex.html

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-- Next question; you seem to indicate that it is necessary to have a boot manager on the first partition of the first drive to boot more than two os's. I don't really recall but I think there was some kind of boot manager as seen by a really old Partition Magic for Win 98 while using LILO. (Win98 still

Spent over an hour reading it. Very informative. but a few questions: The LVM you talk about there; that is a OS2 thing right? Different from LVM in Linux. I originally used LVM in 10.0 and when I installed 10.2 it seemed to want to add the 10.2 LVM to the original 10.0 system. I just gave up with fooling with it in 10.2 and installed the partitions as straight partitions. Maybe I just don't understand how it works. there on hda taking up space to just play a silly game once-in-awhile) If it is not, will I need to install one to run 10.3 once it is installed? Thanks for your patience. Bob S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

06:43

On Sunday 09 September 2007 00:30, Bob S wrote:

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However, Yast partitioner will not allow me to create or edit it because of the extended partition size restrictions. It will not let me resize it neither because supposedly it is the wrong file system type. So, now all of the free space is lost behind it. Does this mean I have to delete the extended partition and make it extend to the end of the disk and lose all of my present logical partitions?

If you have logical partitons than you must have extended partition. To make communication clear, please run as root: fdisk -l and post the output. That will make discussion more practical, based on real data. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

10:44

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Sunday 2007-09-09 at 01:30 -0400, Bob S wrote:

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Neither of those are the problem. The fourth primary (sda4) is the extended and all of the free space is after that.

So, you have 3 primaries, one extended, and then free space, outside of the extended partition? Then that free space is lost. The extended partition most contain all the remaining space, later to be assigned to logical partitions, which may or not use all that space. It should be possible to change the extended partition size without loosing data. Some tools are able to do it, like the commercial partition magic, I think it is. Maybe there is another method in linux. But write here the output of fdisk -l /dev/sda so we can judge better. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG486StTMYHG2NR9URAkr6AJ9EZ9LcUdZZNTTAH5FRDJLvEiz3zQCeKSEJ e5Vp1HjrwlszZzHv48Vjj40= =AM3i -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob S

10 Sep 10 Sep

02:37

On Sunday 09 September 2007 06:44, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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The Sunday 2007-09-09 at 01:30 -0400, Bob S wrote:

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Neither of those are the problem. The fourth primary (sda4) is the extended and all of the free space is after that.

So, you have 3 primaries, one extended, and then free space, outside of the extended partition? Then that free space is lost.

The extended partition most contain all the remaining space, later to be assigned to logical partitions, which may or not use all that space.

It should be possible to change the extended partition size without loosing data. Some tools are able to do it, like the commercial partition magic, I think it is. Maybe there is another method in linux.

But write here the output of fdisk -l /dev/sda so we can judge better.

Thanks Carlos. and for Rajko also Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda Disk /dev/sda: 250.0 GB, 250059350016 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 30401 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda1 1 1306 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda2 1307 3265 15735667+ 83 Linux /dev/sda3 3266 3527 2104515 82 Linux swap / Solaris /dev/sda4 3528 10055 52436160 f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda5 3528 4180 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda6 4181 4833 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda7 4834 6139 10490413+ c W95 FAT32 (LBA) /dev/sda8 6140 7445 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda9 7446 10055 20964793+ 83 Linux EasyStreet:/ # I really hope there is such a tool. Otherwise I have an awful lot of work/fooling around to do. That is what I meant when I said,in my original post, I did a really dumb/stupid thing when I partitioned that disk. Bob S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

03:21

On Sunday 09 September 2007 21:37, Bob S wrote:

...

On Sunday 09 September 2007 06:44, Carlos E. R. wrote: ... Thanks Carlos. and for Rajko also Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda

Disk /dev/sda: 250.0 GB, 250059350016 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 30401 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda1 1 1306 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda2 1307 3265 15735667+ 83 Linux /dev/sda3 3266 3527 2104515 82 Linux swap / Solaris /dev/sda4 3528 10055 52436160 f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda5 3528 4180 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda6 4181 4833 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda7 4834 6139 10490413+ c W95 FAT32 (LBA) /dev/sda8 6140 7445 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda9 7446 10055 20964793+ 83 Linux EasyStreet:/ #

I really hope there is such a tool. Otherwise I have an awful lot of work/fooling around to do. That is what I meant when I said,in my original post, I did a really dumb/stupid thing when I partitioned that disk.

OK. There are 2 options. 1) Run YaST partitoner and try to add more partitions, not to delete or resize /dev/sda4 2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kenneth Schneider

03:40

On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 22:21 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:

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On Sunday 09 September 2007 21:37, Bob S wrote:

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On Sunday 09 September 2007 06:44, Carlos E. R. wrote: ... Thanks Carlos. and for Rajko also Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda

Disk /dev/sda: 250.0 GB, 250059350016 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 30401 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda1 1 1306 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda2 1307 3265 15735667+ 83 Linux /dev/sda3 3266 3527 2104515 82 Linux swap / Solaris /dev/sda4 3528 10055 52436160 f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda5 3528 4180 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda6 4181 4833 5245191 83 Linux /dev/sda7 4834 6139 10490413+ c W95 FAT32 (LBA) /dev/sda8 6140 7445 10490413+ 83 Linux /dev/sda9 7446 10055 20964793+ 83 Linux EasyStreet:/ #

I really hope there is such a tool. Otherwise I have an awful lot of work/fooling around to do. That is what I meant when I said,in my original post, I did a really dumb/stupid thing when I partitioned that disk.

