Michael Hasenstein wrote:

First, as usual, all the following is private opinion, blabla...

Good. If it's SuSE's opinion, it's enough to get me off the platform. By the way, the following responses from me indicate my Company's public opinion, which I get to make <smile> and disseminate:

About updating 6.1: if we have updates and have to make new CDs anyway why shouldn't we use the updates if we can?

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. If you don't know why, I'm not sure I could explain it in less than a one-semester course. The advantage of Linux is that there's continuous evolution, continuous enhancement, and yes, even continuous bug-fixing. The advantage of a distribution is that it represents a snapshot in time; that I can take that snapshot, use it, and yes, even recreate it. Even recreate it if my own copies are somehow destroyed. I run a lot of systems, I'm responsible for the proper running of more. I cannot take the time to determine that one system runs slightly but significantly different from another because of some minor change made in some upgrade. I need all the systems to run the same. I need to know that I can tell a client to put "Linux version X from Distributor Y" onto his machine, and know what he's getting. If I don't know, then I can't support him.

About informing the other users about it: Hmmm, I guess that's a political issue. My first thought is, see above, if we have the opportunity to fix some stuff for no additional cost for us, why not do it?

If it's truly broken, then fix it, and give the new box a new number so we know there's a difference. Then, on your website, on announcement lists, via private email to all registered users, you have an obligation to let us know what in your product was broken, what you did to fix it, and what we should do to get the fixes. Yes, you probably should offer us a CD set incorporating those fixes at some price to cover it's manufacture and handling. If it's not broken, then you have the same obligation to LEAVE IT ALONE until you bring out another version. There's nothing wrong with minor-decimal-upgrades for bug-fixes, and they certainly don't have to be mandatory (in fact, most likely shouldn't be). But they should be acompanied by a lot of publicity. Remember the Intel Pentium fiasco? Maybe Intel should not have gotten in trouble for fixing the bug without telling anyone about it? That seems to be your point.

Ok, so some are luckier than others, so what, hey, there are lots of patches for almost everything _daily_! So waiting one more day _always_ gets you one more patch included.

Nope. Nope. Nope. The point of a distribution is that it shouldn't. If I want to run changing Linux code, I can run odd-number releases. If I'm running even-number releases, I should get something that's going to stick around a while.

It's just the same as with hardware - tomorrow the same stuff will be available for less money or you get more for the same. What difference does it make if we inform everyone? As I've said, there are new patches every day!

If you want to say it twice, I guess I can make my point twice, too... But I won't bother <smile>.

About exchange CD for free: see above, there are daily changes to virtually everything.

Three times. Do you really think that if your opinion is wrong all you have to do is keep repeating it and it becomes right?

Discussion about whether or not you should get 6.1 for free if you had 6.0 or not... and so on, for every single patch, doesn't really matter

No, it doesn't. What does matter is that you shouldn't bring out a new version for every patch. You should bring out versions when you need to do so.

- while I personally might feel that you deserve all .x upgrades for free, I also want to get my money every month, or else, and somebody's gotta pay. Where do you draw the line here?

SuSE draws the line. When it creates versions. I sincerely hope this is NOT the official SuSE stance. If it is, then not only can't I use the SuSE distribution, I can't even give it away to anyone I know; it's way too dangerous. Jeff (who has been using Linux since kernel version 0.99 back in '94) -- Jeff Lasman <jl-lists@jatek.net>, Internet Products Manager, Jatek Corp. Main office: Tel: (310) 375-7646 Fax: (310) 375-0892 Internet Products: Tel: (909) 787-8589 Fax: (909) 782-0205 24hr Internet Products Support: Tel: (909) 787-8589 Fax: (909) 782-0205 -- To get out of this list, please send email to majordomo@suse.com with this text in its body: unsubscribe suse-linux-e Check out the SuSE-FAQ at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A">http://www.suse.com/Support/Doku/FAQ/</A</A>> and the archive at <A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html"><A HREF="http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A">http://www.suse.com/Mailinglists/suse-linux-e/index.html</A</A>>