Re: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change - openSUSE Users

Re: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

fountai＠hursley.ibm.com

6 Jul 2000 6 Jul '00

15:19

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There are still a number of morons out there who think anything with Winelib behind it isn't a Linux application so they won't use it. Don't listen to them. This is a classy application, ported to Linux, just like we are screaming for vendors to do. It works well, and they've given it away free - possibly as a showcase. It seems that good. Corel are struggling and they deserve our support.

[snip]

I resent that, Derek. I'm certainly no moron, and it ISN'T a Linux app. if it depends on Wine....which I don't and won't use.

Resent it all you like. Corel's apps don't depend on Wine. They depend on Winelib. People who form opinions about what is and isn't a Linux app when they clearly don't know what is going on, then spout that opinion to all who will listen, are, IMHO, morons. -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq

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samelash＠ix.netcom.com

6 Jul 6 Jul

10:30

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file. Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy does work well under wine. One of the issues I have is I still havee a bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will resolve its self when we upgrade/replace the two 400 AMD/K6s we have and use those to replace the P150/166s with. Older hardware is one of the major reasons for using linux. I wont use win 98 on that calss machine , and linux just runs better and doesent change setting on its own as windows like to do with out any warning or user permission. I havent had a linux machine go down or even hickup on me. They run finee once you ahve them set up. That I REALY LIKE about linux. At 04:19 PM 7/6/2000 +0100, Derek Fountain wrote:

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There are still a number of morons out there who think anything with Winelib behind it isn't a Linux application so they won't use it. Don't listen to them. This is a classy application, ported to Linux, just like we are screaming for vendors to do. It works well, and they've given it away free - possibly as a showcase. It seems that good. Corel are struggling and they deserve our support.

[snip]

I resent that, Derek. I'm certainly no moron, and it ISN'T a Linux app. if it depends on Wine....which I don't and won't use.

Resent it all you like. Corel's apps don't depend on Wine. They depend on Winelib. People who form opinions about what is and isn't a Linux app when they clearly don't know what is going on, then spout that opinion to all who will listen, are, IMHO, morons.

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...

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fountai＠hursley.ibm.com

7 Jul 7 Jul

08:14

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

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Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if

It *is* a Linux native version. Every single byte of the app and it's libraries was compiled on a Intel Linux machine using (I assume) gcc. It's not emulated, it's not relinked on the fly, it's not fudged in any way. How do *you* define "native"?

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each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file.

If that's the case it will be a problem. I don't see why it should be the case though. Once Winelib gets to version 1.0, that's what everyone will use. While it's in alpha, and the products are in beta, its too early to tell. Corel have jumped the gun a bit, and may have to issue patches, but they are right in there with the Winelib developers so I reckon they know what they are doing.

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Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy

I don't think I would ever run anything under Wine. It's just too slow at startup (when it does its dynamic relink thing) and I'm not convinced it'll ever be stable enough.

...

bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will

Programs running with Winelib are slower than those running with gtk or Qt, etc, it's true. But they do tend to do a lot more (call it bloat if you like). If your hardware isn't up to it, run another program. If you really need an app upgrade your hardware. This is hardly a new concept. On a 650mhz laptop with 128MB of RAM both Photopaint and Toppage are perfectly usable, and as WInelib matures it'll get better. -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq

samelash＠ix.netcom.com

10:04

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

At 09:14 AM 7/7/2000 +0100, Derek Fountain wrote:

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Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if

No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not need wine , just fire it up. All I said was the I prefer linux native , but that currently with the P150/166 machines I have on hand , its downright slow to run WPO200 under wine. I wont bother trying photoshop , as its not somnething that I use . If WPO200 is a dog under wine , then most likely photo shop will be. I have intead used Applixware which is linux native. It sure preforms a lot better and is much more usable on the low end hardware. There are still a lot of low end machines out there in use. Not every one has the resources to go out and but 5 to 10 PIII or Athalon system , just to get the MGHT up past 400. Yep I know that the amd K6 are now considered budget , but I am not going to throw in new motherboards and cpu into these machines. When We replace the high end amd K6 II with some thing better , then those can trick down and replace the P166s on hand. Then maybee We will check out wine agien , till then , its too slow on the hardware thats on hand.

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It *is* a Linux native version. Every single byte of the app and it's libraries was compiled on a Intel Linux machine using (I assume) gcc. It's not emulated, it's not relinked on the fly, it's not fudged in any way. How do *you* define "native"?

...
each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file.