OK. There are 2 options. 1) Run YaST partitoner and try to add more partitions, not to delete or resize /dev/sda4

2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions.

-- Regards, Rajko.

I don't think that will work as he has his extended partition ending at 10055 which is where sda9 ends. At this point his only option is to backup sda5-sda9, delete them and then recreate the extended partition using all of the available space. He will then be able to created more partitions. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

05:23

On Sunday 09 September 2007 22:40, Kenneth Schneider wrote:

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On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 22:21 -0500, Rajko M. wrote: ...

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OK. There are 2 options. 1) Run YaST partitoner and try to add more partitions, not to delete or resize /dev/sda4

2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions. ...

I don't think that will work as he has his extended partition ending at 10055 which is where sda9 ends. At this point his only option is to backup sda5-sda9, delete them and then recreate the extended partition using all of the available space. He will then be able to created more partitions.

I suspect that is as you say, but trying that cost nothing. In the worst case he would have to do what you said. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

05:56

On 2007/09/09 23:40 (GMT-0400) Kenneth Schneider apparently typed:

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On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 22:21 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:

...

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On Sunday 09 September 2007 22:37 (GMT-0400) Bob S wrote:

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Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda

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255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 30401 cylinders

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Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/sda4 3528 10055 52436160 f W95 Ext'd (LBA) /dev/sda9 7446 10055 20964793+ 83 Linux

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There are 2 options. 1) Run YaST partitoner and try to add more partitions, not to delete or resize /dev/sda4

If it won't let you, it's broken. I think it will let you, though it won't necessarily be easy to see how.

...

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2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions.

That certainly should work.

...

I don't think that will work as he has his extended partition ending at 10055 which is where sda9 ends. At this point his only option is to backup sda5-sda9, delete them and then recreate the extended partition using all of the available space. He will then be able to created more partitions.

sda4 only ends at 10055 because that's where sda9 ends. sda9's EPBR has no means to tell where the end of the disk is. As soon as sda10 is created, sda4 will magically grow to end where sda10 ends, unless the partitioning tool is broken. Only when a logical partition has been created that includes cylinder 30401 will sda4 show ending at the end of the disk. -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob S

11 Sep 11 Sep

04:15

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Monday 10 September 2007 01:56, Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2007/09/09 23:40 (GMT-0400) Kenneth Schneider apparently typed:

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On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 22:21 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:

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On Sunday 09 September 2007 22:37 (GMT-0400) Bob S wrote:

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Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda

Felix, Rajko, Ken,

And all of the other great guys on this list who tried to help. What a great bunch! .<snip more older discussion>.......

...

...
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2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions.

That certainly should work.

...
I don't think that will work as he has his extended partition ending at 10055 which is where sda9 ends. At this point his only option is to backup sda5-sda9, delete them and then recreate the extended partition using all of the available space. He will then be able to created more partitions.

sda4 only ends at 10055 because that's where sda9 ends. sda9's EPBR has no means to tell where the end of the disk is. As soon as sda10 is created, sda4 will magically grow to end where sda10 ends, unless the partitioning tool is broken. Only when a logical partition has been created that includes cylinder 30401 will sda4 show ending at the end of the disk. -- cfdisk will do it !! Thanks so much ! All the remaining 167GB of free space.

I had never heard of cfdisk and was afraid of what I would do so I studied the man page over and over and then tried it. It will work. (Wonder why Yast partitioner won't?) What it will do is create sda10 a logical partition of 167GB of all remaining free space which I am assuming will push the extended partion out to the end of the disk. I didn't do it because I am afraid to do it on my running system ( a concern?) and I didn't want a partition of that huge size, and I don't see (yet) a way to create several smaller partitions. Can that be done in cfdisk? I suppose I could go to the yast partitioner and resize it. but that may make the extended partition shrink. I dunno yet. But I am very happy that I have that space back for when I go to install 10.3. Thanks again guys and all ideas welcome on dividing up that 167GB before I commit. Bob S -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

04:50

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Monday 10 September 2007 23:15, Bob S wrote:

...

cfdisk will do it !! Thanks so much ! All the remaining 167GB of free space.

I had never heard of cfdisk and was afraid of what I would do so I studied the man page over and over and then tried it. It will work. (Wonder why Yast partitioner won't?) What it will do is create sda10 a logical partition of 167GB of all remaining free space which I am assuming will push the extended partion out to the end of the disk. I didn't do it because I am afraid to do it on my running system ( a concern?) and I didn't want a partition of that huge size, and I don't see (yet) a way to create several smaller partitions. Can that be done in cfdisk?

The 'cfdisk' is dependable program and easy to use, but that's not all, there is 'sfdisk' too :-) Looks like 'fdisk', but it is better, than 'parted'.

...

I suppose I could go to the yast partitioner and resize it. but that may make the extended partition shrink. I dunno yet. But I am very happy that I have that space back for when I go to install 10.3.

Have you tried to add partition using YaST?

...

Thanks again guys and all ideas welcome on dividing up that 167GB before I commit.

Bob S

-- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

12:30

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Monday 10 September 2007 23:50, which is late night, Rajko M. wrote and now has to explain: ...

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The 'cfdisk' is dependable program and easy to use, but that's not all, there is 'sfdisk' too :-) Looks like 'fdisk', but it is better, than 'parted'.

The 'sfdisk' looks like 'fdisk', but it is better. Than we have parted as another partitioning tool, that is installed by default. AFAIK parted is used by YaST. ...

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Thanks again guys and all ideas welcome on dividing up that 167GB before I commit.

