my thread deteriorated into a discussion of suse's business model, so why don't we start a new one here just to keep organization. in response to all your comments, i want to say the following: i don't mind suse offering charged support - basically any other company does so. sure, in the case of micro$oft, where i was forced to use their support hotline exactly once, paid $90 and never got called back (suckers!), no results are guaranteed, but if suse's support hotline gives you help for money, that's fine. they need to survive somehow too. with the mailing list in place, the average user has plenty of sources of help. now if suse would finally make their knowledge base a little more usable and current... and the price jump is kind of justified simply by comparing 6 disk/3 books suse 7.0 to 4 disk/1 book redhat 7.0. you do get quite a bit with suse, that's for sure. suse should go ahead and make money like everyone else, but please don't let them forget about the small user - the true core of linux - and please don't let them end up like m$, producing sheit-software for ridiculous prices... martin [greetings from the heart of the sun]# echo madduck@!#:1:s@\@@@.net -- qvid me anxivs svm?