If that's the case it will be a problem. I don't see why it should be the case though. Once Winelib gets to version 1.0, that's what everyone will use. While it's in alpha, and the products are in beta, its too early to tell. Corel have jumped the gun a bit, and may have to issue patches, but they are right in there with the Winelib developers so I reckon they know what they are doing.

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Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy

I don't think I would ever run anything under Wine. It's just too slow at startup (when it does its dynamic relink thing) and I'm not convinced it'll ever be stable enough.

...
bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will

Programs running with Winelib are slower than those running with gtk or Qt, etc, it's true. But they do tend to do a lot more (call it bloat if you like). If your hardware isn't up to it, run another program. If you really need an app upgrade your hardware. This is hardly a new concept. On a 650mhz laptop with 128MB of RAM both Photopaint and Toppage are perfectly usable, and as WInelib matures it'll get better.

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...

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fountai＠hursley.ibm.com

10 Jul 10 Jul

08:17

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

None so blind as those that will not see, eh Samy? Wine != Winelib. Corel's stuff uses Winelib. Winelib lives at the same level as Gtk, Qt, Motif. Portable code, linked with Gtk = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Qt = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Motif = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Winelib = Native Linux application. I'm still not saying you should use it. That's your choice. Just don't dis it when you don't understand it.

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Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if

No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not need wine , just fire it up.

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samelash＠ix.netcom.com

15:57

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

At 09:17 AM 7/10/2000 +0100, Derek Fountain wrote:

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None so blind as those that will not see, eh Samy?

Wine != Winelib. Corel's stuff uses Winelib. Winelib lives at the same level as Gtk, Qt, Motif. Portable code, linked with Gtk = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Qt = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Motif = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Winelib = Native Linux application.

I'm still not saying you should use it. That's your choice. Just don't dis it when you don't understand it.

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Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a

...

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naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in

Some of us just dont get it. <grin> Wine lib lives at the same nleval as GTK , QT , Motif. Hmmmmm , GTK is grahpical tk Right ? QT ?? Motif , isent that the unix window manager ? By native I mean that it will run an executable on the linux os. Thats kind of an oxymoran right nnow , with the ability to run scripting languages in linux just by seting the script to an exectuable. I am not ignorant , just new to linux. Native apps to me comming from the windows worlk are C , delphi(pascal) compiled apps that spit out an exe file. I know that linux is somewhat diffrent , and that in linux there is no standard file extension for exes etc.. Myu main gripe with Corel was that using it under wine added another layer and just made the app too slow on the current in house hardware for it to be used in any significant way. P150 and 166 are the hardware I am talking about. That what we have right now , so what ever we use must be usable on that type of hardware. I have tried applixware on the same box and it runs a lot better , So much so that we bouth it. linux that if

...

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No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not need wine , just fire it up.

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tbutler＠uninetsolutions.com

21:39

New subject: [SLE] WINELIB is like an OCX. (was RE: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change)

Samy, As you say a Perl script is excutable too (natively), but it does run through an interpreter per your definition. Corel apps are the same, you simply run them, and they run. They don't run WINE, they run WINELIB (there is a difference). WINELIB is linked to the compiled program just like the Motif toolkit (Motif Window Manager is a different part of Motif). It may have more overhead (I don't know), but it is just like any other programming library (similar to those .ocx files you see included with apps in Windows). -Tim ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks Information Tech. Consultant Christian Web Services Since 1996 ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm An Authorized IPSwitch Reseller tbutler@uninetsolutions.com http://www.uninetsolutions.com ===================== "Solutions that Work" =====================

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-----Original Message----- From: Samy Elashmawy [mailto:samelash@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 10:57 AM To: Derek Fountain; SuSE English Subject: Re: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

At 09:17 AM 7/10/2000 +0100, Derek Fountain wrote:

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None so blind as those that will not see, eh Samy?

Wine != Winelib. Corel's stuff uses Winelib. Winelib lives at the same level as Gtk, Qt, Motif. Portable code, linked with Gtk = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Qt = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Motif = Native Linux application. Portable code, linked with Winelib = Native Linux application.

I'm still not saying you should use it. That's your choice. Just don't dis it when you don't understand it.

Some of us just dont get it. <grin> Wine lib lives at the same nleval as GTK , QT , Motif. Hmmmmm , GTK is grahpical tk Right ? QT ?? Motif , isent that the unix window manager ?

By native I mean that it will run an executable on the linux os. Thats kind of an oxymoran right nnow , with the ability to run scripting languages in linux just by seting the script to an exectuable.