Adding partitions in empty space after already partitioned space is not risky, at least not more than any partitioning. The only operation that requires precision is if you resize partition that is between 2 others. The only advice that you need is to have in mind that you have 6 more left. So maximum 5 partitions of 10 GB for experimental systems, and the rest for archive where you can store iso files, backups, virtual machine images etc. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

12:39

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 00:15 -0400, Bob S wrote:

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cfdisk will do it !! Thanks so much ! All the remaining 167GB of free space.

I had never heard of cfdisk and was afraid of what I would do so I studied the man page over and over and then tried it. It will work. (Wonder why Yast partitioner won't?) What it will do is create sda10 a logical partition of 167GB of all remaining free space which I am assuming will push the extended partion out to the end of the disk. I didn't do it because I am afraid to do it on my running system ( a concern?) and I didn't want a partition of that huge size, and I don't see (yet) a way to create several smaller partitions. Can that be done in cfdisk? I suppose I could go to the yast partitioner and resize it. but that may make the extended partition shrink. I dunno yet. But I am very happy that I have that space back for when I go to install 10.3.

I think you can safely create that big partition, and then, if you want, delete it in Yast and create smaller partitions. This should not shrink the extended partition again (usual disclaimers apply, blah, blah, blah). Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four). - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG5oxttTMYHG2NR9URAiWsAJ9SMLYPIgZ9SR965saUIyTaJmOllACfYA36 +73+yhkvETbwXzAuj0sxjvE= =IRqJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

13:12

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On 2007/09/11 14:39 (GMT+0200) Carlos E. R. apparently typed:

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Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you

The correct statement is more than *15*, as 15 are supported by SCSI, while 16 are not.

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will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

I believe your statement probably is based upon http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse/2007-08/msg01646.html but what that says is that the legacy drivers *may* no longer be included in 10.4, *not* that installing to a disk possessing more than 15 partitions will be impossible (as is the case in Fedora as of v7). -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

14:37

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 09:12 -0400, Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2007/09/11 14:39 (GMT+0200) Carlos E. R. apparently typed:

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Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you

The correct statement is more than *15*, as 15 are supported by SCSI, while 16 are not.

You are probably right. It is fom 0 to 15, which makes 16; but the 0 is the whole disk. So it must be 15 partitions. However, the 10.3 installer message talks about 16. Perhaps it says "16 or more", but I'd had to reboot in order to check it.

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will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

I believe your statement probably is based upon http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse/2007-08/msg01646.html but what that says is that the legacy drivers *may* no longer be included in 10.4, *not* that installing to a disk possessing more than 15 partitions will be impossible (as is the case in Fedora as of v7).

If the legacy drivers are not included, then install and usage are impossible. I'd hug that "may", but... It is also confirmed by https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=309070#c11 - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG5qgTtTMYHG2NR9URAl7XAJ4/lhnZFxSomFhDjx6+aIhA1DDoawCffyt7 Z1We0kJZ2X2qv84Kd7GcCzo= =6x4C -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kenneth Schneider

16:00

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Tue, 2007-09-11 at 16:37 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1

The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 09:12 -0400, Felix Miata wrote:

...
On 2007/09/11 14:39 (GMT+0200) Carlos E. R. apparently typed:

...
Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you

The correct statement is more than *15*, as 15 are supported by SCSI, while 16 are not.

You are probably right.

It is fom 0 to 15, which makes 16; but the 0 is the whole disk. So it must be 15 partitions.

Wrong! sda0 is a partition as well as hda0 is a partition _NOT_ the whole disk. The whole disk would be sda or hda (without the number). -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

17:26

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 12:00 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:

...

...
You are probably right.

It is fom 0 to 15, which makes 16; but the 0 is the whole disk. So it must be 15 partitions.

Wrong! sda0 is a partition as well as hda0 is a partition _NOT_ the whole disk. The whole disk would be sda or hda (without the number).

Wrong, because I'm not refering to that zero, but to the one in the minor number. 8 block SCSI disk devices (0-15) 0 = /dev/sda First SCSI disk whole disk 16 = /dev/sdb Second SCSI disk whole disk 32 = /dev/sdc Third SCSI disk whole disk ... 240 = /dev/sdp Sixteenth SCSI disk whole disk Partitions are handled in the same way as for IDE disks (see major number 3) except that the limit on partitions is 15. So, major 8, minor 0 is sda, and major 8, minor 1 is sda1. Check: cer@nimrodel:~> l /dev/sd* brw-r----- 1 root disk 8, 0 2007-09-11 18:55 /dev/sda brw-r----- 1 root disk 8, 1 2007-09-11 18:55 /dev/sda1 See? :-) - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG5s+ytTMYHG2NR9URAox6AKCZYbstDqypwVlCZBqXCDbVVydFmwCgjimS tlgewz0OnlZ4Xz4MWs57XIw= =hbND -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

13:19

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

* Carlos E. R. [09-11-07 08:39]:

...

Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4. -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

14:38

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 09:19 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Carlos E. R. [09-11-07 08:39]:

...
Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Versionitis! I'd love to see 10.64... :-P - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG5qhbtTMYHG2NR9URAv0OAJ9IZzVtTgk3xwvS+ddQdyTLfynDfACeLrnu hxqKHUAhP9RLQfAT+qRuZZo= =vnca -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Alexey Eremenko

14:50

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On 9/11/07, Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1

The Tuesday 2007-09-11 at 09:19 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
* Carlos E. R. [09-11-07 08:39]:

...
Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Versionitis!

I'd love to see 10.64...

