On 28 February 2017 at 01:44, John Andersen <jsamyth@gmail.com> wrote:
On 02/27/2017 03:29 PM, Carl Hartung wrote:
Thank you very much for writing this up and posting it, Richard!
Its something I never would have written up. At least if I had any responsibility for the product. I would have been half way through that list and would have realized I was documenting a turd.
I'd have gone straight to management and pounded the desk till they agreed to demote it out of the default, or pulled it from the product all together.
I've occasionally realized while documenting things that the product or process is absurd, and I would be ashamed to ship it. I still have pride in my work product.
And what planet are you on? We're talking about _openSUSE_ here Who is responsible for the product? The community Who is the management? There is no management As part of the Project, who and what do I hold pride in? The community and whatever they put together openSUSE is a community project, with no management. There is no one's desk to pound, there never has been. openSUSE is the sum of parts from openSUSE's hundreds of contributors. btrfs as a default was contributed by some of those contributors in 2014. No other contributor in the last 2 years has provided an alternative, compromise, or variation upon this. Now, it is safe to say that SUSE, the corporate entity who sponsors openSUSE and happens to pay the paychecks of a lot of openSUSE's contributors, happened to be the employer of the contributors in question who provided btrfs by default to openSUSE. But the fact of the matter remains that SUSE Management have no direct control over what is available (or not) in openSUSE. It requires actual developers to make actual submissions to our well documented and public processes, and they are considered, accepted, and rejected on the merits of the submissions and it's contents, nothing else. All contributors are equal in this regard, and an experienced amateur working out of their basement in the evenings has every opportunity to shape openSUSE in the way they see fit, just as a SUSE employee does as part of their work on SUSE Linux Enterprise. But for the sake of argument, lets imagine you're suggesting I should beat on SUSE's Management desk regarding btrfs as the default. What do you think the outcome would likely be? Since SUSE has adopted btrfs as the default filesystem in SUSE Linux Enterprise 12 in 2014, they have seen their revenues increase at double-digit percentages each year, earning millions of dollars as a result, and dramatically increasing the size of their workforce as a result. Large multi-million dollar contracts have been won and successfully implemented purely because SUSE ships btrfs by default. As they say, "the proof is in the pudding", and in the case of SUSE's enterprise product there are now two years of successful adoption & growth that will to counter any arguments that btrfs is a "turd" And lets for a second imagine a mythical openSUSE that actually has some desk that I could pound. We have Tumbleweed userbase numbers showing over 300% growth since going btrfs-by-default in 2014 https://speakerdeck.com/sysrich/fosdem-2017-how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-a... And I can't show you a graph for Leap, because we currently have such a problem with our infrastructure dealing with the number of users we have on Leap that we struggle to get meaningful statistics from the systems. So if we had some sort of management, I can imagine what their opinion would be to the suggestion that we've built our distribution on the wrong default filesystem - if it was as bad as you say it is, there is no way we'd be where we are today after the last 2 years. And so, what is the point of your post? If you, or anyone else in the openSUSE community, really thinks openSUSE should do something different with regards to our default filesystem or anything else, the code is open, the tools are open, the platform is open - nothing is stopping you, get up off your ass and make submissions that address the things you see as issues. and if it was just to make noise because you have some irrational dislike of what we're doing, or just like to read your own text, stop it. This is meant to be a support mailinglist for users in need. Assist them, and keep any unproductive complaining off this list.
-- After all is said and done, more is said than done. --
Good words, as you seem to do nothing, might I strongly suggest you now try saying nothing? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org