I am not ignorant , just new to linux. Native apps to me comming from the windows worlk are C , delphi(pascal) compiled apps that spit out an exe file. I know that linux is somewhat diffrent , and that in linux there is no standard file extension for exes etc..

Myu main gripe with Corel was that using it under wine added another layer and just made the app too slow on the current in house hardware for it to be used in any significant way. P150 and 166 are the hardware I am talking about. That what we have right now , so what ever we use must be usable on that type of hardware.

I have tried applixware on the same box and it runs a lot better , So much so that we bouth it.

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Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if

No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not need wine , just fire it up.

-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com

...
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tbutler＠uninetsolutions.com

21:28

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

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No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not

Layers - a problem? Isn't UNIX the operating system of layers? Windows has just one layer. Layers aren't bad, they make Linux modular!

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need wine , just fire it up.

Samy, you do know there is a difference between winelib and wine, right? Winelib apps run by "just firing it up" (as you put it), where as those using Wine are true Windows apps (i.e. they still work in Windows, and are compiled to run in Windows).

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All I said was the I prefer linux native , but that currently with the P150/166 machines I have on hand , its downright slow to run WPO200 under wine. I wont bother trying photoshop , as its not somnething that I use .

Adobe Photoshop? Unless I've missed something, Photoshop is a Windows and Mac app only (Photoshop and Photo-Paint are different - did you mean Corel Photo-Paint?), and using it _would_ require Wine (and it _would_ be slow).

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has the resources to go out and but 5 to 10 PIII or Athalon system , just to get the MGHT up past 400. Yep I know that the amd K6 are now considered budget , but I am not going to throw in new motherboards and cpu into these machines. When We replace the high end amd K6 II with some thing better , then those can trick down and replace the P166s on hand. Then maybee We will check out wine agien , till then , its too slow on the hardware thats on hand.

Have you considered it's just a slow processor? K6's never were known for there speed, and P166's are getting old. However, you seem to expect sheer speed from them if you don't use Windows 98 on them just because it is slow on them. Let me tell you, Windows is quite usable on a P100, so I think you might just be expecting to much from an old processor. -Tim ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks Information Tech. Consultant Christian Web Services Since 1996 ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm An Authorized IPSwitch Reseller tbutler@uninetsolutions.com http://www.uninetsolutions.com ===================== "Solutions that Work" =====================

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It *is* a Linux native version. Every single byte of the app and it's libraries was compiled on a Intel Linux machine using (I assume) gcc. It's not emulated, it's not relinked on the fly, it's not fudged in any way. How do *you* define "native"?

...
each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file.

If that's the case it will be a problem. I don't see why it should be the case though. Once Winelib gets to version 1.0, that's what everyone will use. While it's in alpha, and the products are in beta, its too early to tell. Corel have jumped the gun a bit, and may have to issue patches, but they are right in there with the Winelib developers so I reckon they know what they are doing.

...
Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy

I don't think I would ever run anything under Wine. It's just too slow at startup (when it does its dynamic relink thing) and I'm not convinced it'll ever be stable enough.

...
bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will

Programs running with Winelib are slower than those running with gtk or Qt, etc, it's true. But they do tend to do a lot more (call it bloat if you like). If your hardware isn't up to it, run another program. If you really need an app upgrade your hardware. This is hardly a new concept. On a 650mhz laptop with 128MB of RAM both Photopaint and Toppage are perfectly usable, and as WInelib matures it'll get better.

-- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com

...
Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq

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samelash＠ix.netcom.com

16:28

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

At 04:28 PM 7/10/2000 -0500, Timothy R. Butler wrote:

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No its not native , it needs wine to run , which just adds in another layer , and adds to the inefficency of it. If it were linux native you would not

Layers - a problem? Isn't UNIX the operating system of layers? Windows

has just

...

one layer. Layers aren't bad, they make Linux modular!

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need wine , just fire it up.

No I did not know there was a diffrence between winelib and wine. Thanks for letting me know about the them.

...

Samy, you do know there is a difference between winelib and wine, right? Winelib apps run by "just firing it up" (as you put it), where as those using Wine are true Windows apps (i.e. they still work in Windows, and are compiled to run in Windows).

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All I said was the I prefer linux native , but that currently with the P150/166 machines I have on hand , its downright slow to run WPO200 under wine. I wont bother trying photoshop , as its not somnething that I use .

I was refering to the new corel photshope clone or what ever it was that was just put on there web. Thats what started this thread.