:-P

This is of no relevance ! Until then all CPUs will be 128-bit :) -- -Alexey Eremenko "Technologov" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

17:25

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Tuesday 11 September 2007 06:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Carlos E. R. [09-11-07 08:39]:

...
Notice: beware of adding too many partitions! If you have more than 16 you will not be able to install suse 10.4 (yes, that's a four).

Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Can't wait. I've been hoping for a version of SUSE that is louder than this one. -- kai ponte www.perfectreign.com -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Glenn Holmer

20:33

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Tuesday 11 September 2007 08:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Have you got a link for that? Thanks. -- "After the vintage season came the aftermath - and Cenbe." Glenn Holmer (Q-Link: ShadowM) http://www.lyonlabs.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

20:46

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

* Glenn Holmer [09-11-07 16:35]:

...

On Tuesday 11 September 2007 08:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Have you got a link for that? Thanks.

Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:09:41 +0200 From: Stephan Kulow To: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org Subject: [opensuse-packaging] Next Steps openSUSE 10.3 Mailing-List: contact opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org; run by mlmmj Message-Id: <200709101709.42094.coolo@suse.de> [...] * Bugs that won't be fixed for 10.3 can be moved to 11.0 in bugzilla now. I suggest to take that option for every bug you're not planning to do an online update later (should be a minority of the current bugs). [...] Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:45:37 +0200 (CEST) From: Jan Engelhardt To: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org Subject: Re: [opensuse-packaging] Next Steps openSUSE 10.3 Mailing-List: contact opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org; run by mlmmj Message-ID: On Sep 10 2007 17:09, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

* Bugs that won't be fixed for 10.3 can be moved to 11.0 in bugzilla now. I suggest to take that option for every bug you're not planning to do an online update later (should be a minority of the current bugs).

No future 10.4? Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:59:14 +0200 From: Ladislav Michnovič To: Jan Engelhardt Cc: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org Subject: Re: [opensuse-packaging] Next Steps openSUSE 10.3 Mailing-List: contact opensuse-packaging+help@opensuse.org; run by mlmmj Message-ID: <202bcdd90709100859i475f9570t258096d999cfa5c5@mail.gmail.com> [...] No, the next release is 11.0 like 10.0 was after 9.3. It's just numbering convention. Regards Ladislav. and some ensuing conversation..... -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Glenn Holmer

21:15

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Tuesday 11 September 2007 15:46, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Glenn Holmer [09-11-07 16:35]:

...
On Tuesday 11 September 2007 08:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Have you got a link for that? Thanks.

Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:09:41 +0200 From: Stephan Kulow To: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org

Thanks, I didn't even know about that list. -- "After the vintage season came the aftermath - and Cenbe." Glenn Holmer (Q-Link: ShadowM) http://www.lyonlabs.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Aaron Kulkis

14 Sep 14 Sep

00:44

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

Glenn Holmer wrote:

...

On Tuesday 11 September 2007 15:46, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
* Glenn Holmer [09-11-07 16:35]:

...
On Tuesday 11 September 2007 08:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Have you got a link for that? Thanks.

Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:09:41 +0200 From: Stephan Kulow To: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org

Thanks, I didn't even know about that list.

Why do either of you find this surprising???? Since at least the 7.x days, the highest the editions have always been X.0 through X.3 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

05:47

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4

On 2007/09/13 20:44 (GMT-0400) Aaron Kulkis apparently typed:

...

...
...
...
...
Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0,

...

Why do either of you find this surprising????

...

Since at least the 7.x days, the highest the editions have always been X.0 through X.3

Maybe this time we can get rid of the point release silliness like Fedora did. Call it 11. Call the next 12, and the next 13.... -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

jdd

06:32

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4

Felix Miata wrote:

...

Maybe this time we can get rid of the point release silliness like Fedora did. Call it 11. Call the next 12, and the next 13....

true. the .x should be reserved to minor fixes (like the second dvd set recently) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Tom Patton

15 Sep 15 Sep

04:24

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4

On Fri, 2007-09-14 at 08:32 +0200, jdd wrote:

...

Felix Miata wrote:

...
Maybe this time we can get rid of the point release silliness like Fedora did. Call it 11. Call the next 12, and the next 13....

true. the .x should be reserved to minor fixes (like the second dvd set recently)

jdd

-- In my case, I like the numbering scheme. It has seemed that the x.3 since 6.x has always been the most stable and functional release. I always swear I will wait for the next x.3. But then the next X.0 hits the street and I rush out to buy it. Then I swear again ... Tom in NM -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Doug McGarrett

20:57

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4

On Saturday 15 September 2007 00:24, Tom Patton wrote:

...

On Fri, 2007-09-14 at 08:32 +0200, jdd wrote:

...
Felix Miata wrote:

...
Maybe this time we can get rid of the point release silliness like Fedora did. Call it 11. Call the next 12, and the next 13....

true. the .x should be reserved to minor fixes (like the second dvd set recently)

jdd

-- In my case, I like the numbering scheme. It has seemed that the x.3 since 6.x has always been the most stable and functional release. I always swear I will wait for the next x.3. But then the next X.0 hits the street and I rush out to buy it. Then I swear again ...

Tom in NM I second that motion! --doug -- Blessed are the peacemakers ... for they shall be shot at from both sides. --A.M. Greeley -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Hylton Conacher (ZR1HPC)

16 Sep 16 Sep

06:30

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4

Doug McGarrett wrote:

...

On Saturday 15 September 2007 00:24, Tom Patton wrote:

...
...
...
Maybe this time we can get rid of the point release silliness like Fedora did. Call it 11. Call the next 12, and the next 13....

Felix Miata wrote: true. the .x should be reserved to minor fixes (like the second dvd set recently)

jdd -- In my case, I like the numbering scheme. It has seemed that the x.3 since 6.x has always been the most stable and functional release. I always swear I will wait for the next x.3. But then the next X.0 hits

On Fri, 2007-09-14 at 08:32 +0200, jdd wrote: the street and I rush out to buy it. Then I swear again ...

Tom in NM I second that motion! --doug I vote to keep the numbering scheme as it was said by Linus a good while back that the x.0 version is the first stable release of some new addition ie the move from KDE3 to KDE4.

The x.1 release was the newer library, but with a few bug fixes the developers missed for the x.0 release, however those patches might break something else ie whilst still an immprovement it might still be unstable. The x.2 release was really the first release with the new libraries and patches that is considered stable and therefore a base to add other patches onto. The balance of the x.x numbers until y.0 were for fixes that improved the product but did not warrant a new version number ie y.0 as they were not major updates ie KDE3.5 to KDE 3.6 as opposed to KDE 3 to KDE 4. It is for this reason I only ever buy a new boxed set when the release numbers hit x.2. If I had seen an even release number ie a x.4 or x.6, since 9.2, I might have bought it. Regards Hylton -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Glenn Holmer

14 Sep 14 Sep

11:13

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

On Thursday 13 September 2007 19:44, Aaron Kulkis wrote:

...

Glenn Holmer wrote:

...
On Tuesday 11 September 2007 15:46, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
* Glenn Holmer [09-11-07 16:35]:

...
On Tuesday 11 September 2007 08:19, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
Announced yesterday, there will be no 10.4. It will be 11.0, perhaps related to inclusion/upgrade of/to KDE4.

Have you got a link for that? Thanks.

Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 17:09:41 +0200 From: Stephan Kulow To: opensuse-packaging@opensuse.org

Thanks, I didn't even know about that list.

Why do either of you find this surprising????

Since at least the 7.x days, the highest the editions have always been X.0 through X.3

Why do you think either of us was surprised? I just asked for a link I could point people to if they asked. Anyway, I've been using SUSE since 5.3... including 6.4 :P -- "After the vintage season came the aftermath - and Cenbe." Glenn Holmer (Q-Link: ShadowM) http://www.lyonlabs.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

11:45

New subject: [opensuse] No openSUSE 10.4, was: Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Friday 2007-09-14 at 06:13 -0500, Glenn Holmer wrote:

...

...
Why do either of you find this surprising????

Since at least the 7.x days, the highest the editions have always been X.0 through X.3

Why do you think either of us was surprised? I just asked for a link I could point people to if they asked. Anyway, I've been using SUSE since 5.3... including 6.4 :P

Me too... I didn't know they had the policy of not doing a .4 now. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG6nRKtTMYHG2NR9URAniDAJ0dpaz46a6dJ0V7hOviLSU3/HJrsQCgjfSI XhkcNxBFauPKT1YenPMPcyM= =k6od -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Joe Zien

11 Sep 11 Sep

20:18

New subject: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's - Solved

Bob S wrote:

...

On Monday 10 September 2007 01:56, Felix Miata wrote:

...
On 2007/09/09 23:40 (GMT-0400) Kenneth Schneider apparently typed:

...
On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 22:21 -0500, Rajko M. wrote:

...
On Sunday 09 September 2007 22:37 (GMT-0400) Bob S wrote:

...
Here is output of fdisk -l /dev/sda

Felix, Rajko, Ken,

And all of the other great guys on this list who tried to help. What a great bunch!

.<snip more older discussion>.......

...
...
...
2) Run in console as root cfdisk and see what it has to tell. In normal circumstances it doesn't list extended partition at all. The space after 10055 cylinder should be explicitly listed as free. So move highlight down to that line (free space) and try to add more partitions.

That certainly should work.

...
I don't think that will work as he has his extended partition ending at 10055 which is where sda9 ends. At this point his only option is to backup sda5-sda9, delete them and then recreate the extended partition using all of the available space. He will then be able to created more partitions.

sda4 only ends at 10055 because that's where sda9 ends. sda9's EPBR has no means to tell where the end of the disk is. As soon as sda10 is created, sda4 will magically grow to end where sda10 ends, unless the partitioning tool is broken. Only when a logical partition has been created that includes cylinder 30401 will sda4 show ending at the end of the disk. --

cfdisk will do it !! Thanks so much ! All the remaining 167GB of free space.

I had never heard of cfdisk and was afraid of what I would do so I studied the man page over and over and then tried it. It will work. (Wonder why Yast partitioner won't?) What it will do is create sda10 a logical partition of 167GB of all remaining free space which I am assuming will push the extended partion out to the end of the disk. I didn't do it because I am afraid to do it on my running system ( a concern?) and I didn't want a partition of that huge size, and I don't see (yet) a way to create several smaller partitions. Can that be done in cfdisk? I suppose I could go to the yast partitioner and resize it. but that may make the extended partition shrink. I dunno yet. But I am very happy that I have that space back for when I go to install 10.3.

Thanks again guys and all ideas welcome on dividing up that 167GB before I commit.

Bob S

Hi Bob, I am sending this again so it gets on opensuse@opensuse.org I would suggest you go to this site: http://gparted.sourceforge.net/livecd.php and click this version: gparted-livecd-0.3.4-6 http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=115843&package_id=173828&release_id=500778 This version can act as a boot cd to boot linux or win. I use this all the time and never had a problem. It is an iso file, you can use k3b to burn a disk image, don't just copy it tp a cd jozien -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

10 Sep 10 Sep

05:28

On 2007/09/09 12:44 (GMT+0200) Carlos E. R. apparently typed:

...