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Adobe Photoshop? Unless I've missed something, Photoshop is a Windows and Mac app only (Photoshop and Photo-Paint are different - did you mean Corel

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has the resources to go out and but 5 to 10 PIII or Athalon system , just to get the MGHT up past 400. Yep I know that the amd K6 are now considered budget , but I am not going to throw in new motherboards and cpu into these machines. When We replace the high end amd K6 II with some thing better , then those can trick down and replace the P166s on hand. Then maybee We will check out wine agien , till then , its too slow on the hardware thats on hand.

No I am not expecting shere speed out of them wiuth linux. But to tell you the truth , they run a lot better with linux , and the apps tend to run better on linux , so much so , that you can often use lower end machines to run it on linux and you will get the same prefrmance as you would ru nning win98 on higher end hardware.

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Have you considered it's just a slow processor? K6's never were known for there speed, and P166's are getting old. However, you seem to expect sheer speed from

Nope , a slow proicessor is the 486 , compared with the pentuim. Our last 486 finaly died six months or so ago. We were going to use it as a firwall/ipmasq box till it died. Not thats being done on a P100 with 16 meg ram and Freecso. Works like a champ.

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them if you don't use Windows 98 on them just because it is slow on them. Let me tell you, Windows is quite usable on a P100, so I think you might just be expecting to much from an old processor.

I have found by my experiance that linux uns a lot more stable than win 95/8. I can eveen use the p150/166s that we still ahve for basic office use.They are very usable with linux and preferably linux native apps. ie applixware runs a lot better than corel office. Netscape is a bit slow. But we dont use nbetscape a lot on these boxes. Hopefully they will be phased out in six months or so. Who knowa , would be nice to have a firewall with gui ! Naaa , to M$ like , skipp the gui on the firewall.

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-Tim

----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks Information Tech. Consultant Christian Web Services Since 1996 ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm An Authorized IPSwitch Reseller tbutler@uninetsolutions.com http://www.uninetsolutions.com ===================== "Solutions that Work" =====================

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It *is* a Linux native version. Every single byte of the app and it's libraries was compiled on a Intel Linux machine using (I assume) gcc. It's not emulated, it's not relinked on the fly, it's not fudged in any way. How do *you* define "native"?

...
each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file.

If that's the case it will be a problem. I don't see why it should be the case though. Once Winelib gets to version 1.0, that's what everyone will use. While it's in alpha, and the products are in beta, its too early to tell. Corel have jumped the gun a bit, and may have to issue patches, but they are right in there with the Winelib developers so I reckon they know what they are doing.

...
Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy

I don't think I would ever run anything under Wine. It's just too slow at startup (when it does its dynamic relink thing) and I'm not convinced it'll ever be stable enough.

...
bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will

Programs running with Winelib are slower than those running with gtk or Qt, etc, it's true. But they do tend to do a lot more (call it bloat if you like). If your hardware isn't up to it, run another program. If you really need an app upgrade your hardware. This is hardly a new concept. On a 650mhz laptop with 128MB of RAM both Photopaint and Toppage are perfectly usable, and as WInelib matures it'll get better.

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...
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adrian＠halodule.tamu.edu

7 Jul 7 Jul

14:09

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

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"Derek" == Derek Fountain writes:

I've stayed out of this debate so far since I have strongly ambivalent feeling about Corel. But.... >> Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel >> Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine >> , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it >> uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if Derek> It *is* a Linux native version. Every single byte of the Derek> app and it's libraries was compiled on a Intel Linux Derek> machine using (I assume) gcc. It's not emulated, it's not Derek> relinked on the fly, it's not fudged in any way. Hmmm...in that case I misunderstood what Corel had done. It also makes me rather more disappointed. I have installed Corel WPO2000 Deluxe edition and it's given problems all over. Some of these (such as the fonttastic font server apparently not getting on with xfsft) are of my own doing, but many lay fairly and squarely at Corel's feet. These include but are not limited to * Mistakes in the documentation that, when followed, cause segmentation violations. * Fonts not working and messing up the X server so that one has to re-boot. * Corel support replying to less than 50% of requests. Some are just plain sloppy (such as the documentation), some are related to the organization (such as the poor response from Corel support) and some are programming problems. I've submitted bug reports (though I had to do this on the various corel newsgroups because I was unable to find an official e-mail address to report bugs to). According to some of the people in the know who use the Corel newsgroups, there are no plans for patches, bug fixes etc. from Corel. So whilst I applaud their initial effort (and their work with WINE), I believe they run the risk of shooting themselves in the foot and doing considerable harm to the perception of Linux as a viable desktop OS. Adrian -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq

fountai＠hursley.ibm.com

14:56

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

You're not the only one, but I think they just jumped the gun. The installation for Photopaint9 is much smoother, and I've not seen any problems with fonts or anything else. It doesn't like GNOME-1.2 much, but it seems OK with KDE. Shame, because they are a high profile company and they've screwed up a bit. Doesn't make Linux look good.