So, you have 3 primaries, one extended, and then free space, outside of the extended partition? Then that free space is lost.

An "extended partition" is a logical construct made up from the sum of existing logical partitions plus any freespace existing between them. Any partitioning tool that claims otherwise is broken. No immediately adjacent freespace can ever be "lost". "Lost" freespace can only exist which lies between primary partitions while the MBR table has all 4 of its entries used.

...

The extended partition most contain all the remaining space, later to be assigned to logical partitions, which may or not use all that space.

...

It should be possible to change the extended partition size without loosing data. Some tools are able to do it, like the commercial partition magic, I think it is. Maybe there is another method in linux.

The size of an extended partition is the sum of the two logical partitions farthest apart, plus all space in between. A partitioning program can choose to say it is larger, to the extent of adjacent freespace, and to some people, understanding use of the tool may be easier if it does. As long as the "extended partition" chain is not in an out of order state, which some partitioning tools are capable of creating, the extended technically ends at the end of whatever logical is located farthest from the MBR. It is thus because its EPBR has only one table entry, and it exists, AIUI, only to define itself, and not the "end" of an extended partition. See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_Boot_Record -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

10:39

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Monday 2007-09-10 at 01:28 -0400, Felix Miata wrote:

...

...
So, you have 3 primaries, one extended, and then free space, outside of the extended partition? Then that free space is lost.

An "extended partition" is a logical construct made up from the sum of existing logical partitions plus any freespace existing between them. Any partitioning tool that claims otherwise is broken. No immediately adjacent freespace can ever be "lost". "Lost" freespace can only exist which lies between primary partitions while the MBR table has all 4 of its entries used.

The extended partition is also a primary, real, partition, and can have any size. It can be, as you say, the size between the first logical and the last logical, or it can be all the space not in the other primaries, or it can be anything you choose. For instance, I have a disk with 1 primary, 1 extended, several logicals, and two primaries at the end. In that order. Some partitioners, true, automatically increase the size of the extended when you create a new logical partition. But some don't, and to those the space outside the extended partition is effectively lost. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFG5R7htTMYHG2NR9URAnI9AKCWBXJ6mwJOXjek6AgU7vCeolY3rACfdz5Q AoAB3+SL/dc6YdhK4yxrwWc= =wSFt -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

13 Sep 13 Sep

12:19

On 2007/09/10 12:39 (GMT+0200) Carlos E. R. apparently typed:

...

The Monday 2007-09-10 at 01:28 -0400, Felix Miata wrote:

...

...
An "extended partition" is a logical construct made up from the sum of existing logical partitions plus any freespace existing between them. Any partitioning tool that claims otherwise is broken. No immediately adjacent freespace can ever be "lost". "Lost" freespace can only exist which lies between primary partitions while the MBR table has all 4 of its entries used.

...

The extended partition is also a primary, real, partition, and can have

Your definition of "real" is apparently different from mine. It may be real in the sense that it consumes a partition table entry. e.g. fdisk -l Disk /dev/hda: 250.0 GB, 250059350016 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 30401 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/hda1 1 13 104391 17 Hidden HPFS/NTFS /dev/hda2 * 14 14 8032+ a OS/2 Boot Manager /dev/hda3 15 46 257040 6 FAT16 /dev/hda4 48 30401 243818505 5 Extended ... But, the reason I don't consider it real is I can't put a filesystem on it, e.g.: # mkfs.ext3 /dev/hda4 mke2fs: 1.40.2 (12-Jul-2007) mkfs.ext3: inode_size (128) * inodes_count (0) too big for a filesystem with 0 blocks...

...

any size. It can be, as you say, the size between the first logical and the last logical, or it can be all the space not in the other primaries, or it can be anything you choose.

I can't choose to make it the space on both sides of a primary that is located in the middle of the disk.

...

For instance, I have a disk with 1 primary, 1 extended, several logicals, and two primaries at the end. In that order.

...

Some partitioners, true, automatically increase the size of the extended when you create a new logical partition. But some don't, and to those the space outside the extended partition is effectively lost.

When freespace exists immediately adjacent to a logical partition, and that freespace is not the first cylinder, it's only effectively lost to a broken partitioning tool. -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

10 Sep 10 Sep

01:25

On 2007/09/09 01:30 (GMT-0400) Bob S apparently typed:

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On Saturday 08 September 2007 01:15, Felix Miata wrote:

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Not exactly dumb. Without "sacrificing" a primary for use as an extended, you're limited to 4 partitions total. There are only two ways to be out of available unpartitioned space to add a logical if an extended already exists:

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1-100% of freespace is already allocated to partitions 2-all existing freespace is located in between two primary partitions neither of which is an extended partition

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Neither of those are the problem. The fourth primary (sda4) is the extended and all of the free space is after that.

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However, Yast partitioner will not allow me to create or edit it because of the extended partition size restrictions.

I almost never use anything other than DFSee to add or remove partitions, but even so, I don't believe "because of..." is true.

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It will not let me resize it neither because supposedly it is the wrong file system type. So, now all of the free space is lost behind it.

That's not how it works with sensible partitioning tools. Rather, it will probably resize the extended automatically if you select the freespace following the logical(s), click on "Add", and go through the rest of the steps to create a new logical.

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Does this mean I have to delete the extended partition and make it extend to the end of the disk and lose all of my present logical partitions?

With partitioning tools that have logical user interfaces, one never explicitly deletes an extended partition. One only adds or deletes a logical partition, and the tool automatically adjusts the extended to match. The extended itself doesn't have a "size". Its size is merely the sum of all logicals it contains. So, you only remove it by removing all logicals.

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Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?)

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Linux installers generally will use every swap partition they can find. If you have multiple swap partitions, you'll have to manually change each new fstab to use whichever swap partitions you want used for that Linux.

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Do you mean that if there are two separate swap partitions they can be combined?

I don't know about combining. That might be what the kernel does. The installer merely puts all swap partitions it finds in fstab.

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I doubt anyone does. There's no reason to. I usually have a maintenance and/or boot partition on the first, a boot manager on the second, a small primary type 0x06 for DOS and/or windoz, and everything else as logicals, typically more than 20 total per disk.

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OK, but that means you have used up two very small primary partitions and one larger one for DOS/Windows, right?

Wrong. I don't "install" doz on C:. I merely give it a tiny C: to host its boot files, and "install" it usually to D:.

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On partitioning generally: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/partitioningindex.html

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Spent over an hour reading it. Very informative. but a few questions: The LVM you talk about there; that is a OS2 thing right? Different from LVM in Linux.

I updated it today to remove the confusion between OS/2 LVM and Linux LVM, plus other updates.

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Next question; you seem to indicate that it is necessary to have a boot manager on the first partition of the first drive to boot more than two os's. I don't really recall but I think there was some kind of boot manager as seen by a really old Partition Magic for Win 98 while using LILO. (Win98 still there on hda taking up space to just play a silly game once-in-awhile) If it is not, will I need to install one to run 10.3 once it is installed?

Grub is a boot manager. LILO is a boot manager. WinNT/XP's boot loader is also a crude boot manager. A boot manager doesn't necessarily need its own partition. Some do, some don't, some can go either way. If using only Linux(s) and doz, Grub should be all you need. If you're going to have multiple Linux installations on the same system, I suggest you make a /boot partition for the first one, and that's where grub can live. See also: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/install-doz-after.html -- "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs, whether any free government can be permanent, where the public worship of God, and the support of religion, constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in any assignable shape." Chief Justice Joseph Story Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

8 Sep 8 Sep

05:18

On Friday 07 September 2007 11:49:51 pm Bob S wrote:

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A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

The extended partition is just a container for logical partitions, kind of virtual hard disk within real hard disk. So nothing to move, just add new partitions. My favorite for partitioning is command line program 'cfdisk', or recently YaST Partitioner that makes possible to prepare disk from partitioning and resizing to formating. I use cca 10 GB for installation. For new installations I use old home directory, but create new users. That way changes in configuration of desktop (KDE, GNOME, other applications) doesn't interfere with older versions. The newest tool to experiment with new versions of openSUSE, Live CDs, other distros, is virtual machine. In openSUSE you have options to use QEMU, VirtualBox or Xen, but you can opt for VMware, Parallels etc. For details just ask Google, there is few articles on openSUSE about virtual machines too. -- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob S

9 Sep 9 Sep

05:45

On Saturday 08 September 2007 01:18, Rajko M. wrote:

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On Friday 07 September 2007 11:49:51 pm Bob S wrote:

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A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

The extended partition is just a container for logical partitions, kind of virtual hard disk within real hard disk. So nothing to move, just add new partitions.

Yeah,assuming that I had made the extended partition to filll up the entire hard disk, but as I explained to Felix I cannot make the extended partion larger without deleting it.

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My favorite for partitioning is command line program 'cfdisk', or recently YaST Partitioner that makes possible to prepare disk from partitioning and resizing to formating.

The Yast partitioner is the one complaining I am not allowed to do this.

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I use cca 10 GB for installation.

Don't know what cca is.

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For new installations I use old home directory, but create new users. That way changes in configuration of desktop (KDE, GNOME, other applications) doesn't interfere with older versions.

I don't follow what you are saying here. Use the old /home directory?

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The newest tool to experiment with new versions of openSUSE, Live CDs, other distros, is virtual machine. In openSUSE you have options to use QEMU, VirtualBox or Xen, but you can opt for VMware, Parallels etc. For details just ask Google, there is few articles on openSUSE about virtual machines too.

Yeah, but any of these virtual solutions require disk space right? Not sure I understand the "virtual" concept. Can you point me to a faq, howto, URL? I understand the concept to run Windows stuff on Linux but why do virtual Linux on top of Linux? Doesn't make sense to me.

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Thanks again for replying. Bob S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

07:52

On Sunday 09 September 2007 00:45, Bob S wrote:

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On Saturday 08 September 2007 01:18, Rajko M. wrote:

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On Friday 07 September 2007 11:49:51 pm Bob S wrote:

...
A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

The extended partition is just a container for logical partitions, kind of virtual hard disk within real hard disk. So nothing to move, just add new partitions.

Yeah,assuming that I had made the extended partition to filll up the entire hard disk, but as I explained to Felix I cannot make the extended partion larger without deleting it.

I already sent idea, in another post, to let us see the numbers. If you have already logical partition than extended is in use and can't be deleted, but let us see fdisk -l than we can talk about facts.

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My favorite for partitioning is command line program 'cfdisk', or recently YaST Partitioner that makes possible to prepare disk from partitioning and resizing to formating.

The Yast partitioner is the one complaining I am not allowed to do this.

The cfdisk doesn't list extended partition like fdisk.

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I use cca 10 GB for installation.

Don't know what cca is.

Sorry, cca is abbreviation for circa, Latin word that means about.

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For new installations I use old home directory, but create new users. That way changes in configuration of desktop (KDE, GNOME, other applications) doesn't interfere with older versions.

I don't follow what you are saying here. Use the old /home directory?