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me rather more disappointed. I have installed Corel WPO2000 Deluxe edition and it's given problems all over. Some of these (such as the fonttastic font server apparently not getting on with xfsft) are of my

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bobbyg＠ihug.co.nz

8 Jul 8 Jul

09:22

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

Hi All & Adrian Burd, who wrote: <snip>

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I have installed Corel WPO2000 Deluxe edition and it's given problems all over. Some of these (such as the fonttastic font server apparently not getting on with xfsft) are of my own doing, but many lay fairly and squarely at Corel's feet. These include but are not limited to

* Mistakes in the documentation that, when followed, cause segmentation violations. * Fonts not working and messing up the X server so that one has to re-boot.

<snip> Yup, me too & this is what I did on my Tux box.... Go to dir /etc/fonttastic/config edit the "config" file line (scroll down to the end), "port 7101" & change to "port 7102" I hope that helps? *BFN* Greek Geek :-) -- To unsubscribe send e-mail to suse-linux-e-unsubscribe@suse.com For additional commands send e-mail to suse-linux-e-help@suse.com Also check the FAQ at http://www.suse.com/support/faq

tbutler＠uninetsolutions.com

10 Jul 10 Jul

21:28

New subject: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

If it uses Winelib, isn't it truly a native app? As far as I understood, WINELIB works just like any other library satisfying the needs of the app you compile. If it's compiled with GCC using WINELIB, would it be any different than GTK or QT apps that depend on those libraries? I'm not an expert here, but I from what I understood WINELIB didn't emulate, it just helped port. -Tim ----------------------------------------------------------------- Timothy R. Butler Universal Networks Information Tech. Consultant Christian Web Services Since 1996 ICQ #12495932 AIM: Uninettm An Authorized IPSwitch Reseller tbutler@uninetsolutions.com http://www.uninetsolutions.com ===================== "Solutions that Work" =====================

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-----Original Message----- From: Samy Elashmawy [mailto:samelash@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 5:30 AM To: Derek Fountain; SuSE English Subject: Re: [SLE] Corel - some good news for a change

Ill jump in here , While I applaud Corel for making corel Office 2000 , and its phot shop app avialable on linux via wine , I would rather have a linux naative version. The fact that it uses wine/winelib is relevent in that if each app needs to load/use its own version of wine , than thati is a maitinence issue thaat could get thorny if there are several diffrent apps that need diffrent versions of wine/winelib. I would hoipe that they would only need a diffrent wine configuration file.

Basicly if its an app that I realy need and is not avialable as a linux native app , I will considur using it under wine , but only if it realy does work well under wine. One of the issues I have is I still havee a bunch of P166/150s still in use , and with wine I take a significan preformance hit. Linux native is the way to go. Hopefull thaat issue will resolve its self when we upgrade/replace the two 400 AMD/K6s we have and use those to replace the P150/166s with. Older hardware is one of the major reasons for using linux. I wont use win 98 on that calss machine , and linux just runs better and doesent change setting on its own as windows like to do with out any warning or user permission. I havent had a linux machine go down or even hickup on me. They run finee once you ahve them set up. That I REALY LIKE about linux.

At 04:19 PM 7/6/2000 +0100, Derek Fountain wrote:

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There are still a number of morons out there who think anything with Winelib behind it isn't a Linux application so they won't use it. Don't listen to them. This is a classy application, ported to Linux, just like we are screaming for vendors to do. It works well, and they've given it away free - possibly as a showcase. It seems that good. Corel are struggling and they deserve our support.

[snip]

I resent that, Derek. I'm certainly no moron, and it ISN'T a Linux app. if it depends on Wine....which I don't and won't use.

Resent it all you like. Corel's apps don't depend on Wine. They depend on Winelib. People who form opinions about what is and isn't a Linux app when they clearly don't know what is going on, then spout that opinion to all who will listen, are, IMHO, morons.

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adrian＠halodule.tamu.edu
bobbyg＠ihug.co.nz
fountai＠hursley.ibm.com
samelash＠ix.netcom.com
tbutler＠uninetsolutions.com