User 'me' I use for everyday work. /home/me/.kde has my working settings that I don't want to have messed up. User 'test' is the one that I can always remove /home/test/.kde is where new versions of KDE applications can store settings without changing settings for older versions. This way I have one /home partition, but I test new version of application with user 'test' first and if everything seems fine than I can use that for everday work, logged as user 'me'.

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The newest tool to experiment with new versions of openSUSE, Live CDs, other distros, is virtual machine. In openSUSE you have options to use QEMU, VirtualBox or Xen, but you can opt for VMware, Parallels etc. For details just ask Google, there is few articles on openSUSE about virtual machines too.

Yeah, but any of these virtual solutions require disk space right?

Disk space, RAM and some CPU power.

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I understand the "virtual" concept. Can you point me to a faq, howto, URL?

http://en.opensuse.org/An_Introduction_to_Virtualization http://en.opensuse.org/Virtualization_Resources_for_openSUSE http://en.opensuse.org/VirtualBox http://en.opensuse.org/Using_Qemu

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I understand the concept to run Windows stuff on Linux but why do virtual Linux on top of Linux? Doesn't make sense to me.

:-) It is fun to have another distro without reboot, or test version that can make only virtual damage.

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Thanks again for replying.

Bob S.

-- Regards, Rajko. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Mike McMullin

8 Sep 8 Sep

05:45

On Sat, 2007-08-09 at 00:49 -0400, Bob S wrote:

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Hello SuSE people,

This is especially for you guys/gals that run 3or 4 os's on a big hard drive. How do you handle the primary and extended partitions?

A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

I've got a big HD on my main system, and I'm running 5. Two Os's on one one hd and three are on the big drive. The one with three partitions I set up as such: hdb1=swap, hdb2=/ for 10.1, hdb3=/home for 10.1, then there is an extended partition where hdb5=/ for 10.2, hdb6=/home for 10.2, hdb7=/ for LinuxXP. I do have on hda2 a swap partition, on hda1 Windows XP, on hda3 Ubuntu root, and on hda4 Ubuntu Home.

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Now, I guess I could move my /home and /swap into the extended partition to free up two primary partitions. Hopefully that would give me access to the rest of the unused space on the drive. I always liked having my /home on it's own partition to guard it from mishap. Now, here are some of my questions:

Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition? I could never delete or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right? u Yes to both, almost. You could always backup your /home partition to move it to a new hard drive. Strategies for this have been discussed ad nauseum on this list over the past 18 or so months.

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Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition? Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?)

I have my swap in a primary partition on any drive that I have a swap on, and I have the 4 Linux's use the swap partition on hdb. I'm keeping the one on hda there in case I remove my hdb. I'll tweak Ubuntu to use it using a live cd to make the edit to fstab.

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How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

I give my heavy lifting/everyday Linux the primary partitions and use the extended partition for checking out other releases/distros.

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Love to hear your individual strategies.

Anxiously awaiting the final 10.3 so I can try Compiz-Fusion, Beryl whatever and be able to fall back to 10.2 when I screw it up.

Bob S.

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bob S

9 Sep 9 Sep

06:07

On Saturday 08 September 2007 01:45, Mike McMullin wrote:

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On Sat, 2007-08-09 at 00:49 -0400, Bob S wrote:

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Hello SuSE people,

This is especially for you guys/gals that run 3or 4 os's on a big hard drive. How do you handle the primary and extended partitions?

A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries, /, /swap, and /home, and used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

Mike,thanks for replying. You have answered some of my nagging questions about usability.

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I've got a big HD on my main system, and I'm running 5. Two Os's on one one hd and three are on the big drive. The one with three partitions I set up as such: hdb1=swap, hdb2=/ for 10.1, hdb3=/home for 10.1, then there is an extended partition where hdb5=/ for 10.2, hdb6=/home for 10.2, hdb7=/ for LinuxXP. I do have on hda2 a swap partition, on hda1 Windows XP, on hda3 Ubuntu root, and on hda4 Ubuntu Home.

That explains quite a bit.

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Now, I guess I could move my /home and /swap into the extended partition to free up two primary partitions. Hopefully that would give me access to the rest of the unused space on the drive. I always liked having my /home on it's own partition to guard it from mishap. Now, here are some of my questions:

Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition? I could never delete or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?

Yes to both, almost. You could always backup your /home partition to move it to a new hard drive. Strategies for this have been discussed ad nauseum on this list over the past 18 or so months.

Yeah, I guess I could do that. Move it inside the extended partition or another drive, but then I couldn't use that empty primary because it would be isolated between the /swap and the extended partition and not be able to access the free space left on the disk behind the extended partition as Felix explained. Wonderful ! What dumbness in the original partitioning scheme I made.

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Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition? Do you use the same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE drive?)

I have my swap in a primary partition on any drive that I have a swap on, and I have the 4 Linux's use the swap partition on hdb. I'm keeping the one on hda there in case I remove my hdb. I'll tweak Ubuntu to use it using a live cd to make the edit to fstab.

OK, so I really only need one /swap for 10.0, 10.2, and the future 10.3, right?

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How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

I give my heavy lifting/everyday Linux the primary partitions and use the extended partition for checking out other releases/distros.

Understood and appreciative of your strategy.

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Love to hear your individual strategies.

Bob S. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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participants (16)

Aaron Kulkis
Alexey Eremenko
Bob S
Carlos E. R.
Doug McGarrett
Felix Miata
Glenn Holmer
Hylton Conacher (ZR1HPC)
jdd
Joe Zien
Kai Ponte
Kenneth Schneider
Mike McMullin
Patrick Shanahan
Rajko M.
Tom Patton